Share Transfers Agreed/Cooling off period

[Glesgahibby]

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A lot of people on here are too happy to compare hearts and portsmouth, without really knowing what went on with portsmouth.

Hearts will not be liquidated, time to stop clutching straws.

I suppose the only thing we know that went on is there ex owner is a criminal and so on and so on....eh,I think there has been many a link posted on here regarding the portsmouth situation.

[greenginger]

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I had an argument with a mate who is a massive Pompey fan about whether they were ever liquidated. He says it never happened. I have searched the internet and especially the BBC site to try to prove him wrong, but I can find no reliable reference to Pompey ever actually going into liquidation. I believe they were finally saved from the big L in April 2013 see BBC news story here http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22106528

Happy to be proved wrong if I am.

There are 5 Portsmouth Football Clubs listed at companies House.

http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk//c...844603&#result

3 have been liquidated, Portsmouth 2010 Ltd ( the one BDO did the admin. for is still noted as " Voluntary Arrangement " same as the Yams status ).

The current Portsmouth F C was formed in 2012. Hope that settles the argument !

[#FromTheCapital]

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Jesus, not clutching at anything, was just asking the question which a couple of folk kindly answered.

Fwiw you dont know for definite what will happen, nobody does.

It wasn't directed at you, no idea why you decided to take it that way? Was just saying in general a lot of people on here mention Portsmouth as if they were in an identical situation to hearts with regards to these frozen shares and somehow this means hearts are going to be liquidated.

Fwiw it looks like you are clutching straws if you think anything other than exiting admin via cva will happen.

[Craig_in_Prague]

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It wasn't directed at you, no idea why you decided to take it that way? Was just saying in general a lot of people on here mention Portsmouth as if they were in an identical situation to hearts with regards to these frozen shares and somehow this means hearts are going to be liquidated.

Fwiw it looks like you are clutching straws if you think anything other than exiting admin via cva will happen.

People can clutch at straws if they want.
Until it's 100% done and dusted; then why not.

[bingo70]

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It wasn't directed at you, no idea why you decided to take it that way? Was just saying in general a lot of people on here mention Portsmouth as if they were in an identical situation to hearts with regards to these frozen shares and somehow this means hearts are going to be liquidated.

Fwiw it looks like you are clutching straws if you think anything other than exiting admin via cva will happen.

Im not really arsed if they get liquidated, im satisfied with them being relegated as punishment. I think having to live within their means will be the real punishment longer term as they dont have a clue how to do that.

Apologies if i picked you up wrong, i thought your post was in response to my question this morning regarding the comparison with portsmouth.

[JeMeSouviens]

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I had an argument with a mate who is a massive Pompey fan about whether they were ever liquidated. He says it never happened. I have searched the internet and especially the BBC site to try to prove him wrong, but I can find no reliable reference to Pompey ever actually going into liquidation. I believe they were finally saved from the big L in April 2013 see BBC news story here http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22106528

Happy to be proved wrong if I am.

Some sleight of hand and jiggery pokery involved (they got a CVA but gave up waiting for the shares):

http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk//w...essCompanyInfo

The company number for the Portsmouth FC that entered admin first time was 03747237. It sold business and assets to 07264768 which also went into admin.

The currently operating Portsmouth is 07940335.

[Glesgahibby]

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It wasn't directed at you, no idea why you decided to take it that way? Was just saying in general a lot of people on here mention Portsmouth as if they were in an identical situation to hearts with regards to these frozen shares and somehow this means hearts are going to be liquidated.

Fwiw it looks like you are clutching straws if you think anything other than exiting admin via cva will happen.

(see green gingers post above)
1)this tells us that we do indeed "know" what happened in portsmouths case
2)identical,who knows?same circumstances,yes.
3)after all the twist and turns and ups and downs anything is possible

[Weststandwanab]

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It wasn't directed at you, no idea why you decided to take it that way? Was just saying in general a lot of people on here mention Portsmouth as if they were in an identical situation to hearts with regards to these frozen shares and somehow this means hearts are going to be liquidated.

Fwiw it looks like you are clutching straws if you think anything other than exiting admin via cva will happen.

I am not convinced they will - lack of time being the issue - but I am not clutching at straws.

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Im not really arsed if they get liquidated, im satisfied with them being relegated as punishment. I think having to live within their means will be the real punishment longer term as they dont have a clue how to do that.

Apologies if i picked you up wrong, i thought your post was in response to my question this morning regarding the comparison with portsmouth.

I think you are absolutely spot on problems just start not finishing.

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Some sleight of hand and jiggery pokery involved (they got a CVA but gave up waiting for the shares):

http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk//w...essCompanyInfo

The company number for the Portsmouth FC that entered admin first time was 03747237. It sold business and assets to 07264768 which also went into admin.

The currently operating Portsmouth is 07940335.

You have hit the bulls eye - no reason why Hearts will not follow suit when time is hours from running out.

Bear in mind Bidco 1874 ready to rock and role at the drop of a hat.

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People can clutch at straws if they want.
Until it's 100% done and dusted; then why not.

I appreciate that !

[Geo_1875]

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You have hit the bulls eye - no reason why Hearts will not follow suit when time is hours from running out.

Bear in mind Bidco 1874 ready to rock and role at the drop of a hat.

FA rules allow automatic transfer of club share to newco. Don't think SFA/SPFL rules do.

[Weststandwanab]

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FA rules allow automatic transfer of club share to newco. Don't think SFA/SPFL rules do.

Yes I realise that and when Bidco 1874 buy the "assets" as opposed to take the out of Administration they will fall to them same fate as The Rangers.

Not so in Englandshire.

If it was the same as Englandshire The Jambos would have been Liquidated last summer.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Yes I realise that and when Bidco 1874 buy the "assets" as opposed to take the out of Administration they will fall to them same fate as The Rangers.

Not so in Englandshire.

If it was the same as Englandshire The Jambos would have been Liquidated last summer.

It won't necessarily be Bidco 1874 that buys the assets.

[Jack]

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FA rules allow automatic transfer of club share to newco. Don't think SFA/SPFL rules do.

You're right.

FA rules allowed Pompey to carry on as before with a change of company ownership.

SFA/SPFL rules mean the sevco scenario.

[down-the-slope]

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FA rules allow automatic transfer of club share to newco. Don't think SFA/SPFL rules do.

football authorities have no control of company law and how shares are traded. The issue is football licence / membership ...which can't just be passed on / 'traded ... which was why Rangers / SEVCO had to suck up the drop to bottom

[CropleyWasGod]

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football authorities have no control of company law and how shares are traded. The issue is football licence / membership ...which can't just be passed on / 'traded ... which was why Rangers / SEVCO had to suck up the drop to bottom

It is actually a share in the company that is the SPFL. It's not a licence. And the internal rules of the SPFL have restrictions on the transferability of those shares.

The "licence" is issued by the SFA.

[Keith_M]

Regarding the threat of Hearts running out of money:

FoH have £1Million allocated for running costs to tide them over until next season. I'd imagine they'll find some way to use that, rather than go out of business.

[spike220]

The "Fat Lady' is still hovering in the Lobby (so to speak).

[Weststandwanab]

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It won't necessarily be Bidco 1874 that buys the assets.

Indeed but as they may only have hours to do a deal re transfer of assets if Liquidated my view is that will be used initially and then transferred/sold on - if it happens.

Incorporating a Company now specifically to acquire the assets from the Liquidators would give the game away at C.H..

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Regarding the threat of Hearts running out of money:

FoH have £1Million allocated for running costs to tide them over until next season. I'd imagine they'll find some way to use that, rather than go out of business.

That would risk losing it if the big L happened shortly thereafter

[Keith_M]

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That would risk losing it if the big L happened shortly thereafter

Maybe, but put yourself in their position; if this was Hibs, would you mind taking the gamble if you thought it would save your club? I personally would be willing to lose the few hundred quid I'd paid in if I thought Hibs were going to be no more.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Indeed but as they may only have hours to do a deal re transfer of assets if Liquidated my view is that will be used initially and then transferred/sold on - if it happens.

Incorporating a Company now specifically to acquire the assets from the Liquidators would give the game away at C.H..

r

Think you're missing my point, or I yours.

If they are liquidated, the assets go on the open market. "They" can't immediately transfer the assets to anyone; the assets would be under the control of the liquidator.

[Coco Bryce]

Surely there is no way they can be liquidated now?

The sales of the WW1 strip are hitting record numbers I hear

[Weststandwanab]

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Maybe, but put yourself in their position; if this was Hibs, would you mind taking the gamble if you thought it would save your club? I personally would be willing to lose the few hundred quid I'd paid in if I thought Hibs were going to be no more.

I agree - particularly about Hibs - but F.O.H. do not have the mandate to risk funds and would need to go back to all 8,000 subscribers for a decision - more time they do not have so I think F.O.H. will not be able to do that.

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Think you're missing my point, or I yours.

If they are liquidated, the assets go on the open market. "They" can't immediately transfer the assets to anyone; the assets would be under the control of the liquidator.

Indeed you are correct but I am presuming Bidco will either be the only bid or the highest bid and we know who the Liquidator' will be.

All dependent on time running out.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Indeed you are correct but I am presuming Bidco will either be the only bid or the highest bid and we know who the Liquidator' will be.

All dependent on time running out.

You can't presume that. The liquidator (who would be BDO; that much has already been agreed) would have to test the market on that. That would take weeks and months, not the "hours" that you mention.

[Keith_M]

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You can't presume that. The liquidator (who would be BDO; that much has already been agreed) would have to test the market on that. That would take weeks and months, not the "hours" that you mention.

Do you genuinely think they would bother? From what little I've seen from Administration/Liquidation, nothing would surprise me any more. These people are in their business for the benefit of themselves, nobody else. They appear to be a law unto themselves.

For instance, what has BDO's ongoing investigation (1.5 years so far, I think) into the previous incarnation of Rangers achieved so far, other than move the remaining money from that company's bank account into their own?

[Weststandwanab]

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You can't presume that. The liquidator (who would be BDO; that much has already been agreed) would have to test the market on that. That would take weeks and months, not the "hours" that you mention.

Indeed they should but who knows in these exceptional circumstances.

The hours I refer to would be the time taken to make a decision after Liquidation by Bidco to do anything.

My view is still that time will run out before anything can be done and the big L arrives.

In the meantime F.O.H. are worrying about the sound of the Tremeloes.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Do you genuinely think they would bother? From what little I've seen from Administration/Liquidation, nothing would surprise me any more. These people are in their business for the benefit of themselves, nobody else. They appear to be a law unto themselves.

For instance, what has BDO's ongoing investigation (1.5 years so far, I think) into the previous incarnation of Rangers achieved so far, other than move the remaining money from that company's bank account into their own?

It's not a case of whether they would "bother". It's their legal duty.

FTR, they're not "investigating" RFC. They are liquidating them. The same as they would do were HMFC to go there. HMFC would be quicker and simpler, sure, but they would still have to go through the statutory exercises.

[Keith_M]

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It's not a case of whether they would "bother". It's their legal duty.

FTR, they're not "investigating" RFC. They are liquidating them. The same as they would do were HMFC to go there. HMFC would be quicker and simpler, sure, but they would have to go through the statutory exercises.

OK, I agree that I used the wrong word to describe the process. Surely Liquidation is the process whereby the assets of the Liquidated company are 'liquefied', in order to give something to any remaining creditors.

Now please tell me what it has achieved in 1.5 years other than transfer the money into their own (and lawyers) bank accounts.

[CropleyWasGod]

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OK, I agree that I used the wrong word to describe the process. Surely Liquidation is the process whereby the assets of the Liquidated company are 'liquefied', in order to give something to any remaining creditors.

Now please tell me what it has achieved in 1.5 years other than transfer the money into their own (and lawyers) bank accounts.

The last I heard, they were suing Collyer Bristow, Craig Whyte's lawyers, for £25m.

If that claim is successful, it will go a long way to appeasing the creditors and justifying BDO's fees.

[Hibrandenburg]

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Salmonds ACTUAL words on Putin were the result of a series of questions on his views on world leaders and other politicians. Incidentally, the actual interview took place before the situation in Crimea developed.


'Asked about Mr Putin, Mr Salmond said: "Well, obviously, I don't approve of a range of Russian actions, but I think Putin's more effective than the press he gets I would have thought, and you can see why he carries support in Russia."'

He called him 'effective' but dissaproves of many of his actions.

'Pressed on whether he admires the Russian leader, the First Minister said: "Certain aspects. He's restored a substantial part of Russian pride and that must be a good thing. There are aspects of Russian constitutionality and the inter-mesh with business and politics that are obviously difficult to admire. Russians are fantastic people, incidentally, they are lovely people."'

So, his admiration extends to certain aspects of Putin, as a politician. He does not at any point say he has unreserved admiration for him.

Herald

The Nazis weren't all bad, Hitler did build the Autobahns.

[Leith Mo]

Think it was the Weimar Republic that built the majority of the autobahns but Adolf and his pals claimed the glory....

[CropleyWasGod]

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Think it was the Weimar Republic that built the majority of the autobahns but Adolf and his pals claimed the glory....

Bit like Collins with Mowbray's team