Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[Seveno]

CVA out tomorrow but Ticketus got advanced notice. Presumably Hector did as well.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18240543

[jgl07]

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Dundee probably can't be a straightforward substitute for Rangers after the fixtures are published, though, as Dundee can't play at home on the same day as Dundee U. Rangers on the other hand can't be at home on the same day as Celtc. It'd all be too complicated. I'm coming round to Donkey D's view, that all things considered it'd be best to keep Rangers in the (top six of the) SPL.

Nonsense.

They can produce two sets of fixtures, one including Rangers, one including Dundee.

[calmac12000]

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Nonsense.

They can produce two sets of fixtures, one including Rangers, one including Dundee.

That's altogether far to reasonable an approach, to find favour with the SPL!

[grunt]

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Dundee to the SPL, Airdrie Utd to Division One, Stranraer to Division Two and Govan 1690 as the new entrant to Division Three.

Why should Govan 1690 get in before Spartans? Last time there was a vacancy in the SFL there was a vote...

[hibs0666]

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Nonsense.

They can produce two sets of fixtures, one including Rangers, one including Dundee.

The SFL cannot do that though.

[jgl07]

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The SFL cannot do that though.

Airdrie for Dundee in SFL1 will hardly be a major change. Neither will Stranraer for Airdrie be a major deal in SFL2.

These feeble excuses hold no water whatsoever. Not even a buffoon like Doncaster would use that one?

Administrative convenience is not the issue. It is sporting integrity against money.

[hibs0666]

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Airdrie for Dundee in SFL1 will hardly be a major change. Neither will Stranraer for Airdrie be a major deal in SFL2.

These feeble excuses hold no water whatsoever. Not even a buffoon like Doncaster would use that one?

Administrative convenience is not the issue. It is sporting integrity against money.

And when exactly do you expect the clubs concerned to set their budgets?

[jgl07]

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And when exactly do you expect the clubs concerned to set their budgets?

You appear to be making a (feeble) case to retain Rangers in the SPL. If so come clean.

As if Airdrie would have a markedly different budget in SFL2 as compared to SFL1?

[grunt]

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And when exactly do you expect the clubs concerned to set their budgets?

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As if Airdrie would have a markedly different budget in SFL2 as compared to SFL1?

And any team going up a division will have an increased budget than they previously anticipated. Much easier to handle an increased budget. I'm sure they'd manage.

[Twa Cairpets]

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Not true; the sfa don't organise leagues in our country, for senior clubs. That's the job of the SPL and the SFL. Even so, SPL, SFL and SFA are only governing bodies for Scottish clubs. Not one of them is required for groups of clubs to form and to play together in a league ... therefore, the clubs are more important than the governing bodies, and that's how it should be.

This isn't correct. from a practical point of view. No SFA affiliation = no referees provided by SFA, no European football, nor players able to play international football. So while in theory they could play games against each other, they'd do so with no recognition by world football, and with no referees or Craig Thomson.

[hibs0666]

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You appear to be making a (feeble) case to retain Rangers in the SPL. If so come clean.

As if Airdrie would have a markedly different budget in SFL2 as compared to SFL1?

There is no need to make this feeble argument for the disposal of the huns - there are far better reasons than this marginal nonsense to chuck them out.

Don't let yourself be distracted by small technicalities - always follow the money.

[Purple & Green]

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The fixtures will not be a problem, well at least not for the SPL. They can simply substitute Dundee for Rangers.

Im not convinced its that simple, I thought all spl teams are paired in the fixture computer and rangers are paired with Celtic, us and hearts etc because of the logistics of having one team home and one team away each given week. Dundee and Dundee United presumably share stewards etc so just swapping rangers with Dundee would presumably mean significant disruption for the two Dundee sides.

Have the Dundee teams played alternate weeks in different divisions?

[PatHead]

Had this forwarded to me this evening. Appreciated the guys heartfelt honesty. Wish someone would ask the simple questions and get straightforward answers.

http://shaunyfbblog.wordpress.com/20...ed-by-many-13/

[PatHead]

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Im not convinced its that simple, I thought all spl teams are paired in the fixture computer and rangers are paired with Celtic, us and hearts etc because of the logistics of having one team home and one team away each given week. Dundee and Dundee United presumably share stewards etc so just swapping rangers with Dundee would presumably mean significant disruption for the two Dundee sides.

Have the Dundee teams played alternate weeks in different divisions?

Yes.

[clerriehibs]

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This isn't correct. from a practical point of view. No SFA affiliation = no referees provided by SFA, no European football, nor players able to play international football. So while in theory they could play games against each other, they'd do so with no recognition by world football, and with no referees or Craig Thomson.

The SFA is the governing body of the clubs; it doesn't exist if the clubs don't want it to. It always will do, because whatever shape or or form the clubs want their grouping the clubs want to take, it's always a grouping of Scottish football clubs. But the SFA only exists because the clubs want it to ... the clubs don't exist because the SFA came along.

[clerriehibs]

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Im not convinced its that simple, I thought all spl teams are paired in the fixture computer and rangers are paired with Celtic, us and hearts etc because of the logistics of having one team home and one team away each given week. Dundee and Dundee United presumably share stewards etc so just swapping rangers with Dundee would presumably mean significant disruption for the two Dundee sides.

Have the Dundee teams played alternate weeks in different divisions?

It has to be simple ... the SPL f-up the so called "provincial" teams all the time with their fixture rearrangements for TV. Even if every single Dundee/Dundee United home fixture were scheduled for the same weekend, we have Thursday night, Friday night, Saturday lunchtime/3pm/evening, Sunday lunchtime/3pm, Monday evening to choose from ... if Donkey sees rescheduling as a problem, then why the f has it not been a problem to p!ss us off over the past few years when it suits them?

[Cool_Hand_Luke]

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Had this forwarded to me this evening. Appreciated the guys heartfelt honesty. Wish someone would ask the simple questions and get straightforward answers.

http://shaunyfbblog.wordpress.com/20...ed-by-many-13/

Is that a funny handshake he is asking us to ponder at the very end

[Sammy7nil]

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Is that a funny handshake he is asking us to ponder at the very end

Looks like Super Ally may have got it wrong but Mr Mccall knows how to get on in the West coast

[Twa Cairpets]

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The SFA is the governing body of the clubs; it doesn't exist if the clubs don't want it to. It always will do, because whatever shape or or form the clubs want their grouping the clubs want to take, it's always a grouping of Scottish football clubs. But the SFA only exists because the clubs want it to ... the clubs don't exist because the SFA came along.

Thats true, but as the clubs are now memebers of the SFA, if the SFA decided for whatever reason not to recognise what would effectively be a breakaway body, the clubs would be entirely isolated, and ultimately doomed to fail. It may seem counter intuitive as it affects the elite senior clubs, but the SFA is the governing body for the entirety of the sport in Scotland to which the SPL, SFL and all other governing bodies (youth, schools, referees, womens etc) are ultimatly responsible.

[PatHead]

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Is that a funny handshake he is asking us to ponder at the very end

No need for a hmmm. Obvious

[clerriehibs]

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Thats true, but as the clubs are now memebers of the SFA, if the SFA decided for whatever reason not to recognise what would effectively be a breakaway body, the clubs would be entirely isolated, and ultimately doomed to fail. It may seem counter intuitive as it affects the elite senior clubs, but the SFA is the governing body for the entirety of the sport in Scotland to which the SPL, SFL and all other governing bodies (youth, schools, referees, womens etc) are ultimatly responsible.

That's true as well ... but if a very significant majority of the senior clubs fell out with the others, and formed their own association, then I would think chances are UEFA would ultimately go along with the breakaways. After long and protracted court cases.

This won't happen, and is entirely unfeasible (because the SFA is the clubs), but suppose the great majority of the affiliated clubs (the ones without SFA committee members) get fed up with the SFA allowing Rankgers to break every rule in the book without the punishment we can all see is appropriate. So they break away and form SFA-2 ... ultimately, UEFA would probably have to recognise SFA-2, if it was representative of those involved in the game in Scotland.

[Greentinted]

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Looks like Super Ally may have got it wrong but Mr Mccall knows how to get on in the West coast

Am no sure its a big secret that Sue Barker's favourite cheeky chappie likes a bit of breast-flashing up the lodge. http://www.lodge76.wanadoo.co.uk/fam...emasons.htm#M.

[ScottB]

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Had this forwarded to me this evening. Appreciated the guys heartfelt honesty. Wish someone would ask the simple questions and get straightforward answers.

http://shaunyfbblog.wordpress.com/20...ed-by-many-13/

Craig Thomson a stick on for being one of those refs

[gramskiwood]

I think this is the time for all football supporters to reclaim the game from the football cartell that is the old firm (SFA SPL RFC CFC).

[Ozyhibby]

Copied this from RTC. The poster is fairly well regarded over there as being ITK.

there has been a lot of speculation surrounding the news that more is to come out about Rangers and the seriousness of what is still to be revealed.

the first thing however is to dispel some of the wider rumours that have been doing the rounds.

this is not about match fixing, its not about bribing referees, its not about political interference , its not about banks behaving inappropriately or illegally .

I have absolutely no knowledge of any of these things.It is also highly unfair that individuals who have not been involved in any wrongdoing are speculated about. As i posted earlier the information I alluded to is not my story. I can therefore only provide a little bit of information at this time. When I am allowed to I will post more. Timing is not in my control.

The BBC documentary touched on EBT beneficiaries and the amounts they received. The nuclear information takes this further. I am able only to give you this initial bit of information just now, however the significance is enormous .

“Graeme Souness received much more than just the 30k Mark Daly mentioned. Rangers supporters, Scottish football administrators, and the legal authorities in Scotland deserve to know why he received this money a decade after leaving Rangers’ employment?”

Maybe Mr Souness could enlighten us, or maybe one his chums in the MSM could provide him with a platform to deny this.

[reservoir hibee]

can anyone tell me why and who decided this???? seems to me it could have already been dealt with?

" the SPL has granted Rangers "a period of grace" after the club missed the deadline for filing financial documents.

The Ibrox club have until Friday 15 June to provide documentation to the league or they could face sanctions."

"the financial documents sought by the SPL are required for participation in next season's top flight. "

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18240543

thats them cheating again!!!!

has anybody else been allowed this perios of grace in the past?

[joe breezy]

Just realised someone has already posted this above...

Barcabhoy is the guy who is supposed to have more on Rangers - the 'nuclear' thing

He's alluding to bungs although I'm not sure how nuclear that is - Harry Redlnapp's been doing that for years...

"barcabhoy says:
29/05/2012 at 6:33 am

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there has been a lot of speculation surrounding the news that more is to come out about Rangers and the seriousness of what is still to be revealed.

the first thing however is to dispel some of the wider rumours that have been doing the rounds.

this is not about match fixing, its not about bribing referees, its not about political interference , its not about banks behaving inappropriately or illegally .

I have absolutely no knowledge of any of these things.It is also highly unfair that individuals who have not been involved in any wrongdoing are speculated about. As i posted earlier the information I alluded to is not my story. I can therefore only provide a little bit of information at this time. When I am allowed to I will post more. Timing is not in my control.

The BBC documentary touched on EBT beneficiaries and the amounts they received. The nuclear information takes this further. I am able only to give you this initial bit of information just now, however the significance is enormous .

“Graeme Souness received much more than just the 30k Mark Daly mentioned. Rangers supporters, Scottish football administrators, and the legal authorities in Scotland deserve to know why he received this money a decade after leaving Rangers’ employment?”

Maybe Mr Souness could enlighten us, or maybe one his chums in the MSM could provide him with a platform to deny this."

[s.a.m]

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The SFA is the governing body of the clubs; it doesn't exist if the clubs don't want it to. It always will do, because whatever shape or or form the clubs want their grouping the clubs want to take, it's always a grouping of Scottish football clubs. But the SFA only exists because the clubs want it to ... the clubs don't exist because the SFA came along.

The SFA if responsible for the governance of football at all levels in Scotland, and UEFA and FIFA recognise them as our governing body. You are right that the clubs could play each other without the SFA, I doubt that the international bodies would recognise them - particularly if they had banded together to avoid punisment of a club which had violated their association's rules.



Edit: I've just seen the post where you ay as much - I don't know that I agree with you that UEFA/FIFA would recognise an alternative SFA, though.

[Newry Hibs]

So with the CVA out there, what happens if (I have a sneaky feeling of 'when') it's accepted?

Should our anger be directed at Hector for caving in?

RFC continue in the SPL free of any debt, as that was paid off with the £8.5m from Green. On the assumption that the transfer ban stays, is there anything to stop RFC offering current players shed loads of money to stay? If the ban is reduced, then RFC are free to buy players with money from Green & Co.

Is there any legal (forget moral) reason to stop Green / RFC spending money when they have offered a small percentage to settle up, or is that down to the creditors being gullible enough to settle?

Any future problems for RFC next season other than not having quite as much money to spend as they have in the past? Not enough to challenge Celtc, but way more than anyone else.

What about double contracts / EBTs - if found guilty could they be dumped?

[s.a.m]

This thing about Green making available a 'pot' of 8.5 million, or whatever, to appease the creditors, then spending millions which you haven't made available to them......is that allowed?
Basically saying: "Aye, I've got money, but you're no gettin it."?