Reading The Bible in full as a non-believer

[Bangkok Hibby]

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So you don't hold to the concept of the Divine Feminine, then?

😀 nah mate, even more bollocks 😄

[CropleyWasGod]

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😀 nah mate, even more bollocks 😄

I think you'll find it's "fewer".

[Bangkok Hibby]

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I think you'll find it's "fewer".

😂😂😂

[Hibernia&Alba]

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So you don't hold to the concept of the Divine Feminine, then?

What kind of blasphemy is this ? Allow me to quote this morning's Gospel reading at Mass:

'Give way to one another in obedience to Christ. Wives should regard their husbands as they regard the Lord, since as Christ is head of the Church and saves the whole body, so is a husband the head of his wife; and as the Church submits to Christ, so should wives to their husbands, in everything'.

St. Paul to the Ephesians.

That is the sacred Word; there's no getting around that. Suck it up Germaine Greer and all the other left wing subversives, yeez are telt .

[Pretty Boy]

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What kind of blasphemy is this ? Allow me to quote this morning's Gospel reading at Mass:

'Give way to one another in obedience to Christ. Wives should regard their husbands as they regard the Lord, since as Christ is head of the Church and saves the whole body, so is a husband the head of his wife; and as the Church submits to Christ, so should wives to their husbands, in everything'.

St. Paul to the Ephesians.

That is the sacred Word; there's no getting around that. Suck it up Germaine Greer and all the other left wing subversives, yeez are telt .

We have a (permanent) Decaon who gave the homily last night at the Vigil Mass. He began by saying his wife was scheduled to give the 2nd reading at the equivalent Mass last year and refused to read that. When I got home I suggested to my fiance that should be one of the readings at our wedding....... I actually think the 2nd half of the reading puts a bit of a different slant on it accepting the context of the time of course.

The Gospel reading for this week is always an interesting one. It seems even back then people found some of the teachings difficult and were happy to walk away:

'This saying is hard; who can accept it?' followed by: 'As a result of this, many of his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him.'

[marinello59]

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We have a (permanent) Decaon who gave the homily last night at the Vigil Mass. He began by saying his wife was scheduled to give the 2nd reading at the equivalent Mass last year and refused to read that. When I got home I suggested to my fiance that should be one of the readings at our wedding....... I actually think the 2nd half of the reading puts a bit of a different slant on it accepting the context of the time of course.

The Gospel reading for this week is always an interesting one. It seems even back then people found some of the teachings difficult and were happy to walk away:

'This saying is hard; who can accept it?' followed by: 'As a result of this, many of his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him.'

I read it last night and thought of this thread. It’s problematical to say the least.
As your post shows though, nothing is unthinkingly accepted, nor should it be.

[J-C]

One day, a farmer was out mending fences and at some point along the way he lost his Bible.

A month later, one of his sheep walks up to him clutching the Bible between its teeth.

"Oh, Lord," exclaims the farmer as he drops to his knees, "Thank you Lord, it's a miracle!"

"Not really," says the sheep, "Your name's inside the cover, you daft *******.”

[Hibernia&Alba]

I'm up to Book 25, Ecclesiastes, about 750 pages in. I'm enjoying reading the full Bible more than I expected. Whether it's the divine Word of God, I shall maintain a diplomatic silence.....

[Keith_M]

I decided to finally get into the spirit of the thread, and read a book in which I'm a non-believer.


So I read The Highway Code.



What a load of utter nonsense that was. I have no idea how anybody could be naive enough to believe that stuff.

[Hibernia&Alba]

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I decided to finally get into the spirit of the thread, and read a book in which I'm a non-believer.


So I read The Highway Code.



What a load of utter nonsense that was. I have no idea how anybody could be naive enough to believe that stuff.

I would recommend the Old Testament for those who like action stories. God puts on quite a show:

Genocide
Blood Magic
Infanticide
Child brides and paedophilia
Rape
Land theft
Racism
Slavery
Torture
Genital mutilation
Plagues
Famines
Floods
Earthquakes

Plus other exciting phenomena

Remember, God is all loving and all merciful

[w pilton hibby]

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I would recommend the Old Testament for those who like action stories. God puts on quite a show:

Genocide
Blood Magic
Infanticide
Child brides and paedophilia
Rape
Land theft
Racism
Slavery
Torture
Genital mutilation
Plagues
Famines
Floods
Earthquakes

Plus other exciting phenomena

Remember, God is all loving and all merciful

So it's more or less Hollyoaks in sandals 😀

[Keith_M]

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So it's more or less Hollyoaks in sandals 😀

I would have said it's more of a Brookside, but I get your point

[Keith_M]

I was just watching yet another story on the news about widespread paedophilia and child abuse in the Catholic church, this time in France.

This one was about the THOUSANDS of Priests, and other associated Church members, that abused HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of children over the decades.

Thank God (pun intended) for Free Will.... and God's apparent disinterest in the welfare of those children... AND the fact that those people claim to be his representatives on earth.

Those in charge of the various Churches must be absolutely delighted that their followers still blindly believe... after centuries of hideous behaviour from those in positions of power in said churches... that these same people represent God on Earth, and even have the right to tell others what is and what is not wrong.

And God, in his infinite wisdom, sits up there and lets them carry on like that, while those down on earth still blindly believe, or even blindly still try to defend the indefensible


But to be fair, they have some lovely church buildings and never hold back from filling them with pointless paintings of 'Saints' and 'Virgins', crosses of Gold and precious stones..... so that makes it all worth while, I suppose.

[Keith_M]

"Some 216,000 children - mostly boys - have been sexually abused by clergy in the French Catholic Church since 1950, a damning new inquiry has found.


The head of the inquiry said there were at least 2,900-3,200 abusers, and accused the Church of showing a "cruel indifference towards the victims"

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-58801183


"The inquiry found the number of children abused in France could rise to 330,000, when taking into account abuses committed by lay members of the Church, such as teachers at Catholic schools."

[Hibernia&Alba]

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I was just watching yet another story on the news about widespread paedophilia and child abuse in the Catholic church, this time in France.

This one was about the THOUSANDS of Priests, and other associated Church members, that abused HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of children over the decades.

Thank God (pun intended) for Free Will.... and God's apparent disinterest in the welfare of those children... AND the fact that those people claim to be his representatives on earth.

Those in charge of the various Churches must be absolutely delighted that their followers still blindly believe... after centuries of hideous behaviour from those in positions of power in said churches... that these same people represent God on Earth, and even have the right to tell others what is and what is not wrong.

And God, in his infinite wisdom, sits up there and lets them carry on like that, while those down on earth still blindly believe, or even blindly still try to defend the indefensible


But to be fair, they have some lovely church buildings and never hold back from filling them with pointless paintings of 'Saints' and 'Virgins', crosses of Gold and precious stones..... so that makes it all worth while, I suppose.

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"Some 216,000 children - mostly boys - have been sexually abused by clergy in the French Catholic Church since 1950, a damning new inquiry has found.


The head of the inquiry said there were at least 2,900-3,200 abusers, and accused the Church of showing a "cruel indifference towards the victims"

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-58801183


"The inquiry found the number of children abused in France could rise to 330,000, when taking into account abuses committed by lay members of the Church, such as teachers at Catholic schools."

It's both utterly outrageous and tragic. I will say from the outset that this issue is certainly not unique to the Catholic Church, but, being a huge organisation of 1.3 billion people, with thousands of priests around the world, it will have more of these appalling cases than any other organisation. All religions have been hit with this issue. The Church of England, for example, continues to uncover new scandals each year. The perverts who commit such terrible crimes join professions/vocations where they will have easy access to children and hold authority over them. What better position of trust than the clergy? Other professions, such as teaching, are also vulnerable for the same reason, and there are inquiries into almost every boys boarding school in the UK. Organisations such as the Boy Scouts have also been infiltrated by paedophiles.

If institutions hit by child abuse allegations dealt with it in the proper way, the crimes would be bad enough; but the cover ups are what really destroys trust. When institutions care more about their reputation than the well being of children, abuse can continue for decades. There are so many examples of the Catholic Church putting public reputation before the safeguarding of children: paedophile priests being moved from parish to parish when scandal erupts, which only spreads the abuse to new areas! It has to be said the vast majority of priests are good men who genuinely want to serve God. However, the response of the Church to paedophile priests has on numerous occasions been woeful: cover ups, hush money, victim blaming, denial - there are examples of each. In many countries church attendances have dropped, due to child abuse scandals. I'm sure any Irish posters can attest to that. The Church, indeed all institutions which work with children, must be compelled to transparency. Zero tolerance, robust safeguarding policies, and criminal investigations of all allegations must be a legal requirement. Thousands upon thousands of young lives have been destroyed already.

[marinello59]

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I was just watching yet another story on the news about widespread paedophilia and child abuse in the Catholic church, this time in France.

This one was about the THOUSANDS of Priests, and other associated Church members, that abused HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of children over the decades.

Thank God (pun intended) for Free Will.... and God's apparent disinterest in the welfare of those children... AND the fact that those people claim to be his representatives on earth.

Those in charge of the various Churches must be absolutely delighted that their followers still blindly believe... after centuries of hideous behaviour from those in positions of power in said churches... that these same people represent God on Earth, and even have the right to tell others what is and what is not wrong.

And God, in his infinite wisdom, sits up there and lets them carry on like that, while those down on earth still blindly believe, or even blindly still try to defend the indefensible


But to be fair, they have some lovely church buildings and never hold back from filling them with pointless paintings of 'Saints' and 'Virgins', crosses of Gold and precious stones..... so that makes it all worth while, I suppose.

Surely this is a totally different topic from what the thread was intended for? I get your utter contempt for Catholics and the religious in general but this is a whole new topic.

[Hibernia&Alba]

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Surely this is a totally different topic from what the thread was intended for? I get your utter contempt for Catholics and the religious in general but this is a whole new topic.

Fair point there. I'm about to start Book 28, Sirach, p. 795.

I enjoyed the previous Book, The Wisdom of Solomon, more than any so far. Here we clearly see the philosophy of the ancient Greeks, such as Plato, Aristotle, Aeschylus and Euripides at work: mortality and the shortness of life; how to find meaning when we know we shall die; how to avoid fear of death. It's ancient stoicism and existentialism, which is much more my thing than the miracles of the Old Testament. I'm sure The New Testament in full will be more to my way of thinking than the wrath of the O.T. God.

I just noticed that The Wisdom of Solomon is one of the books that Protestant Bibles do not include. That's a real shame, as it's a very interesting philosophical tract. Was it Martin Luther who decided which books Protestant should dispense with, and does any Biblical scholar on here know why that book is omitted from Protestant Bibles?

[Keith_M]

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Surely this is a totally different topic from what the thread was intended for? I get your utter contempt for Catholics and the religious in general but this is a whole new topic.

Wow, that's an amazing way to interpret what I wrote. I most certainly don't have contempt for all my mates who are Catholics or for the abused children, it's the self-righteous, hypocritical religions in general I have a serious problem with


Anyway, I was responding to an ongoing discussion on this subject in this thread, but I'll happily move this to another thread.

[Hibrandenburg]

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Anyway, I was responding to an ongoing discussion on this subject in this thread, but I'll happily move this to another thread.

Go for it, my popcorn stocks have been replenished.

[Kato]

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I'm sure The New Testament in full will be more to my way of thinking than the wrath of the O.T. God.

After you've done with the NT a good follow up is the writings of Josephus. He shows what happens to the "wicked generation" JC preaches against and the actual fate of the temple "*I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down."

The Vespasian/Titus campaigns in Palestine is great movie waiting to be made.

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[Hibernia&Alba]

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After you've done with the NT a good follow up is the writings of Josephus. He shows what happens to the "wicked generation" JC preaches against and the actual fate of the temple "*I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down."

The Vespasian/Titus campaigns in Palestine is great movie waiting to be made.

Sent from my SM-A405FN using Tapatalk

My next book is either going to be the new Jilly Cooper or Katie Price's autobiography. Actually at the weekend I bought Thomas a Kempis' 'Imitation of Christ' and might go straight into that. Not being religious, I've read very little theology.

[Kato]

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My next book is either going to be the new Jilly Cooper or Katie Price's autobiography. Actually at the weekend I bought Thomas a Kempis' 'Imitation of Christ' and might go straight into that. Not being religious, I've read very little theology.

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[Keith_M]

I just saw this and thought it was quite funny...

[Hibernia&Alba]

Finished it, all 1588 pages. The New Testament is much more my thing; if we could all (not least those who claim to be Christians) actually live by the code Jesus commands, we'd have an infinitely better world. Do I believe it's literally true? Deep down, no I don't, but the social message is commendable. I've been attending Mass again since my best friend died earlier and the year, and I completely understand the comfort it provides to true believers. It would be wonderful if there is something better after death, but I just don't buy it. I think all religions are ultimately an attempt by human beings to come to terms with our mortality. As far as we know, we are the only species aware we will die; it's the ultimate question, and I think religions of every hue try to answer that, telling us that our lives do have meaning and comforting us in the face of our mortality. Those of us without that belief can easily slip into nihilism, and religion attempts to tackle that problem.

[WeeRussell]

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Finished it, all 1588 pages. The New Testament is much more my thing; if we could all (not least those who claim to be Christians) actually live by the code Jesus commands, we'd have an infinitely better world. Do I believe it's literally true? Deep down, no I don't, but the social message is commendable. I've been attending Mass again since my best friend died earlier and the year, and I completely understand the comfort it provides to true believers. It would be wonderful if there is something better after death, but I just don't buy it. I think all religions are ultimately an attempt by human beings to come to terms with our mortality. As far as we know, we are the only species aware we will die; it's the ultimate question, and I think religions of every hue try to answer that, telling us that our lives do have meaning and comforting us in the face of our mortality. Those of us without that belief can easily slip into nihilism, and religion attempts to tackle that problem.

First of all - good effort. Seems like it’s been a worthwhile exercise at least somewhat for you.

I’ve always said to my pals that religion serves a purpose, or at least it should. It’s a form of guidance to try and help human beings be good people and live decent lives (obviously it leads to the opposite in some cases). Maybe advancements in science, technology and people generally not being god-fearing faithful people that fall into line means it’s lost the effectiveness it once had and some would argue religion has had its time.

As long as it continues to help and comfort people without them forcing their views on others then no harm is being done.

Unfortunately we’ve full scale wars and horrendous acts being carried out with people using “religion” as the reason, or indeed using their position in the church in negative (and horrible) ways. I’m sure the teachings in the bible never intended it this way…

[Keith_M]

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Finished it, all 1588 pages. The New Testament is much more my thing; if we could all (not least those who claim to be Christians) actually live by the code Jesus commands, we'd have an infinitely better world. Do I believe it's literally true? Deep down, no I don't, but the social message is commendable. I've been attending Mass again since my best friend died earlier and the year, and I completely understand the comfort it provides to true believers. It would be wonderful if there is something better after death, but I just don't buy it. I think all religions are ultimately an attempt by human beings to come to terms with our mortality. As far as we know, we are the only species aware we will die; it's the ultimate question, and I think religions of every hue try to answer that, telling us that our lives do have meaning and comforting us in the face of our mortality. Those of us without that belief can easily slip into nihilism, and religion attempts to tackle that problem.

So your next task is the Koran.

Then the Book of Mormon.



Happy reading.

[Hibernia&Alba]

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So your next task is the Koran.

Then the Book of Mormon.



Happy reading.

I have the Pali Canon of The Buddha. "Turn off your mind, relax and float downstream..."