We've not become a bad team overnight, but..................

[Perfect Hatrick]

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We clearly aren’t an average football team in Scotland. I’d agree we are an average team. But in Scotland we are a top 4 team ergo not average.

We’re not in the top four so I’m not sure how you can say that in such a matter of fact way. We were a top 3 team last season and above average. Our results this season though would suggest we’re not as good a team this season.

We’re currently sitting in that mid table area outside the top 4. That’s pretty average to me.

[Smartie]

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Where's all this selective praise of JDH coming from? He was as useless as the rest yesterday and went into hiding himself.

I'd say he was probably the biggest disappointment for me yesterday.

The game was crying out for him to take responsibility and get in about it but he didn't. He hid and just didn't fancy it.

His level of performance through August was very high and he was a revelation tbh.

He needs to give himself a shake.

[Pretty Boy]

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I'd say he was probably the biggest disappointment for me yesterday.

The game was crying out for him to take responsibility and get in about it but he didn't. He hid and just didn't fancy it.

His level of performance through August was very high and he was a revelation tbh.

He needs to give himself a shake.

I think he probably gets a bit of slack because of the covid situation. It may have taken a bit out of him and he could still be battling back to full fitness.

Again it's probably testament to how light we are that I can't think of any option other than to play him yesterday though. The only other choice currently is Gogic who I highly doubt will be a Hibs player beyond his current contract.

[Nicho87]

I like jdh but one pass summed hibs up yesterday

Ball was desperate to be pinged out wide to Boyle so 1v1 with the full back

Jdh jogged a further 20 yards with the ball sent the pass out slowly by the time the ball reached Boyle jdh had brought another two players with him

Simple little thing but our tempo was a joke yesterday

Wood and hanlon slow drivel

[madhatter]

What worries me is the best of ourselves comment by Jack Ross. He acknowledged we didn't do that against Dundee United but it sounded like he thought we did it fairly often.

If we are playing at our best possible capacity most of the time, why are our wins regularly tight, some decided on penalties?

We should be beating teams 3-0 at home. We won't see that often unless this team gets a whole redesign.

No surprise on our home record. We rarely take the game to the opponents at home. If we can't counterattack we run out of ideas and pass side to side at the back.

[Northernhibee]

We’re the sort of team that can be absolutely sublime but ever so often will have an absolute stinker of a performance (Ross County last season, Livi in Dec ‘19) etc.

We also seem to usually bounce back from that fairly quickly and rarely risk it becoming a genuine bad run of results and form.

There appear to be some of the usual suspects absolutely wallowing in it again and I’m looking forward to us getting back to winning ways and keeping them quiet again.

[Key West]

Not based on the performance yesterday but I have the feeling that though Jack Ross has improved us we are not making further progress. It seems that a trip to Easter Road for any opposition is a welcoming and comfortable one, plenty of time on the ball and the luxury of settling into the game, we appear to be very one paced,lacking any sort of tempo in our passing and relying on one or two players to make things happen for us.

[madhatter]

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We’re the sort of team that can be absolutely sublime but ever so often will have an absolute stinker of a performance (Ross County last season, Livi in Dec ‘19) etc.

We also seem to usually bounce back from that fairly quickly and rarely risk it becoming a genuine bad run of results and form.

There appear to be some of the usual suspects absolutely wallowing in it again and I’m looking forward to us getting back to winning ways and keeping them quiet again.

Name a game we've been absolutely sublime. I'm assuming it is a 5-0 win?

Suggest you look forward to Hibs winning so you can enjoy the win rather than sticking it to paying fans that had to endure that nonsense yesterday. There's usual suspects that take their defence to ridiculous levels. Jack Ross said any criticism that comes their way is deserved after yesterday.
Are we becoming a comfortable club for any one who isn't Graeme Mathie?

[hibbydog]

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We’re not in the top four so I’m not sure how you can say that in such a matter of fact way. We were a top 3 team last season and above average. Our results this season though would suggest we’re not as good a team this season.

We’re currently sitting in that mid table area outside the top 4. That’s pretty average to me.

The league table doesn’t lie. We are bang average.

The season we got relegated under Butcher, every game was like that yesterday. No fight. No belief. Predicable and easy to play against.

We play like that every week and there’s only going to be one outcome.

Yes we are badly missing Doidge, but we haven’t recruited well enough to cover him. It’s our own stupid fault.

That’s as bad as I’ve seen Hibs for a number of years against a decent, but limited side.

No more days like yesterday please

[Northernhibee]

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The league table doesn’t lie. We are bang average.

The season we got relegated under Butcher, every game was like that yesterday. No fight. No belief. Predicable and easy to play against.

We play like that every week and there’s only going to be one outcome.

Yes we are badly missing Doidge, but we haven’t recruited well enough to cover him. It’s our own stupid fault.

That’s as bad as I’ve seen Hibs for a number of years against a decent, but limited side.

No more days like yesterday please

We don’t and won’t play like that every week though.

[B.H.F.C]

We have the core of a decent team and with a bit of proper business in the summer could really have kicked on. I’m not Ross’s biggest fan but he was let down in the summer and were suffering for it now.

Can take getting beat but their attitude yesterday was a disgrace. The way they come out and start games (or don’t start games) at ER has to come from Ross though.

[Northernhibee]

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Name a game we've been absolutely sublime. I'm assuming it is a 5-0 win?

Suggest you look forward to Hibs winning so you can enjoy the win rather than sticking it to paying fans that had to endure that nonsense yesterday. There's usual suspects that take their defence to ridiculous levels. Jack Ross said any criticism that comes their way is deserved after yesterday.
Are we becoming a comfortable club for any one who isn't Graeme Mathie?

Name what part of my post is a defence of the team to “ridiculous levels”.

[madhatter]

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Name what part of my post is a defence of the team to “ridiculous levels”.

"Usual subjects absolutely wallowing in it again". You couldn't just debate the performance of the team, you had to throw in criticism of fellow fans, even saying you'll love it when we win so they shut up. That for me is ridiculous.

[B.H.F.C]

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It's probably not relevant to this thread but it's also not worth a thread of it's own.

Anyway I stumbled across a couple of videos on Twitter of Celtic fans reaction towards their manager at FT yerterday. By their standards they have not had a good start to the season. Already trailing Rangers, lost the derby, out the CL, struggling in the Europa League etc etc. Yet their manager got a huge ovation from them and the general feel I get is that they really like him.

Part of that is they know they have a huge rebuild on and their anger is aimed elsewhere. Equally though his attacking, exciting style resonates with them. They love the energy of their team and they love the 'if you score 1 goal, we' ll score 2' mentality. I think fans will forgive a lot if they are entertained.

That's one thing I rarely feel watching Hibs these days. More often than not I'm satisfied with the result and ultimately you can't put up much of an argument against the manager when that is the case. I struggle to find much enthusiasm though as I find us utterly boring most of the time. It's functional football with Martin Boyle being one bright spark and Scott Allan occasionally turning the clock back.

As long as it works and we get results the grumbling will remain an undercurrent, flaring up a bit more after days like yesterday, but the majority will remain onside even if in cases like mine it:s a bit grudging. If we lose a few in a row and drop a couple of places in the table I don't think it will take much for a fair few to turn. You heard the reaction towards the end of the game yesterday and that was from people who had both bothered to turn up in the 1st place and then stayed long after a huge majority had walked out.

There are clearly plenty folk not connecting with our team/manager going by the number of empty seats. Even before a ball was kicked yesterday, there was absolutely no buzz about the place either. I think there are a lot of people in the same boat as you, can’t complain too much with the results but don’t particularly enjoy it.

[GreenCastle]

This has been coming since the transfer window shut.

Lack of recruitment in areas we needed.

Even I’m now worried with folk saying wait till Doidge is back. He’s had a really bad injury. We need to sign another goalscorer.

I agree with the original poster we are too predictable to play against. We have to be careful with Boyle - 3 games in a short space of time plus travelling, he could easily become injured then watch us struggle even more.

Our problem last season was we had too many players not helping the squad / contributing. This has happened again this season - the starting 11 basically pick itself and the bench is weak. No impact. Ok we have had some games subs have helped off the bench but you get the feeling Ross doesn’t trust / rate players like Gullan so he’s just on bench for real emergencies.

From now will the next Derby will define Ross at Hibs I feel. Aberdeen haven’t won in 10 games but our record to them and away isn’t great. We also have the semi final and old firm at Easter Road twice.

With Aberdeen so bad outside the top 4 is failure.

[Northernhibee]

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"Usual subjects absolutely wallowing in it again". You couldn't just debate the performance of the team, you had to throw in criticism of fellow fans, even saying you'll love it when we win so they shut up. That for me is ridiculous.

Yes, I’ll love it when we win and this place becomes more rational again. I mentioned the performance yesterday (it was a stinker) but also mentioned we have in the past two seasons had the occasional day like yesterday and always bounced back from it.

For example, that game against Ross County where we blew them away was sublime, the 3-1 cup win against Dundee United was excellent as was the opening day win against a very good Motherwell side. There’s plenty for optimism and although yesterday was rank, it was the exception to the rule.

[Nicho87]

I watched Ross a few times yesterday to see what he does during a game

A lot of standing at the sidelines and a little burst of claps to players.

Always find it interesting to see what they are doing

Anyway I’m not a jack Ross fan and he’s not the man to take us to the level Gordon wants us to be at.

Think it’s clear to see the the lack of volume from the fans at home games, along with performance and results will mean this gathers pace

[hibeedonald]

What concerns about JR is I think we genuinely have good players. At the start of the season we looked great times... fast forward a few weeks and other managers have watched our tactics during the early streak of good performances and nullified it.

We don't close players down anywhere near fast enough - it doesn't make sense when the likes of DU can do it.

[NC1875]

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We’re the sort of team that can be absolutely sublime but ever so often will have an absolute stinker of a performance (Ross County last season, Livi in Dec ‘19) etc.

We also seem to usually bounce back from that fairly quickly and rarely risk it becoming a genuine bad run of results and form.

There appear to be some of the usual suspects absolutely wallowing in it again and I’m looking forward to us getting back to winning ways and keeping them quiet again.

Sublime ? Seriously ? One thing I wouldnt ever call this Hibs team is sublime.

When we do win games, it’s very rarely even a very good performance, never mind sublime.

It’s usually boring. But we accept as because it’s a win. The football is crap

[Nakedmanoncrack]

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You’re right we’ve not become a bad team. We had a mare today, but we’ll still comfortably finish third.

Post of the day, hilarious.

[Smartie]

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Yes, I’ll love it when we win and this place becomes more rational again. I mentioned the performance yesterday (it was a stinker) but also mentioned we have in the past two seasons had the occasional day like yesterday and always bounced back from it.

For example, that game against Ross County where we blew them away was sublime, the 3-1 cup win against Dundee United was excellent as was the opening day win against a very good Motherwell side. There’s plenty for optimism and although yesterday was rank, it was the exception to the rule.

We had a couple of stinking performances and results around Christmas time last year and went into a mini-slump. There were deficiencies in the squad at that time and Jack Ross was able to address those by bringing in Cadden and Irvine. That gave us a wee boost and we started to kick on in the right direction again (even if Porto and Nisbet both dipped after having their heads turned).

The problem we have this time is that it's a long time to January. Getting Doidge back early is the only boost we might enjoy soon, other than getting the players back who were missing yesterday and keeping them fit for the foreseeable (not insignificant tbf).

This has been coming since the window closed and it's pretty unforgivable really, as much as we might want to make excuses. We've failed to strengthen when in a position of relative strength and it might come back to bite us firmly on the arse.

[madhatter]

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Yes, I’ll love it when we win and this place becomes more rational again. I mentioned the performance yesterday (it was a stinker) but also mentioned we have in the past two seasons had the occasional day like yesterday and always bounced back from it.

For example, that game against Ross County where we blew them away was sublime, the 3-1 cup win against Dundee United was excellent as was the opening day win against a very good Motherwell side. There’s plenty for optimism and although yesterday was rank, it was the exception to the rule.

We disagree on the definition of sublime. Our play is generally one paced and we require moments of magic from Boyle more often than not.

Rational? Paying hard earned money to watch your football team play in yesterday's manner and not be absolutely raging? Why isn't that rational? All our players and our manager didn't turn up. That's a disgrace all round, nevermind at home.

You know what was irrational, I sat and waited for the final whistle. The rational ones left when the 3rd goal went in.

[Peevemor]

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Yes, I’ll love it when we win and this place becomes more rational again. I mentioned the performance yesterday (it was a stinker) but also mentioned we have in the past two seasons had the occasional day like yesterday and always bounced back from it.

For example, that game against Ross County where we blew them away was sublime, the 3-1 cup win against Dundee United was excellent as was the opening day win against a very good Motherwell side. There’s plenty for optimism and although yesterday was rank, it was the exception to the rule.

Well said.

With the number of regulars missing yesterday we needed everyone else to play well which simply didn't happen.

I can't think of any positives to take from yesterday, but that shouldn't be applied to the season so far or indeed the whole of Ross's tenure which is what some are too quick to do.

As JR said post match, nothing can be done to change what happened yesterday. It's now up to him & his coaches to get the right reaction from the players, starting from next weekend.

[Smartie]

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What concerns about JR is I think we genuinely have good players. At the start of the season we looked great times... fast forward a few weeks and other managers have watched our tactics during the early streak of good performances and nullified it.

We don't close players down anywhere near fast enough - it doesn't make sense when the likes of DU can do it.

We do have good players.

It's just that yesterday they were either injured or MIA.

I'm not convinced that's solely down to Jack Ross.

On a separate note - I've been impressed by Tam Courts. My mate supports United and was lambasting his credentials and budget for players over the summer, expecting a relegation battle this season. United were excellent yesterday and have been decent every time I've seen them this season.

[Danderhall Hibs]

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I watched Ross a few times yesterday to see what he does during a game

A lot of standing at the sidelines and a little burst of claps to players.

Always find it interesting to see what they are doing

Anyway I’m not a jack Ross fan and he’s not the man to take us to the level Gordon wants us to be at.

Think it’s clear to see the the lack of volume from the fans at home games, along with performance and results will mean this gathers pace

One thing that really irritated me during the lockdown season was being able to hear the inane drivel managers shout at players during a game - just nonsense. Made me wonder what the point of them shouting was - I think it’s to keep fans happy that they’re motivating the team and that when in reality it’s all just an act.

[Peevemor]

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I watched Ross a few times yesterday to see what he does during a game

A lot of standing at the sidelines and a little burst of claps to players.

Always find it interesting to see what they are doing

Anyway I’m not a jack Ross fan and he’s not the man to take us to the level Gordon wants us to be at.

Think it’s clear to see the the lack of volume from the fans at home games, along with performance and results will mean this gathers pace

On the odd occasion that he was shown on the live stream he was shouting instructions.

[hibbydog]

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We don’t and won’t play like that every week though.

I bloody hope not!

Others have said that it’s the exception rather than the rule. I’d tend to agree.

Maybes yesterday was a much needed wake up call.

I hope so. I’m tired of going to ER and seeing us outfought by hungrier, but less talented, teams.

Fingers crossed that you’re right

[Smartie]

I'm never convinced by the windmilling of arms, howling and gesticulation that goes on from managers and I believe that players should know their jobs, be able to find motivation from within themselves so that the manager on the touchline is almost redundant for much of the game.

[J-C]

On our day we are a decent team but have a tendency to turn in these absolute horrendous performances every now and then, we can get away with the odd player not on it but every so often the whole team looks like amateurs and we get a humping like yesterday. Now there's a reason some if not all the players are here and it's called consistency, if they weren't so inconsistent they'd be playing at a higher level, it's just unfortunate when they all decide to be inconsistent at the same time.

I think getting 3rd last season papered over the cracks, most of the football wasn't great to watch and we had a good few poor games, as bad as we all thought Aberdeen were we only lost 1 fewer game and drew 2 fewer games than them and the home losses to Motherwell, Ross C and Livingstone. Add in the very poor set of results against St Johnstone in the league and particularly the cup and you can see why a good few punters are still not convinced by Ross or in this team, the lack of squad s=depth and strength is a real worry.

[Perfect Hatrick]

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Yes, I’ll love it when we win and this place becomes more rational again. I mentioned the performance yesterday (it was a stinker) but also mentioned we have in the past two seasons had the occasional day like yesterday and always bounced back from it.

For example, that game against Ross County where we blew them away was sublime, the 3-1 cup win against Dundee United was excellent as was the opening day win against a very good Motherwell side. There’s plenty for optimism and although yesterday was rank, it was the exception to the rule.

I’m not sure fans being critical of what was a rotten performance yesterday and what is slowly creeping into the realms of a poor start to the season considering we’re meant to be the third best team in the country is all that irrational. Infact I’m not sure what you expect the reaction to be. We’re looking likely to be mid table come the end of the first round of fixtures, are currently mid table right now and just been horsed 3-0 at home by a not all that exciting Dundee United side. Criticism of those facts is to be expected I’d have thought.

We look an average team. Something that our results, league placing and performances would back up.