Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[Lungo--Drom]

It's like I said a few weeks ago. Unless you can't help yourself coz you're a dyed in the wool Hun, then everyone should boycott RFC on all levels, including commercially and football wise. In other words ignore them and have nothing to do with them. Don't sell goods or services to them and don't attend any matches that they play in. Their blue tinted world would maybe implode sooner if that happened.

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I have to say more fool those who continue to do business with them. Commercial naivete on their part.

[Spike Mandela]

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Is there a distinction here though?

If the Swiss FA followed all the correct procedures but Sion went to court then they were fair game. Is that what happened?

It seems like an error has been made by the SFA which means they'd be stupid to ignore the decision or risk possible further intervention from the courts, not just here but throughout football.

The SFA haven't necessarily made an error though Vick. A QC and a high court judge have disagreed with another high court judge. The SFA chose not to appeal the decision but may very well have won an appeal. They seem to have acquiesced to Rangers rather quickly imo.

[Caversham Green]

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Yup, if it increases the selling value of the property....

But a price has already been agreed and contracted .

[jgl07]

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The SFA haven't necessarily made an error though Vick. A QC and a high court judge have disagreed with another high court judge. The SFA chose not to appeal the decision but may very well have won an appeal. They seem to have acquiesced to Rangers rather quickly imo.

The SFA could not have gone to appeal without getting themselves in trouble with FIFA. I suspect that unless Rangers are given a harsher penalty that they will be hauled up by FIFA.

We will have to wait and see what the panel hands out. If Rangers challenge this in the courts then there really will be blood on the carpet.

[cad]

Somethings be bothering me for a while now and I need to get it off my chest in this Rangers fiasco , theres always a single point in cases that stick out things that went against the grain things that the SFA , FIFA , Uefa and the police should have done something about , yet didnt ,
they seem to have let it slide for whatever reason

I`ll tell you whats pee`d me of big time is McCoists name the panel stint and the afters these elected people had to put up with ,plus the singing of the songs whens that all getting looked into, never heard a peep about it ,brushed under the carpet forgotten about,if something you said resulted in threats of violence ,possible arson attacks ,and threats to your family surely some form of accountability would be laid at your door ,the police even had to issue warnings ,so wheres the follow up whens the tap tap tap on Allys door going to happen ,would it have taken a victim or a fire to get things moving Im just asking likes I see this as a gross dereliction of duty by the bodies Ive mentioned and they themselves should be investigated for those very reasons

I think the notch just got raised by a tweet today I took this of my other form of entertainment Rangers Media and in this case they definitely have a point, tell me what you think is it a storm in a tea cup or more sinister Ive always believed ones as bad as the other nothing between them but the fact people can even consider putting that up for public viewing beggars belief .

[Andy74]

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The SFA haven't necessarily made an error though Vick. A QC and a high court judge have disagreed with another high court judge. The SFA chose not to appeal the decision but may very well have won an appeal. They seem to have acquiesced to Rangers rather quickly imo.

I think they had to, they couldn't argue in future against clubs going to the courts if they were to use it themselves to appeal.

I can't see any other way than the SFA committee going up the way with the punishments and Rangers will certainly risk FIFA action if they chose to take that, which is within the remit of the SFA committee, to further court action. That would really be challenging a valid football judgement.

If the Committee go down the way then the game is up as far as who runs Scottish football.

[greenginger]

Did Regan not say that if Rangers accept the original signing ban that would be an end of it.

Rangers would be crazy not to take this way out, but we can but hope their arrogance prevails over common sense.

[Spike Mandela]

I have a funny feeling that all that will happen in the event of suspension is the CVA will fail and newco will form and circumvent any suspension by leaving the punishment with the oldco. Then it will be up to the SPL lapdogs to re admit the cheats.

[lapsedhibee]

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I`ll tell you whats pee`d me of big time is McCoists name the panel stint and the afters these elected people had to put up with ,plus the singing of the songs whens that all getting looked into, never heard a peep about it ,brushed under the carpet forgotten about,if something you said resulted in threats of violence ,possible arson attacks ,and threats to your family surely some form of accountability would be laid at your door ,the police even had to issue warnings ,so wheres the follow up whens the tap tap tap on Allys door going to happen ,would it have taken a victim or a fire to get things moving Im just asking likes I see this as a gross dereliction of duty by the bodies Ive mentioned and they themselves should be investigated for those very reasons

Surprising too that Traynoryoungdodds haven't been using their combined journalistic muscle to get to the bottom of this inaction.

[CropleyWasGod]

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But a price has already been agreed and contracted .

I was looking beyond the Green situation to liquidation.

[grunt]

D&P release results of creditors meeting and revision to their initial proposals - wonder what changed?

http://www.rangers.co.uk/staticFiles...~177305,00.pdf

[Newry Hibs]

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I have a funny feeling that all that will happen in the event of suspension is the CVA will fail and newco will form and circumvent any suspension by leaving the punishment with the oldco. Then it will be up to the SPL lapdogs to re admit the cheats.

Just thinking out loud a bit here, but this voting in the newco, is it a possibility becasue they will get the oldco licence? If so why should the cheating oldco still hold the licence (other than they arra peepul)? Surely the oldco need to have this stripped from them?

If it doesn't depend on the licence, then are the SPL voting in any old company that just happens to be formed and have Rangers in the name?

[CropleyWasGod]

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D&P release results of creditors meeting and revision to their initial proposals - wonder what changed?

http://www.rangers.co.uk/staticFiles...~177305,00.pdf

Was the bit about HMRC getting their way with the appointment of the liquidators in the original?

[Caversham Green]

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I was looking beyond the Green situation to liquidation.

Liquidation isn't on the table though. The options are CVA or Newco buying all the assets for £5.5m - unless the point I made way back in post #10288 is accurate.

[green glory]

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Was the bit about HMRC getting their way with the appointment of the liquidators in the original?

Hmm I don't think so, but I do remember BDO being talked about as liquidators a while ago.

Wednesday/Thursday next week will be joyous if the CVA is rejected. Hopefully with the SFA kicking them when they're down with a suspension or expulsion.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Liquidation isn't on the table though. The options are CVA or Newco buying all the assets for £5.5m - unless the point I made way back in post #10288 is accurate.

Was that about the properties not being sold on? (sorry, CBA reading back)

[johnbc70]

Lots of thing being swept under the carpet. I have asked the SPL 3 times now for details of their investigation into alleged sectarian signing at the Rangers v Kilmarnock game on the 18th February. It was mentioned in the SPL delegate's match report yet more than 3 months on we have seen nothing. All my requests have been polite and courteous yet not even had an acknowledgment from the SPL. I don't see how the current issues at Ibrox can stop them investigating this and issuing a response to what were serious allegations.

[HFC 0-7]

Is there any way that that the creditors can all get together and ask for th admins to be removed and different ones installed?

[grunt]

These two clauses are new:

17.1.9 - acceptance of Joint Admin's proposals does not imply acceptance of Voluntary Arrangements
17.1.10 - admins to report to creditors on CVA no later than 3 months from creditors meeting (I guess this means by 5 July)

These clauses have changed:

17.1.11 - appointment of liquidators - in the original proposal, D&P suggested they would act as liquidators. In the revised and agreed version, BDO will be liquidators.

17.1.12 - now includes right of creditors to challenge D&P fees.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Is there any way that that the creditors can all get together and ask for th admins to be removed and different ones installed?

If a majority thought that the admins weren't doing their job properly, they could apply to the Courts.

[Caversham Green]

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Was that about the properties not being sold on? (sorry, CBA reading back)

That's right - in the Estimated Outcome Statement the £5.3m purchase price is marked against player contracts and IPR/goodwill only. Freehold property is marked N/A. I did come to the conclusion that it was just badly drafted, but it's a big error given their keenness to stick to the letter of the law.

[grunt]

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Liquidation isn't on the table though. The options are CVA or Newco buying all the assets for £5.5m - unless the point I made way back in post #10288 is accurate.

Sure, but NewCo means liquidation of OldCo, no?

[Caversham Green]

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Sure, but NewCo means liquidation of OldCo, no?

It does, but within the context of my debate with CWG my point was that the value of Ibrox isn't enhanced by the relaying of the pitch because the liquidation sale price has already been established.

[JeMeSouviens]

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Liquidation isn't on the table though. The options are CVA or Newco buying all the assets for £5.5m - unless the point I made way back in post #10288 is accurate.

Suggestions on the RTC blog have been made that the asset purchase deal is only irrevocable in one direction, ie. the admins have a fallback position that Green will buy if they can't get more any other way.

[Just Alf]

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Just thinking out loud a bit here, but this voting in the newco, is it a possibility becasue they will get the oldco licence? If so why should the cheating oldco still hold the licence (other than they arra peepul)? Surely the oldco need to have this stripped from them?

If it doesn't depend on the licence, then are the SPL voting in any old company that just happens to be formed and have Rangers in the name?

Absolutley spot on argument .... would be very keen to see the "powers that be" respond to that question.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Suggestions on the RTC blog have been made that the asset purchase deal is only irrevocable in one direction, ie. the admins have a fallback position that Green will buy if they can't get more any other way.

"any other way" INCLUDING liquidation?

[grunt]

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It does, but within the context of my debate with CWG my point was that the value of Ibrox isn't enhanced by the relaying of the pitch because the liquidation sale price has already been established.

Ah right, sorry, see what you mean. Another example of expenditure which diminishes creditor pot (if Rangers (IA) paid for it) but does not enhance creditor value. I hope that the sale of assets to Green is capable of challenge.

[Caversham Green]

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Suggestions on the RTC blog have been made that the asset purchase deal is only irrevocable in one direction, ie. the admins have a fallback position that Green will buy if they can't get more any other way.

I think that's probably right, but the discussion was about the cost of relaying the pitch at Ibrox. My point is that the administrators had no reason to incur that cost because as far as they are concerned only CVA or Newco is going to happen and relaying the pitch doesn't improve the outcome for creditors in either option.

It looks like the debate has been superseded anyway if the RFFF have financed it.

[JeMeSouviens]

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These two clauses are new:

17.1.9 - acceptance of Joint Admin's proposals does not imply acceptance of Voluntary Arrangements

This is interesting in that it backs up the position of one regular RTC poster who has been banging the drum that the "CVA" is not really a CVA but merely a "Proposal to hold a CVA". So creditors would have to accept the proposal and then we'd go back to D&P for an actual CVA and another vote (and yet another delay).

[johnbc70]

Lots of thing being swept under the carpet. I have asked the SPL 3 times now for details of their investigation into alleged sectarian signing at the Rangers v Kilmarnock game on the 18th February. It was mentioned in the SPL delegate's match report yet more than 3 months on we have seen nothing. All my requests have been polite and courteous yet not even had an acknowledgment from the SPL. I don't see how the current issues at Ibrox can stop them investigating this and issuing a response to what were serious allegations.