Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[calmac12000]

What are the odds of a Green rescue for Castle Greyskull? These fuds still don't get it, their screwed end of story.

[ScottB]

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Can't see the planners and Historic Scotland going for that option realistically!

Maybe I'm missing the point here but is this not simply a case of "risk assessment" by the Administrators in respect of each respective bidder and the likelihood of their respective bids being capable of being delivered without the fairly commonplace "last minute chips"!

At the end of the day, who is most correct in that aspect of the bid(s) assessment will be known in due course and taking account of the time constraints being mentioned here and there will be part of that risk assessment I imagine!

Certainly a bit of brinksmanship posturing evident from the section of BK's interview on Sky Sports that I saw around 6pm in seeking to pressurise the Administrators into an earlier decision than perhaps they would consider appropriate in the circumstances?!

To be fair, I'd be inclined to agree that we are likely at, if not past the point were attempting a CVA becomes unworkable before next season, not that a CVA is workable at all in the first place, but still.

Perhaps the BK's belief in a CVA is why they have been ruled out?

[Dashing Bob S]

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Those cyberhuns really do make themselves look like the biggest tools on the planet. And Thommo just rips them every time. I can't get anough of it, it's addictive.

Not a particularly difficult task for them, given that's exactly what they are. (No offense to any Jambos looking in.)

[PaulSmith]

Duff and Duffere release statement hitting back at claims by BK

[Hank Schrader]

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Duff and Duffere release statement hitting back at claims by BK

I chuckled out loud at the news that the Blue Knights bid was reliant on money from Rangers debtors and also the club reaching the "latter stages of the Champions League".

Oh ma sides!!

[magpie1892]

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Duff and Duffere release statement hitting back at claims by BK

Got a link?

[jgl07]

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To be fair, I'd be inclined to agree that we are likely at, if not past the point were attempting a CVA becomes unworkable before next season, not that a CVA is workable at all in the first place, but still.

Perhaps the BK's belief in a CVA is why they have been ruled out?

Aong with the fact that they are a bunch of time wasting self-publicists who do not have two beans to rub together.

[cabbageandribs1875]

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You have to laugh Brian Kennedy has been wasting everyones time from the start.

His comment clearly infers his bid was not good and was not fully funded, what a tool.

As for "It's about Rangers Football Club surviving"...yet again the point has been missed. Administration is about getting the best deal for the creditors, that MAY involve saving the club but it might not...

Rather bizzare to have a press conference to effectively have a go at everyone else when in fact their bid was p*sh, they were never seriously in with a chance and have therefore done nothing but muddy the waters and delay the whole process.

kennedy is now a hero to the neanderthals, although i've not saw his speech on the tv earlier, he's playing the mind games trying to get all the neanderthal buns on side, i believe he used the word "blood on their hands" he's trying to stir up a baying mob of buns to start putting pressure on duff and duffier, just like McCoist done with his "we need to know who they are" p@sh, the buns love this type of talk, they think they are being asked to take up arms

[cad]

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Duff and Duffere release statement hitting back at claims by BK

It was to be expected ,you said he said ,naw a never aye ye did.


Its causing a bit of a furore on the Huns sites ,questions and answers ,

The following is a thread title on RM ,the language is shocking by the way






The Total Fanny Fuds In Our Support



Hun 1 Post (Not clever IMO )

Yes! I absolutely believe that.

The Rangers fans are a powerful force when they unite. It's getting them to unite that's the hard part.

Or do you prefer just to get shat on and die quietly?




Hun 2 Answer ( Angry )

Your a ****** roaster your clueless, you don't even know what you are protesting about.

Try reading up on the administration process before making a complete tit of yourself



Hun 2(a) Answer ( Well pissed off , passed caring , fed up )

Are your for real or do you have no grasp of reality?

If you believe your post then there really is no hope for you.







Hun 3 Post ( Does sound a bit miffed )

**** Follow Follow you utter clown. It's not about FF or RM or VB or any other forum. It's about RANGERS!

Kennedy spoke like a leader, like a man that knows what he's on about.

Where have all these Johnny Come Lately's been hiding ? They've arrived just in time to feast on our carcass and all you want to do is slag FF.

WAKEN UP FFS !




Hun 4 Answer ( Equally Miffed )


You ****** waken up

YOUR PROTESTING AT THE ONLY CANTS WHO CAN AFFORD TO BUY US FFS








Hun 5 Posts ( Just wants to join in )

need kennedy in lets tell the duffers wot we think and green,






Hun 6 Answers ( Passed miffed losing the will to live )

How can they have a protest against Green when we don't even know properly which Consortium he is part of, who he is representing and what his plans are FFs ?

[Jim44]

Is there anywhere you can see Kennedy's address to the nation?

[cad]

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Is there anywhere you can see Kennedy's address to the nation?

http://www.skysports.com/video/inlin...749807,00.html

[JoeTortolanoFanClub]

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Is there anywhere you can see Kennedy's address to the nation?

Aye...here you go... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLmiOEk59n8

[stokesmessiah]

Quantum......

[Bostonhibby]

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It was to be expected ,you said he said ,naw a never aye ye did.


Its causing a bit of a furore on the Huns sites ,questions and answers ,

The following is a thread title on RM ,the language is shocking by the way







Hun 6 Answers ( Passed miffed losing the will to live )

How can they have a protest against Green when we don't even know properly which Consortium he is part of, who he is representing and what his plans are FFs ?

Is it because he is Green?

[Lungo--Drom]

OMG think a've pished masel' laughing :D RAOFL RAOFL, this is better than a good laugh, this thread gets better every day!

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Quantum......

[grunt]

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Doesn't miss does he?

I just want to make sure that folks on here see both of Alex Thomson's blog posts from today. Here's the first:

"It was the boss, not me..."

As the tribunal which punished Rangers FC for bringing the game into disrepute publishes the reasons for its findings, we gain an astounding insight into a major UK football club completely out of control. Rangers under Craig Whyte, the Tribunal says , were ignoring all sense of reality in any kind of management on Planet Earth – let alone within Glasgow, also a part of the planet though in recent weeks you’d be forgiven for disputing that one.
Here goes…

Take the Craig Whyte take-over of the club. Yes, this was the one where the Glasgow tabloids trumpeted Mr Whyte’s ‘off the radar wealth’ – he was the ‘billionaire’ saviour of Ibrox, remember?. Well, in the real world, nobody had a clue in Rangers about what his financial pedigree was and they couldn’t find out either. The tribunal records:

“A real and substantial concern existed as to the genuineness of his offer to purchase and as to his motives.
“A real and substantial concern existed as to the lack of information available about his history both personal and commercial and his apparent reluctance to divulge or provide any information which was requested.
“A real and substantial concern existed as to whether and from what source he could find and invest the very substantial funds which would be required in acquiring the majority shareholding,”

Yet astonishingly the whole thing went ahead and the Scottish FA Chief Executive Stewart Regan admitted to Channel 4 News last month that they – football’s governing body in Scotland -more or less took it on trust from Rangers that old Craigy was a good egg – when we now know nobody had a clue. And he wasn’t. The tribunal states:

“Mr Craig Whyte disclosed little or no information. Financial models for working capital requirements prepared by the finance officers and accountants of Rangers FC were repeatedly disputed and rejected by Mr Craig Whyte… Mr Craig Whyte produced his own working capital projections which were wholly at variance with those of Rangers FC…. despite their making all relevant confidential financial data available under secure conditions for the examination and scrutiny of Mr Craig Whyte and his advisers in a process of due diligence in their purchase consideration, almost no advantage was taken of this facility and hardly any enquiry or scrutiny of the detailed and confidential financial information about Rangers FC was carried out by or on behalf of Mr Craig Whyte or any of his companies. This failure to carry out ordinary “due diligence” enquiries served to increase the substantial concern felt… for the motives, the genuineness…”

So they knew little about Craig Whyte’s finances. And Craig Whyte made little or no effort to find out much about Rangers. At the time management there were concerned at Mr Whyte’s motives for buying the club at all…yet it all went ahead and nobody said boo. Incredible.
Think that’s weird? Well check out what happened – or didn’t – once Craig Whyte was behind the chairman’s desk at Ibrox Park – on the odd occasions he actually went there, along with his lawyer Garry Withey:

“… in the course of the first few weeks of his chairmanship Mr Craig Whyte and Mr Garry Withey were in attendance at Rangers FC Headquarters at Argyle House, Ibrox on a frequent basis, but Mr Gary Withey then became an infrequent attender. Mr Craig Whyte’s attendance became irregular and increasingly infrequent. When he attended at Argyle House he spent little time speaking to any of the operational and administration managers and staff. He was difficult to access. He spent most of the time when he was in Argyle House closed in the Chairman’s room in meetings with persons unknown.”

Directors were left unsure what it even was they were supposed to direct – men like John McClelland and John Greig who had long association with Rangers. They were facing their biggest test in the club and – the Tribunal rules – they were about to fail it spectacularly:
“… as a result of the discussion and the perceptions of both Mr John McClelland and Mr John Greig arising from the absence of any management accounts or financial information about Rangers FC being provided to them, the failure to convene any Board meetings and Mr McClelland’s exclusion from the offices, they both arrived at the conclusion that they were now being so marginalised and excluded from the governance of Rangers that their position as directors was untenable.”

But did they do anything? Did they tell anyone? Did they inform the Scottish Football Association or the Scottish Premier League? Did they inform the media? No. no, no and no. The Tribunal damns them as individuals who could and should have acted but they did not act.

They walked away.

“Mr John McClelland and Mr John Greig resigned in October because they knew that they were being excluded and marginalised at the same time as they had great concerns for the governance of Rangers FC and were deeply suspicious of Mr Craig Whyte… Other than resignation there was no evidence that either of these directors took any steps with any person or authority to do anything about what they knew was happening.”

Paragraph by paragraph the age-old Rangers defence of ‘it was the boss not me’ it cut to shreds in the measured prose of deliberative , legal minds:

“… certain directors and / or senior managers were entirely aware that Mr Craig Whyte, a director of Rangers FC was engaged in a deliberate programme of non payment of taxes, non-cooperation with and frustration of the attempts of the auditors appointed by Rangers FC to carry out the annual inspection of the books of account and preparation of the statutory annual accounts…These matters all frustrated preparation of the annual accounts and prevented the holding of the annual general meeting which required to be held by 1 January 2012.
“From May 2011 Mr David King was aware that he was being excluded from the governance of the company and he appears to have done little about it except repeat his demands to Mr Olverman and Mr Craig Whyte for information. “

So too David King .What is that old saying, that for wrongdoing to triumph, all it takes is for good men to fail to act? As the Tribunal states itself, in a reflective moment:

“ …individual directors and employees must have known that what was happening within Rangers FC was entirely wrong and illegitimate but they chose to do nothing to bring it to the attention of the public. That may be matter for their long term reflection but it does reduce the mitigatory impact of the suggestion that Rangers FC were innocent victims. “

For anybody requiring this last bit in black and white – if anybody at Ibrox dares to whine that it’s wrong to blame Rangers FC for Craig Whyte’s craziness – they should be ashamed. Are you listening, Ally McCoist?

He engaged in a disingenuous correspondence in which he claimed to be anxious to put his case to the tribunal face to face but had singularly failed to do so, citing safety issues. This was the same man who was regularly spotted in public in Scotland and elsewhere. He engaged in a campaign of derogatory, ill founded and ill judged criticism of the integrity of the Judicial Panel Protocol, its members and the Scottish FA itself. He alleged bias and a lack of fairness.

The tribunal could come to no other conclusion that his conduct was scandalous and disgraceful and in each case represented a contempt of the proceedings of the most serious kind.

[grunt]

Here's the second:

"Inside the Big Bad Hoose"

As the Rangers saga moves into what – Act 345? some congratulations are in order for the Scottish FA in publishing its recent deliberations into what Rangers was really like under the ownership of Craig Whyte. Or to their tribunal for insisting their deliberations are published, which is not quite the same thing. You will recall this hearing led to Mr Whyte – former Rangers owner and still the major shareholder – being banned for life from Scottish football . The club itself is banned for a year from buying players and fined £160,000. The appeal against all this will now be heard on Wednesday and I understand we will get a decision that day on whether or not to uphold – or indeed increase - these punishments which Rangers manager Ally McCoist has deemed unfair.

The Rt Honourable Lord Carloway (Chair) Craig Graham and Allan Cowan will be on the three-man tribunal. The SFA has said they must be free to do their job without fear of intimidation: “It is essential that these panel members are allowed to conduct the appeal without fear of intimidation and we respectfully ask all involved in the process to do their utmost to observe our wishes and the wishes of the panel members.”

Intimidation which happened after the same Ally McCoist demanded that the identity of SFA Tribunal members should be made public. It’s not yet clear if the SFA will pursue that potential breach of conduct with Mr McCoist. But it says everything about Glasgow football culture that anyone should be threatened in any situation and that police advice should need to be sought. Which century are we in again?
And what emerges from the notes duly released this morning after the initial hearing on Rangers which led to those sanctions is astonishing stuff.

The panel considers Rangers Football Club has gone so far off the financial rails that: “the tribunal considered whether it should terminate Rangers FC’s membership of the Scottish FA and concluded that punishment was too severe.”

Notorious culture

Indeed the panel felt the offences were so serious that “only match fixing might be a more serious breach”. And they go out of their way to say that directors had to have known what was going on. The age-old Rangers defence for years going back past Craig Whyte’s ownership to Sir David Murray’s that ‘we didn’t know’ and ‘we weren’t told’ or ‘we left it all to the chairman’ is clearly not convincing this panel. That strikes a blow to the heart of Rangers’ notorious culture for passing the buck whilst winning glory with money it did not have and potentially millions which should have gone to the taxman.

The tribunal talks of the ‘scandalous business activities’ of Craig Whyte – who deems this entire process ‘a joke’ accusing the SFA of never giving him a chance to put his case and of judging him and punishing him without proper due process.

Channel 4 News uncovers the web of connections showing a club in crisis

These are legal brains taking what one must presume is a dispassionate look at a football club which had lost all norms of proper governance under the Craig Whyte ownership and people knew it was happening and did nothing about it. All of which makes the simple and childish scapegoating of Craig Whyte wrong in principle, wrong in fact and wrong in law. Craig Whyte is not the only baddie in all this and the club management more widely, stands roundly condemned here.

Lunatic fringe

And that is why those who say – and there are many of them – that the club cannot and should not be held responsible for Craig Whyte’s actions, are laid bare in all this for what they are – cowards who refuse to face the facts, the truth and the hard reality that Rangers went catastrophically wrong and that is Rangers’ responsibility and nobody else’s – chairmen and directors.

Foremost among those, because of his recent words and actions, must be the current managers of Rangers, Ally McCoist. Who questioned very openly the independence of this inquiry and whose actions in demanding identities be made public were followed by threats from the lunatic fringe. This should be a time for reflection and introspection within at Rangers Mr McCoist, not simply more of the loud, boorish fingerpointing without. Not likely to help Rangers appeal these punishments. Not likely to help Rangers at all.

On Wednesday the appeal will be heard. The gravity of what is at stake for Rangers is clear for all to see. Be in no doubt this appeal is able to increase punishments handed down to the club as well as reduce them.

[crewetollhibee]

If Kennedy really had Ranger's interests at heart, where was he all the time that SDM had the club up for sale ?

[Www1875hfc]

Brian Kennedy's lawyer David Hinchliffe has sent this email to Duff and Phelps in response to the D & P statement.

David I note you have not yet replied as promised in your email below please respond as soon as you can.
Regarding your recent press announcement ..".you were advised there was not agreement within the consortium about the funding of the bid" ....please let me know who apparently advised you of this as this is wholly inaccurate and on no occasion has anyone contacted either myself or Brian to state this is a worry.
Further to state that amounts were included in the offer for playing in europe next season when it can't be achieved is completely inaccurate as the actual offer is for increasing the consideration in seasons 2 and 3 if they played in europe .
Further to state that the offer should be reduced by 3.5 m because these are debts due to the company is also misleading as 2.4 million of this sum is payable in the next few weeks as per Brians earlier email and will be used as cashflow for the trading losses of the club.
You completely fail to state our client had agreed to fund the huge trading losses post June 1st and picked up liabilities for 3.6 m of football creditors ... tupe liabilities ...debenture holders etc making a cash payable of 9.1m. plus trading losses prior to completion and European add ons together with other liabilities. You seem to be continually comparing the quantum of my clients bid against bids such as the Miller bid which are not real .
As you know I have vast experience of people making bids for insolvent football clubs ....I cannot see how any of these new parties can be making real bids when they have done no real due diligence ....proof of funds may have been provided but it does not make sense to me why investors would invest in Rangers without full due diligence by them and I would strongly recommend that full due diligence is carried out by you on these parties as there is no time to have another Miller situation .
Finally regarding your comment that Brian wanted to be the last man standing. In mine and Brians view he is as we don't believe the other bidders will complete
If you want to talk to find a way to save this great club Brian has said his phone will be on this evening otherwise I fear it will be too late David



David Hinchliffe
Partner

[stokesmessiah]

Best post i have ound in the bears den tonight...

"TBH our anger should be shown at hmrc and no one else.

They have ****** us over for years by leaking all sorts of crap to the media and steadfastly refusing to do a cva.

These clowns let Whyte run up paye/vat bill for 9 months and did nothing to stop him."

Unbelieveable Jeff.

[HibeeMG]

^^^ quantum alert ^^^

[Part/Time Supporter]

If you've got a spare hour (or two), the SFA findings re Rangers is definitely worth reading. Completely explodes the Hun-apologist notion that Craig Whyte did it all and ran away.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/93212354/S...ote-of-Reasons

[cabbageandribs1875]

Brian - bite the bullet and just dig that wee bit deeper

---

For the sake of some extra cash, you can do this.

Our very existence is at stake here. surely you can dig deeper and end this hell.

We do not want to hear the rattle of padlocks on the gates of Ibrox.

Please Brian. I am in tears here. I am begging you. Please.



this thread on swallow swallow had me in tears.......


of laughter

[truehibernian]

Was Lord Carloway, one of the 3 appeal panel selected, also not the judge who last year ruled on an appeal and upheld a conviction of a Rangers fan charged with racism after being heard to sing the Famine Song.....that'll fairly go down well with the Rangers fans eh. I wonder how long it will take the red tops to 'question' this selection......

[jacomo]

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Brian Kennedy's lawyer David Hinchliffe has sent this email to Duff and Phelps in response to the D & P statement.

David I note you have not yet replied as promised in your email below please respond as soon as you can.
Regarding your recent press announcement ..".you were advised there was not agreement within the consortium about the funding of the bid" ....please let me know who apparently advised you of this as this is wholly inaccurate and on no occasion has anyone contacted either myself or Brian to state this is a worry.
Further to state that amounts were included in the offer for playing in europe next season when it can't be achieved is completely inaccurate as the actual offer is for increasing the consideration in seasons 2 and 3 if they played in europe .
Further to state that the offer should be reduced by 3.5 m because these are debts due to the company is also misleading as 2.4 million of this sum is payable in the next few weeks as per Brians earlier email and will be used as cashflow for the trading losses of the club.
You completely fail to state our client had agreed to fund the huge trading losses post June 1st and picked up liabilities for 3.6 m of football creditors ... tupe liabilities ...debenture holders etc making a cash payable of 9.1m. plus trading losses prior to completion and European add ons together with other liabilities. You seem to be continually comparing the quantum of my clients bid against bids such as the Miller bid which are not real .
As you know I have vast experience of people making bids for insolvent football clubs ....I cannot see how any of these new parties can be making real bids when they have done no real due diligence ....proof of funds may have been provided but it does not make sense to me why investors would invest in Rangers without full due diligence by them and I would strongly recommend that full due diligence is carried out by you on these parties as there is no time to have another Miller situation .
Finally regarding your comment that Brian wanted to be the last man standing. In mine and Brians view he is as we don't believe the other bidders will complete
If you want to talk to find a way to save this great club Brian has said his phone will be on this evening otherwise I fear it will be too late David



David Hinchliffe
Partner

Is this for real?

[TheEastTerrace]

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If you've got a spare hour (or two), the SFA findings re Rangers is definitely worth reading. Completely explodes the Hun-apologist notion that Craig Whyte did it all and ran away.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/93212354/S...ote-of-Reasons

About 40 pages in - every current bun should be made to sit down and read this, including Ally McCoist, who today still felt no remorse for his despicable incitement to out and demonise the panel members. 'I didn't know who they were' - bawllocks Ally

[Jim44]

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Brian - bite the bullet and just dig that wee bit deeper

---

For the sake of some extra cash, you can do this.

Our very existence is at stake here. surely you can dig deeper and end this hell.

We do not want to hear the rattle of padlocks on the gates of Ibrox.

Please Brian. I am in tears here. I am begging you. Please.



this thread on swallow swallow had me in tears.......


of laughter

Can these clowns not see the problem? The money means little to a guy who has a fortune of £700M. His offer of around £5M is the amount of pin money he's prepared to fritter away on a venture that has no chance of making cash for him. He could treble that bid overnight in order to 'save, the great Scottish institution and still he would be buying a business pig in a poke. When asked by a near tearful Jim White if he might sink a few more quid into the deal if the administrators came back to him, he unequivocally replied 'no'. Under the bald facade there's an uncanny resemblance, voice wise as well, to Graham Sounness.

[magpie1892]

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Is this for real?

It can't be.

[SurferRosa]

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Brian - bite the bullet and just dig that wee bit deeper

---

For the sake of some extra cash, you can do this.

Our very existence is at stake here. surely you can dig deeper and end this hell.

We do not want to hear the rattle of padlocks on the gates of Ibrox.

Please Brian. I am in tears here. I am begging you. Please.



this thread on swallow swallow had me in tears.......


of laughter

[PaulSmith]

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It can't be.

It is.