Scottish Independence

[TrinityHibs]

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A wee bit of statisitcs to throw a wee bit of perspective, (especially for one of the No campaigners on here )

The total Electorate is 4,283,392
The total No vote is 2,001,392

So only 46.7% of the electorate voted in favour of NO, meaning 53.3% didn't get the result they wanted.

This is just like every election, isn't it?

Its a much stronger argument to say that by not voting you are tacitly accepting the decision of those that do so you are getting exactly what you wanted and deserved. The turn out on both sides was outstanding and I would be very surprised if we ever see numbers like that again unless promises are not kept in which case %'s could well be up and the decision different.

[Moulin Yarns]

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- 'Guess' campaign...I mean, 'Yes' campaign maths.

4,283,392 total electorate
3,619,915 total votes cast

663,477 of the electorate therefore did not vote - How can you possibly assume that these people did not get what they wanted?

The clue was in the smilies.

It was aimed at one particular contributer who repeatedly claimed that he never got what government he votes for.

[Jones28]

I'm not going to pretend that I'm not a wee bit gutted, but this is what democracy is.

Humble in victory, gracious in defeat.

Change is coming in Scotland and this is the start of the change that most of the country has been craving.

[JeMeSouviens]

Beyond gutted, I feel like my country has voted itself out of existence. Hopefully won't feel like that for ever.

Enjoy your celebrations No people. I think even some of you may see it as a pyrrhic victory in the end. "English votes for English laws" doesn't sound like what the Labour bods had in mind.

Thanks to all, Yes and No, that contributed to a great thread. Lots of good points mostly well argued I thought. Where I crossed the line, I re-apologise.

[The Harp Awakes]

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Sickened by this result. What an opportunity, let down by our own.

Will never vote for Labour ever again.

Have to say that I'm totally gutted with the referendum outcome and it will take long time for me to get over this lost opportunity. It's wrong however to criticise those who voted no. Everyone has their own reasons for voting the way they did and we need to respect that and move on.

This result though will have repercussions for the organisations who got their hands dirty with the part they played in the debate. In particular the hypocrisy of the Labour Party in Scotland is truly stunning. A chance to improve the lives of the poorest people in Scotland, the people they are supposed to represent, and they sacrifice that opportunity to protect the jobs of their Westminster elite. I believe they will suffer a backlash in future elections and they deserve everything they get. The BBC also have questions to answer and I really hope there is an independent inquiry into the way they have covered the campaign particularly over the last 2 weeks. Standard Life, Asda, Sainsburys, RBS, Clydesdale Bank and all the other businesses who tried to influence people's voting intentions at such a late stage, will also face repercussions I would expect. They will lose customers as a result.

The most striking images for me in the BBC's election coverage overnight though were those from the gatherings of the respective camps to each result. On the No side you had a slap up jamboree of Hooray Henrys raising their wine glasses in the air and on the Yes side you had scenes from some city centre back office with activists at their desks.

This was a result for the 'haves' over the 'have nots'. Triumph for self-interest over social justice. A sad day for Scotland.

[Hibby Bairn]

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- 'Guess' campaign...I mean, 'Yes' campaign maths.

4,283,392 total electorate
3,619,915 total votes cast

663,477 of the electorate therefore did not vote - How can you possibly assume that these people did not get what they wanted?

663,477 did not vote. I just don't get that. Why did they choose not to vote?

I mean six hundred thousand people!

[calumhibee1]

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Have to say that I'm totally gutted with the referendum outcome and it will take long time for me to get over this lost opportunity. It's wrong however to criticise those who voted no. Everyone has their own reasons for voting the way they did and we need to respect that and move on.

This result though will have repercussions for the organisations who got their hands dirty with the part they played in the debate. In particular the hypocrisy of the Labour Party in Scotland is truly stunning. A chance to improve the lives of the poorest people in Scotland, the people they are supposed to represent, and they sacrifice that opportunity to protect the jobs of their Westminster elite. I believe they will suffer a backlash in future elections and they deserve everything they get. The BBC also have questions to answer and I really hope there is an independent inquiry into the way they have covered the campaign particularly over the last 2 weeks. Standard Life, Asda, Sainsburys, RBS, Clydesdale Bank and all the other businesses who tried to influence people's voting intentions at such a late stage, will also face repercussions I would expect. They will lose customers as a result.

The most striking images for me in the BBC's election coverage overnight though were those from the gatherings of the respective camps to each result. On the No side you had a slap up jamboree of Hooray Henrys raising their wine glasses in the air and on the Yes side you had scenes from some city centre back office with activists at their desks.

This was a result for the 'haves' over the 'have nots'. Triumph for self-interest over social justice. A sad day for Scotland.

This is how I see it. The chance to improve the lives of everyone in Scotland, but in particular the people who needed it most. We've backed the establishment instead. Feel a bit upset at the thought of it tbh.

[JustPassing]

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This is how I see it. The chance to improve the lives of everyone in Scotland, but in particular the people who needed it most. We've backed the establishment instead. Feel a bit upset at the thought of it tbh.

We've been denied a great opportunity to make a difference to the lives of Scots. Instead we'll forever be in thrall to the three Tory parties at Westminster, thanks in part to the barely concealed bias of the BBC.

Be prepared for 'revised' upward estimates of oil and gas reserves and the net contribution of revenue to the Exchequer from Scotland. The Callaghan government pulled the same stunt in 1979.

[Scottie]

Absolutely devastated with the outcome of the vote. Can't believe 1.6 million voted and believed in the dream and have ended up with the same nightmare that has blighted Scotland for decades.

Will never understand until the day I die why the people of Scotland with a chance to change the future and history chose to keep begging for the crumbs off the Westminster table instead of grasping this once in a lifetime chance to make a difference and take our destiny into our own hands and for the generations to follow.

Congratulations to the NO campaign for getting the required votes to get over the line. The establishment have reeled you in hook line and sinker with their promises of This and that but haven't even told you what they are promising you in "their vow"

Already they have forgotten about Scotland down at Westminster and are taking about everyone else apart from us. With voting NO Scotland has been dealt with as far as they are concerned so enjoy you next 3-4 decades of London rule. We ALL had the chance to make a difference and blew it.

[lord bunberry]

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Absolutely devastated with the outcome of the vote. Can't believe 1.6 million voted and believed in the dream and have ended up with the same nightmare that has blighted Scotland for decades.

Will never understand until the day I die why the people of Scotland with a chance to change the future and history chose to keep begging for the crumbs off the Westminster table instead of grasping this once in a lifetime chance to make a difference and take our destiny into our own hands and for the generations to follow.

Congratulations to the NO campaign for getting the required votes to get over the line. The establishment have reeled you in hook line and sinker with their promises of This and that but haven't even told you what they are promising you in "their vow"

Already they have forgotten about Scotland down at Westminster and are taking about everyone else apart from us. With voting NO Scotland has been dealt with as far as they are concerned so enjoy you next 3-4 decades of London rule. We ALL had the chance to make a difference and blew it.

[Swedish hibee]

Gutted.
Now I live in a fair & equal country, I would have liked the same for my homeland.

..You cannie fool the Glaswegians though

[adhibs]

Feel numb. Was expecting a no but it hasnt made it any easier to take

[Moulin Yarns]

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663,477 did not vote. I just don't get that. Why did they choose not to vote?

I mean six hundred thousand people!

About double the winning margin!!

This is an interesting post referendum poll.


Post ref poll.jpg

[JeMeSouviens]

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About double the winning margin!!

This is an interesting post referendum poll.


Post ref poll.jpg

Thanks, that is interesting. Half the No vote's biggest reason was "too risky" and the disproportionate number of their support in 65+ is amazing. I think you could characterise enough of the No vote as "Not Yet" to be fairly certain we'll be back here again someday. Only 62% of the No vote think that settles it for >10 years.

Looking at the result numbers, it looks like differential turnout won it for No. Yes did an extraordinary job of motivating low turnout areas to come out in large numbers, but the affluent No voters turned themselves out in even greater numbers to stop them.

[over the line]

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A wee bit of statisitcs to throw a wee bit of perspective, (especially for one of the No campaigners on here )

The total Electorate is 4,283,392
The total No vote is 2,001,392

So only 46.7% of the electorate voted in favour of NO, meaning 53.3% didn't get the result they wanted.

This is just like every election, isn't it?

The same statistics show that just over 62% of the electorate didn't vote for independence it would seem.

I actually thought it would be a Yes and I'm a bit surprised with the result in a way.

I do feel for the passionate Yes campaigners, as it must be a gut wrenching disappointment for them.

I still think the whole campaign has highlighted some really important issues for Scotland and the whole UK. People up and down the UK are clearly not happy about the current situation and I hope this translates into meaningful change for the whole UK. Only time will tell.

[JeMeSouviens]

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About double the winning margin!!

This is an interesting post referendum poll.


Post ref poll.jpg

Just looked up the number of over 65s in Scotland - 930K! So if that poll was correct, Yes may have won among the working age population. Incredible pensioner power.

[allmodcons]

We get sovereignty put in our hands for a one day and our people hand it straight back to Westminster!!
Beggars belief, but would appear that a combination of fear and self-interest have won the day ahead of hope and social justice.
I’m not sure where we go from here as country, given the size of the ‘Yes’ vote (i.e. – over 1.6M) I think this will have a serious impact our psyche as a ‘Nation’.

[Gus]

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We get sovereignty put in our hands for a one day and our people hand it straight back to Westminster!!
Beggars belief, but would appear that a combination of fear and self-interest have won the day ahead of hope and social justice.
I’m not sure where we go from here as country, given the size of the ‘Yes’ vote (i.e. – over 1.6M) I think this will have a serious impact our psyche as a ‘Nation’.

Maybe it wasn't fear that motivated people to vote no. Maybe it was belief & hope that the country will be better together? Long term, Social injustice? More people voted no than yes.

Would you of been saying if the result was yes "where does the country go for here due to the impact on the psyche of no supporters"

[#FromTheCapital]

I've made no secret of my intention to vote no to independance throughout. Although in the aftermath I have to admit it genuinely upsets me to see so many people in despair. Its been an extremely emotional time for Scotland as a whole and people had/have a lot of belief in the issue. Hopefully once the dust settles and people can start thinking positively again then we can move forward.

[JeMeSouviens]

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Maybe it wasn't fear that motivated people to vote no. Maybe it was belief & hope that the country will be better together? Long term, Social injustice? More people voted no than yes.

Would you of been saying if the result was yes "where does the country go for here due to the impact on the psyche of no supporters"

Not all of them, no, but "shock and awe" wasn't done for nothing, was it? Look at the poll posted above. No voters given 3 broad categories as to why they voted No:

- 47% "too much risk"
- 27% "better together"
- 25% "best of both worlds"

[Colonel_HFC]

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Maybe it wasn't fear that motivated people to vote no. Maybe it was belief & hope that the country will be better together? Long term, Social injustice? More people voted no than yes.

Would you of been saying if the result was yes "where does the country go for here due to the impact on the psyche of no supporters"

Exactly, double standards. Just accept the result, as everyone promised they would. And it's also a bit strange to criticise someone for voting out of self-interest. Why wouldn't they?

[CropleyWasGod]

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Exactly, double standards. Just accept the result, as everyone promised they would. And it's also a bit strange to criticise someone for voting out of self-interest. Why wouldn't they?

... because not everyone does. We all have our own reasons for voting the way we do, all of them valid. Self-interest wasn't one of mine yesterday.

[the_ginger_hibee]

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I've made no secret of my intention to vote no to independance throughout. Although in the aftermath I have to admit it genuinely upsets me to see so many people in despair. Its been an extremely emotional time for Scotland as a whole and people had/have a lot of belief in the issue. Hopefully once the dust settles and people can start thinking positively again then we can move forward.

Very good comments. Things are still raw and people will always react in the immediate aftermath.

The vote is done. If you still feel robbed or passionate, join your local independence action group or political party, use your pain as a springboard to positive action - don't use it as a tool to isolate yourself from friends, family, fellow supporters.

[JeMeSouviens]

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I've made no secret of my intention to vote no to independance throughout. Although in the aftermath I have to admit it genuinely upsets me to see so many people in despair. Its been an extremely emotional time for Scotland as a whole and people had/have a lot of belief in the issue. Hopefully once the dust settles and people can start thinking positively again then we can move forward.

Nice thought but the "silent majority" won, remember? That's the people who don't want to be involved. The grassroots campaign that mobilised itself will be in utter dejection for years. My country just voted itself out of existence, not something that's easy to get over I don't think.

[SteveHFC]

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I probably shouldn't have ranted like that, just emotions running a bit high so appologies to anyone offended by that post. I wanted a Yes vote, but now that it is a No, i just hope that this country can move forward and prosper. I still think we will be ****ed if/when the Tories and UKIP get in though, just my 2 cents.

Great post

[allmodcons]

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Maybe it wasn't fear that motivated people to vote no. Maybe it was belief & hope that the country will be better together? Long term, Social injustice? More people voted no than yes.

Would you of been saying if the result was yes "where does the country go for here due to the impact on the psyche of no supporters"

We've had 35 years of social injustice! It began with Thatcher and then morphed in to New Labour under Tony Blair.

How much longer do we have to wait before it gets Better Together?

The middle classes would prefer to spend their money on another iPad or iPhone to add to their already ridiculous collection of gadgets before they'd consider paying more tax to implement socially just policies.

Last night's vote was a once in a lifetime opportunity to shake up the failed Westminster system of Government and we blew it. As I said, sovereignty for one day and we handed it straight back!!

[allmodcons]

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Exactly, double standards. Just accept the result, as everyone promised they would. And it's also a bit strange to criticise someone for voting out of self-interest. Why wouldn't they?

I have accepted the result, but that doesn't mean I have to be happy about it.

As to the bit in bold, this is everything that's wrong with our society. If you can't see outside your own 'little bubble' when you are in the polling booth then we truly are ****ed.

[Gus]

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Not all of them, no, but "shock and awe" wasn't done for nothing, was it? Look at the poll posted above. No voters given 3 broad categories as to why they voted No:

- 47% "too much risk"
- 27% "better together"
- 25% "best of both worlds"

A poll of every no person or a pool of say 100. Depending where it geographically I don't take any notice of these polls. Not a dig at you btw as I see where you are coming from.

[TRC]

I hope come the next elections that 87% of the electorate vote as have done in this vote!

[stantonhibby]

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We've had 35 years of social injustice! It began with Thatcher and then morphed in to New Labour under Tony Blair.

How much longer do we have to wait before it gets Better Together?

The middle classes would prefer to spend their money on another iPad or iPhone to add to their already ridiculous collection of gadgets before they'd consider paying more tax to implement socially just policies.

Last night's vote was a once in a lifetime opportunity to shake up the failed Westminster system of Government and we blew it. As I said, sovereignty for one day and we handed it straight back!!

Why doesn't the SNP use the tax raising powers they already have then ?