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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Jones28 View Post
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    Bring on the attacking players, potentially compromising the good work of the team over the 80 minutes or so gone as we have to either change the shape to accommodate them or lose some of the midfield chasing that served us well in the game.

    What would you have said if he had brought Scott Allan on and we lost 2/3 nil?


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  3. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by munchar View Post
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    What are you talking about? You obviously know nothing about football. Your claiming there was no danger in making a sub in Saturday, but even against 10 men, he wouldn’t make changes till late in the game. He then chucks players on with 4 minutes to go expecting them to make an impact!!
    You don’t think that’s negative tactics?
    He never made the subs at Perth because we were hammering them. He then made them at the perfect time and it won us the game. Not quite sure how this is a negative. Rangers game is completely different - game was in the balance and while hindsight the subs may have helped, on another day they don’t get the penalty and we get a point at least and we go home satisfied. If we make the subs and they go and score then folk would go nuts about changing it when comfortable.

  4. #63
    @hibs.net private member Jones28's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hibbysam View Post
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    He never made the subs at Perth because we were hammering them. He then made them at the perfect time and it won us the game. Not quite sure how this is a negative. Rangers game is completely different - game was in the balance and while hindsight the subs may have helped, on another day they don’t get the penalty and we get a point at least and we go home satisfied. If we make the subs and they go and score then folk would go nuts about changing it when comfortable.


    I wasn't at the game though, so my opinion doesn't count.
    "...when Hibs won the Scottish Cup final and that celebration, Sunshine on Leith? I don’t think there’s a better football celebration ever in the game.”

    Sir Alex Ferguson

  5. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by Jones28 View Post
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    Bring on the attacking players, potentially compromising the good work of the team over the 80 minutes or so gone as we have to either change the shape to accommodate them or lose some of the midfield chasing that served us well in the game.

    What would you have said if he had brought Scott Allan on and we lost 2/3 nil?
    What if we’d won 2 or 3-0 though?

    They cut right though our midfield in the build up to the penalty anyway.

    I’d rather lose trying to win a game than just lose without doing anything but each to their own I suppose.

  6. #65
    @hibs.net private member Jones28's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B.H.F.C View Post
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    What if we’d won 2 or 3-0 though?

    They cut right though our midfield in the build up to the penalty anyway.

    I’d rather lose trying to win a game than just lose without doing anything but each to their own I suppose.

    If someone turns around to me and says you're coming in to this game with 1 win in 7 in the league, do you want a point against Rangers to follow up a good win away from home? I'd bite their hand off and so would you.
    "...when Hibs won the Scottish Cup final and that celebration, Sunshine on Leith? I don’t think there’s a better football celebration ever in the game.”

    Sir Alex Ferguson

  7. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Jones28 View Post
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    If someone turns around to me and says you're coming in to this game with 1 win in 7 in the league, do you want a point against Rangers to follow up a good win away from home? I'd bite their hand off and so would you.
    Absolutely.

  8. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Jones28 View Post
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    If someone turns around to me and says you're coming in to this game with 1 win in 7 in the league, do you want a point against Rangers to follow up a good win away from home? I'd bite their hand off and so would you.
    I’d have taken a point, absolutely. I just don’t think a positive change would have hindered our chances of getting it and would also have increased our chances of getting more. There seems to be an assumption any such change would have left us wide open but that happened when they broke on us anyway.

  9. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Jones28 View Post
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    I wasn't at the game though, so my opinion doesn't count.
    Your right. You weren’t at the game so how can you comment on it? You never seen how the game was developing so your just surmising. How can you possibly have a debate on a game you never seen?

  10. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by hibbysam View Post
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    He never made the subs at Perth because we were hammering them. He then made them at the perfect time and it won us the game. Not quite sure how this is a negative. Rangers game is completely different - game was in the balance and while hindsight the subs may have helped, on another day they don’t get the penalty and we get a point at least and we go home satisfied. If we make the subs and they go and score then folk would go nuts about changing it when comfortable.
    You could say the same about Rangers. If they’d lost would their fans have complained? They tried to be positive & got the rewards. SA also brought in late at Ross County, again after we lost a goal. We have a negative approach to how we try & win games if they’re in the balance. Happy to plod on & collect a point.

  11. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by munchar View Post
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    You could say the same about Rangers. If they’d lost would their fans have complained? They tried to be positive & got the rewards. SA also brought in late at Ross County, again after we lost a goal. We have a negative approach to how we try & win games if they’re in the balance. Happy to plod on & collect a point.
    Or the manager reckons our best chance of winning the game was as it was going. Loading the team with attacking players doesn’t give you more of a chance of winning a game.

  12. #71
    Coaching Staff SMAXXA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hibbysam View Post
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    Or the manager reckons our best chance of winning the game was as it was going. Loading the team with attacking players doesn’t give you more of a chance of winning a game.
    No point he’s not for moving on his view and to slag someone else saying the obviously don’t have a clue about football 😂. Hibs were trying to win the game and as an offshoot of that we were getting hit on the counter which for the most part we were coping with. To make changes and bring on the players mentioned compromises the whole structure of a team tjay for 80m made rangers look average.

    And for the comments about the St J game it’s like he’s having a moan about everything I.e we only won as they had 10 men apart from the fact we we’re the better side 11v11.

    I’m guessing he’s in the wanting on JR out camp

  13. #72
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    Why try and go for it when you are already behind reacting to a situation? Just go for it in the first place?

    A point that is under estimated is the number of games we have and making late changes really makes no sense.

  14. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by hibbysam View Post
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    Loading the team with attacking players doesn’t give you more of a chance of winning a game.
    I never thought I'd ever read such a quote on here given our heritage and traditional style of play.

  15. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by SMAXXA View Post
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    No point he’s not for moving on his view and to slag someone else saying the obviously don’t have a clue about football 😂. Hibs were trying to win the game and as an offshoot of that we were getting hit on the counter which for the most part we were coping with. To make changes and bring on the players mentioned compromises the whole structure of a team tjay for 80m made rangers look average.

    And for the comments about the St J game it’s like he’s having a moan about everything I.e we only won as they had 10 men apart from the fact we we’re the better side 11v11.

    I’m guessing he’s in the wanting on JR out camp
    We were trying to win the game, I’d agree.

    But we were lacking any quality to make it happen. The most common argument for not making any changes was that it’d leave us more open but, as you say, there was a risk of that happening anyway. Why not have someone that might actually make something happen? It might actually have gave them something and prevented them countering?

  16. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by B.H.F.C View Post
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    We were trying to win the game, I’d agree.

    But we were lacking any quality to make it happen. The most common argument for not making any changes was that it’d leave us more open but, as you say, there was a risk of that happening anyway. Why not have someone that might actually make something happen? It might actually have gave them something and prevented them countering?
    The real question is, what is Jack Ross going to do v Celtic in the final? Is he savvy enough to realise that how to play against Celtic is pressing them, being in their faces and having a go?

  17. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by SMAXXA View Post
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    No point he’s not for moving on his view and to slag someone else saying the obviously don’t have a clue about football 😂. Hibs were trying to win the game and as an offshoot of that we were getting hit on the counter which for the most part we were coping with. To make changes and bring on the players mentioned compromises the whole structure of a team tjay for 80m made rangers look average.

    And for the comments about the St J game it’s like he’s having a moan about everything I.e we only won as they had 10 men apart from the fact we we’re the better side 11v11.

    I’m guessing he’s in the wanting on JR out camp
    Am I missing something here?
    We LOST v Rangers & your still saying it was correct to plod on?
    We were better team v Saints 11 v 11. We were LOSING the game.
    Never said I wanted JR out, I’m saying we have a negative approach to games in the balance. Don’t make positive changes until we are chasing the game.,

  18. #77
    First Team Regular GRA's Avatar
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    Based on our previous form of 3 points out of 18, and how the game went during the first 70 minutes, I'd have been happy with a point against the current league champions. Wasn't as if we were under the cosh the whole game and clinging on. Game was decided by a marginal call where if Porto had pulled his foot back 0.25 seconds sooner we'd have probably got a point.

    I still stand by the call that the subs were too late and reactive. We needed fresh legs about the time Rangers brought on Arfield. Last 15 minutes before their goal they were starting to apply more pressure and our heavy schedule was starting to take its toll.

    Not saying that would have won us the game or even got a point but Allan and Murph helped win the game at the weekend. Wrong call to save them and only to bring them on reactively as soon as we were chasing the game.

  19. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by munchar View Post
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    Am I missing something here?
    We LOST v Rangers & your still saying it was correct to plod on?
    We were better team v Saints 11 v 11. We were LOSING the game.
    Never said I wanted JR out, I’m saying we have a negative approach to games in the balance. Don’t make positive changes until we are chasing the game.,
    FWIW I agree with you, it was a missed opportunity on Wednesday night to show initiative and try and win the game by having a go at Rangers with 25 mins to go onwards.

    I just hope it's not the same timid pragmatic performance in the final where its a close game that we ultimately lose. We have seen that before in the 2013 final, a very tame performance. I fear we will see a repeat of that, hopefully not though.

  20. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by 90274 View Post
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    The real question is, what is Jack Ross going to do v Celtic in the final? Is he savvy enough to realise that how to play against Celtic is pressing them, being in their faces and having a go?
    Is that the way to do it though? How are you savvy enough to know this?

  21. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by 90274 View Post
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    I never thought I'd ever read such a quote on here given our heritage and traditional style of play.
    What? Just firing loads attacking players on a pitch isn’t going to help you score - hence why games very rarely turn around when teams go behind and end up with 4/5 strikers on the pitch. That’s heehaw to do with ‘heritage and traditions’ 😂

  22. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danderhall Hibs View Post
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    Is that the way to do it though? How are you savvy enough to know this?
    We saw what happened in the first half against them at Easter Road.

  23. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by B.H.F.C View Post
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    We were trying to win the game, I’d agree.

    But we were lacking any quality to make it happen. The most common argument for not making any changes was that it’d leave us more open but, as you say, there was a risk of that happening anyway. Why not have someone that might actually make something happen? It might actually have gave them something and prevented them countering?
    I agree with you, the fact he made the two attack minded changes after we lost the goal suggests to me he thought the players he brought on gave us a better chance of getting one back ourselves. Your last sentence is telling for me. Last season we were 2-1 up against Celtic, they made attacking changes to try and get an equaliser, we made defensive ones, sat back and they scored. Had we made a more attack minded one that may have given them something to think about.

  24. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by hibbysam View Post
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    What? Just firing loads attacking players on a pitch isn’t going to help you score - hence why games very rarely turn around when teams go behind and end up with 4/5 strikers on the pitch. That’s heehaw to do with ‘heritage and traditions’ 😂
    Nobody is daft enough to chuck attcking players aimlessly on, but when it's clear as it was in Wednesday, to show initiative with creativity and fresh legs, surely you have a go to attack and win the game.

  25. #84
    @hibs.net private member Jones28's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by munchar View Post
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    Your right. You weren’t at the game so how can you comment on it? You never seen how the game was developing so your just surmising. How can you possibly have a debate on a game you never seen?
    Well, the next best thing is to listen to the radio, read the match reports, look at the stats and to read Johnny's excellent summaries and testimony from people on here.

    All theses told me we did more than enough to win the game, and would have been good value for the win even if Saints had kept 11 men on the pitch.

    Do I still not count?
    "...when Hibs won the Scottish Cup final and that celebration, Sunshine on Leith? I don’t think there’s a better football celebration ever in the game.”

    Sir Alex Ferguson

  26. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jones28 View Post
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    Well, the next best thing is to listen to the radio, read the match reports, look at the stats and to read Johnny's excellent summaries and testimony from people on here.

    All theses told me we did more than enough to win the game, and would have been good value for the win even if Saints had kept 11 men on the pitch.

    Do I still not count?
    That is interesting that you weren't at the game and didn't watch it.

  27. #86
    @hibs.net private member Jones28's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B.H.F.C View Post
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    I’d have taken a point, absolutely. I just don’t think a positive change would have hindered our chances of getting it and would also have increased our chances of getting more. There seems to be an assumption any such change would have left us wide open but that happened when they broke on us anyway.
    I'll meet you in the middle and say that fresh legs would have been good, I just don't necessarily agree that we had the right personnel to make the changes we should have made. It all goes back to how poor recruitment was in the summer.
    "...when Hibs won the Scottish Cup final and that celebration, Sunshine on Leith? I don’t think there’s a better football celebration ever in the game.”

    Sir Alex Ferguson

  28. #87
    @hibs.net private member Jones28's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 90274 View Post
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    That is interesting that you weren't at the game and didn't watch it.
    The St Johnstone game? No I wasn't.
    "...when Hibs won the Scottish Cup final and that celebration, Sunshine on Leith? I don’t think there’s a better football celebration ever in the game.”

    Sir Alex Ferguson

  29. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jones28 View Post
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    I'll meet you in the middle and say that fresh legs would have been good, I just don't necessarily agree that we had the right personnel to make the changes we should have made. It all goes back to how poor recruitment was in the summer.
    The summer window is long gone and an easy way out, the manager can't hide behind that or anyone really as we had attacking options on the bench.

    A good manager will perform with what he's got and find a way to get results.

  30. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jones28 View Post
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    The St Johnstone game? No I wasn't.
    It was on alba at 6pm as live.

  31. #90
    @hibs.net private member Jones28's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 90274 View Post
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    The summer window is long gone and an easy way out, the manager can't hide behind that or anyone really as we had attacking options on the bench.

    A good manager will perform with what he's got and find a way to get results.
    So what you're saying is that no manager thats ever been sacked is a good manager?

    You can't say the summer window is not a mitigating factor for a disappointing season.
    "...when Hibs won the Scottish Cup final and that celebration, Sunshine on Leith? I don’t think there’s a better football celebration ever in the game.”

    Sir Alex Ferguson

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