Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[HoboHarry]

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All those leagues and trophies we won before this and since its been brought out ,it certainly adds weight to your argument

Aye that's the spirit. We weren't very good so everyone else should have the right to cheat.

[ian cruise]

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You are defending the indefensible. Until sevco, cheating has always been punished in sport and regardless of our current expenditure we were competing on a playing field that was even more out of level than we had believed.

You're missing my point. I'm not defending Rangers but the original OP said he was needing to recoup money he lost due to their actions, which is nonsense. There is plenty of evidence to condemn Rangers but let's not just go making stuff up or claiming withholding support from Hibs is thw morally correct way to punish Rangers.

[Ozyhibby]

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All those leagues and trophies we won before this and since its been brought out ,it certainly adds weight to your argument

Actually since Rangers got caught, our cup comps have been spread around nicely and we have won the Scottish.


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[HoboHarry]

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Easy to understand (IMHO) they've all been told keep quiet and don't rock the boat. It's a disgrace and will continue to be while the corrupt SPFL caters to only two teams.

I get that Budge has been railroaded into keeping quiet but why would she agree since she was supposed to be part of a new dynamic? She has been corrupted just like the rest but I would like to know what it is that makes them all bow to Sevco.

[JeMeSouviens]

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Actually since Rangers got caught, our cup comps have been spread around nicely and we have won the Scottish.


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And the Sheep in particular were closing the gap to Celtc a bit. That's gone a bit backwards with the arrival of Sevco in the top league pushing Celtc ST numbers back up and pressuring their board to get Rodgers in.

[Stubbsy2016]

https://mobile.twitter.com/thefootys...73583910998016

A new one for the songbook, how simple can you get...

[ian cruise]

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Actually since Rangers got caught, our cup comps have been spread around nicely and we have won the Scottish.


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A valid point. I don't disagree that having Rangers compete on an equal footing (i.e. paying what they can afford for players) increases the chances of other clubs winning trophies. I don't see what stripping trophies retrospectively gains other than giving us something to cast over them. The club and the fans will ignore it, some may get wound up granted, but in the main it's the equivalent of putting a big sign saying SHAME round their neck and walking them up and down the length of the country. Will it determine other clubs? I suspect not as they're not retrospectively being asked to hand back their winnings. The fans still remember the players with the trophies in their hands, the club still has pictures of the players lifting the trophies and the players have their medals. Rangers argue they could have afforded them anyway so the onus is on the accuser, SPFL or whoever to prove they couldn't even though the tax would have been higher.

A more suitable punishment would be a signing embargo alongside a fine for previously nor declaring contracts as the rules demanded. That's an acknowledgement the previous entity did wrong and if they are, as claimed, the same club then the team currently playing in the SPFL should carry the punishment.

My point is that saying you're not giving Hibs any money doesn't punish Rangers in any way unless we were complicit at the time and ignored it.

[ian cruise]

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And the Sheep in particular were closing the gap to Celtc a bit. That's gone a bit backwards with the arrival of Sevco in the top league pushing Celtc ST numbers back up and pressuring their board to get Rodgers in.

Arguable that is more to do with Delia being very, very poor. Celtic needed more CL football rather than just two legs and would have pushed for a signing of Rodgers standing anyway in my opinion. They need the world to think of the as a big club.

[MrSmith]

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You're missing my point. I'm not defending Rangers but the original OP said he was needing to recoup money he lost due to their actions, which is nonsense. There is plenty of evidence to condemn Rangers but let's not just go making stuff up or claiming withholding support from Hibs is thw morally correct way to punish Rangers.

Spectacularly wrong. My club hibs, should be at the forefront of justice in regards to rangers cheating. They are not and are complicit in the 5-way agreement and allowing this farcical merry go round to continue. Why should I now put my hard earned in?

[plhibs]

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I get that Budge has been railroaded into keeping quiet but why would she agree since she was supposed to be part of a new dynamic? She has been corrupted just like the rest but I would like to know what it is that makes them all bow to Sevco.

The SPFL wants this to go away, no other explanation. I think they all want to protect themselves and don't want anymore dirt raked up about the whole sorry mess.

[Bostonhibby]

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Spectacularly wrong. My club hibs, should be at the forefront of justice in regards to rangers cheating. They are not and are complicit in the 5-way agreement and allowing this farcical merry go round to continue. Why should I now put my hard earned in?

Sadly. I think when we do get a statement from Hibs this will be essentially correct however the club choose to dress it up.

I will be spending everything I always do on Hibs but respect everyone who supports us has the right to do what they like with their hard earner dosh.

However they dress it up, the now defunct glasgow rangers got an on field advantage as a result of the fiddle they operated to ensure they could pay more money to players they couldn't otherwise attract, and their rivals who didn't cheat in this way couldn't afford. It sticks in the throat whenever I think about the "sporting integrity" statement.

[ian cruise]

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Spectacularly wrong. My club hibs, should be at the forefront of justice in regards to rangers cheating. They are not and are complicit in the 5-way agreement and allowing this farcical merry go round to continue. Why should I now put my hard earned in?

That's a different argument. Withholding funds and/or support because you disagree with what they have decided to do as retrospective punishment to the uncovering of prior cheating is different from recouping lost money that you previously spent. So I'm not spectacularly wrong, you're just changing your reason for not giving Hibs money. Something I entirely agree is you decision to do regardless of the reason, and if it is the latter reason you've given, it's a valid and strong point, but it's not recouping a loss.

[greenginger]

Can The Rangers just not be made to face the truth that they are a new Club and what was won by the liquidated club Rangers 1872 does not belong on their trophy list so the cheating is history.

The fact is the only senior prize this Club has is a Scottish Cup runners up 2016 award.

[MrSmith]

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That's a different argument. Withholding funds and/or support because you disagree with what they have decided to do as retrospective punishment to the uncovering of prior cheating is different from recouping lost money that you previously spent. So I'm not spectacularly wrong, you're just changing your reason for not giving Hibs money. Something I entirely agree is you decision to do regardless of the reason, and if it is the latter reason you've given, it's a valid and strong point, but it's not recouping a loss.

the point is, there is no two arguments or more! There is duplicity and complicity in it all and has brought about a situation of which has killed our game in terms of sporting fairness. Again, our club should be at the forefront screaming for justice along with those others who have suffered - over the period - due to keeping their house in order. We the fans, have footed the bill that enabled rangers to be successful through non payment of tax and NI. ITS ILLEGAL, CHEATING AND NEEDS ADDRESSED.

[MrSmith]

Until then, I will not put any money into my team till it proves it is not complicit nor guilty by association. Have hibs proved this?

[Blaster]

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Until then, I will not put any money into my team till it proves it is not complicit nor guilty by association. Have hibs proved this?

Punishing your club for rangers misbehaving

Cracking logic 👍👍

[MrSmith]

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Punishing your club for rangers misbehaving

Cracking logic 👍👍

No I'm punishing a lack of courage and justice. Our club is complicit.

[MrSmith]

Why were the SPL determined to get rid of David Longmuir? Look him up. He spoke up for the teams in the lower divisions and refused SEVCO entry at division 1. This whole episode stinks! Why can't we get info on the 5-way agreement? What did they do? Sold Scottish football's soul? Certainly seems that way.

[Blaster]

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No I'm punishing a lack of courage and justice. Our club is complicit.

My club is more important to me than due punishment to rangers (which we would all like to happen but unfortunately isn't going to happen now)

By punishing hibs you are effectively benefitting other clubs including The Rangers.

[MrSmith]

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My club is more important to me than due punishment to rangers (which we would all like to happen but unfortunately isn't going to happen now)

By punishing hibs you are effectively benefitting other clubs including The Rangers.

Yep lets do nothing and accept cheating. Sorry no can do.

[Blaster]

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Yep lets do nothing and accept cheating. Sorry no can do.

I think it stinks too. But still can't fathom out why any hibs fan would take it out financially on their own club

[connerg]

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Until then, I will not put any money into my team till it proves it is not complicit nor guilty by association. Have hibs proved this?

Must admit i've considered walking away from Scottish football since the The Rangers and Hearts were caught.

[Smartie]

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I think it stinks too. But still can't fathom out why any hibs fan would take it out financially on their own club

That argument is the emotional blackmail that I expect will be heaped on us the next time we're being asked to stump up for season tickets, from Hibs and from our own fans.

Hibs happily took decent sums off us for season tickets for a rigged competition, and our representatives are complicit in the current whitewashing.

Rangers shouldn't have been allowed to play in Europe this season, our authorities fudged it.

Do you have any faith in our current authorities to run a fair competition? I don't.

And as long as Hibs have 12,000 people pitching up wanting season tickets they won't care either.

Hibs are complicit in the cover up, sell season tickets for rigged competitions and a decent argument could be made that they deserve to be hurt in some way.

Which is sad. I loved it when Rod "sporting integrity" Petrie was leading from the front.

[jacomo]

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Until then, I will not put any money into my team till it proves it is not complicit nor guilty by association. Have hibs proved this?

Hibs are neither complicit in cheating nor guilty by association.

The authorities have given themselves legal cover not to retrospectively strip titles from Deadco. That is a separate argument.

[Blaster]

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That argument is the emotional blackmail that I expect will be heaped on us the next time we're being asked to stump up for season tickets, from Hibs and from our own fans.

Hibs happily took decent sums off us for season tickets for a rigged competition, and our representatives are complicit in the current whitewashing.

Rangers shouldn't have been allowed to play in Europe this season, our authorities fudged it.

Do you have any faith in our current authorities to run a fair competition? I don't.

And as long as Hibs have 12,000 people pitching up wanting season tickets they won't care either.

Hibs are complicit in the cover up, sell season tickets for rigged competitions and a decent argument could be made that they deserve to be hurt in some way.

Which is sad. I loved it when Rod "sporting integrity" Petrie was leading from the front.

I don't have faith in governments but still pay my taxes 😄

Most of the time......

[Smartie]

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I don't have faith in governments but still pay my taxes 😄

Most of the time......

Most folk don't have any choice about whether or not to pay tax.

The purchase of a season ticket is a different matter.

[stantonhibby]

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Most folk don't have any choice about whether or not to pay tax.

The purchase of a season ticket is a different matter.

The season tickets were sold in good faith at the time as no one other than Rangers knew it was a rigged competition.

[Smartie]

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The season tickets were sold in good faith at the time as no one other than Rangers knew it was a rigged competition.

True.

I'm less concerned about what has gone on in the past. I'm not as militant as some about title-stripping but i think it would be a helpful part of the rehabilitation.

Of far more concern to me is that it appears that no lessons have been learned. Certain clubs are being given preferential treatment. Most of the people who were involved around the time of Sevco's rebirth, the 5-way agreement and the misleading of Lord Nimmo-Smith are all still in positions of influence.

I'm still going to go along this season as I've already paid for it.

I'll think long and hard next season.

I just want to see a fair competition and I'm not remotely convinced that it is.

[Hibrandenburg]

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Not buying season tix nor home or away strips for my three boys this year. Need to recoup over a decade of putting money into a rigged league. Chew on that Rod!

[MrSmith]

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Hibs are neither complicit in cheating nor guilty by association.

The authorities have given themselves legal cover not to retrospectively strip titles from Deadco. That is a separate argument.

We are complicit in the 5-way agreement plus allowing this farce to continue. Rod as part of the SFA/SPFL could've done more to ensure fairness and transparency as well as determining rules re cheating. Has he done enough?