Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[TowerHibs]

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That just doesn't add up? In theory I could start a new club today. Purchase Ibrox and call myself Huns F.C - but I would be a NEWCO with no history. Surely I can't just adopt their history?

Also I wish they would stop hidding behind the term NEWCO - should it not just be NEW CLUB?

in theory you could - but Greene has a binding agreement to buy assets and registrations of Old Co

Rangers get to keep all historic trophies - works the other way though. Any punishment that will be dished out due to double contracts ("only match fixing worse") will transfer to new co as they have taken over rangers membership

[frazeHFC]

.....and the captain of the Titanic? They were both at the helm of sinking ships.

[Kaiser1962]

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The year we went from 10 to 12 teams the Dons finished bottom, but obviously there was no relegation. This wasn't done to save them.

In any case, Rangers haven't finished bottom, they've ceased to exist.

In reality there should be a vote to see who replaces them in the Scottish Leagues as there was following the demise of Gretna. Rangers FC will, in essence, cease to exist so therefore there will be a vacancy in the league set up. Newhun FC should take their chance to be elected by members along with Spartans and Gala Fairydean, who have been trying to get in for years.

[smurf]

Bye bye. As paying customers/supporters of our club it was us who were cheated. Our club must not vote to see them kept in.

[EdinMike]

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I have stated I would not go back to Easter Road if a newco Rangers go straight back into SPL. (I gave up my season 2 years ago before I slit my wrists watching Hibs). I have continued to go on an irregular basis.


However, if Rangers newco do not get elected into SPL I will buy a season ticket to support Hibs and the SPL for taking the moral integrity stance. Would anyone else do the same?


Would make a good poll if anyone can do it.

I have been struggling to decide to go on holiday or get me a season ticket this year. ( I haven't been on a good holiday in 5 years)

And yes I can officically say I will take up this "offer" !

[Dashing Bob S]

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That just doesn't add up? In theory I could start a new club today. Purchase Ibrox and call myself Huns F.C - but I would be a NEWCO with no history. Surely I can't just adopt their history?

Also I wish they would stop hidding behind the term NEWCO - should it not just be NEW CLUB?

It's not that far-fetched. The fans are what really makes up any club, not the board, who are custodians, or the players, who are temporary. If I were a businessman, I'd be going after Ibrox long before I went for the players contracts or 'intellectual' rights. Who has the church has the flock, and who has the flock has the club, even if they have to start non-league. So the scenario mooted on here earlier, about 2 competing Rangers FC's, is still credible, if a bit far-fetched.

It seems to me that Green doesn't have money to buy both parts of the club. Yet, there seems to be a belief that all the assets will end up in the hands of the same Newco (Green) and for a relatively trifling sum. That is very naive, and now that the incompetent, obstructive D&P are out the picture (who only seemed in their to buy Murray/Whyte more time) the HMRC appointed liquidators will go for the most money in the sale and won't be bound by sentiment/vested interest in the same way. I think other people might come in now.

[iwasthere1972]

.......................and Prince Philip. They both shafted the Queen good and proper.

[CropleyWasGod]

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How can Rangers assets e.g. Ibrox, the players and Murray park be sold, if HMRC are due £20m?

If it comes to liquidation, all the assets will be sold. IIRC, there will be no value in the players, as I think their contracts are cancelled or revert to the SFA.

The proceeds of those sales will be distributed amongst the creditors pro rata. HMRC will still get much less than their original claim, as will everyone else, but almost certainly more than they would have under the CVA.


For the record, RFC are not yet in liquidation. D&P are still administrators, and still have much of their job to do.

[Dashing Bob S]

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in theory you could - but Greene has a binding agreement to buy assets and registrations of Old Co

Rangers get to keep all historic trophies - works the other way though. Any punishment that will be dished out due to double contracts ("only match fixing worse") will transfer to new co as they have taken over rangers membership

That sounds good.

For that and other reasons, this will probably drag on to the extent I can see the newco Huns missing a season in the game.

[Kaiser1962]

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The bit that I can't make my mind up about though, is that £5.5m is ridiculously low for properties like Ibrox and Murray Park plus players' registrations, stock, fixtures and fittings and effectively the business of Rangers FC without any debts. Take out the properties and it becomes more realistic (although still quite cheap IMO). On the other hand, the implication within the CVA proposal - apart from the bit I'm referring to - is that the properties are included, and the liquidation scenario produces only £4.6m - again, ridculously low, but that values goodwill, players registrations etc at only £900k. Neither option makes complete sense to me unless the porperties really have already been salted away into separate ownership....

Rangers average income over the last ten seasons tops £50m per season average. Given that most SPL clubs wage bill is between £3m-£5m then there is huge scope to make money.

[Dashing Bob S]

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I have been struggling to decide to go on holiday or get me a season ticket this year. ( I haven't been on a good holiday in 5 years)

And yes I can officically say I will take up this "offer" !

It's a huge defining moment for Scottish football. The product has been dull and Hun cheating has helped strangle the last of the competition out the game. I think so many people have had enough and are ready to walk. If this window of opportunity to clean up the game is wasted by a bunch of cowards and self-interested short-termist fools who want an easy life, then it's finished in my book.

[PatHead]

BDO the liquidators of Rangers FC have made a statement

BDO partners Malcolm Cohen and James Stephen will be appointed joint-liquidators to the old company, although no timescale for when this will happen has been made available.

Cohen said: "Once BDO is formally appointed, the joint liquidators will be seeking to protect any remaining assets, maximise recoveries for the benefit of creditors, and investigate the reasons behind the failure of the company.

"It is right that there is a full and robust investigation into why the company failed, together with concerted efforts to recover monies for creditors and the taxpayer. This may include pursuit of possible claims against those responsible for the financial affairs of the company in previous years."

David Murray could be in for some hard labour. Wonder if Campbell Ogilvie will get off scot free?

[Lungo--Drom]

Heard it for the first time driving home from Stirling on the M80 when I put the 1 o'clock news on the radio. Nearly swerved right off onto the hard shoulder when they read the news out,
and then this hit song from 1989 popped into my head for some reason

[frazeHFC]

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.......................and Prince Philip. They both shafted the Queen good and proper.

[Kaiser1962]

Would anyone else s****** ever so slightly if its now announced that the Big Tax Case has went in Rangers favour? Be honest.....

[Kyle A]

http://sport.stv.tv/football/105857-...w-for-rangers/


On this STV Q&A a guy asked this

Guest: Guys, we are aware NewCo Rangers would inherit history of OldCo Rangers if membership transfer is agreed. What if SPL vote No to accepting them but SFA agree to transfer. Would that mean most of Ranger's history is intact but they would lose history from '98 onwards? Thanks :).

Was answered with this

STV Grant:
Rangers would still be down as the title winners but any New Rangers which started again in Division Three presumably wouldn't be viewed as the same club as Old Rangers by the SPL.

So to answer your question, New Rangers wouldn't have won SPL titles from 1998 onwards.
Also on the Q&A was this cracker

Eddie Hart :
how can the newco get a vote on if they can become an spl member surely only existing members get a vote and on that surely the oldco wont have a vote either as they no longer exist?? is there NO integrity in this game??

Answer

Eddie, the newco doesn't vote. The oldco still exists at this point and holds the share so it has the right to vote on any proposal on the table. Obviously they will vote yes but they are entitled to do so.

[ancienthibby]

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BDO the liquidators of Rangers FC have made a statement

BDO partners Malcolm Cohen and James Stephen will be appointed joint-liquidators to the old company, although no timescale for when this will happen has been made available.

Cohen said: "Once BDO is formally appointed, the joint liquidators will be seeking to protect any remaining assets, maximise recoveries for the benefit of creditors, and investigate the reasons behind the failure of the company.

"It is right that there is a full and robust investigation into why the company failed, together with concerted efforts to recover monies for creditors and the taxpayer. This may include pursuit of possible claims against those responsible for the financial affairs of the company in previous years."

David Murray could be in for some hard labour. Wonder if Campbell Ogilvie will get off scot free?

I think there's about to be an implosion at RFC and the SPL.

We have the completely ludicrous position of Duff and Duffer making statements about which they no longer have any say - well after the formal CVA rejection vote is in on Thursday.

Then we have the Green Goblin pontificating as if he now has a done deal on the first favoured position ahead of liquidation.

Hector has already said that's not the case.

The Weegie media are already forecasting that NewHunCo will be in the SPL next year.

And Donkey-caster is nowhere to be found.

The sparks have only just started!

[Kato]

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They might find that difficult. Wasn't there something about Celtic fans/financial opportunists buying all legal copyright names when the Huns financial difficulties were first mooted?

No one bought up "Zombie Rangers FC". That's were they'll go imho.

That way there will be a constant reminder that they were once just "Rangers" and the fans can continue in their shambling, bedraggled style without a blink. The green skin might be a draw back though.

[CB_NO3]

Colin Hendry "the Old Firm are the SPL"
Alex Rae "HMRC have done us over"
Gordon Smith "we were told the CVA would be accepted" eh by who? your Mum.

These guys are muppets and the most ignorant men on the planet.

[CropleyWasGod]

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I think there's about to be an implosion at RFC and the SPL.

We have the completely ludicrous position of Duff and Duffer making statements about which they no longer have any say - well after the formal CVA rejection vote is in on Thursday.

Then we have the Green Goblin pontificating as if he now has a done deal on the first favoured position ahead of liquidation.

Hector has already said that's not the case.

The Weegie media are already forecasting that NewHunCo will be in the SPL next year.

And Donkey-caster is nowhere to be found.

The sparks have only just started!

D&P are still administrators, and probably will be even after the CVA rejection is formalised. Remember that Plan B was to sell some/all assets to CG for £5.5m. That process will continue, albeit it will probably be challenged.

So, until they are out of office, D&P are entitled to make such statements.

[Leithenhibby]

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Would anyone else s****** ever so slightly if its now announced that the Big Tax Case has went in Rangers favour? Be honest.....

Honestly, I'd be gutted. I don't want, and never will want them to get anything.

This has been coming for a good long time now and sadly the end to this thread also.

Bring on the next contestant

[Lungo--Drom]

I would accept Govan Hun FC being accepted into SFL Division 3 too, but if they are allowed straight into the SPL then I will refuse to recognise them and never attend or watch a match that they play in. The SPL chairmen must stand together and show that they too are not crooks and dodgy dealers and fast buck merchants but chairmen of sports clubs.

All hail The Tache, all hail sporting integrity!

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Answered few pages up...SPL dual contract investigation could still leave them open to 'charges'...From Hectors point of view its over (other than seeking to nail historical owners / directors)



To be fair to D&P (hard as that is) Rangers made themselves toxic and worth diddly squat...like selling pork for a Jewish wedding feast




Div 3 would be my favoured route---and should ensure all those saying they would not go back without punishment will fill ER to the brim

[Bishop Hibee]

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BDO the liquidators of Rangers FC have made a statement

BDO partners Malcolm Cohen and James Stephen will be appointed joint-liquidators to the old company, although no timescale for when this will happen has been made available.

Cohen said: "Once BDO is formally appointed, the joint liquidators will be seeking to protect any remaining assets, maximise recoveries for the benefit of creditors, and investigate the reasons behind the failure of the company.

"It is right that there is a full and robust investigation into why the company failed, together with concerted efforts to recover monies for creditors and the taxpayer. This may include pursuit of possible claims against those responsible for the financial affairs of the company in previous years."

David Murray could be in for some hard labour. Wonder if Campbell Ogilvie will get off scot free?

Happy day K. Hopefully BDO will be thorough in their investigations. Ogilvie is as guilty as sin in my opinion and hopefully Hertz will be drawn into the mire at some point.

We need Petrie and 3 other SPL Chairmen to do the right thing and then the coffin lid will be closed with the stake firmly driven through the heart of the beast.

[GreenCastle]

The SPL doesn't need Rangers - several media outlets have printed reports over the last few weeks explaining the amount of money Rangers bring is isn't as much as people make out. The chances are season ticket sales will improve if Rangers are fairly kicked out

Can someone answer these questions please -

1. When is the vote of the clubs to say whether or not they want Rangers in the SPL ? (Do Dunfermline or Ross County vote?)
2. T.V deal - what happens to this ? Will it be re-negotiated if Rangers are kicked out ?
3. If Rangers are kicked out - how does that affect the other teams in the club ? Youth Teams / Women's Team ?
4. Who would take their position in the SPL if they are booted out ?
5. Will the SPL release fixtures on Monday and will the SPL kick off on time?
6. Will Rangers be banned from competing in the League and Scottish Cup ?

Thanks

[GordonHFC]

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So Rangers last 2 owners where Green & Whyte and the last player they signed was Celik. You really couldn't make this up.

What are the chances of Victor Gold coming in with a late bid to partner Green and Whyte

[monktonharp]

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The year we went from 10 to 12 teams the Dons finished bottom, but obviously there was no relegation. This wasn't done to save them.

In any case, Rangers haven't finished bottom, they've ceased to exist.

correct, Rangers is now a non-word

[Moulin Yarns]

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If it comes to liquidation, all the assets will be sold. IIRC, there will be no value in the players, as I think their contracts are cancelled or revert to the SFA.

The proceeds of those sales will be distributed amongst the creditors pro rata. HMRC will still get much less than their original claim, as will everyone else, but almost certainly more than they would have under the CVA.


For the record, RFC are not yet in liquidation. D&P are still administrators, and still have much of their job to do.

I was saying the very same to one of our finance folks at lunchtime. by selling off the assests at realistic prices more will be raised.

a quick question. after Thursday's confirmation that the CVA is dead, do Duff and Phelps get added to the list of creditors, or do they still get all that's due them?

[monktonharp]

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What are the chances of Victor Gold coming in with a late bid to partner Green and Whyte

green white and gold, oh, the bells o' hell go ting-a-ling-a-ling ...............fur you ya ex-hun b.......s

[ScottB]

If New Rangers want their old clubs history as there own, fine, but they should have to take the lot, its many punishments with it. I object to the notion that they can buy just the good bits.

Also at this stage, with the Tribunal possibly likely to suspend or terminate the Oldco's SFA licence, how can there possibly be a transfer? The Newco needs to start from scratch with its own licence and apply for entry into Division 3. Anything else is simply unacceptable.

[Leithenhibby]

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I was saying the very same to one of our finance folks at lunchtime. by selling off the assests at realistic prices more will be raised.

a quick question. after Thursday's confirmation that the CVA is dead, do Duff and Phelps get added to the list of creditors, or do they still get all that's due them?

I understand that they do!

********* shysters ...