Share Transfers Agreed/Cooling off period

[CropleyWasGod]

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How are Hearts going to get a license to compete next season if they cannot publish audited accounts. Surely not even the most trusting Auditor can sign off their accounts on the basis on ongoing support from UBIG?

Without the implied support, Hearts with £32 million in debt and money owing to HMRC must be seen as insolvent? The authorities may not be as lenient this time as last year.

Of course if they had not them in to the SFA before UKIO went bust it may have been different. They couldn't have could they?

They could have had them into the SFA before the deadline. We can't know that, although I think it unlikely.

However:-

1. UKIO going bust is neither here nor there for the auditors, of itself. It doesn't help the going-concern judgement, of course, but it's not as important as, for example, UBIG going into administration. See Cav's earlier posts for his view on the auditors' difficulties.

2. the licensing requirements don't actually say that a club can't play if they fail to meet them. There are a number of sanctions available, ranging from fines through to expulsion.

[s.a.m]

Graham Stack‏@GrahamStack11hCan all cash converters, trade & exchange outlets and car boot sales keep an eye out for the Scottish cup & a Lithuanian trying to sell it!

[Treadstone]

I haven't heard of any appeal concerning the freezing of the mad ones assets. I know he had 7 days. Is this the usual practice ? Or is he using the time to get all his ducks in a row etc ? Would the financial guys expect an appeal ?

[Malthibby]

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Graham Stack‏@GrahamStack11hCan all cash converters, trade & exchange outlets and car boot sales keep an eye out for the Scottish cup & a Lithuanian trying to sell it!

He's the man.
GG

[21.05.2016]

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Graham Stack‏@GrahamStack11hCan all cash converters, trade & exchange outlets and car boot sales keep an eye out for the Scottish cup & a Lithuanian trying to sell it!

nice one Stacky!

[justlikebrazil]

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Graham Stack‏@GrahamStack11hCan all cash converters, trade & exchange outlets and car boot sales keep an eye out for the Scottish cup & a Lithuanian trying to sell it!

Stacky knows its pay day tomorrow

[Andy74]

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Graham Stack‏@GrahamStack11hCan all cash converters, trade & exchange outlets and car boot sales keep an eye out for the Scottish cup & a Lithuanian trying to sell it!

If he means Romanov, he's Russian!

[ballengeich]

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If he means Romanov, he's Russian!

Born in Russia, but he's a Lithuanian citizen now.

[Dashing Bob S]

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I haven't heard of any appeal concerning the freezing of the mad ones assets. I know he had 7 days. Is this the usual practice ? Or is he using the time to get all his ducks in a row etc ? Would the financial guys expect an appeal ?

It unclear to me whether the freezing of the assets is to do with financial procedures, regarding the non-viability of his enterprises, or, as seems more likely and is potentially far, far, more damaging to Hearts, the result of a legal investigation concerning where the money that was being passed around those businesses in the UBIG group came from. Hearts, of course, as part of this group, will be very much involved in any such inquiry.

They used to say -they don't anymore- that they only owe the debt to themselves. We may soon see exactly just what they've been owing to themselves for the last seven years, where it came from, and who are those other 'selves' their club has been associated with.

[CropleyWasGod]

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It unclear to me whether the freezing of the assets is to do with financial procedures, regarding the non-viability of his enterprises, or, as seems more likely and is potentially far, far, more damaging to Hearts, the result of a legal investigation concerning where the money that was being passed around those businesses in the UBIG group came from. Hearts, of course, as part of this group, will be very much involved in any such inquiry.

They used to say -they don't anymore- that they only owe the debt to themselves. We may soon see exactly just what they've been owing to themselves for the last seven years, where it came from, and who are those other 'selves' their club has been associated with.

Much as I love the prospect of a Grisham-type saga, I am not sure it will play out like this. These types of investigations are normally slow and tortuous; by the time there is any resolution, the commercial world will have caught up with HMFC. If the freezing of the assets becomes permanent, I'm struggling to see how they can get out of this.

[Dashing Bob S]

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Much as I love the prospect of a Grisham-type saga, I am not sure it will play out like this. These types of investigations are normally slow and tortuous; by the time there is any resolution, the commercial world will have caught up with HMFC. If the freezing of the assets becomes permanent, I'm struggling to see how they can get out of this.

Don't think we're necessarily at odds here; I'm struggling to see how the frozen assets can be be unfrozen while any legal investigations are ongoing. Which, as you suggest, will likely take some time, particularly if there's any indication that there will be prosecutions. That would doubtlessly mean appeals and counter appeals, and the result might be a dormant Hearts for the duration, possibly years. It's becoming increasingly difficult to conceive of how they can put a team out, in any league, next year.

[ScottB]

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Don't think we're necessarily at odds here; I'm struggling to see how the frozen assets can be be unfrozen while any legal investigations are ongoing. Which, as you suggest, will likely take some time, particularly if there's any indication that there will be prosecutions. That would doubtlessly mean appeals and counter appeals, and the result might be a dormant Hearts for the duration, possibly years. It's becoming increasingly difficult to conceive of how they can put a team out, in any league, next year.

I'd take it to mean that they'll have to become a 'full' newco, unlike Rangers they won't be able to even pretend to be a continuation, because of the old club and its assets being tied up in criminal investigations. Some group of Yams will create a Hearts AFC or some such, set up shop elsewhere and hope to buy the original club's name / ground / whatever in the future. See how newco Fiorentina where called Florentina Viola for a few years till the liquidation of the original club was complete and they could then buy the rights to the name.

[CropleyWasGod]

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I'd take it to mean that they'll have to become a 'full' newco, unlike Rangers they won't be able to even pretend to be a continuation, because of the old club and its assets being tied up in criminal investigations. Some group of Yams will create a Hearts AFC or somesuch and set up shop elsewhere and hope to buy the original club's name / ground / whatever in the future. See how newco Fiorentina where called Florentina Viola for a few years till the liquidation of the original club was complete and they could then buy the rights to the name.

... all of which will be so much cheaper and cleaner for them, and which I have been suggesting to Yam mates for a few years.

[greenginger]

http://verslas.delfi.lt/ukiobankas/


Vlad's making a fight of it. He is suing the Lithuanian State for stealing his money.


* translator problems with that site !

[CropleyWasGod]

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http://verslas.delfi.lt/ukiobankas/


Vlad's making a fight of it. He is suing the Lithuanian State for stealing his money.


* translator problems with that site !

That'll keep things frozen.

[ScottB]

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... all of which will be so much cheaper and cleaner for them, and which I have been suggesting to Yam mates for a few years.

Yeah definitely, might be harder for them to try and parachute into SFL3 though than it was for Rangers.

I can't see why anyone would consider trying to keep the club going in its current state, even given emotional considerations, it just doesn't seem sensible.


I guess the other option would be to buy another club, Airdrie style. I was surprised Rangers didn't go that route, but then they got all obsessed with pretending to still be the same club I suppose...

[grunt]

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http://verslas.delfi.lt/ukiobankas/

Not very clear, but ...

Vladimir Romanov gives Lithuania and Lithuanian bank to court and seek compensation in damages (129)

April 2013. 15 d. 19:01

Failed "Farm bank owner Vladimir Romanov gives the court the State of Lithuania and Lithuanian bank. Application, the former banker says that the state and Lithuanian bank cheated it and requires an order damages. Required may amount to 70 million litas, announces LNK "Knowledge."

Informal knowledge, V. Romanov application states that all economic difficulties of the bank, for which the Bank of Lithuania to shut down the central bank has been known for several years ago. After the bank "Snoras collapse themselves with the Bank of Lithuania has agreed an action plan. It provides what you need to do Economy Bank, to avoid Snoras fortune. They say that 90 per cent. these actions Economy Bank fulfilled, and only his condition has improved, the Bank of Lithuania to shut down.

"Attorneys ask, I do not know anything. I could not find anything, just signed, the lawyer prepared. I know nothing. I'm not a businessman. I am an athlete. Goodbye, I do not want anything to calculate and know - LNK told V. Romanov.

His lawsuit against the state, and served on the Bank of Lithuania Vilnius Regional Court, and paid 50 thousand. LTL stamp duty. Its application to revoke Lithuanian bank's decision to limit economic activities of the Bank, appointed him an administrator, and then to the bank to transfer balances Siauliai Bank. It also requires the state to order on the Lithuanian bank decisions V. Romanov suffered financial harm. Amount of the claim does not request that the court calculated lost V. Romanov asset.

Day before the economic collapse of the bank, V. Romanov held bank holding exchange was worth about 70 million. LTL. Experts question whether an entrepreneur really such a sum would have received if they tried to sell. For exchange of such shares by the purchaser, is unlikely to occur. In addition, the audit disclosed to the bank's financial problems.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Not very clear, but ...

I know nothing. I'm not a businessman. I am an athlete.

Classic.

[Hibby70]

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I know nothing. I'm not a businessman. I am an athlete.

Classic.

I'm getting that on a tshirt.

[JeMeSouviens]

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Yeah definitely, might be harder for them to try and parachute into SFL3 though than it was for Rangers.

I can't see why anyone would consider trying to keep the club going in its current state, even given emotional considerations, it just doesn't seem sensible.


I guess the other option would be to buy another club, Airdrie style. I was surprised Rangers didn't go that route, but then they got all obsessed with pretending to still be the same club I suppose...

Think the rules were changed after Clydebank/Airdrie so that's not an option any more.

[lapsedhibee]

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Some group of Yams will create a Hearts AFC or some such, set up shop elsewhere and hope to buy the original club's name / ground / whatever in the future. See how newco Fiorentina where called Florentina Viola for a few years till the liquidation of the original club was complete and they could then buy the rights to the name.

Maybe "Hearts Trumpets" in the interim then?

[Prof. Shaggy]

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Maybe "Hearts Trumpets" in the interim then?

Brilliant!

[Mikey]

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I know nothing. I'm not a businessman. I am an athlete.

Classic.

Sounds very similar to the recent....

I know nothing. I'm not a businessman. I am a jounalist.

#allisathletic

[Dashing Bob S]

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I'd take it to mean that they'll have to become a 'full' newco, unlike Rangers they won't be able to even pretend to be a continuation, because of the old club and its assets being tied up in criminal investigations. Some group of Yams will create a Hearts AFC or some such, set up shop elsewhere and hope to buy the original club's name / ground / whatever in the future. See how newco Fiorentina where called Florentina Viola for a few years till the liquidation of the original club was complete and they could then buy the rights to the name.

Those assets that are frozen for the duration of the investigation, they must surely include the PBS and player contracts?

[CropleyWasGod]

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Those assets that are frozen for the duration of the investigation, they must surely include the PBS and player contracts?

Don't think so. They, as far as we know, are still owned by HMFC.

It's UBIG's assets that are frozen, ie its shares in HMFC. I know it's a pedantic distinction, but in theory they are still HMFC's to sell.

[Dashing Bob S]

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Don't think so. They, as far as we know, are still owned by HMFC.

It's UBIG's assets that are frozen, ie its shares in HMFC. I know it's a pedantic distinction, but in theory they are still HMFC's to sell.

So the ownership of the club is effectively frozen, unless they can find somebody would be stupid enough to buy those shares.

The only people in the known universe, and even this is now an outside possibility, would be Hearts fans themselves.

They have to try it on; surely there's going to be one last, massive, departing sting!

[CropleyWasGod]

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So the ownership of the club is effectively frozen, unless they can find somebody would be stupid enough to buy those shares.

The only people in the known universe, and even this is now an outside possibility, would be Hearts fans themselves.

They have to try it on; surely there's going to be one last, massive, departing sting!

Even stupid people aren't allowed to buy them

That said, UBIG don't own all the shares. Stupid people might want to buy the ones they don't own.

[Kato]

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I know nothing. I'm not a businessman. I am an athlete.

Classic.

Was going to pick out the exact same bit on reading it.

Top quality Vladness from the man himself.

[Springbank]

http://verslas.delfi.lt/ukiobankas/

Third picture down - is that the Lithuanian Rod Petrie or what?

[greenginger]

http://www.delfi.lt/news/daily/lithu....d?id=61153405


A new article on Vlad , his bank, UBIG and his associates but all in Lithuanian

Over to the Hibs.net Enigma operators.