Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[Famous Fiver]

How dd Albion Rovers get kicked out of a cup for one minor indiscretion yet Rangers had players for years that were not properly registered and got kicked out of hee haw?

Something stinks.

[Baldy Foghorn]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

How dd Albion Rovers get kicked out of a cup for one minor indiscretion yet Rangers had players for years that were not properly registered and got kicked out of hee haw?

Something stinks.

Because the powers that be run "our" game for two teams only. The rest are not relevant.

[marinello59]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

How dd Albion Rovers get kicked out of a cup for one minor indiscretion yet Rangers had players for years that were not properly registered and got kicked out of hee haw?

Something stinks.

In Albion Rovers case it was a clear breach of the rules.
It's taken years to establish that EBTs were illegal and it is far from clear that they actually broke any rules as they stood a the time. I wish that wasn't the case but sadly it is.

[Ozyhibby]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Because the powers that be run "our" game for two teams only. The rest are not relevant.

Which is why people are asking questions. The clubs run our game, so it's up to us to ask why our club wants to just accept this.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Skol]

It is clear to everyone (although Rangers fans will deny it) that there is no need to strip titles as the only titles won by the Rangers are the three lower league titles which were won fairly and squarely.

Rangers can continue to claim as they please, but just look silly as a result

[blackpoolhibs]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

In Albion Rovers case it was a clear breach of the rules.
It's taken years to establish that EBTs were illegal and it is far from clear that they actually broke any rules as they stood a the time. I wish that wasn't the case but sadly it is.

They hid the side letters at the time, which was as clear a breach of rules as you could get.

[Baldy Foghorn]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Which is why people are asking questions. The clubs run our game, so it's up to us to ask why our club wants to just accept this.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's something you will have to ask the Execs, not the volunteers

[marinello59]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

They hid the side letters at the time, which was as clear a breach of rules as you could get.

Not at the time it wasn't. I'm not defending Sevco by the way. I wish Ibrox was flats now.

[grunt]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Not at the time it wasn't. I'm not defending Sevco by the way. I wish Ibrox was flats now.

Are you sure about that? Do you mean that at some point in the past it was ok to not report part of a player's remuneration to the SFA?

[stantonhibby]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Are you sure about that? Do you mean that at some point in the past it was ok to not report part of a player's remuneration to the SFA?

I assume he means that at the time it wasnt widely known about the side letters.

[grunt]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I assume he means that at the time it wasnt widely known about the side letters.

That's kind of my point.

[blackpoolhibs]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I assume he means that at the time it wasnt widely known about the side letters.

The reason nobody knew about those side letters, was because they hid them. Rangers hid the side letters and was a clear breach of the rules AT THAT TIME.

[stantonhibby]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

The reason nobody knew about those side letters, was because they hid them. Rangers hid the side letters and was a clear breach of the rules AT THAT TIME.

Yeah I know that.

[marinello59]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Are you sure about that? Do you mean that at some point in the past it was ok to not report part of a player's remuneration to the SFA?

No.
I mean it wasn't clear that was what had happened at the time.

[majorhibs]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

The reason nobody knew about those side letters, was because they hid them. Rangers hid the side letters and was a clear breach of the rules AT THAT TIME.

How come even some of our ain still incredibly try to defend that? Guilty as sin! Everyone knows! You'd expect the guilty to try to deflect of course. But "Hibbies" that went to games to see gascoigne laudrup etc beating Hibs & they were only there because they were getting sneaky untaxed side payments, what exactly is the motivation in trying to to defend such breaches of the rules. SIDE LETTERS!

[Jack Hackett]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

No.
I mean it wasn't clear that was what had happened at the time.

It is clear now though. The fact that they lied to hide a breach of the rules should not be time barred. Such a ruling would be a travesty of justice and renders the very existence of rules a farce.

[marinello59]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

How come even some of our ain still incredibly try to defend that? Guilty as sin! Everyone knows! You'd expect the guilty to try to deflect of course. But "Hibbies" that went to games to see gascoigne laudrup etc beating Hibs & they were only there because they were getting sneaky untaxed side payments, what exactly is the motivation in trying to to defend such breaches of the rules. SIDE LETTERS!

I don't see anybody defending it.
Rangers and Celtic were financially well out of sight of us at that time without the EBTs. They fixed a two horse race. They cheated when they really didn't have to.

[Radium]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

That's something you will have to ask the Execs, not the volunteers

A reasonable suggestion that perhaps lays bare the issue the Reps are facing.

Good PR and a route for fans to contact the club. Representation when others are not available.
But ultimately not part of the inner circle

Our Chairman is currently Vice President at the SFA, the organisation that has failed spectacularly in it's duty to look after the game. He is also the current chair of the Professional Game board. Given how poor (non existent would be another description) the SFAs response was to the EBT ruling I don't sit completely surprised at the silence from ER. We do have someone in a position of influence though.

ATM the Reps appear to been painted into a corner. Their next update will be scrutinised and if it contains nothing on this they will have been hung out to dry. The club could sort this with a statement, irrespective of how tepid.

A sad, and unintended consequence of this seems to be that the updates from the Reps has stopped.

I do think that this situation should moderate any expectations around an HSL director as well - exercising the voting rights will be HSLs strongest card.

Part of the reason I think there is a need for scrutiny, is that I am yet to be convinced that there is anything in place to effectively deal with clubs that live beyond their means.

As an aside, Doncaster made a big play of being prepared to meet fans groups to discuss the SPFL position. Have we had any groups contacted?




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Ozyhibby]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I don't see anybody defending it.
Rangers and Celtic were financially well out of sight of us at that time without the EBTs. They fixed a two horse race. They cheated when they really didn't have to.

Look how beatable the new club are without the ebt's. We need to make sure they can never do it again. We can only do that by finding out how they got away with it in the first place and strengthening the rules.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[marinello59]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Look how beatable the new club are without the ebt's. We need to make sure they can never do it again. We can only do that by finding out how they got away with it in the first place and strengthening the rules.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

They're beatable because they were relegated and have failed to rebuild. You can't compare the Rangers team back then and Sevco today.
I totally agree, the priority has to be making what they did a clear breach of the rules. They got away with it because they saw a loophole and exploited it.

[ballengeich]

Rangers were found guilty of not registering players correctly so there were rules in place. Lord Nimmo-Smith's commission fined them £250,000 for it. The question is why the commission thought a fine was appropriate when other clubs, most recently Albion Rovers, have been kicked out of tournaments for minor mistakes in registration.

Rangers' punishment was the equivalent of a thief who's stolen £10,000 being fined £250 and being allowed to keep the stolen goods.

[lapsedhibee]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

They're beatable because they were relegated and have failed to rebuild. You can't compare the Rangers team back then and Sevco today.
I totally agree, the priority has to be making what they did a clear breach of the rules. They got away with it because they saw a loophole and exploited it.

You're having an off day today M59.

[Ozyhibby]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

They're beatable because they were relegated and have failed to rebuild. You can't compare the Rangers team back then and Sevco today.
I totally agree, the priority has to be making what they did a clear breach of the rules. They got away with it because they saw a loophole and exploited it.

There was no loophole. It was against the rules to pay players outside their contract.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[marinello59]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

There was no loophole. It was against the rules to pay players outside their contract.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

But who knew at the time that was what EBT's were doing? Rangers weren't the only club to use them.
Actually I don't know why I am still in this conversation. I was only trying to go give reasons for the club and supporters directors silence.

[majorhibs]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I don't see anybody defending it.
Rangers and Celtic were financially well out of sight of us at that time without the EBTs. They fixed a two horse race. They cheated when they really didn't have to.

You are defending it, & we all know they were cheating. Why?

[marinello59]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

You are defending it, & we all know they were cheating. Why?

Point out where I am defending it. I've given reasons why I think it's not easy for the club to issue a statement aligned with those of a few Celtic bloggers. I have defended nothing.

[Crazyhorse]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

There was no loophole. It was against the rules to pay players outside their contract.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

This has always been the key point. The broke the rules and they knew they were breaking the rules. They were then subsequently caught, just as many cheats in other sports have been caught after the event, and like those other cheats they should now be punished for that cheating by having the prizes they won taken away.
The current sevco are irrelevant in all this. It is the Rangers which were liquidated in 2012 which should be punished. It is a bit like discovering a dead Olympic athlete who won gold was actually a drugs cheat, the IOC would still strip them of their gold medal.

[grunt]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

You're having an off day today M59.

:)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[marinello59]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

You're having an off day today M59.

Ozy's post suggested if they hadn't used EBTs they would have been easily beatable back then, much as they are now. That's not true. Even without the EBTs they would have been miles ahead of us. They cheated to win their two horse race with Celtic.

[majorhibs]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

They're beatable because they were relegated and have failed to rebuild. You can't compare the Rangers team back then and Sevco today.
I totally agree, the priority has to be making what they did a clear breach of the rules. They got away with it because they saw a loophole and exploited it.

No! No! No! The priority is NOT what you think! If even 1 X Hibs fan is disgruntled because they paid money to watch their team for 10 years try to win, while another team cheated sneakily & won most of the honours because of that cheating, ( & Dinnae come back wi any nonsense please, they had players so far out of reach of ALL our league, because they paid them EBTs, but got caught because of SIDE LETTERS) so please go back in your box because there is A LOT more than 1 disgruntled fan resentful at having been cheated for 10 years, who will not come close to closure until the right thing is done here. & your references earlier to celtic blogs & nonsense earlier is shameful! Personally I think of only Hibs & the damage done to Hibs here. I do not think I am alone in that! But you crack on with your agenda & brand folk at odds with YOUR views why don't you.