Share Transfers Agreed/Cooling off period

[DaveF]

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Kenny Millar who wrote the sun story this morning reckons as long as its paid before the court hearing then the SPL won't get involved.

Let's hear it for the SPL .Every other club strives to comply with the tax laws, while the clampitts flounce around withholding money until the last minute. That seems pretty fair

[bingo70]

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Let's hear it for the SPL .Every other club strives to comply with the tax laws, while the clampitts flounce around withholding money until the last minute. That seems pretty fair

Be interesting to see if they rubber stamp the signing of Danny Wilson?!

[Gus Fring]

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Let's hear it for the SPL .Every other club strives to comply with the tax laws, while the clampitts flounce around withholding money until the last minute. That seems pretty fair

The SPL pretty much only deals with Football related matters. They can't get involved in things the press write about and say is happening. It's important to remember at this stage there is no official confirmation this tax bill even exists.

Anything the SPL do in these types of circumstances must be watertight.

[HibeeHendo]

When do you think we'll get the next update on events in Lith Land?

[Caversham Green]

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That doesn't make sense. If it's not paid by close today it goes to court.

If it's not paid today HMRC will apply to the court for a Winding Up Order but the hearing itself will be three weeks away (I think there's a 21 day notice period). They've been at this point at least four times before, but they've never been under a 'time to pay' agreement before. That agreement will almost certainly have a clause that requires current tax payments to be kept up to date or the full amount falls due immediately. If that's the case here then the winding up petition could still be heard even if the £100k is paid in the interim. In short, if there is such a clause they have to pay today or they will be wound up.

The exact nature of this 'bill' still remains unclear and if they do pay it today then they were likely to have been in a position to pay it last week and are stringing everyone along. FWIW I think it will be paid today but they're playing a very dangerous game - possibly because they have no alternative.

[PatHead]

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The SPL pretty much only deals with Football related matters. They can't get involved in things the press write about and say is happening. It's important to remember at this stage there is no official confirmation this tax bill even exists.

Anything the SPL do in these types of circumstances must be watertight.

Whilst I agree with your comments the SPL must be aware of the situation re non-payment of alleged tax bill through direct quotes in the press. Surely it is in the interests of the SPL to be pro-active in this matter even only to the extent of contacting Hearts asking if this is the case so they can at least plan for next season. The last thing the SPL need after last summer is another farce whereby we do not know who is playing in the tournament until a week before the season starts

[brog]

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To make it even more ridiculous the yaks managed to get a massive one month into the tax repayment plan before messing up again.

Their time is almost up, it's just a question of who administers the lethal injection.

I forecast months ago that Yams would make no more than 1 or 2 payments against this repayment plan, basically to get them to end of the season.
To summarise;
1. They're supposedly self sufficient but that includes £1million raised from what increasingly looks like a fraudulent share issue. Also the cakebakes etc & probably a significant sum from increased gates following their emotional blackmail.
2. We're one week into the close season & they can't pay PAYE which they've already collected ( on behalf of HMRC ) & spent on Danny Wilson!
3. They're due £1.5million to HMRC, they have payroll due this week & they have an acknowledged black hole of £2.5mm for the season ahead.
4. Oh & no one knows who owns them but whoever it is they're either in bankruptcy, liquidation or admin & Yams owe anywhere upwards of £25mm in debt with their ramshackle stadium pledged as security against some of that debt.
However, allisbarry!!
I honestly believe HMRC may realise this institution is a basket case & pull the plug sooner rather than later. Mind you I'll miss this thread when it happens!

[Gus Fring]

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Whilst I agree with your comments the SPL must be aware of the situation re non-payment of alleged tax bill through direct quotes in the press. Surely it is in the interests of the SPL to be pro-active in this matter even only to the extent of contacting Hearts asking if this is the case so they can at least plan for next season. The last thing the SPL need after last summer is another farce whereby we do not know who is playing in the tournament until a week before the season starts

Quotes in the press aren't grounds for punishing a club. There have been no "direct quotes" either. They are attributed to a "Hearts Spokesman" who is always unnamed in bad news situations like this. There has been nothing official from HMRC, at this point, to say any of this is true and there is enough reasonable doubt to conclude it might not be as Hearts portray it.

As it stands just now, the SPL line up is confirmed for next season. Hearts are still trading and have said they will survive. The SPL contacting them will make no difference at all, no business would admit they are screwed beyond repair until they literally have no other choice.

[Caversham Green]

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I forecast months ago that Yams would make no more than 1 or 2 payments against this repayment plan, basically to get them to end of the season.
To summarise;
1. They're supposedly self sufficient but that includes £1million raised from what increasingly looks like a fraudulent share issue. Also the cakebakes etc & probably a significant sum from increased gates following their emotional blackmail.
2. We're one week into the close season & they can't pay PAYE which they've already collected ( on behalf of HMRC ) & spent on Danny Wilson!
3. They're due £1.5million to HMRC, they have payroll due this week & they have an acknowledged black hole of £2.5mm for the season ahead.
4. Oh & no one knows who owns them but whoever it is they're either in bankruptcy, liquidation or admin & Yams owe anywhere upwards of £25mm in debt with their ramshackle stadium pledged as security against some of that debt.
However, allisbarry!!
I honestly believe HMRC may realise this institution is a basket case & pull the plug sooner rather than later. Mind you I'll miss this thread when it happens!

That's a point that struck me when this tax bill was first publicised. According to some over on Keechbag they're not actually paying his wages yet as he's still contracted to Liverpool, but he will have been paid a fee for signing the pre-contract agreement, and it's likely to have been in excess of the £100,000 they're now trying to scrape together. That pre-contract was totally unnecessary and it all gives a clear indication that the people running HoMFC are incapable of running a football club within its means.

[PatHead]

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Quotes in the press aren't grounds for punishing a club. There have been no "direct quotes" either. They are attributed to a "Hearts Spokesman" who is always unnamed in bad news situations like this. There has been nothing official from HMRC, at this point, to say any of this is true and there is enough reasonable doubt to conclude it might not be as Hearts portray it.

As it stands just now, the SPL line up is confirmed for next season. Hearts are still trading and have said they will survive. The SPL contacting them will make no difference at all, no business would admit they are screwed beyond repair until they literally have no other choice.

I agree that at this moment the SPL have no grounds and don't disagree with you about that. At this moment of time Hearts are late on a tax payment according to reports in the press and have until tonight to avoid going to court. My understanding of the rules is that you must be up to date with all taxes. There a quote from Banderson on his twatter saying he had been told by Fedekovas that debt would not be settled today. That is surely enough grounds for the SPL to make an enquiry. It would then allow the board to provisionally arrange a board meeting to discuss any potential punishment and show all clubs that rules are rules and who is in charge. What I want is for the SPL to be proactive rather than reactive and for once provide leadership. Doncaster et al seem incapable of doing this and always seem to be chasing events.

[Gus Fring]

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I agree that at this moment the SPL have no grounds and don't disagree with you about that. At this moment of time Hearts are late on a tax payment according to reports in the press and have until tonight to avoid going to court. My understanding of the rules is that you must be up to date with all taxes. There a quote from Banderson on his twatter saying he had been told by Fedekovas that debt would not be settled today. That is surely enough grounds for the SPL to make an enquiry. It would then allow the board to provisionally arrange a board meeting to discuss any potential punishment and show all clubs that rules are rules and who is in charge. What I want is for the SPL to be proactive rather than reactive and for once provide leadership. Doncaster et al seem incapable of doing this and always seem to be chasing events.

If the SPL held a board meeting every time there was a report of wrongdoing in the press they'd never be allowed to go home! Barry Anderson is not someone who's word should ever be taken seriously, he's been caught telling porky pies so many times Hearts are thinking of employing him to do catering. Again, there's nothing whatsoever about HMRC on this alleged bill.

The SPL will do something only when there is something to actually do something about.

[Spike Mandela]

What's the betting that they are begging/blackmailing players to take wage deferrals next week to dodge any SPL sanctions.

[Waxy]

I'm fed up hearing thier advert on radio forth. How much does it cost them to advertise on the radio?

[Aldo]

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What's the betting that they are begging/blackmailing players to take wage deferrals next week to dodge any SPL sanctions.

More fool them then. You'll prob not far off the mark tbh Spike. Let them do as they see fit but when the preverbial hits the fan and they've said nowt then they are as bad as the club in my books.

[PatHead]

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If the SPL held a board meeting every time there was a report of wrongdoing in the press they'd never be allowed to go home! Barry Anderson is not someone who's word should ever be taken seriously, he's been caught telling porky pies so many times Hearts are thinking of employing him to do catering. Again, there's nothing whatsoever about HMRC on this alleged bill.

The SPL will do something only when there is something to actually do something about.

So you don't think it is worth the SPL picking up the phone and asking Hearts if there is any truth in this story? If there is will they be able to pay the bill, are they going to pay the players wages this week and finally can they see a business plan to ensure that Hearts are capable of seeing out the season? As a member of the SPL Hearts are obliged to behave in a manner expected of one of the Premier clubs in the land, it is not unreasonable for the SPL to behave like a regulator in these circumstances.

[Gus Fring]

Barry's article today.

HEARTS are confident of paying an outstanding £100,000 tax bill before being served with a winding-up order in court.The deadline for the unpaid PAYE amount is 5pm today and Tynecastle sources say the club will meet the obligation before the matter reaches Edinburgh’s Court of Session.
As of this morning, Hearts officials were unsure if the full amount would be raised before close of business today. Should the deadline pass without payment, Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs (HMRC) will ask the courts to wind up the club. Hearts would then have a further eight days to pay the £100,000 once the winding-up advert appears in the press.
HMRC are expecting payment in full today and will not hesitate to begin the winding-up process tomorrow if their deadline is not met by Hearts. However, those within Tynecastle remain confident that the tax bill, if not cleared today, will be met before the matter reaches court.
Meanwhile, a potential takeover of the club by fans will reach its next stage on July 4 when Foundation of Hearts begins converting fans’ pledges. The group is working on behalf of six key supporter organisations, which hope to collectively take control of Hearts from majority shareholder Vladimir Romanov.
Foundation of Hearts have received over 4000 pledges from individuals via their website and will hold an open question-and-answer session this Friday in Tynecastle’s Gorgie Suite (7.30pm start). Anyone wishing to attend should email [email protected] with their name and address. Tickets are available for collection from the club shop from this afternoon.

That last bit confirms what I had already heard, that pledges to FoH are nowhere near the amount needed. The average pledge would need to be £17,500 just to clear the security on the stadium. No chance.

[Ozyhibby]

Hearts are about to implode big time. There is no need for the SPL to act at all just now. Handing out point penalties to a club that won't even start next season is a complete waste of time.

[Ozyhibby]

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Barry's article today.



That last bit confirms what I had already heard, that pledges to FoH are nowhere near the amount needed. The average pledge would need to be £17,500 just to clear the security on the stadium. No chance.[/FONT][/COLOR]
[/FONT][/COLOR]

Which amazingly, is close to what I've pledged. They might just do it. :-)

[Gus Fring]

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So you don't think it is worth the SPL picking up the phone and asking Hearts if there is any truth in this story? If there is will they be able to pay the bill, are they going to pay the players wages this week and finally can they see a business plan to ensure that Hearts are capable of seeing out the season? As a member of the SPL Hearts are obliged to behave in a manner expected of one of the Premier clubs in the land, it is not unreasonable for the SPL to behave like a regulator in these circumstances.

Hearts are just going to say "Yes" to all of those questions, the same as they have been since October. Hearts themselves have said 3 times in the last year alone they are going to die without the financial support of fans, everybody knows they are struggling to make ends meet. The SPL is doing the right thing here and letting them get on with it. The SPL should not be getting involved in the day to day running of any of it's member clubs.

Remember, the SPL is the clubs. They know what's going on.

[YehButNoBut]

Another Barry Anderson re-hash stating that Hearts are confident this £100k bill will be paid today.

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/footba...date-1-2961004

Also notice FOH have a Q&A this Friday, should be fun.

Foundation of Hearts have received over 4000 pledges from individuals via their website and will hold an open question-and-answer session this Friday in Tynecastle’s Gorgie Suite (7.30pm start). Anyone wishing to attend should email [email protected] with their name and address. Tickets are available for collection from the club shop from this afternoon.

[Springbank]

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Hearts are about to implode big time. There is no need for the SPL to act at all just now. Handing out point penalties to a club that won't even start next season is a complete waste of time.

I totally agree

I do see the point people are making that the SPL, in adopting this approach, can look like they are reactive not proactive.

But there's no point turning Vlad into a Martyr when he's just a common & garden thief. Let Vlad's actions be the death knell, even if it takes a little longer, son't give any Yam the opportunity (as with their big cousins last year) to somehow blame the SPL/football authorities for their closure.

The HMFC are the cheats here, let them stew in their own juices.

[Twa Cairpets]

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I agree that at this moment the SPL have no grounds and don't disagree with you about that. At this moment of time Hearts are late on a tax payment according to reports in the press and have until tonight to avoid going to court. My understanding of the rules is that you must be up to date with all taxes. There a quote from Banderson on his twatter saying he had been told by Fedekovas that debt would not be settled today. That is surely enough grounds for the SPL to make an enquiry. It would then allow the board to provisionally arrange a board meeting to discuss any potential punishment and show all clubs that rules are rules and who is in charge. What I want is for the SPL to be proactive rather than reactive and for once provide leadership. Doncaster et al seem incapable of doing this and always seem to be chasing events.

Much as though Doncaster is a trumpet of the first water, doing something like this - certainly publicly - could (correctly) be seen as pre-judging. its like convicting someone of looking like they were about to hit you.

[Twa Cairpets]

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So you don't think it is worth the SPL picking up the phone and asking Hearts if there is any truth in this story? If there is will they be able to pay the bill, are they going to pay the players wages this week and finally can they see a business plan to ensure that Hearts are capable of seeing out the season? As a member of the SPL Hearts are obliged to behave in a manner expected of one of the Premier clubs in the land, it is not unreasonable for the SPL to behave like a regulator in these circumstances.

You also assume that there is no dialogue going on. I don't know if there is or isn't, but if it's the former, why would you expect this or the content of any such call to be made public?

[KWJ]

How can Vlad sell the club to anybody when he's posted missing!?

[#FromTheCapital]

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How can Vlad sell the club to anybody when he's posted missing!?

They can't be sold at the moment because UBIG's assets are frozen, in order ofr them to be unfrozen they will need to go into admin which means a 15 point deduction for hearts. It is possible for them to be sold after this but it won't be Vlad who is selling them

[Dashing Bob S]

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Hearts are about to implode big time. There is no need for the SPL to act at all just now. Handing out point penalties to a club that won't even start next season is a complete waste of time.

In a nutshell. Why bother, and get pulled into all that mess?

All we are witnessing now is some Yams trying to rearrange deckchairs on the Titanic, while the more sensible ones run for the lifeboats.

No need for anybody else to do anything but 'kick back' and enjoy the show.

[lapsedhibee]

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Foundation of Hearts have received over 4000 pledges from individuals via their website and will hold an open question-and-answer session this Friday in Tynecastle’s Gorgie Suite (7.30pm start).

Even if all those pledgers were yams - which they're not - it'd still be a poor show for only 1% of their fans to have signed up.

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How can Vlad sell the club to anybody when he's posted missing!?

They'll have e-bay in Chechnya, shirley.

[Treadstone]

Foundation of Hearts have received over 4000 pledges from individuals via their website and will hold an open question-and-answer session this Friday in Tynecastle’s Gorgie Suite (7.30pm start). Anyone wishing to attend should email [email protected] with their name and address. Tickets are available for collection from the club shop from this afternoon.

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That last bit confirms what I had already heard, that pledges to FoH are nowhere near the amount needed. The average pledge would need to be £17,500 just to clear the security on the stadium. No chance.

I know they look in so here are some questions they should be asking at the 'Q and A Session.'

1. Do they expect a drop off from the mentioned 4000 pledgers come the certainty of 'signing up' for actual money being taken by FoH ?

2. Generously assuming ALL pledgers give £50 a month this realises an annual return of £2.4m. How would this be used to buy the club ? Would they agree a deal and make scheduled payments from monies gathered ?

3. If pledgers fell by the wayside over the course of time as they almost certainly would, and a scheduled payment could not be made who would own the club ?

4. There is a funding gap of £2.5m for the coming season, how would this be addressed considering contracts already agreed would have to be honoured ?

5. If the club can't be purchased 'debt free' would this end all interest from FoH ?

6. Do FoH consider the club and Tynecastle as a 'both together' deal or would they consider buying one without the other ?

7. How would recruitment/termination work regarding non playing but essential football staff ?

Plenty other Qs but left it as 7 is a nice number.

[silverhibee]

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What's the betting that they are begging/blackmailing players to take wage deferrals next week to dodge any SPL sanctions.

[Sanger]

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How can Vlad sell the club to anybody when he's posted missing!?

Only the administrator of Ukio Bankas can sell Hearts as they have a claim against Tynecastle and 70% of HMFC shares on outstanding direct and indirect debts HMFC have to UKIO Bankas.