Conspiracy theories which turned out to be true

[Edina Street]

This thread is regarding this post here https://www.hibs.net/showthread.php?...=1#post7329218 and the anti-vaccination conspiracy theorists that were outside Easter Road before the derby.

As a member of both a Conspiracy Debunking website, "and" a Conspiracy Theory website, I mostly side with the debunkers. I believe vaccine hesitancy to be dangerous to herd immunity, and I believe that other similar types of denialism including AIDS denialism to be equally as dangerous. Another topic I am extremely skeptical regarding, is the topic of alternative therapy, such as recently documented on Coronation Street. I do not believe alternative therapies to be a replacement for chemotherapy. However, I do find one of the best ways to debate with those with far left or far right leanings is to be honest about real conspiracies and cover-ups which have taken place, and also admit when conspiracy theories have been proven to be true.

So here I answer the question which was presented to me in the link I provided above.

However I am only going to present one argument at a time, because if I spend an eternity composing a thread, it is very likely I will time out, and my entire article and effort will be lost.

So, I will begin with what I consider to be the most appropriate conspiracy, given that this is a website about football.

Hillsborough disaster

Liverpool supporters and conspiracy theorists along with many members of the wider public alleged for years that there was a Police cover-up concerning the Hillsborough disaster.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...yside-57356486

Two police forces are to pay damages to more than 600 people over a cover-up which followed the Hillsborough disaster.

[Edina Street]

There is a conspiracy theory that the government is controlling the weather for nefarious purposes. This is probably not true. But governments have certainly "tried" to control the weather for nefarious purposes, as witnessed by Operation Popeye.

Operation Popeye

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Popeye

Operation Sober Popeye (Project Controlled Weather Popeye / Motorpool / Intermediary-Compatriot) was a military cloud-seeding project carried out by the U.S. Air Force during the Vietnam War in 1967–1972. The highly classified program attempted to extend the monsoon season over specific areas of the Ho Chi Minh Trail, in order to disrupt North Vietnamese military supplies by softening road surfaces and causing landslides.

[Pretty Boy]

Smoking causing cancer.

Tobacco companies knew by the late 40s, 1950s at the latest that there was an indisputable link between smoking and lung cancer, along with others, yet openly denied and paid vast sums to bury the research and have scientists and doctors speak out against it. Even after the US surgeon general endorsed the research tobacco companies still told people their product was safe and denialist propoganda was everywhere.

It was the very late 80s before Philip Morris finally completely ceased the practice.

[Edina Street]

It is probably not true that 9/11 was an inside job coordinated in order to justify an invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq, and the Twin Towers being a controlled demolition does not stand up to scrutiny. However false flag operations are real, and there are think tanks that are evil enough to present manifestos which support committing acts of terrorism against ones own citizens, in order to blame it on the enemy, and thus justify an invasion. Operation Northwoods is proof of this.

Operation Northwoods

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operat...t%20in%201962.

Operation Northwoods was a proposed false flag operation against American citizens that originated within the US Department of Defense of the United States government in 1962. The proposals called for CIA operatives to both stage and commit acts of violent terrorism against American military and civilian targets, blaming them on the Cuban government, and using it to justify a war against Cuba.

[Edina Street]

If you suspect the chip your Cat received when you took it to the vet is being used by the government to spy on you, are you schizophrenic? Probably, but not necessarily. The CIA have actually considered planting chips in Cats for the purposes of spying.

Acoustic Kitty

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acoustic_Kitty

Acoustic Kitty was a Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) project launched by their Directorate of Science & Technology in the 1960s, which intended to use cats to spy on the Kremlin and Soviet embassies.^[1]
In an hour-long procedure, a veterinary surgeon implanted a microphone in the cat's ear canal, a small radio transmitter at the base of its skull, and a thin wire into its fur

[Edina Street]

Everyone will be familiar with Mel Gibson's MK Ultra from his film "conspiracy theory". MK Ultra is also a favourite allegation of the conspiracy theory community. However, the only thing the conspiracy theorists are wrong about, is that MK Ultra is an abandoned project. However, it "was" a real project.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MKUltra
[QUOTE] Project MKUltra (or MK-Ultra)^[a] was an illegal human experimentation program designed and undertaken by the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency (CIA), intended to develop procedures and identify drugs that could be used in interrogations to weaken individuals and force confessions through brainwashing and psychological torture.^[1][2][3][4] It began in 1953 and was halted in 1973. MKUltra used numerous methods to manipulate its subjects' mental states and brain functions, such as the covert administration of high doses of psychoactive drugs (especially LSD) and other chemicals without the subjects' consent, electroshocks,^[5] hypnosis,^[6][7] sensory deprivation, isolation, verbal and sexual abuse, and other forms of torture./QUOTE]

[Onceinawhile]

Not sure it 100% fits but Operation paperclip?

[Just_Jimmy]

Scottish football is bent.



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[Edina Street]

I personally find the notion of conspiracy theorists making allegations that murdered children in school shootings such as Sandy Hook are in fact "crisis actors" taking part in hoaxes in order to bring about gun control, to be appalling and disgusting. Extrordinary cliams require extrodinary evidence. However, when the US government use children to stand up and make statements to the media regarding the murder of even younger children in order to justify an invasion of a country, which later turn out to be Atrocity Propaganda, they certainly make the lines blurry and make themselves hard to defend. Such was the case with the Niyarah testimony.

Niyarah testimony

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nayirah_testimony

The Nayirah testimony was false testimony given before the United States Congressional Human Rights Caucus on October 10, 1990, by a 15-year-old girl who was publicly identified at the time by her first name, Nayirah. The testimony was widely publicized and was cited numerous times by U.S. senators and President George H. W. Bush in their rationale to support Kuwait in the Gulf War.In 1992, it was revealed that Nayirah's last name was Al-Ṣabaḥ (Arabic: نيرة الصباح) and that she was the daughter of Saud Al-Sabah, the Kuwaiti ambassador to the United States. Furthermore, it was revealed that her testimony was organized as part of the Citizens for a Free Kuwait public relations campaign, which was run by the American public relations firm Hill & Knowlton for the Kuwaiti Government. Following this, al-Sabah's testimony has come to be regarded as a classic example of modern atrocity propaganda.^[1][2]
In her testimony, Nayirah claimed that after the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait she had witnessed Iraqi soldiers take babies out of incubators in a Kuwaiti hospital, remove the incubators and leave the babies to die.

Her story was initially corroborated by Amnesty International, a British-based global NGO, which published several independent reports about the supposed killings^[3] and testimony from evacuees. Following the liberation of Kuwait, reporters were given access to the country. An ABC report found that "patients, including premature babies, did die, when many of Kuwait's nurses and doctors ... fled" but Iraqi troops "almost certainly had not stolen hospital incubators and left hundreds of Kuwaiti babies to die."^[4]Amnesty International USA reacted by issuing a correction, with executive director John Healey subsequently accusing the Bush administration of "opportunistic manipulation of the international human rights movement".^[5]

[Edina Street]

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Not sure it 100% fits but Operation paperclip?

I don't think there was a pre-existing conspiracy theory which directly accused the US of hiring NAZI scientists. And I don't think that Operation paperclip is the biggest scandal ever, as to be fair, none of the Nazi scientists that were hired by the US government were found guilty of any crimes. However, certainly, conspiracy theorists maintain that the term NASA comes from the word NAZI, and Operation paperclip is the project that they site as proof of this.

[hibsbollah]

The Gulf of Tonkin incident, which gave President Lyndon Johnson the excuse to expand US involvement in Vietnam, didn’t actually happen and we’ve known this conclusively for 15 years or so. Whether it was ‘staged’ deliberately at a high political level or was a result of genuine bad intel on the ground is apparently ‘up for debate’…

https://www.usni.org/magazines/naval...h-about-tonkin

[O'Rourke3]

Hearts were going bust under Romanov...

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[Hibbyradge]

[Edina Street]

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Yes, a lot of conspiracy theorists are like this. In their world 2+2 only equals four because TPTB say so.

[CropleyWasGod]

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Yes, a lot of conspiracy theorists are like this. In their world 2+2 only equals four because TPTB say so.

2.3, rounded to the nearest whole number, is 2.

2.3 + 2.3 = 4.6. Rounded to the nearest whole number, it's 5.

Ergo 2+2 can equal 5.

Try it on a spreadsheet

[Kato]

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2.3, rounded to the nearest whole number, is 2.

2.3 + 2.3 = 4.6. Rounded to the nearest whole number, it's 5.

Ergo 2+2 can equal 5.

Try it on a spreadsheet

That would be 2+2 ≈ 5

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[Keith_M]

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2.3, rounded to the nearest whole number, is 2.

2.3 + 2.3 = 4.6. Rounded to the nearest whole number, it's 5.

Ergo 2+2 can equal 5.

Try it on a spreadsheet

Interestingly (or maybe not),

....in Binary, 1 + 1 = 10

Which leads me elegantly into my next point*.


One of my work colleagues genuinely believes that the Scottish Government is involved in a worldwide conspiracy to brainwash children into being confused about their sex/gender. He hasn't yet given any explanation of why they'd want to do this, but he's so convinced about it that he actually removed both of his children from school and his wife now teaches them at home.



* Think about it a bit and you'll get the link

[Jones28]

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Interestingly (or maybe not),

....in Binary, 1 + 1 = 10

Which leads me elegantly into my next point*.


One of my work colleagues genuinely believes that the Scottish Government is involved in a worldwide conspiracy to brainwash children into being confused about their sex/gender. He hasn't yet given any explanation of why they'd want to do this, but he's so convinced about it that he actually removed both of his children from school and his wife now teaches them at home.



* Think about it a bit and you'll get the link

Does you colleague do a job that involves heavy machinery or the safety of people? If so, I’d rather he didn’t.

[Keith_M]

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Does you colleague do a job that involves heavy machinery or the safety of people? If so, I’d rather he didn’t.

Thankfully he doesn't, no.

[ErinGoBraghHFC]

Time to resurrect this thread, reading another post reminded me of one of the most mental conspiracy theories I’ve ever heard. Some folk claim that Stevie wonder can see, that he’s never been blind or partially sighted and has been spotted driving a car. A part of me wishes this is true, but I have my doubts thoughts?


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[Keith_M]

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Time to resurrect this thread, reading another post reminded me of one of the most mental conspiracy theories I’ve ever heard. Some folk claim that Stevie wonder can see, that he’s never been blind or partially sighted and has been spotted driving a car. A part of me wishes this is true, but I have my doubts thoughts?


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This is a theory based on a character from an episode of Jonathan Creek called 'blind Hewie Harper'.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0616878/?ref_=ttep_ep4

[LaMotta]

I have 2 Hibs/Hearts related conspiracy theories.

1) Vladimir Romanov was handing brown envelopes of cash to Zibby Malkowski to make howlers against Hearts. Zibby made a huge amount of ridiculous errors in a Hibs jersey - but all of them came against Hearts. The rest of the time against all other teams he was largely an average goalie going about his businesses.

2) Vladimir Romanov handed brown envelope(s) to Referee Craig Thomson before the 2012 Scottish Cup Final to ensure the outcome was favourable to Hearts.

[ErinGoBraghHFC]

Maybe not technically a conspiracy theory, but does anyone remember the UFO sighting in Livingston in the late 70s? Or does anyone believe the guy?


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[McD]

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Maybe not technically a conspiracy theory, but does anyone remember the UFO sighting in Livingston in the late 70s? Or does anyone believe the guy?


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I wasn’t born when it supposedly happened (79 I think it was), but I remember a lot of the chat about it, especially as a kid

[Jones28]

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I have 2 Hibs/Hearts related conspiracy theories.

1) Vladimir Romanov was handing brown envelopes of cash to Zibby Malkowski to make howlers against Hearts. Zibby made a huge amount of ridiculous errors in a Hibs jersey - but all of them came against Hearts. The rest of the time against all other teams he was largely an average goalie going about his businesses.

2) Vladimir Romanov handed brown envelope(s) to Referee Craig Thomson before the 2012 Scottish Cup Final to ensure the outcome was favourable to Hearts.

Bizarrely the Youtube algorithm decided I wanted to watch the full cup final yesterday. I didn't quite do that but I did re-watch the main incidents in the game. I am convinced there's nothing that could have happened that would have seen us win the cup that day.

They had the luck, the ref and the millions of pounds of debt that allowed them to finance a squad they never should have had.

I guess thats a conspiracy theory of sorts.

[Mon Dieu4]

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Maybe not technically a conspiracy theory, but does anyone remember the UFO sighting in Livingston in the late 70s? Or does anyone believe the guy?


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My dad and his family saw one over a beach in kinghorn when he was a kid, said it was like a reflective cigar wasn't too far away but just shot off at a speed that no plane etc could have, my Nana and Grandad saw it too, my Grandad was a RAF spotter as well, he was none the wiser about what it had been

[Bridge hibs]

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My dad and his family saw one over a beach in kinghorn when he was a kid, said it was like a reflective cigar wasn't too far away but just shot off at a speed that no plane etc could have, my Nana and Grandad saw it too, my Grandad was a RAF spotter as well, he was none the wiser about what it had been

An old friend (Andrew Cherry) was a young lad heading to work one morning in a bottling factory in Portobello when he described seeing a UFO, his description of what he saw was so detailed

If I remember correctly he described it as black diamond shaped, matt in finish and silent. He described is as being very low that he could actually see a “pilot” dressed in black, he said the UFO tilted and then in a split second flew off at breakneck speed towards Fife

I spoke to Andy in his later years, he would have been late 70s or early 80s, a genuine and polite guy and certainly not a Jackanory. He could still tell the story to the word

It is also documented in a book named the Mac x Files, the Livingston sighting is mentioned in the book too

[ErinGoBraghHFC]

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An old friend (Andrew Cherry) was a young lad heading to work one morning in a bottling factory in Portobello when he described seeing a UFO, his description of what he saw was so detailed

If I remember correctly he described it as black diamond shaped, matt in finish and silent. He described is as being very low that he could actually see a “pilot” dressed in black, he said the UFO tilted and then in a split second flew off at breakneck speed towards Fife

I spoke to Andy in his later years, he would have been late 70s or early 80s, a genuine and polite guy and certainly not a Jackanory. He could still tell the story to the word

It is also documented in a book named the Mac x Files, the Livingston sighting is mentioned in the book too

Interesting, do you know if there’s any online info on this sighting?


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[HUTCHYHIBBY]

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I wasn’t born when it supposedly happened (79 I think it was), but I remember a lot of the chat about it, especially as a kid

I would imagine plenty folk have had a close encounter in Livvy. 🤔

[ErinGoBraghHFC]

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I wasn’t born when it supposedly happened (79 I think it was), but I remember a lot of the chat about it, especially as a kid

I remember hearing about it from time to time growing up in Livi, not a ten minute walk from where it supposedly happened. A lot of people in Deans, Carmondean and Dechmont take his word as gospel. I did always get a weird feeling walking through those woods.


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