Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[Just Alf]

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Not sure about that. Money to Hearts and Vienna maybe but nothing in statement about accepting oldco sanctions.

I was meaning this bit....

"•Rangers newco's acceptance into the Scottish FA would only be approved if they accept responsibility for the football debts and fines incurred by the previous club along with their waiving of rights to a legal challenge "


mind you, that's from the BBC website so prob needs to be taken with a large pinch of salt!

[Spike Mandela]

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I was meaning this bit....

"•Rangers newco's acceptance into the Scottish FA would only be approved if they accept responsibility for the football debts and fines incurred by the previous club along with their waiving of rights to a legal challenge "


mind you, that's from the BBC website so prob needs to be taken with a large pinch of salt!

That's what I mean Sir Alf. I am no lawyer but debts and fines incurred but no mention of oldco sanctions.

Do you mean the legal challenge bit? Do you think this referes to the previous legal challenge regarding the embargo? My reading of that was no legal challenge to accepting debts and fines.

[Brando7]

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Am I missing something here?
if
Whatever happened to this SFA rule whereby to participate in the SPL you needed to be in possession of the Uefa Standard License? Given that oldco Rangers lost theirs and newco Rangers can't get one until they have 3 years trading accounts, ergo you'd assume no SPL for at least 3 years no? Their SPL share should then just get passed onto either Dunfemline or Dundee [**** knows how you argue that one out] and in the meantime newco Rangers have to apply to SFL for entry to Div3 [yes I hear the calls about even lower down the chain...]

For one, I've been scratching my heads as to why the rest of the SPL clubs were even being asked about allowing newco Rangers straight in as it would require a rule change by the SFA in that case? Unless its Doncasters way of trying to deflect flak from Rangers about it onto the other clubs? With regards them going straight into Div1, I've no idea whether theres a rule allowing this in the SFL or not but would suspect that clubs denied access to the SFL previously and those in Div2 and 3 will kick up **** [rightly] if that's the case.

Beginning to scratch my head at this as its getting more and more obviously crooked, particularly if they try to tack on the much needed and long overdue league rejigging as part of it but because it gets them back to the top table ahead of schedule. Reorganise it yes - put them at the bottom where the rules say they should go - everyone starts over.

Or was this rule about needing the Uefa License just a myth in the first place? Or if it wasn't have we just all given up on rules entirely? I for one will be livid with Hibs if they're part of rejigging with the pay-off being Rangers getting a leg-up. No need for any individual club to get any favourable treatment and certainly should have nothing to do with the rejig.

Heid is spinning with it all now...

GGTTH

As you say any SPL have 3 years trading accounts, So if they do allow Newco to go to the 1st and they win the league they surely not be allowed promotion as they do not meet SPL requirements?

[JeMeSouviens]

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I'm coming round to the idea of keeping Rangers half alive as a first division plaything, with the promise of more punishments, not being able to sign players and probably further demotion.

To me it beats just allowing them back as a totally new club at the bottom, being able to sign who they want and escaping any further punishment on ongoing investigations.

I predict that if this plan goes ahead the signing embargo will be dropped. They will tell FIFA that the relegation is a punishment greater than the embargo.

[jdships]

Stop and think about this for a minute .
As far as SFA /Div 1 clubs are concerned this is all simply about short term benefit .
They vote them into Div 1 , get two home games where the hordes will descend and give them two decent paydays ( by their standards) .
After a season they are promoted (?) and " Team 12" are someone elses problem.
Sorry I don't buy into this at all .
Let the rules apply as to any to other club . they apply for membership and if that request is granted they start in Div 3.
If the SFA/SPL or whoever hasn't the b...s to work by the rules then Scottish football will be a bigger joke than it is at 28/6/2012

[HFC 0-7]

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As you say any SPL have 3 years trading accounts, So if they do allow Newco to go to the 1st and they win the league they surely not be allowed promotion as they do not meet SPL requirements?

I mentioned the same thing a few posts ago and I think the rule would probably be revised following league restructuring.

[Andy74]

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I predict that if this plan goes ahead the signing embargo will be dropped. They will tell FIFA that the relegation is a punishment greater than the embargo.

Not so sure, I think relegation would be seen as a trade off for not treating them as a new enity and having to start again. (Not that I'm sure that relegation is even possible for them)

There are still other investigations ongoing for which punishments should be very severe.

These would presumably fall away with everyone's favoutite solution in allowing them to join as a newco in SFL 3.

[erin go bragh]

1st div clubs on newco joining them.

Cowdenbeath ..yes [no surprise there as guess who their chairman is ]

Dunbarton .. undecided

Dundee .. undecided

Dunfermline..undecided

Falkirk..no

Hamilton..undecided

Livingston..undecided

Morton..no

Partick Thistle..undecided

Raith Rovers no

3rd div or the juniors


ggtth

[matty_f]

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I predict that if this plan goes ahead the signing embargo will be dropped. They will tell FIFA that the relegation is a punishment greater than the embargo.

That's my take on it as well. They can't simply decide to relegate oldco Rangers without a reason for it. Oldco Rangers still have their share (and with it, I presume rights) until the vote on the 4th July.

If they are relegated prior to that date, as far as I can tell the need for the SPL clubs to vote in (or not) newco Rangers is gone. They are not the SFL's problem.

If the SFL clubs vote newco Rangers into the SFL 1, with the proviso that newco Rangers take the punishments due to oldco, along with the sweeteners for the TV deal, then this goes ahead and we'll all have been royally stitched up big style.

Rangers have a season in the First, then come back toot-sweet and strong as ever a season later.

Meanwhile, hopefully if that happens the rest of us give Scottish football the big **** you.

[blackpoolhibs]

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Not so sure, I think relegation would be seen as a trade off for not treating them as a new enity and having to start again. (Not that I'm sure that relegation is even possible for them)

There are still other investigations ongoing for which punishments should be very severe.

These would presumably fall away with everyone's favoutite solution in allowing them to join as a newco in SFL 3.

I wouldn't trust the authorities to deal out any other punishments once they are safely in SFL 1. They have done their damnedest to keep them in the SPL, what makes you think they have the balls to inflict more punishment on the great institution?

This needs finishing now, and the only way is to adhere the rules as set out at this minute in time. FFS even those have to be bent a little to let them in Div 3.

[matty_f]

Has anyone that's emailed Hibs about this had a reply yet?

[ancient hibee]

So you screw all the teams in the league you play in and that league then gives you a million quid-seems fair to me

[blackpoolhibs]

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So you screw all the teams in the league you play in and that league then gives you a million quid-seems fair to me

Only in Scotland.

[ancient hibee]

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If the stitch up is going ahead will they not be granted a licence as a matter of course? Will they not then be able to sign who they want? Maybe even get back some of their 'lost' players?

They've no money.

[matty_f]

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So you screw all the teams in the league you play in and that league then gives you a million quid-seems fair to me

It's ludicrous, isn't it?

The only flip side is that it's the SPL clubs that will benefit from selling the rights to SKY or whoever wants to watch SFL1, while the other SFL clubs take a shafting because they'll get a fraction of the £1m sweetener money and that's it.

The whole thing is fuelled by greed and money. From top to bottom, there is no sporting integrity. Just shafting folk left, right and centre for the purposes of making the rich clubs richer.

Quite why we should be bending over backwards for Green, who's sole intention is to take money OUT of the Scottish game and into his own pockets, I do not know.

[HFC 0-7]

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I'm coming round to the idea of keeping Rangers half alive as a first division plaything, with the promise of more punishments, not being able to sign players and probably further demotion.

To me it beats just allowing them back as a totally new club at the bottom, being able to sign who they want and escaping any further punishment on ongoing investigations.

Andy I would say that if the authorities are going to all this trouble to get them into division 1 they won't waste it by suddenly announcing the outcome of the dual contracts and having to take further action. If they went o division 3 they would struggle financially. Hey would have to completely change, the fans wouldn't come flooding in and inbox would become a costly stadium to run in division 3 as would Murray park. I have no doubts that this scenario should it actually happen will benefit rangers much more than division 3 would.

[Zondervan]

Now they are (allegedly) threatening to blackmail the SFL teams:

http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/r...rangers-plans/

If true, it is a disgrace - all to save the cheating Huns. And the SPL chairmen are a bunch of snakes if they have even contemplated this in the circumstances.

If anything, this whole Newco scenario has brought the non-Old Firm fans together.

[matty_f]

SPL statement below, doesn't tell us much though it does still refer to the vote on July 4th:

Press Statement ~ SPL Update

The SPL today held constructive talks with 11 member clubs ahead of the General Meeting on 4 July.

Following today’s meeting, the SPL will continue to work with the Scottish FA and SFL to discuss the best way forward for Scottish football.

All member clubs will meet on 4 July to formally decide whether to approve the transfer of Rangers FC share.

[matty_f]

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Now they are (allegedly) threatening to blackmail the SFL teams:

http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/r...rangers-plans/

If true, it is a disgrace - all to save the cheating Huns. And the SPL chairmen are a bunch of snakes if they have even contemplated this in the circumstances.

If anything, this whole Newco scenario has brought the non-Old Firm fans together.

These ******* will kill the Scottish game with this.

[Kyle A]

"SPL threaten breakaway second tier if clubs do not agree to Rangers plans"

http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/r...rangers-plans/


Games a bogey!

[EdinMike]

20 odd years of cheating and trophies for 1 year out of the picture and no debts !?!

You listening Petrie !?!

Of course Hibs (or any other team) Wouldn't be given this leniency, bar Celtic...

[Hibs7]

All honest supporters should boycott all games if this goes ahead, no supporters and they would soon rethink.

In fact all supporters associations should bombard the SPL condemning this plan. Sickening !!

[blackpoolhibs]

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These ******* will kill the Scottish game with this.

But Matty Hibs voted no, everythings fine. I believe you are right, this whole episode with rangers, has shown the world, but more importantly, its shown the supporters of every non old firm club, we are only in Scottish football to make the numbers up.

The authorities have taken the piss out of each and every one of us, with their pandering to Rangers.

I believe the games ****ed now, and A LOT OF PEOPLE WILL NEVER BE BACK. And thats a result of the actions of those in charge at the top of Scottish footballs.

[truehibernian]

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Now they are (allegedly) threatening to blackmail the SFL teams:

http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/r...rangers-plans/

If true, it is a disgrace - all to save the cheating Huns. And the SPL chairmen are a bunch of snakes if they have even contemplated this in the circumstances.

If anything, this whole Newco scenario has brought the non-Old Firm fans together.

Absolutely nothing surprises me with this move from Doncaster. What better promotion of SPL2 than to have Rangers, the media frenzy surrounding them, the no doubt season long saga of who owns them, who wants to buy them, court battles and more.

It means the concept hits the ground running and obtains the media spotlight all year.

Utterly disgraceful, corrupt and morally unacceptable and unpalatable - sums up Scottish football don't you think.

Sadly though it's what many thought would happen. Fans are secondary, money is king. They should hang their heads in shame - how ignorant do they think we are ?

[Sylar]

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1st div clubs on newco joining them.

Cowdenbeath ..yes [no surprise there as guess who their chairman is ]

Dunbarton .. undecided

Dundee .. undecided

Dunfermline..undecided

Falkirk..no

Hamilton..undecided

Livingston..undecided

Morton..no

Partick Thistle..undecided

Raith Rovers no

3rd div or the juniors


ggtth

Livingston came out at the start of this whole sorry saga and said they would be watching the unfolding situation with beady eyes to ensure the rule book was as rigidly enforced as it was when the SFL chose to relegate them to the third division.

I'd assume they're still very much in the "no" camp.

[Cropley10]

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I like the bit near the beginning of part 3 where I am pretty sure he says, "This club is going from strength to strength." WTF? He's either "McF****n Mad" (to paraphrase a Hun the other day talking about Vlad) or he's had one or ten cans of Tennents too many :O

Thank you John Brown. I listened to just a few minutes of his shambolic sub-fascist cretinous uber-nonsense on the steps of the Hoose of Bigness to the assembled riffraff, and thought to myself, what in the name of God can anyone possibly ever do or say on behalf of Rangers that could be more cringeworthy, more embarrassing than this mental case was coming away with.

And I was completely stumped.

[Andy74]

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SPL statement below, doesn't tell us much though it does still refer to the vote on July 4th:

Press Statement ~ SPL Update

The SPL today held constructive talks with 11 member clubs ahead of the General Meeting on 4 July.

Following today’s meeting, the SPL will continue to work with the Scottish FA and SFL to discuss the best way forward for Scottish football.

All member clubs will meet on 4 July to formally decide whether to approve the transfer of Rangers FC share.

I still really can't put together the statements made last week by chairman with the fact they are all plotting to get them in the SFL1 or an SPL2.

There has to be more to this, they aren't that stupid are they??

[Baldy Foghorn]

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Livingston came out at the start of this whole sorry saga and said they would be watching the unfolding situation with beady eyes to ensure the rule book was as rigidly enforced as it was when the SFL chose to relegate them to the third division.

I'd assume they're still very much in the "no" camp.

I am sure I read somewhere Livingston would be watching the situation closely, with the possibility of legal action against our governing body, if Derhun did not receive the harshest penalties possible....

[Andy74]

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Thank you John Brown. I listened to just a few minutes of his shambolic sub-fascist cretinous uber-nonsense on the steps of the Hoose of Bigness to the assembled riffraff, and thought to myself, what in the name of God can anyone possibly ever do or say on behalf of Rangers that could be more cringeworthy, more embarrassing than this mental case was coming away with.

And I was completely stumped.

What about the BNP boy that got involved? The murder of Rangers due to a Sectarian agenda.

[joe breezy]

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I still really can't put together the statements made last week by chairman with the fact they are all plotting to get them in the SFL1 or an SPL2.

There has to be more to this, they aren't that stupid are they??

Sounds like they're stupid - If i was a ST holder I certainly wouldn't be renewing with this cloud still ready to piss down on everyone