Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

[CropleyWasGod]

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So to define that position a bit more, CW did fund RFC at the start, which money was then used to pay-off LLoyds, switch the Floating charge to one of his companies along with the key assets of Ipox and Murray Park, then sell 3 years ST monies to Ticketus and then pay-off the loans he had put in place in the first place, along with a wee dividend which left RFC with no cash??

There is no charge registered at Companies House. That, of course, doesn't mean that one doesn't exist.

However, if RFC don't owe CW anything, any charge held by him is worthless. And he can't take part in the CVA.

I also find it hard to believe that Ticketus don't have any security. Their part in all of this is, for me, critical.

[ancienthibby]

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There is no charge registered at Companies House. That, of course, doesn't mean that one doesn't exist.

However, if RFC don't owe CW anything, any charge held by him is worthless. And he can't take part in the CVA.

I also find it hard to believe that Ticketus don't have any security. Their part in all of this is, for me, critical.

Assume you mean as given by RFC? But if the assets had first been switched to a CWNewco, then it would be in the name of ANO?

Re Ticketus, I believe they have done this for some EPL clubs so they will have a model they use, with or without security. One of their key criteria would be to lend only at a huge discount, say 50%, to book value??

Reporting Scotland last night suggested there's up to £30 million that cannot be account for.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Assume you mean as given by RFC? But if the assets had first been switched to a CWNewco, then it would be in the name of ANO?

Re Ticketus, I believe they have done this for some EPL clubs so they will have a model they use, with or without security. One of their key criteria would be to lend only at a huge discount, say 50%, to book value??

Reporting Scotland last night suggested there's up to £30 million that cannot be account for.

So you're saying that the assets may have been switched already? I am sure some journalist would have discovered that already... it's easy to check.

But okay, assuming you're right (and I'm thinking out loud here )...if so, where did the proceeds go? Two things flow from that:-

1. CW potentially owes RFC for that. The administrator has to recoup that..... at an open market value.

2. HMRC would want to get a liquidator involved, and have the transfer reversed.

The Reporting Scotland figure is what Jim Traynor mentioned on Newsnight the other night. £24m Ticketus and £6m Jelavic.

[Spike Mandela]

Anyone still clinging to the notion that this administration is anything other tha a tool for tax avoidance and stinks to high heaven really must read this blog.....

http://scotslawthoughts.wordpress.com/

[jgl07]

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So you're saying that the assets may have been switched already? I am sure some journalist would have discovered that already... it's easy to check.

But okay, assuming you're right (and I'm thinking out loud here )...if so, where did the proceeds go? Two things flow from that:-

1. CW potentially owes RFC for that. The administrator has to recoup that..... at an open market value.

2. HMRC would want to get a liquidator involved, and have the transfer reversed.

The Reporting Scotland figure is what Jim Traynor mentioned on Newsnight the other night. £24m Ticketus and £6m Jelavic.

All this should be investigated to see if there is any fraud involved. There have been calls to involve the FSA:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...-west-17049723

[Leithenhibby]

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All this should be investigated to see if there is any fraud involved. There have been calls to involve the FSA:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...-west-17049723

John McFall was on Newsnight Scotland last night trying to put this point over. Not very well may I add.

I can't see RFC getting away with as much as they would like. This matter has still to gather pace and the administrators know that everyone is watching them like a hawk ...

[Sylar]

Live streaming press conference on BBC Sportscotland website in 5 minutes.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/scotland/8501453.stm

[silverhibee]

Rangers news Conference coming up on SSN shortly.

[PatHead]

Ticketus have their loan fully insured and will not lose out in the deal.

[YehButNoBut]

Celtic released a statement today saying that they were very disappointed with Salmonds statement thet they need Rangers to prosper. Salmond really should not be getting involved in this.

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#Celtic statement on First Minister's comments: "We are very disappointed with the First Minister's claims that Celtic "need" Rangers and that Celtic "can't prosper unless Rangers are there".

"This is simply not true. In a series of interviews given just 3 days ago, we made it abundantly clear that Celtic has a well defined strategy and a business plan independent of the fortunes of any other club. That remains absolutely the case ".

"The predicament of Rangers is clearly a serious and complex matter with a whole range of possible outcomes.

"However, we are extremely well qualified to make our own position clear and have no wish to see that being misrepresented for political reasons ".

[CropleyWasGod]

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Ticketus have their loan fully insured and will not lose out in the deal.

Insured as in "insured" or as in "secured"?

[Smidge]

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Insured as in "insured" or as in "secured"?

I would have thought it was a credit default swap-type arrangement. I wonder what the margin on that was?!?

[CropleyWasGod]

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I would have thought it was a credit default swap-type arrangement. I wonder what the margin on that was?!?

I also wonder if it is transferable to a NewHunCo?

[PatHead]

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Insured as in "insured" or as in "secured"?

Insured with a third party.....was told this by an Octopus employee a couple of weeks ago when story re sale was first revealed. Used in their IHT plan

[Moody Mulder]

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If he isn't a creditor, he can't take part in the CVA. I can't see anyone involved in the CVA (Ticketus at £20m, HMRC at c. £50m) allowing the administrators to transfer the assets out of the company, at least not without a fair price being obtained.

What are Ibrox, Murray Park and the car park worth?

Erm its glasgow so probs worth about £30.00 for all 3

[CropleyWasGod]

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Insured with a third party.....was told this by an Octopus employee a couple of weeks ago when story re sale was first revealed. Used in their IHT plan

Ah okay, that's interesting. Cheers.

[YehButNoBut]

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Celtic released a statement today saying that they were very disappointed with Salmonds statement thet they need Rangers to prosper. Salmond really should not be getting involved in this.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

#Celtic statement on First Minister's comments: "We are very disappointed with the First Minister's claims that Celtic "need" Rangers and that Celtic "can't prosper unless Rangers are there".

"This is simply not true. In a series of interviews given just 3 days ago, we made it abundantly clear that Celtic has a well defined strategy and a business plan independent of the fortunes of any other club. That remains absolutely the case ".

"The predicament of Rangers is clearly a serious and complex matter with a whole range of possible outcomes.

"However, we are extremely well qualified to make our own position clear and have no wish to see that being misrepresented for political reasons ".

The more I think about this the more stupid Salmond's comments are politically as he will not get many votes from Hun fans (mostly Unionists) and after these comments there will be few Celtic fans voting for him.

[Leithenhibby]

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Live streaming press conference on BBC Sportscotland website in 5 minutes.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/scotland/8501453.stm

I'm not getting anything, has it started yet??

[CropleyWasGod]

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I'm not getting anything, has it started yet??

Not yet. STV site is better

[Smidge]

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I'm not getting anything, has it started yet??

Nope. Also available on SSN.

[jonty]

Late for tax payments, late for press conference.

[Captain Trips]

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I'm not getting anything, has it started yet??

Just about to start, hope this is worse than hoped.

[Leithenhibby]

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Not yet. STV site is better

Cheers

[YehButNoBut]

Just starting now on SSN

[jonty]

here we go.

[hibs0666]

Press conference just starting - hope it's all bad.

[Joe's ice cream]

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The more I think about this the more stupid Salmond's comments are politically as he will not get many votes from Hun fans (mostly Unionists) and after these comments there will be few Celtic fans voting for him.

tbh i would love to see other clubs, inc us in the SPL put out similar style statments, already fed up with being told how we couldnt survive without them!!

[Phil MaGlass]

live footage

[YehButNoBut]

Sounds to me that there is little for Rangers to be concerned about and they will be "Business As Normal" fairly soon.

[PaulSmith]

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Sounds to me that there is little for Rangers to be concerned about and they will be "Business As Normal" fairly soon.

Not listening but how then do they expect to pay the o/s tax issues?