Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[joe breezy]

A Sellick fans post but true

A short history of Rangers...
1872-1920 Normal Scottish club
1920-1989 Bigoted, sectarian institution, built on the hate pound
1988-2012 Buying trophies with money they didn't have. Officially multi-cultural but flirting with bigotry to retain the hate pound.


Financial doping/theft
1999-2012 Theft of money from Scottish clubs and tax authorities £500M+
2012-2015 Money expected to be lost from TV deal £50M


Scottish football verdict: Scotland needs Rangers.

[Kojock]

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That's the articles of the SFA rather than the SPL, but the SPL rules are a newer version than I've got.

I've just ordered a copy of the SPL articles - I'll give my thoughts once I've had a chance to look at them.

Articles of Association of The Scottish Premier League Limited
As at 15 April 2010


http://www.scotprem.com/content/medi...0(CURRENT).pdf

[JeMeSouviens]

I think they've removed these from the SPL website (wonder why? ):


11. Except where such transfer is occasioned by the promotion of an association football club from and relegation of a Club to the SFL the consent of the Board shall be required before the transfer of any Share shall be registered.

13. The Board shall refuse to register the transfer of a Share:-
(i) to a person who is not the owner and operator of a Club;
(ii) unless the instrument of transfer is lodged at the Office or at such other place as the Board may appoint and is accompanied by the certificate for the Share to which it relates;
(iii) except where the transfer arises on promotion of an association football club from and relegation of a Club to the SFL, the consent of the Board has not been given to the transfer;
(iv) if the transferor and/or transferee shall fail to provide such evidence as the Board may require to show the respective rights of the transferor to make the transfer and the transferee to become a Member;
(v) if the instrument of such transfer is in respect of more than one Share; or
(vi) if the transferee or an Associate of the transferee shall own or have an interest in any other Share.


14. If:-
(i) a Member shall cease to be entitled to hold a Share; or
(ii) a trustee in sequestration, manager, receiver or administrative receiver shall be appointed in respect of a Member or any property of a Member, or an administration order shall be made in respect of a Member or any property of a Member or an order shall be made or an
effective resolution passed for the winding up of a Member otherwise than for the purpose of reconstruction or amalgamation;
then that Member or its manager, receiver, administrative receiver, administrator or liquidator or any other person entitled to the Share shall, on receiving notice in writing from the Board following the Company in General Meeting passing a Qualified Resolution that such notice should be issued by the Board and confirming the identity of the proposed transferee, transfer its Share to such other person as the Board shall direct at the price of £1 and the Club owned and operated by such Member shall forthwith cease to be a member of the League and the Club owned and operated by the transferee shall become a member of the League in its place.

[Iain G]

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Following the statement from the Killie chairman, Michael Johnston, who thinks that Rangers have been punished enough and no more sanctions should be taken against them, I think that supporters of all other clubs who oppose this view should boycott all matches at Rugby Park, and any other clubs that take Johnston's and Rangers side. If Johnston thinks that Rangers are key to his clubs existence, they may lose out on TV money and one or two visits of the current buns per season, but how much more would they lose if they played all season with no visiting supporters.

Tell me if you think this idea is rubbish or if you think that it might be a goer?

He does seem to be an old firm appologist doesn't he, might be do with the geography of Lanarkshire but more likely his club are spending more than they should be and are dependant on the Old Firm fans coming to Rugby Park to keep his club in profit. Money talks for some clubs, especially those in the immediate shadow of the Old Firm.

What he can't see is that Rangers and Celtic are what is wrong with Scottish football and they are strangling the life out of the game in Scotland.

Hopefully the East Coast clubs won't cave in to the financial arguement and stand firm and bring down the cheating Hun.

[SouthamptonHibs]

Not a bad idea. Always enjoyed the trip to Ayrshire but there fans are diet huns. Im sure theres more cream buns leave from Killie each Sat to go to Ibrox than actually attend a Killie game.
Hit them were it hurts and don't gee them the cash

[Caversham Green]

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Articles of Association of The Scottish Premier League Limited
As at 15 April 2010


http://www.scotprem.com/content/medi... (CURRENT).pdf

Thanks Hamish - I could have saved myself a quid there...

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I think they've removed these from the SPL website (wonder why? ):


11. Except where such transfer is occasioned by the promotion of an association football club from and relegation of a Club to the SFL the consent of the Board shall be required before the transfer of any Share shall be registered.

13. The Board shall refuse to register the transfer of a Share:-
(i) to a person who is not the owner and operator of a Club;
(ii) unless the instrument of transfer is lodged at the Office or at such other place as the Board may appoint and is accompanied by the certificate for the Share to which it relates;
(iii) except where the transfer arises on promotion of an association football club from and relegation of a Club to the SFL, the consent of the Board has not been given to the transfer;
(iv) if the transferor and/or transferee shall fail to provide such evidence as the Board may require to show the respective rights of the transferor to make the transfer and the transferee to become a Member;
(v) if the instrument of such transfer is in respect of more than one Share; or
(vi) if the transferee or an Associate of the transferee shall own or have an interest in any other Share.


14. If:-
(i) a Member shall cease to be entitled to hold a Share; or
(ii) a trustee in sequestration, manager, receiver or administrative receiver shall be appointed in respect of a Member or any property of a Member, or an administration order shall be made in respect of a Member or any property of a Member or an order shall be made or an
effective resolution passed for the winding up of a Member otherwise than for the purpose of reconstruction or amalgamation;
then that Member or its manager, receiver, administrative receiver, administrator or liquidator or any other person entitled to the Share shall, on receiving notice in writing from the Board following the Company in General Meeting passing a Qualified Resolution that such notice should be issued by the Board and confirming the identity of the proposed transferee, transfer its Share to such other person as the Board shall direct at the price of £1 and the Club owned and operated by such Member shall forthwith cease to be a member of the League and the Club owned and operated by the transferee shall become a member of the League in its place.

That says that admission is entirely at the board's discretion, which is not the impression Doncaster seems to have given BHFL. In any case, 13(i) could be argued to prohibit a newco since it is not the owner and operator of a club.

[Gez1875]

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He does seem to be an old firm appologist doesn't he, might be do with the geography of Lanarkshire but more likely his club are spending more than they should be and are dependant on the Old Firm fans coming to Rugby Park to keep his club in profit. Money talks for some clubs, especially those in the immediate shadow of the Old Firm.

What he can't see is that Rangers and Celtic are what is wrong with Scottish football and they are strangling the life out of the game in Scotland.

Hopefully the East Coast clubs won't cave in to the financial arguement and stand firm and bring down the cheating Hun.

excellently put!!!!!

[PeterboroHibee]

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Following the statement from the Killie chairman, Michael Johnston, who thinks that Rangers have been punished enough and no more sanctions should be taken against them, I think that supporters of all other clubs who oppose this view should boycott all matches at Rugby Park, and any other clubs that take Johnston's and Rangers side. If Johnston thinks that Rangers are key to his clubs existence, they may lose out on TV money and one or two visits of the current buns per season, but how much more would they lose if they played all season with no visiting supporters.

Tell me if you think this idea is rubbish or if you think that it might be a goer?

Are Killie not one of the clubs in real financial mess? It does appear to be a very short term view by him, but if theres a risk of his, or any club going bust due to a loss of revenue from Rangers not being in the SPL, you cant really blame them.

Not the stance I take mind you, Id be totally against a newco Rangers team being allowed back in, but I can understand where some of the smaller clubs are coming from in terms of a financial point of view.

[LancashireHibby]

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Not a bad idea. Always enjoyed the trip to Ayrshire but there fans are diet huns. Im sure theres more cream buns leave from Killie each Sat to go to Ibrox than actually attend a Killie game.
Hit them were it hurts and don't gee them the cash

Bit of a contradiction in terms, surely? I've got plenty of respect for Killie/Motherwell/St Mirren/Ayr fans etc who stick by their local team instead of following Rantic. That said, this is isn't a question about the fans of those clubs and all to do with the stance of each club - if they support a NewCo staying in the SPL then I think it's only fair that they face some sort of backlash from fans of other clubs (and maybe even their own?)

[ancienthibby]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...d_the_Jerseys/

[greenginger]

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I think they've removed these from the SPL website (wonder why? ):


11. Except where such transfer is occasioned by the promotion of an association football club from and relegation of a Club to the SFL the consent of the Board shall be required before the transfer of any Share shall be registered.

13. The Board shall refuse to register the transfer of a Share:-
(i) to a person who is not the owner and operator of a Club;
(ii) unless the instrument of transfer is lodged at the Office or at such other place as the Board may appoint and is accompanied by the certificate for the Share to which it relates;
(iii) except where the transfer arises on promotion of an association football club from and relegation of a Club to the SFL, the consent of the Board has not been given to the transfer;
(iv) if the transferor and/or transferee shall fail to provide such evidence as the Board may require to show the respective rights of the transferor to make the transfer and the transferee to become a Member;
(v) if the instrument of such transfer is in respect of more than one Share; or
(vi) if the transferee or an Associate of the transferee shall own or have an interest in any other Share.


14. If:-
(i) a Member shall cease to be entitled to hold a Share; or
(ii) a trustee in sequestration, manager, receiver or administrative receiver shall be appointed in respect of a Member or any property of a Member, or an administration order shall be made in respect of a Member or any property of a Member or an order shall be made or an
effective resolution passed for the winding up of a Member otherwise than for the purpose of reconstruction or amalgamation;
then that Member or its manager, receiver, administrative receiver, administrator or liquidator or any other person entitled to the Share shall, on receiving notice in writing from the Board following the Company in General Meeting passing a Qualified Resolution that such notice should be issued by the Board and confirming the identity of the proposed transferee, transfer its Share to such other person as the Board shall direct at the price of £1 and the Club owned and operated by such Member shall forthwith cease to be a member of the League and the Club owned and operated by the transferee shall become a member of the League in its place.

This is where Doncaster has been bullsh*tting ever since the Huns went into administration. He has stated that the Huns share transfer should be dealt with by the SPL Board under Clause 11 when the correct treatment under SPL Rules would be Clause 14 (2).

"----an administration order shall be made in repect of a Member ----" the share transfer has to be approved by " theCompany in general meeting passing a qualified resolution "
That is all SPL members voting 90 % in favour of Rangers SPL share going to the new football club which will replace Tax Dodging F C in the SPL. It could be Dundee, Dunfermline, or even a new Rangers F C . but that is what the SPL Rules state and Doncaster should be removed if he can't stomach the prospect of applying the rules correctly.

[PatHead]

13. The Board shall refuse to register the transfer of a Share:-
(i) to a person who is not the owner and operator of a Club;
(ii) unless the instrument of transfer is lodged at the Office or at such other place as the Board may appoint and is accompanied by the certificate for the Share to which it relates;
(iii) except where the transfer arises on promotion of an association football club from and relegation of a Club to the SFL, the consent of the Board has not been given to the transfer;

BHFL- I understand Mr Doncaster has said there are no rules relating to a newco within SPL Articles. Any chance you could email him asking him to clarify Article 13(iii)? Only reason I am asking is you will probably have a better chance of a reply.

BTW Hearts shareholders meeting today. I have asked a friend to ask what Hearts view on the newco route would be? Doubt he will have the gonads so if anyone else knows someone going to the meeting give them a call and ask them to do the same?

[Brooster]

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Not a bad idea. Always enjoyed the trip to Ayrshire but there fans are diet huns. Im sure theres more cream buns leave from Killie each Sat to go to Ibrox than actually attend a Killie game.
Hit them were it hurts and don't gee them the cash

I think you are way off the mark with that one SH. I have friends who are season ticket holders at Killie, Ive spent a lot of time in the company of Killie fans and I can assure you they hate Rangers just as much as us. I was speaking to a Killie fan yesterday and he is raging at Jonston's stance on the newco situation.

[PatHead]

Hearts AGM at lunchtime today. I have asked a friend to ask what Hearts take is on a newco getting straight into SPL. Don't think he will have balls to ask the question. Anyone else got a friend going who might ask and if they do can you call them? Would love to know their thoughts as they have never said a word.

Ta

[doddsy]

It is my humble but honest opinion that thousand s of fair minded fans of lots of clubs in scotland will be lost to the game forever if rangers are not properly punished for financial suicide. I don t know what that punishment should be but it must be fair and must be seen to be fair. i think the time for sweeping under the carpet is gone and if there is to be a broom involved it should be used to clean up the sfa, with a good clearout of the blazers behind the scenes who must have known what was going on. If not then the good men still in scottish football should let the fans know who these people are. i hope i make sense and think the questions must be asked and answered properly. what do you think.

[cad]

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Not a bad idea. Always enjoyed the trip to Ayrshire but there fans are diet huns. Im sure theres more cream buns leave from Killie each Sat to go to Ibrox than actually attend a Killie game.
Hit them were it hurts and don't gee them the cash

Cant say Ive found that Davy ,always got on well with the Killie supporters ,but its up to themselves to get shot of that bellend Johnston,
if they dont I cant see many going to Rugby Park .

[Expecting Rain]

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It is my humble but honest opinion that thousand s of fair minded fans of lots of clubs in scotland will be lost to the game forever if rangers are not properly punished for financial suicide. I don t know what that punishment should be but it must be fair and must be seen to be fair. i think the time for sweeping under the carpet is gone and if there is to be a broom involved it should be used to clean up the sfa, with a good clearout of the blazers behind the scenes who must have known what was going on. If not then the good men still in scottish football should let the fans know who these people are. i hope i make sense and think the questions must be asked and answered properly. what do you think.

Agree, if the cheating goes unpunished then the implication is that the rest of us only exist to prop up a successful Rangers, ta ta SPL.

[Cropley10]

We should all remember as this unfolds that not that long ago Rangers (and Celt c) were desperate to get out of Scottish Football.

For anyone to tell us that we 'need' Rangers or any New Club called something like Rangers is ridiculous. If they could have gone they would, now they want us to save them!!

[TrinityHibs]

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Trouble with the Yams tax scam is the side letters were all in Lithuanian and coded by the Enigma Fax Machine.

However, I still think Skacel court case with his agent, due to return to Court next month will prove the player was getting a lot more cash for playing for Hearts than the amount recorded in is Hearts Contract.

His Contract, according to press reports was for 190,000 Euros per year, thats about £ 3000 per week. I don't think he came back for that considering what others were on at the PBS.

You saying that Satchel might be on the take and so would have been ineligible for the cup final? Now that has the potential to be the best news ever.

[Derek Dougan]

With the lengths Mark Daly went to get his information, I'm just wondering if Mr Charles Green is maybe having second thoughts? Somehow I don't think he is squeaky clean

[SouthamptonHibs]

Just going by the types off songs they sing when i've been at the game "Hello Hello" etc, back that up with there chairmens thoughts on newco rangers. But fair do's i may off mis judged them, i'll listen to those that no them better. Hail Hail

[Iain G]

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Bit of a contradiction in terms, surely? I've got plenty of respect for Killie/Motherwell/St Mirren/Ayr fans etc who stick by their local team instead of following Rantic. That said, this is isn't a question about the fans of those clubs and all to do with the stance of each club - if they support a NewCo staying in the SPL then I think it's only fair that they face some sort of backlash from fans of other clubs (and maybe even their own?)

The issue isnt the fans here, all power and respect to those supporting their local teams in the direct face of the In Firm. The issue here is Johnson and the club owners thinking they are reliant on the Old Firm coin, the sooner we can break the link between Old Firm dependence and independence of the rest of the Scottish game the better for all of us and the more competitive the league will get and the better and more interesting the Scottish game will get as all clubs have to get back to blooding their own local players again.

OFGTF

[vanNISHtelroy]

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Not a bad idea. Always enjoyed the trip to Ayrshire but there fans are diet huns.

Cheers for that!

[lyonhibs]

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Cheers for that!

He's way off the mark with the comments re: your fans, but as for your Chairman greasing up.......................

[SouthamptonHibs]

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Cheers for that!

Already put a comment on with drawing my statement just angry with everything just now hail hail

[vanNISHtelroy]

I was reasonably sure that we would support the NewCo if it came to it due to needing the money that comes from either of the ugly sisters but do find it difficult to read all the comments that MJ is giving everyone.

It was pretty obvious that with a debt of ~£9m (~£6m of that due to hotel I think) the bank would have an influence on our position on this issue.

Not in an annoying way after last week btw....but 15 years ago today Monty went up to lift the Scottish Cup!

[Iain G]

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I was reasonably sure that we would support the NewCo if it came to it due to needing the money that comes from either of the ugly sisters but do find it difficult to read all the comments that MJ is giving everyone.

It was pretty obvious that with a debt of ~£9m (~£6m of that due to hotel I think) the bank would have an influence on our position on this issue.

Not in an annoying way after last week btw....but 15 years ago today Monty went up to lift the Scottish Cup!

But where do the Killie fans sit on the issues, are you happy enough for the NewCo to exist in the SPL when and if it arrives, or are you happy to finally see Rangers get what they deserve and die a horrible, nasty, ugly yet thoroughly deserving death?

[vanNISHtelroy]

I think that the majority would be quite happy to see them get exactly what they deserved.

[VickMackie]

I think it's a great idea to boycott those that support the OF/Rangers during this.

Unfortunately/fortunately there are people who will always go to support the team irrespective of the other club because they want to support our team.

Also, people will lose track of who they should boycott and others won't like being suggested too that they should boycott . There will be no coordination or official list drawn up unless supporters clubs arranged something and circulated it.

It would be great to see the Rangers away end empty all next season. It won't happen though. Pity.

[Benny Brazil]

Any thoughts or suggestions on where Mark Daly got his information / documentation?
Would appear to me that a large number of these documents would be something that would be useful in lets say a tribunal case which has been ongoing