Scottish Independence

[lucky]

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Would like to point out that my "poofy tenner" comment was not meant to offend anyone, and apologise to anyone who was offended by it. I am not homophobic and have no ill feelings with regards to homosexuality.

It was meant as a piece of light hearted banter in what has been a very serious and heavy debate. This was obviously very misguided.

Good response mate. I'm not overly PC but no need for stuff like that.
Still don't accept that pro UK supporters think that Scotland is a subsidy junkie.

[steakbake]

Aberdeen city council to include an appeal for voters to vote no in with the council tax bills this month. A new low in the campaign. Imagine the hoots of outrage and media guff if an SNP council decided to do the same...

[steakbake]

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Good response mate. I'm not overly PC but no end for stuff like that. Still don't accept that pro UK supporters don't think that Scotland is a subsidy junkie.

Freudian slip in the double negative. Can you confirm whether you mean they do or they don't?

I think part of the no campaign sees it like that.

[marinello59]

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Aberdeen city council to include an appeal for voters to vote no in with the council tax bills this month. A new low in the campaign. Imagine the hoots of outrage and media guff if an SNP council decided to do the same...

Your last line should read 'imagine the hoots of outrage and media guff if a council in the Central belt had decided to do the same.'
It's been well reported in the press up North and the tone is pretty negative towards the Council administration. The Labour group in Aberdeen are an embarrassment who have embarked on a course of petty politics since the last election. What other council in the land would cancel a city centre development voted for by the people of the city in a referundum and basically tell a local businessman willing to pay most of the costs to stick his money?
If Aberdeen City Council are telling people to vote No I suspect plenty will see it as a reason to vote YES.

[lucky]

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Freudian slip in the double negative. Can you confirm whether you mean they do or they don't?

I think part of the no campaign sees it like that.

Very poor use of the English language from myself in original post, I have now amended .

[JeMeSouviens]

New Survation poll out for the Record today. Ex don't-knows it stands at 55-45 for No.

The polls seem to have split into 2 clumps: ICM, Survation, Panelbase have about a 10% lead for No, MORI and YouGov about 20%. Both clumps have been pretty steady for the past few weeks suggesting not much movement caused by the currency stramash.

Even on the optimistic clump, Yes has a big old gap to try and bridge but if that clump is correct it's at least possible which I must admit I never thought it would be with only 6 months to go.

[JimBHibees]

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Aberdeen city council to include an appeal for voters to vote no in with the council tax bills this month. A new low in the campaign. Imagine the hoots of outrage and media guff if an SNP council decided to do the same...

Thats disgusting.

[heretoday]

Aberdeen council are particularly mental. If people don't get out and vote in local elections - and they generally don't - they can end up with a bunch of nutcases in charge. Hopefully next time sense will prevail.

[steakbake]

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Very poor use of the English language from myself in original post, I have now amended .

I was just messing ;-)

[lucky]

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I was just messing ;-)

I guessed that but still well deserved dig lol

[One Day Soon]

Been a bit ill so just starting to catch up on thread again today. Will reply more fully later (that means you AMC) but in brief: separatists still wrong on currency and numbers, let's keep the P word out of it (that's not being PC, that's being normal), how about that GERS deficit?, you must be imagining the Herald piece because the MSM is all a Unionist conspiracy remember and some posters on here have a real cheek complaining about questions not being answered - I'm talking about the throwing stones and running away brigade. Away for more virus pills now...

[Hibercelona]

The SNP don't even need to say anything anymore. David Cameron and his cronies at Westminster are causing their own down fall everytime they open their mouths.

[Just Alf]

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Been a bit ill so just starting to catch up on thread again today. Will reply more fully later (that means you AMC) but in brief: separatists still wrong on currency and numbers, let's keep the P word out of it (that's not being PC, that's being normal), how about that GERS deficit?, you must be imagining the Herald piece because the MSM is all a Unionist conspiracy remember and some posters on here have a real cheek complaining about questions not being answered - I'm talking about the throwing stones and running away brigade. Away for more virus pills now...

Good thing about the GERS bit is that it's blown the claim that rUK subsidises Scotland out the water.

[hibsbollah]

http://m.scotsman.com/news/politics/...high-1-3339111

The gap narrows. Yea 39% Nay 47% Floaters 13%. David Cameron doing his best to turn it around.

[marinello59]

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http://m.scotsman.com/news/politics/...high-1-3339111

The gap narrows. Yea 39% Nay 47% Floaters 13%. David Cameron doing his best to turn it around.

I'm worried that Salmond and co are not doing nowhere near enough to close the gap. They should be actively targeting women voters (most likely to vote No) and reaching out more to the poorer sections of our society. (Least likely to vote but most likely to vote Yes.) They are doing neither satisfactorily. Instead they concentrate on dismissing every counter argument as scare mongering and busting made up myths. Frustrating to say the least. There's still everything to play for here.

[Beefster]

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http://m.scotsman.com/news/politics/...high-1-3339111

The gap narrows. Yea 39% Nay 47% Floaters 13%. David Cameron doing his best to turn it around.

I love this line of reasoning.

Cameron refuses to get involved - "He's running scared. Why won't he take on Salmond?".

Cameron gets involved and promises more powers to the Scottish Government, if the No vote comes to pass (and busting a long-running argument about how we won't get more powers) - "He's doing his best to make the Yes vote happen".

[Glory Lurker]

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I love this line of reasoning.

Cameron refuses to get involved - "He's running scared. Why won't he take on Salmond?".

Cameron gets involved and promises more powers to the Scottish Government, if the No vote comes to pass (and busting a long-running argument about how we won't get more powers) - "He's doing his best to make the Yes vote happen".

But he didn't though, did he? And, as things stand (with next to no chance of things changing), it's not an "argument", it's a stone-cold fact (of the non-.net variety). It's 1979 misdirection all over again.

[hibsbollah]

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I love this line of reasoning.

Cameron refuses to get involved - "He's running scared. Why won't he take on Salmond?".

Cameron gets involved and promises more powers to the Scottish Government, if the No vote comes to pass (and busting a long-running argument about how we won't get more powers) - "He's doing his best to make the Yes vote happen".

I often make the mistake of assuming hibs.net folk know when my tongue is firmly in my cheek. Apparently not For the sake of clarity, It seems fantastical that DC is deliberately scuppering the No vote (for Tory party electoral reasons) by getting involved, and you'd need to have a highly developed conspiracy theory to assume this is his strategy.

But its fairly obvious that the bumps in the Yes numbers during polling are happening when the mainstream Westminster parties get involved in the debate, or when scots based financial institutions issue press releases critical of a Yes vote. If I was a tory strategist with an interest in keeping the union id advise him to keep it zipped.

[allmodcons]

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I'm worried that Salmond and co are not doing nowhere near enough to close the gap. They should be actively targeting women voters (most likely to vote No) and reaching out more to the poorer sections of our society. (Least likely to vote but most likely to vote Yes.) They are doing neither satisfactorily. Instead they concentrate on dismissing every counter argument as scare mongering and busting made up myths. Frustrating to say the least. There's still everything to play for here.

You need to read behind the headlines M59 and maybe get out more often. :0)

I can assure you that these 2 groups (i.e. - women and the poor) are being heavily targeted by the Yes campaign.

[Future17]

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I'm worried that Salmond and co are not doing nowhere near enough to close the gap. They should be actively targeting women voters (most likely to vote No) and reaching out more to the poorer sections of our society. (Least likely to vote but most likely to vote Yes.) They are doing neither satisfactorily. Instead they concentrate on dismissing every counter argument as scare mongering and busting made up myths. Frustrating to say the least. There's still everything to play for here.

Still 185 days of campaigning to go. Both sides' campaign strategies will intensify the nearer we get to 18 September.

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I love this line of reasoning.

Cameron refuses to get involved - "He's running scared. Why won't he take on Salmond?".

Cameron gets involved and promises more powers to the Scottish Government, if the No vote comes to pass (and busting a long-running argument about how we won't get more powers) - "He's doing his best to make the Yes vote happen".

You're right of course, but the fact is Cameron and what he represents to most of the electorate in the referendum makes him one of "Yes" campaign's biggest weapons regardless of what he does.

[marinello59]

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You need to read behind the headlines M59 and maybe get out more often. :0)

I can assure you that these 2 groups (i.e. - women and the poor) are being heavily targeted by the Yes campaign.

Thanks.
Rewind to the Sturgeon/Lamont debate. The very first question Sturgeon was asked was how women would benefit from an Independent Scotland. I thought, great, this is a real chance for her to shine. She totally failed to answer it and threw out a few general phrases.
As for targeting the poor, I hope it involves something more than canvassing poorer areas and chasing out the vote on referendum day.

[lucky]

Labour will launch their report into further devolved powers on Tuesday. It will contain significant additional powers for the Scottish Parliament. Basically it's "Devo Max" that majority of Scots have said they want. It will then be voted on by the Scottish Labour conference on Friday morning and will be part of Labours 2015 UK manifesto.

[allmodcons]

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Thanks.
Rewind to the Sturgeon/Lamont debate. The very first question Sturgeon was asked was how women would benefit from an Independent Scotland. I thought, great, this is a real chance for her to shine. She totally failed to answer it and threw out a few general phrases.
As for targeting the poor, I hope it involves something more than canvassing poorer areas and chasing out the vote on referendum day.

Apologies if I offended you M59. My opening line was said tongue in cheek.
The wider Yes campaign is very active and, as I said, well aware of the potential vote to be had from these 2 groups.
What would you have them do that they aren't already doing?

[Hibrandenburg]

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Labour will launch their report into further devolved powers on Tuesday. It will contain significant additional powers for the Scottish Parliament. Basically it's "Devo Max" that majority of Scots have said they want. It will then be voted on by the Scottish Labour conference on Friday morning and will be part of Labours 2015 UK manifesto.

And what if the rest of the Labour Party say no or the Tories get in again?

Full blown independence is the only way to guarantee that Scotland do what's best for Scotland.

[marinello59]

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Labour will launch their report into further devolved powers on Tuesday. It will contain significant additional powers for the Scottish Parliament. Basically it's "Devo Max" that majority of Scots have said they want. It will then be voted on by the Scottish Labour conference on Friday morning and will be part of Labours 2015 UK manifesto.

It's Devo Plus rather than Devo Max .

[marinello59]

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Apologies if I offended you M59. My opening line was said tongue in cheek.
The wider Yes campaign is very active and, as I said, well aware of the potential vote to be had from these 2 groups.
What would you have them do that they aren't already doing?

I wasn't offended. I do need to get out more.
I'll answer your question later.

[lucky]

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And what if the rest of the Labour Party say no or the Tories get in again?

Full blown independence is the only way to guarantee that Scotland do what's best for Scotland.

All parties at Westminster are committed to additional powers. The demand for what powers is being answered by the Scottish Labour party

[lucky]

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It's Devo Plus rather than Devo Max .

Once it's released you will see the term Devo max is used but the reality it's the powers not the name that's the issue.

[#FromTheCapital]

I'll be voting no. Mainly because of my work having to shift a lot of work to England if the yes vote wins. 90% of our custom is south of the border which would be disasterous if the vote went through. I imagine there'll be a few Scottish companies thinking along the same lines.
Also, I can't see how independence is going to make things any better. We live in a stable country as it is and should be thankful for that, no need for a major shake up. Alex Salmond just doesn't have the answers on some key issues so why take a risk when there is no huge long term benefit to be had?

[CropleyWasGod]

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I'll be voting no. Mainly because of my work having to shift a lot of work to England if the yes vote wins. 90% of our custom is south of the border which would be disasterous if the vote went through. I imagine there'll be a few Scottish companies thinking along the same lines.
Also, I can't see how independence is going to make things any better. We live in a stable country as it is and should be thankful for that, no need for a major shake up. Alex Salmond just doesn't have the answers on some key issues so why take a risk when there is no huge long term benefit to be had?

Why "would" your employer have to shift its work?

Surely, as at present, it would make a decision on its base on commercial grounds.