Catalunya

[CloudSquall]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-49974289

Catalan leaders jailed for up to 12 years for the independence referendum in 2017, El Prat airport taken over by protestors, all kicking off..

[southsider]

Wee Nic next for the Tin Pail ?

[southsider]

FC Barcellona today released a statement supporting the jailed activists. Mild statement, but support nevertheless. Visca Catalunya Lliure !

[Fife-Hibee]

Stupid, stupid move by the Spanish authorities. It's like they wanted it all to kick off.

[Future17]

La Liga has requested El Classico be moved from the Nou Camp to the Bernabeu on 26 October.

I'm sure that will go down well.

[ronaldo7]

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La Liga has requested El Classico be moved from the Nou Camp to the Bernabeu on 26 October.

I'm sure that will go down well.

The Spanish football Association have decided to postpone the match instead.

Disgrace of a country.

Who said football is not political.

[Moulin Yarns]

MAJOR BREAKING: One of the Marches for Freedom arrives in Barcelona. https://t.co/qgj6bKTo2n

[weecounty hibby]

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MAJOR BREAKING: One of the Marches for Freedom arrives in Barcelona. https://t.co/qgj6bKTo2n

This appeared in my Twitter feed and I then went into the BBC to see what was being said. Nothing, that's what's being said about it on the Beeb. They are not keen to report on any independence movements at all at the moment! Amazing show of support for Catalonian independence.

[CloudSquall]

Spain now blocking Catalan websites,

https://twitter.com/jordiPuignero/st...95738202071040


A play straight from the Chinese Communist Party's playbook

[cabbageandribs1875]

the spanish police like a bit of brutality huh, kin shocking videos going around

[makaveli1875]

Its the sort of scenes you'd expect to see in Turkey or China not in the middle of the EU

[Cataplana]

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The Spanish football Association have decided to postpone the match instead.

Disgrace of a country.

Who said football is not political.

By postponing the fixture, are the FA not preventing the game being drawn into the political situation?

Spain is hardly a disgrace of a country if it goes to these lengths to protect its democracy.

How would people here feel if Johnson was to act in an illegal manner?

[ronaldo7]

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By postponing the fixture, are the FA not preventing the game being drawn into the political situation?

Spain is hardly a disgrace of a country if it goes to these lengths to protect its democracy.

How would people here feel if Johnson was to act in an illegal manner?

Im assuming you know of the history of Barcelona fc,
the political affiliations, and intrinsic, fabric of the club within the Catalan community?

My comment about Spain being a disgrace may seem ott, it's rather the state Im speaking of, with all the organs it entails. You only have to see the beating that the youngsters in Barcelona have had to endure from the stormtroopers to see, the state is out of control, and therefore a disgrace.

[Cataplana]

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Im assuming you know of the history of Barcelona fc,
the political affiliations, and intrinsic, fabric of the club within the Catalan community?

My comment about Spain being a disgrace may seem ott, it's rather the state Im speaking of, with all the organs it entails. You only have to see the beating that the youngsters in Barcelona have had to endure from the stormtroopers to see, the state is out of control, and therefore a disgrace.

Of course I know the history of CFB, it was the only place where people could speak the Catalan language for much of Franco's dictatorship.

At a time when El Caudillo's body is to be exhumed and removed from it's sacred place in the Valley of the Fallen, it is clear that the Spanish government is trying its hardest to balance the nation.

They are a state with many challenges, and have to be seen to be fair to both sides. Challenging democracy by calling a referendum illegally wasn't fair.

As I am not Spanish / Catalan, I cannot understand the complexities of this dispute, but I agree the Guardia Civil are *******s, and are probably enjoying all of this.

As for the football - at such a sensitive time, and given what Barcelona means to one side, I think it is wise to postpone the fixture.

[IberianHibernian]

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Im assuming you know of the history of Barcelona fc,
the political affiliations, and intrinsic, fabric of the club within the Catalan community?

My comment about Spain being a disgrace may seem ott, it's rather the state Im speaking of, with all the organs it entails. You only have to see the beating that the youngsters in Barcelona have had to endure from the stormtroopers to see, the state is out of control, and therefore a disgrace.

Could you give me more information about what you mean about everything you say about Barcelona FC ? Political affiliations of who ? A few rich businessmen who want to be president or ordinary fans in Barcelona / rest of Catalonia / Spain /the world ? Within the Catalan community ? What about the Catalans who support their local teams in Gerona / Sabadell etc ? Or Espanyol supporters who support their local team rather than a multinational - one of most famous nationalist politicians Gabriel Rufian for example is an Espanyol fan .

[IberianHibernian]

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Of course I know the history of CFB, it was the only place where people could speak the Catalan language for much of Franco's dictatorship.

At a time when El Caudillo's body is to be exhumed and removed from it's sacred place in the Valley of the Fallen, it is clear that the Spanish government is trying its hardest to balance the nation.

They are a state with many challenges, and have to be seen to be fair to both sides. Challenging democracy by calling a referendum illegally wasn't fair.

As I am not Spanish / Catalan, I cannot understand the complexities of this dispute, but I agree the Guardia Civil are *******s, and are probably enjoying all of this.

As for the football - at such a sensitive time, and given what Barcelona means to one side, I think it is wise to postpone the fixture.

You have made 5 very sensible observations but I have a few queries .
1. Your first point - are you seriously suggesting that the FC Barcelona stadium was the only place where Catalan was spoken for most of Franco`s 36 - year reign ?
2. Do you really think that there is any connection between Franco`s exhumation and the violence of the last week in Catalonia ?
3. Your third point . Are you referring to Catalans only ?
4. Why do you think that about the GC ? Because of something you`ve read in a book written by some Oxbridge academic referring to the role of the GC during the Franco regime or because of some personal problem you`ve had with the GC in the last decade ? The GC have hardly been involved in public order operations so far and I doubt the Catalan GC are enjoying protecting their spouses and children from abuse from political agitators even if they are used to it .
5. Think FC Barcelona were keen to have match cancelled as well as Real Madrid for numerous reasons . Both clubs are primarily money machines like the big clubs in England , Paris SG , etc but at the same time have to think about public safety ( safety of fans , players etc ) .
As above is mainly about football and conflict between Catalans who ( don`t ) want independence from Spain I listened to an interesting statement from one of Spain`s most famous football journalists Paco Gonzalez about Pep Guardiola and Xavi Hernandez`s verbal attacks on Spain but silence on human rights in Qatar where they have earned so much money without making statements on human rights . Certainly puts it all into perspective .

[Cataplana]

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You have made 5 very sensible observations but I have a few queries .
1. Your first point - are you seriously suggesting that the FC Barcelona stadium was the only place where Catalan was spoken for most of Franco`s 36 - year reign ?
2. Do you really think that there is any connection between Franco`s exhumation and the violence of the last week in Catalonia ?
3. Your third point . Are you referring to Catalans only ?
4. Why do you think that about the GC ? Because of something you`ve read in a book written by some Oxbridge academic referring to the role of the GC during the Franco regime or because of some personal problem you`ve had with the GC in the last decade ? The GC have hardly been involved in public order operations so far and I doubt the Catalan GC are enjoying protecting their spouses and children from abuse from political agitators even if they are used to it .
5. Think FC Barcelona were keen to have match cancelled as well as Real Madrid for numerous reasons . Both clubs are primarily money machines like the big clubs in England , Paris SG , etc but at the same time have to think about public safety ( safety of fans , players etc ) .
As above is mainly about football and conflict between Catalans who ( don`t ) want independence from Spain I listened to an interesting statement from one of Spain`s most famous football journalists Paco Gonzalez about Pep Guardiola and Xavi Hernandez`s verbal attacks on Spain but silence on human rights in Qatar where they have earned so much money without making statements on human rights . Certainly puts it all into perspective .

I am no expert and am repeating what may well be urban myths from what you say.

My views on the Guardia Civil are far from scientific, and are based on the very prejudices you mention, plus their behaviour when Rangers won the Cup Winners Cup.

As for the exhumation, speculation.

I know very little about Spain, and appreciate it as a complex issue. Your thoughts on the questions you ask would be very welcome.

I know what I don't know, and feel that some of the responses to the events in Catalonia need more explanation.

[CloudSquall]

https://mobile.twitter.com/BTVideoCl...52056061992960

Franco's boys back in action..

[danhibees1875]

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https://mobile.twitter.com/BTVideoCl...52056061992960

Franco's boys back in action..

That's disgusting.

[southsider]

Visca Catalonya Lliure. Spanish bombs sang Joe Strummer 40 years ago. How right he was.

[Cataplana]

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Visca Catalonya Lliure. Spanish bombs sang Joe Strummer 40 years ago. How right he was.

Unless, I am missing something in the lyrics, Catalonia doesn't get a look in. It was about a different subject altogether.

Spanish songs in Andalucía
The shooting sites in the days of '39
Oh, please, leave the ventana open
Federico Lorca is dead and gone
Bullet holes in the cemetery walls
The black cars of Guardia civil
Spanish bombs on the Costa Rica
I'm flying in on a DC-10 tonight
Spanish bombs, yo te quiero infinito
Yo te quiero, oh mi corazón
Spanish bombs, yo te quiero infinito
Yo te quiero, oh mi corazón
Spanish weeks in my disco casino
The freedom fighters died upon the hill
They sang the red flag
They wore the black one
But after they died it was mockingbird hill
Back home the buses went up in flashes
The Irish tomb was drenched in blood
Spanish bombs shatter the hotels
My señorita's rose was nipped in the bud
Spanish bombs, yo te quiero infinito
Yo te quiero, oh mi corazón
Spanish bombs, yo te quiero infinito
Yo te quiero, oh mi corazón
The hillsides ring with free the people
Or can I hear the echo from the days of '39?
With trenches full of poets
The ragged army, fixin' bayonets to fight the other line
Spanish bombs rock the province
I'm hearing music from another time
Spanish bombs on the Costa Brava
I'm flying in on a DC 10 tonight
Spanish bombs, yo te quiero infinito
Yo te quiero, oh mi corazón
Spanish bombs, yo te quiero infinito
Yo te quiero, oh mi corazón
Oh mi corazón...
Oh mi corazón...
Spanish songs in Andalucía, mandolina, oh mi corazón
Spanish songs in Granada, oh mi corazón
Oh mi corazón...
Oh mi corazón...
Oh mi corazón...
Oh mi corazón…

[Moulin Yarns]

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Unless, I am missing something in the lyrics, Catalonia doesn't get a look in. It was about a different subject altogether.

Spanish songs in Andalucía
The shooting sites in the days of '39
Oh, please, leave the ventana open
Federico Lorca is dead and gone
Bullet holes in the cemetery walls
The black cars of Guardia civil
Spanish bombs on the Costa Rica
I'm flying in on a DC-10 tonight
Spanish bombs, yo te quiero infinito
Yo te quiero, oh mi corazón
Spanish bombs, yo te quiero infinito
Yo te quiero, oh mi corazón
Spanish weeks in my disco casino
The freedom fighters died upon the hill
They sang the red flag
They wore the black one
But after they died it was mockingbird hill
Back home the buses went up in flashes
The Irish tomb was drenched in blood
Spanish bombs shatter the hotels
My señorita's rose was nipped in the bud
Spanish bombs, yo te quiero infinito
Yo te quiero, oh mi corazón
Spanish bombs, yo te quiero infinito
Yo te quiero, oh mi corazón
The hillsides ring with free the people
Or can I hear the echo from the days of '39?
With trenches full of poets
The ragged army, fixin' bayonets to fight the other line
Spanish bombs rock the province
I'm hearing music from another time
Spanish bombs on the COSTA BRAVA*
I'm flying in on a DC 10 tonight
Spanish bombs, yo te quiero infinito
Yo te quiero, oh mi corazón
Spanish bombs, yo te quiero infinito
Yo te quiero, oh mi corazón
Oh mi corazón...
Oh mi corazón...
Spanish songs in Andalucía, mandolina, oh mi corazón
Spanish songs in Granada, oh mi corazón
Oh mi corazón...
Oh mi corazón...
Oh mi corazón...
Oh mi corazón…

To borrow the lyrics of one of our songs

And if you Know your geography. ��

*The Costa Brava is part of Catalunia #justsaying

[southsider]

Oh mi corazon is in my heart. Does not really mater where but how and why. As a resident of Andalusia, neighbours I have spoken hate Madrid and how it runs Spain.

[Cataplana]

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Oh mi corazon is in my heart. Does not really mater where but how and why. As a resident of Andalusia, neighbours I have spoken hate Madrid and how it runs Spain.

Ok, I get it, doesn't matter what the issue is, whether it was the Civil War, or the Basques, Madrid makes a mess of it?

[Moulin Yarns]

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Ok, I get it, doesn't matter what the issue is, whether it was the Civil War, or the Basques, Madrid makes a mess of it?

Or even the Costa Brava which is mentioned in the lyrics.

[southsider]

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Or even the Costa Brava which is mentioned in the lyrics.

Correct, as does London.

[southsider]

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Or even the Costa Brava which is mentioned in the lyrics.

Correct, as does London.
Joe was so far ahead of his time. Was planting trees, Rebel Wood, long before most people had heard of climate change.

[Cataplana]

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Correct, as does London.

Also referenced in the song. Interesting to hear a Spanish perspective on it, as it is something I am always wary of discussing with people in Spain.

We used to take in Spanish students, and I soon learned that saying "Franco was a rat" was one of those things you just don't say. A bit like asking what school somebody went to here.

I remember two different girls, one recalled how the local head of the Guardia Civil wanted a new car, and her grandfather was ordered to hand his over; the other, was the daughter of lawyers from Granada, who worked for Real Madrid, she cringed when I told her my thoughts on Franco.

It's going to take a long time to heal, from what I can make out.

[southsider]

Jailing the Catalan leaders is a major own goal by Madrid. But like when London shot Connolly the hard liners became mote hard line and the waverers did so too.

[Cataplana]

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Jailing the Catalan leaders is a major own goal by Madrid. But like when London shot Connolly the hard liners became mote hard line and the waverers did so too.

Why do you think they took such a stupid measure? I agree it is never wise to create martyrs.