Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[CropleyWasGod]

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Can't imagine that will excuse them in law, especially given the evidence we have heard thus far. I can see this trial collapsing fairly soon at this rate.......

Seems to me that Donald Findlay is playing a blinder here......

There's lots still to play for yet.

The Ticketus evidence will be crucial, and then there's the Duff & Phelps guys. I am wondering if the reason that the charges against them were dropped was to persuade them to be the star witnesses for the Crown.

You're right about DF though. 😆

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[s.a.m]

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There's lots still to play for yet.

The Ticketus evidence will be crucial, and then there's the Duff & Phelps guys. I am wondering if the reason that the charges against them were dropped was to persuade them to be the star witnesses for the Crown.

You're right about DF though. 😆

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Turning Queen's evidence...against the Queen's Eleven?

[O'Rourke3]

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Seems to me that Donald Findlay is playing a blinder here......

He'll release that album of folk songs if he wins and cash in on the publicity.

[Jack]

Two things strike me reading the transcript.

What a shower of arrogant @#£%&-+s the rangers board were.

The ongoings then could only be eclipsed by what's going on now!

[Joe6-2]

Can anyone tell me what's the worst that can happen to them?

[lapsedhibee]

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Can anyone tell me what's the worst that can happen to them?

Worst thing that can happen to a hun is to have its blood analysed and discovered to be kafflick.

[ehf]

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There's lots still to play for yet.

The Ticketus evidence will be crucial, and then there's the Duff & Phelps guys. I am wondering if the reason that the charges against them were dropped was to persuade them to be the star witnesses for the Crown.

You're right about DF though. 😆

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In the pantheon of shameful trials the Scottish criminal justice system has perpetrated over the last few decades, I never thought anything would top Lockerbie but this is going to come close.

It is obvious that Whyte was the sucker/patsy in all this. A scandalous waste of public money for COPFS to proceed with these charges. Mesmerising entertainment, though

[Skol]

Findlay's position here is intruiging.

He was a member of that board and presumably knows a lot of 'stuff'. I dont think he was still on the board at the time though having been caught on camera with some FTP type banter!

You would have thought there may be some loyalty, but maybe he wants revenge.

Add to that, for all that he is an unsavoury character, he is pretty clever and knows his stuff.

My money would be on Findlay winning

[Colr]

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Seems to me that Donald Findlay is playing a blinder here......

Findlay objected to me being on a jury once. (For which I was grateful).

[jacomo]

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Findlay's position here is intruiging.

He was a member of that board and presumably knows a lot of 'stuff'. I dont think he was still on the board at the time though having been caught on camera with some FTP type banter!

You would have thought there may be some loyalty, but maybe he wants revenge.

Add to that, for all that he is an unsavoury character, he is pretty clever and knows his stuff.

My money would be on Findlay winning

Maybe he felt hung out to dry by the rest of the Board when he had to resign after signing The Sash?

Maybe the whole Board liked to get together and sing songs?

The fact that an ex vice Chair of Rangers is playing such a prominent role in this case raises questions. Scotland eh?

[JeMeSouviens]

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Findlay's position here is intruiging.

He was a member of that board and presumably knows a lot of 'stuff'. I dont think he was still on the board at the time though having been caught on camera with some FTP type banter!

You would have thought there may be some loyalty, but maybe he wants revenge.

Add to that, for all that he is an unsavoury character, he is pretty clever and knows his stuff.

My money would be on Findlay winning

He was long gone by 10 years or more by the time of these events. David Murray was no longer on the board either. Not sure if he overlapped with any of the board at the time of the Whyte takeover.

[Deansy]

Wonder if Donald Findlay is the first lawyer - out of all the lawyers involved in all the court-cases that've arisen from them being caught cheating, began - that hasn't received death-threats and hasn't required protection and safety-advice from the 'Special Branch' ?.

[AndyM_1875]

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Findlay's position here is intruiging.

He was a member of that board and presumably knows a lot of 'stuff'. I dont think he was still on the board at the time though having been caught on camera with some FTP type banter!

You would have thought there may be some loyalty, but maybe he wants revenge.

Add to that, for all that he is an unsavoury character, he is pretty clever and knows his stuff.

My money would be on Findlay winning

Perhaps. He was dropped like a hot toley by Murray and the Rangers board after his well documented pished up sing song. So there will be an element of "afters" from him doubtlessly.

I wouldn't say he's unsavoury, he's a QC and a very experienced one. He has the reputation for taking 'unwinnable' cases and wrecking them by ripping apart the Fiscal's cases. There are a number of absolute villans walking at liberty because of him. And don't confuse his cartoon image for some halfwitted knuckle dragging FTP Orange type. He's an atheist and has no time for God botherers of any type.

[Brunswickbill]

I remember reading that CW had claimed the film rights to the takeover. I said at the time that it would be a unique movie as it would be the only one I know of where all the characters are baddies. After reading what's going on at the trial, I rest my case m'lud.

[Bostonhibby]

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Perhaps. He was dropped like a hot toley by Murray and the Rangers board after his well documented pished up sing song. So there will be an element of "afters" from him doubtlessly.

I wouldn't say he's unsavoury, he's a QC and a very experienced one. He has the reputation for taking 'unwinnable' cases and wrecking them by ripping apart the Fiscal's cases. There are a number of absolute villans walking at liberty because of him. And don't confuse his cartoon image for some halfwitted knuckle dragging FTP Orange type. He's an atheist and has no time for God botherers of any type.

My friend is a lawyer in Edinburgh and he says exactly the same thing about Findlay.

That said still can't help thinking it's a giant masonic conspiracy to hang all the blame on Whyte and gloss over all the other stuff with the help of a the rangers friendly meejah.



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[AndyM_1875]

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My friend is a lawyer in Edinburgh and he says exactly the same thing about Findlay.

That said still can't help thinking it's a giant masonic conspiracy to hang all the blame on Whyte and gloss over all the other stuff with the help of a the rangers friendly meejah.



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Sellik Mick from Carfin told me the same thing

[Bostonhibby]

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Sellik Mick from Carfin told me the same thing

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[Moulin Yarns]

Star Wars Day


First witness of the day, Michael McGill


Murray GroupFinance Director

[JeMeSouviens]

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Perhaps. He was dropped like a hot toley by Murray and the Rangers board after his well documented pished up sing song. So there will be an element of "afters" from him doubtlessly.

I wouldn't say he's unsavoury, he's a QC and a very experienced one. He has the reputation for taking 'unwinnable' cases and wrecking them by ripping apart the Fiscal's cases. There are a number of absolute villans walking at liberty because of him. And don't confuse his cartoon image for some halfwitted knuckle dragging FTP Orange type. He's an atheist and has no time for God botherers of any type.

According to Findlay's own account, he called Murray to resign from the board as soon as he was aware it was in the papers.

[Moulin Yarns]

And we are off and running

McGill asked to explain difference betweenadministration and liquidation. Says first is attempt to save a company, latteris end of it

McGill asked about a "pre-packadministration" Says is when a company goes into administration with abuyer arranged in advance.

McGill says no banking guarantee betweenthe football club and the wider group. Bank could not make Murray Group payclub debts

McGill: in December 2005 Murray groupinvested £57.1m in Rangers to "reduce indebtedness'

Witness says economic downturn in 2008 hada big impact on the group, Murray International Metals sold along with otherbusinesses

McGill says aim in Project Charlotte was tosell assets and reduce debt. "Rangers by its nature took adisproportionate amount of time"

McGill says Rangers generated little valuefor the group

"Not a huge amount of interest inacquiring Murray's share in the club" McGill tells the court

Withess says there was a bid from aconsortium led by Andrew Ellis in 2010.

Two individuals introduced by the brotherof an English premier league manager, said they had €50m, proof of funds letter"fraudulent"

A bid for Rangers from a Lithuanian bank was rejected asthere were fears it was linked to money laundering and organised crime

Main conditions of sale were bank debteliminated and investment into the club McGill says.

McGill says any bid for the shares thatdidn't include investment into the club; "isn't something we would haveconsidered"

Bank of Scotland funded 10 of the 12Scottish premier football clubs McGill says but after takeover by Lloyd'swanted out of sector

McGill says club was introduced to Whyte byAndrew Ellis.

TEA BREAK

[mim]

I wonder which of the many Lithuanian banks he is meaning??

[Moulin Yarns]

Hearts were already 'owned' by Ukios Bankas by the time of Craig Whyte's takeover at Rangers.

Tea break over


McGill says club had performed well in2009/2010 season and gained access to the Champions League. No longer"actively seeking" to sell club

McGill says he was not aware of anypressure from Lloyds bank to sell the club, Murray group still "open tooffers" though

Bank not a party to proposed sale but dueto debt "had to be involved" McGill says

McGill says he was aware of Ticketus,agrees their parent company was called "Octopus"

McGill says Rangers could not gain aconsumer credit licence to take direct debit payments "because of one ofthe directors" (WHO?)

McGill says in 2009 club looked like wasgoing breach bank credit facility, money borrowed from Ticketus, £5-6m thatyear and again in 2010

McGill says Ticketus took control of someseats in the stadium, repayment when season tickets sold for these

McGill says Ticketus transaction did notappear on accounts as funds advanced in October and repaid in April, "norequirement to disclose"

Hence no liability when accounts produced

McGill says no desire to hide Ticketustransaction but they "recognised for some fans would be a sensitiveissue"

McGill says lawyer Gary Withey said he hadseen a proof of funds letter from a "UK financial institution" Emailconfirmation shown in court

McGill says proof of funds letter gave"comfort that the bidder had the funds to continue" allowed bidder to"kick the tyres"

Advocate Depute "Did you know the firmCollyer Bristow?" McGill "I had walked past their office"

McGill says he first met Whyte in London inlate 2010 to discuss transaction and the "Independent committee"

McGill says Independent committee was setup to represent minority shareholders. Any offer to majority shareholder mustbe made to all

McGill says "At all times My Whyteassured us the funds were coming from his personal resources" says thesewere verbal assurances not email

McGill says he has "no recollectionwhatever" of discussing a wider use of Ticketus by Whyte

McGill says initial deal was £5.5m for 100%of the shares Later reduced to a "notional pound"

"It was a £27.5m transaction, not apound" McGill tells the court

McGill says Whyte told him the £5m workingcapital for the deal was "coming from a recognised UK financialinstitution" rest from own funds

McGill says he had no knowledge Whyte wasusing 3 years of future season ticket income to finance purchase.

McGill says the Rangers board were"generally not supportive" of sale. Wanted funding for big tax caseif lost. "Not an issue for Murray"

McGill "we could have sold or walkedaway" but wanted to see investment in the club

McGill "The football club is rather anunusual asset which carries press a PR responsibilities" Murray didn'twant to just "walk away"

McGill, David Murray's sole concern was tosee investment in the club




LUNCH

[Geo_1875]

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Hearts were already 'owned' by Ukios Bankas by the time of Craig Whyte's takeover at Rangers.

Maybe Vlad realised he'd bought the wee Huns by mistake and wanted to trade them in for something bigger?

[Moulin Yarns]

Afternoon session



McGill says Murray asked repeatedly forWhyte to deposit funds into a "client account" held by a solicitors

McGill says he did not think Withey letterwas sufficient proof of funds, but was enough to "open the door of thedata room"

Court shown letter from Collyer Bristow re"project Charlotte" says "Newco" will have sufficient funds

McGill says "Newco" was thecompany being set up to carry out the acquisition

Letter goes on to say Whyte's​ company wasthe beneficial owner of Liberty Capital, based in the Virgin islands

Letter "The share capital of Newcowill be owned by Andrew Ellis (tba %) Chris Akers (tba%) and Liberty Capital(75%) Tba-To be Arranged

Letter "Total financial requirementsfor Project Charlotte is £33m' "None of the finance to be secured againstthe assets of the target."

Email from Craig Whyte to McGill April 222011: "As discussed have attached update on working capital..£5m pa forplayers"

Email also mentions additional workingcapital from Ticketus

McGill reply to Whyte "We have not hadsufficient comfort on the issue of working capital"

McGill "The last thing we wanted wassomeone to buy the club on day one then go bust the next week"

Gary Withey email to McGill, says Wavetowerhas access to £5m in working capital from a "UK financialinstitution"

31 March email from Gary Withey: "I ampleased to confirm I now have access to the funds to complete thetransaction"

McGill, "that wasn't enough for us ashaving access to the funds not the same as having them." Still wanteddeposit into client account

McGill email to on same day re funds:"I think it would be helpful to know how much you have received and howmuch you are waiting on"

Witness now being asked about SharePurchase Agreement between Whyte and Murray, says in corporate terms is"concise"

McGill says under the impression "Allthe funds were resting in the account of Collyer Bristow"

Says if he had known funds came fromTicketus would not have completed transaction, not legacy Murray wanted toleave behind


McGill reading all 27 pages of SharePurchase Agreement



Afternoon Tea Break

[greenginger]

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I wonder which of the many Lithuanian banks he is meaning??

Not necessarily the Ukio.

There was another Lith. bank , the Snoras or something that was funding Portsmouth and its Lith. owner .

It went down the tubes about a year before Vlad did his disappearing act to Moscow for err , em health reasons.

[Eyrie]

Tom English jeopardising his continued employment by the BBC with an article asking awkward questions about King. Nothing new in there, but good to see the MSM finally allowing something other than a servile attitude to Sevco.

[ancient hibee]

Unfair.ThevBBC investigations team worked hard to expose Rangers cheating.

[Bostonhibby]

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Unfair.ThevBBC investigations team worked hard to expose Rangers cheating.

Indeed, pretty early on in the whole mess I am pretty sure someone tipped them off that it was them kaffliks wot dun it so they closed down all semblance of investigations there and then as you would expect from a serious national news agency.

[seanshow]

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Afternoon session

Afternoon Tea Break

Thanks for all the updates

was there anymore before close of play.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Thanks for all the updates

was there anymore before close of play.

McGill was reading all 27 pages of the Share Purchase Agreement. This may take some time. 😁

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