Share Transfers Agreed/Cooling off period

[Phil MaGlass]

No hertz or the buns in the league, one can but dream,I have a feeling league restructuring will save the yams.

[greenginger]

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The trading while insolvent thing is a bit misleading. Broadly the rule is that if the directors incurred costs when they knew (or should have known) that the company would be unable to pay them then they could be held personally liable for those costs. This can only happen when the company suffers an insolvency event because until then the creditors will have an expectation of full payment. As it's written, the law is very strict and very clear, but in practice it doesn't seem to be pursued very strongly. The directors should be worried though, because if an insolvency event does take place they have very little defence against any lawsuit. In my long career I've advised directors to stop trading immediately (and that does mean NOW) maybe half a dozen times, but I've never seen a company in as bad shape as HoMFC is right now. I can honestly say that I wouldn't be at all surprised if we woke up one morning to find Tynie closed for good, particularly given Mr Romanov's recent comments and attitude.

http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk/4d...b5/compdetails

Funnily enough, Companies House lists them as being about 6 weeks late with their Annual Return which would confirm the names of current Yam directors.
May'be nobody wants to be the fall-guy, or may'be they can,t raise the £ 13 filing fee.

[matty_f]

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A lot of news sources now reporting they expect to have everyone paid by the end of today.

F****** boooooooooooooo!!!

[Monktonhall 7]

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What I dont understand is where they're getting the money to pay them today. I'm guessing its their 6 highest earners that haven't been paid which would amount to 10's if not 100's of thousands of pounds. If they couldn't pay them 3 days ago, what has happened in the last 3 days that has brought the new 'self sufficient' hearts that amount of money?

I'm thinking likewise. Although they have a home game on Sunday which is televised. Would ESPN/Sky pay the TV fee upfront? Add in a couple of thousand walk ups, and all the pie money, they might be able to survive this week. They will be at home next week also, but then its mid to end Nov before the next home game. Its going to be a tough Xmas for Ryan Stevenson and his family, but its obvious that they are not self sufficient, and that the mad one must be bailing them out, or they would need to shut down early Nov.

[mr_green]

:fenlon

[JimBHibees]

Were there not meant to be rules in place punishing teams who dont pay. Thought this was put in place after their last non-payment or is it the nonsense the players need to complain. One thing they shouldnt be allowed to do is sign new players though no doubt Skacel will be walking through the door in the next few days.

[Hibbyradge]

So what's happened between payday on Tuesday and today, that they have come up with the wages?

They haven't had money from Lithuania since the turn of the year, so where did it come from?

Bear in mind that it's the top earners who weren't paid.

[CallumLaidlaw]

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Were there not meant to be rules in place punishing teams who dont pay. Thought this was put in place after their last non-payment or is it the nonsense the players need to complain. One thing they shouldnt be allowed to do is sign new players though no doubt Skacel will be walking through the door in the next few days.

http://www.scotprem.com/content/defa...2&newsid=11407

– Specific requirements for SPL Clubs to pay their players and HMRC on time and be subject to sanctions if they do not. Clubs must also report to the SPL any failure to pay players or HMRC on time.

[#FromTheCapital]

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I'm thinking likewise. Although they have a home game on Sunday which is televised. Would ESPN/Sky pay the TV fee upfront? Add in a couple of thousand walk ups, and all the pie money, they might be able to survive this week. They will be at home next week also, but then its mid to end Nov before the next home game. Its going to be a tough Xmas for Ryan Stevenson and his family, but its obvious that they are not self sufficient, and that the mad one must be bailing them out, or they would need to shut down early Nov.

Yeah all points to the fact that barry anderson was talking ***** and hearts are a long way off being self sufficient. A normal football club can only make money in certain ways, i'd like to see how much the other spl teams have raked in the last 3 days when there has been absolutely nothing happening

[JimBHibees]

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http://www.scotprem.com/content/defa...2&newsid=11407

Cheers.

[DarrenSQH]

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So what's happened between payday on Tuesday and today, that they have come up with the wages?

They haven't had money from Lithuania since the turn of the year, so where did it come from?

Bear in mind that it's the top earners who weren't paid.

Wonga?

[hibs0666]

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So how can they actually keep trading at this point? I'm looking at Caversham and our other resident experts here...

Isn't it an offence to keep trading while knowing you are insolvent? This is a company with costs far beyond its income, it can't even meet its payroll obligations and its owner has publicly stated he won't fund them any more. Surely that all paints a picture of a business that should be shut down?

We shouldn't kid ourselves here - the yaks continue to spend more than they take in, and Romanov/UBIG continues to pick up the tab for the balance. If that was not the case the yaks would have shut down already.

The problem in yak-land is that all cash coming into the club is immediately transferred to UBIG in Lithuania, and the club gets a periodic hand-out to fund the operation. The yaks in Scotland have no control over the size or timing of that monthly hand-out. However, the current size of the hand-out is more than the club can generate itself, but less than what it needs to pay its many bills.

I wouldn't be surprised if, one month, the hand-out from UBIG simply doesn't happen and the whole house of cards simply topples at that point. If it does happen it will be without warning but you can bet your bottom dollar that Roanov will blame everyone but himself for bringing the yaks to their knees.

[hibs0666]

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I'm thinking likewise. Although they have a home game on Sunday which is televised. Would ESPN/Sky pay the TV fee upfront? Add in a couple of thousand walk ups, and all the pie money, they might be able to survive this week. They will be at home next week also, but then its mid to end Nov before the next home game. Its going to be a tough Xmas for Ryan Stevenson and his family, but its obvious that they are not self sufficient, and that the mad one must be bailing them out, or they would need to shut down early Nov.

Clubs aren't paid a fee for appearing on the telly - it goes into a big pot that is divvied out depending on performance, not on the number of TV appearances.

[Brooster]

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I'm thinking likewise. Although they have a home game on Sunday which is televised. Would ESPN/Sky pay the TV fee upfront? Add in a couple of thousand walk ups, and all the pie money, they might be able to survive this week. They will be at home next week also, but then its mid to end Nov before the next home game. Its going to be a tough Xmas for Ryan Stevenson and his family, but its obvious that they are not self sufficient, and that the mad one must be bailing them out, or they would need to shut down early Nov.

What tv fee? clubs don't get paid for games being on tv.

[Stevie Reid]

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The trading while insolvent thing is a bit misleading. Broadly the rule is that if the directors incurred costs when they knew (or should have known) that the company would be unable to pay them then they could be held personally liable for those costs. This can only happen when the company suffers an insolvency event because until then the creditors will have an expectation of full payment. As it's written, the law is very strict and very clear, but in practice it doesn't seem to be pursued very strongly. The directors should be worried though, because if an insolvency event does take place they have very little defence against any lawsuit. In my long career I've advised directors to stop trading immediately (and that does mean NOW) maybe half a dozen times, but I've never seen a company in as bad shape as HoMFC is right now. I can honestly say that I wouldn't be at all surprised if we woke up one morning to find Tynie closed for good, particularly given Mr Romanov's recent comments and attitude.

Thoroughly enjoyed reading that, CG

[NOLA]

They seem to play better when their wages are late, maybe its a russian motivation thing? Start winning or dinny get your money on time, simples ;)

[#FromTheCapital]

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They seem to play better when their wages are late, maybe its a russian motivation thing? Start winning or dinny get your money on time, simples ;)

If thats a genuine reason for them performing better and not some kind of weird coincidence then I'd be raging if I was a pink scarf twirler. If they can only be arsed performing when a financial issue arises then what does that say about them

[alexedwards]

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Why?

1. The club is not for sale - unless a madman puts in an insane offer.
2. It suits Romanovs bank to have the assets on their balance sheet
3. Romanov tried to buy Russian club Saturn and advised the Saturn owners they could forget about top division football and would have to accept a lower level if he took over, as the reason he was taking over was to route money. So it is likely Hearts will continue under this model - although Romanov had great interest initially that has changed due to other factors. However, he will keep them afloat for his own benefit but may also let them fall down a league as per his want.
4. Going into administration would benefit Romanov how?

[Part/Time Supporter]

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1. The club is not for sale - unless a madman puts in an insane offer.
2. It suits Romanovs bank to have the assets on their balance sheet
3. Romanov tried to buy Russian club Saturn and advised the Saturn owners they could forget about top division football and would have to accept a lower level if he took over, as the reason he was taking over was to route money. So it is likely Hearts will continue under this model - although Romanov had great interest initially that has changed due to other factors. However, he will keep them afloat for his own benefit but may also let them fall down a league as per his want.
4. Going into administration would benefit Romanov how?

It would allow them to get out of bad contracts.

[Phil D. Rolls]

With all this talk of winning trophies and medals by cheating, I couldn't help wondering what an older generation of fitba folk would make of it - such as the late great Brian Clough. Perhaps someone has a link?

[jgl07]

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If the season ticket money is now gone, the SPL have paid them in full, they have spent all the extra cash they made from the cup final and the tie with Liverpool and now don't have enough money to cover the wages for this month, they will not see out the month without a payment being sent from Lithuania.
They have 2 home game with a max of 2000 paying customers at each. That would bring in £80,000. Their wage bill is around £800,000 a month. Someone is going to have to beg Vlad or else call in the administrators.
Am I missing something, are there any other sources of income at this time of year?

Does anyone know what the wages paid by Hearts and who the big earners are?

[TrinityHibs]

On the zombieco thread somebody compared cash in and cash out and worked out when oldhuns were due to run out of money. Has anyone done the same for the pink palace parasites? I just dont understand how they can survive with say 3000 walk ups every fortnight paying an average of say £20. I would have thought that would have just about cover the six top paid soulsellers and Fuddley McFuddley. Has Vladdy stuck their season ticket cash in some long term Ukios back pocket in Lithuania that needs a notice period to free up cash?

[Viva_Palmeiras]

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They seem to play better when their wages are late, maybe its a russian motivation thing? Start winning or dinny get your money on time, simples ;)

Performance related pay - you perform get paid, don't you don't simples!

[Viva_Palmeiras]

In 1986 the football season seemed like just any other
but it wasn't.
It was different in many ways, as so were those that did the playing.
In 1986 the average age of the jambo player was 26...
In 2012 he is 19.
In inininininin 2012 he is 19.


(Singing Girls)
All those who remember that year
They won't forget what they've seen..
Destruction of men in their prime
whose average was 19
Dedededededede-Destruction
Dedededededede-Destruction

For those born post 80s apologies but at least this song didn't leave an imprint on your brain




http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=b3LdM...%3Db3LdMAqUMnM

[Peevemor]

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On the zombieco thread somebody compared cash in and cash out and worked out when oldhuns were due to run out of money. Has anyone done the same for the pink palace parasites? I just dont understand how they can survive with say 3000 walk ups every fortnight paying an average of say £20. I would have thought that would have just about cover the six top paid soulsellers and Fuddley McFuddley. Has Vladdy stuck their season ticket cash in some long term Ukios back pocket in Lithuania that needs a notice period to free up cash?

I suspect it was used to pay their wages at the end of last season and over the summer, as well as some VAT/PAYE that was due.

[HibbySpurs]

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In 1986 the football season seemed like just any other
but it wasn't.
It was different in many ways, as so were those that did the playing.
In 1986 the average age of the jambo player was 26...
In 2012 he is 19.
In inininininin 2012 he is 19.


(Singing Girls)
All those who remember that year
They won't forget what they've seen..
Destruction of men in their prime
whose average was 19
Dedededededede-Destruction
Dedededededede-Destruction

For those born post 80s apologies but at least this song didn't leave an imprint on your brain




http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=b3LdM...%3Db3LdMAqUMnM

- Hardcastle to perform at *********** per chance

[Caversham Green]

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1. The club is not for sale - unless a madman puts in an insane offer.
2. It suits Romanovs bank to have the assets on their balance sheet
3. Romanov tried to buy Russian club Saturn and advised the Saturn owners they could forget about top division football and would have to accept a lower level if he took over, as the reason he was taking over was to route money. So it is likely Hearts will continue under this model - although Romanov had great interest initially that has changed due to other factors. However, he will keep them afloat for his own benefit but may also let them fall down a league as per his want.
4. Going into administration would benefit Romanov how?

1. The club is not for sale - unless a madman puts in an insane offer. Mr Romanov has stated that the club is for sale, but has quoted a ridiculous price for it. In truth HoMFC is worth zilch as an investment because the assets are covered twice over by debt and it continues to make a loss. I don't know whether he thinks his price is a clever negotiating gambit or he thinks he can recover some of his losses by continuing to run the club, but it seems to me that his greatest wish is for that horrible little club to stop pissing all his money up the wall.

2. It suits Romanovs bank to have the assets on their balance sheet. If Mr Romanov's bank is following Intenational Accounting Standards it will already have a full provision against the asset meaning that the value in the balance sheet is already zero - bacause, as I've probably mentioned, that's what they're worth.

3. Romanov tried to buy Russian club Saturn .....let them fall down a league as per his want. I can't comment on the Saturn thing, but it certainly looks like the 'money routing' thing was one of his initial reasons for getting involved in HoMFC in the first place. It seems to me that the whole thing has been a huge failure - it's notable that his bank closed its office in Edinburgh after only a few months and his football club is worthless.

4. Going into administration would benefit Romanov how? The club is trying to operate as if it was in administration already, but not making a very good fist of it. If Mr Romanov wants to achieve a turnaround he might be better to appoint a professional, suffer the fees and protect the club from external creditors. As it stands the club is worth nothing so he has nothing to lose, particularly if he comes out the other side with a healthy club as Boyle did at Motherwell. I think they're beyond that though. While we all know that the directors are puppets it would certainly be in their interest to effect an insolvency event because, with reference to my earlier post, their only defence against trading while insolvent charges went down the pan when Mr Romanov declared he was no longer willing to fund the club. In any case it may not be Mr Romanov who decides to take the administration route if it happens.

[Sergey]

Not just a few Yams going without their wages, UBIG are 2 months behind paying their staff at their aluminium plant in Bosnia.

http://www.nezavisne.com/posao/privr...ta-163717.html

[Mikey]

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Not just a few Yams going without their wages, UBIG are 2 months behind paying their staff at their aluminium plant in Bosnia.

http://www.nezavisne.com/posao/privr...ta-163717.html

That's much more serious than a few highly paid layabouts not getting their money.

[EskbankHibby]

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That's much more serious than a few highly paid layabouts not getting their money.

, have to say even some of the more nauseating jambos seem to have woken this morning to the surprisingly strong aroma of coffee.

Difficult not to enjoy the paradigm shift from "GIRUY 5-1 likesay", "big team", "we owe it to ourselves" to:

"We need help to get through this, not punished. And by 'help' I don't mean hand-outs, I mean just a bit of understanding and patience."

Yes that's right my friends we - and others - need to help the wee lambs out apparently. The rod of iron which the pink hordes agreed everyone should use against the nasty, insolvent Rangers should not be used against them.

I look forward to the cap in hand, forelock tugging, obsequious pink hordes begging for a crumb from the glorious Hibernian table.