Maggenis

[B.H.F.C]

Don’t think Magennis is really to blame for the lack of impact. It’s not his fault he was coming back from a bad injury, not his fault he has had other niggles and not his fault he caught COVID. He probably couldn’t believe his luck when he was getting offered the security of a five year deal having been out injured for so long though.

I did find his signing a bit strange at the time. We’d obviously been in for McCrorie, missed him and then moved on to Magennis is a totally different type of player. And you had the injury situation as well. When he was getting played out on the left it felt, to me, that we were just trying to get him in to the team rather than having signed him for any particular purpose.

[calumhibee1]

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But then missed another two months in amongst that (two single full months). He’s never been fully match fit due to the injuries and lack of opportunity in amongst that.

He has played >45 minutes on 3 occasions and never played 90 once. Hardly a big opportunity.

Yes. But he’s been back from the serious injury that people keep harking back to for nearly 5 months. It’s time we stopped using it as an excuse and expected him to actually offer something when he’s fit/gets an opportunity.

If he’s as good as people claim he is then he’d be forcing the manager to give him game time. He’s made 14 appearances. That’s 14 games where he’s been deemed fit enough to get on the pitch. Instead of making a claim for a starting slot he makes it very easy for the manager to only give him less than 45 mins and never give him 90 mins. He’s been a huge disappointment so far.

The same excuses have been getting trotted out for Drey Wright who returned from his serious injury in mid 2019!

[cabbageandribs1875]

off topic a tad but where is this other McGinn brother we signed from st.mirren, what's going on


injured ? or what




asking for a friend

[jacomo]

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I'm yet to see any of these flashes of what he might be. I think back to players like McGeouch who broke down every 2nd game but is was clear as day what he brought to the team when he was in it, not seen that with Magennis yet unfortunately.

I'm holding out hope that next season we will see him shine but he probably doesn't have too long next season to prove himself before he starts too look like a duff signing to most Hibs fans I'd say.

Oh I think he’s definitely got something. Unfortunately he’s not been fit enough to show us more than glimpses of his ability so far.

I’m still hoping he’s going to be a big player for us, and the closest we’ve had to SJM since SJM himself.

[JimBHibees]

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He signed with a very bad injury on a 4 year contract. He was never going to hit the ground running.

He wasn't signed with a bad njury he had recovered from that. Very good player imo but been very stop start due to niggles.

[Robbo6-2]

Huge gamble to pay and hand out the length of contract for a player coming back from such a serious injury.

Hes looked poor apart from 45mins vs Dundee Utd.

[hibbysam]

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Yes. But he’s been back from the serious injury that people keep harking back to for nearly 5 months. It’s time we stopped using it as an excuse and expected him to actually offer something when he’s fit/gets an opportunity.

If he’s as good as people claim he is then he’d be forcing the manager to give him game time. He’s made 14 appearances. That’s 14 games where he’s been deemed fit enough to get on the pitch. Instead of making a claim for a starting slot he makes it very easy for the manager to only give him less than 45 mins and never give him 90 mins. He’s been a huge disappointment so far.

The same excuses have been getting trotted out for Drey Wright who returned from his serious injury in mid 2019!

He may have been fit as in injury free for those 14 games, but he’s nowhere near match fit, the same as the likes of Scott Allan just now, may be fit enough but as we can’t play reserve games there’s no way of getting players up to speed. He never had a preseason and the niggles are always going to come with the injury he had. It’s been stop start but through absolutely no fault of his own. You’ve said it yourself, ‘when he’s fit’ but he’s never been match fit as he can’t get a run of games under his belt.

Couple all of that with the fact that in the main we’ve won the majority of our games then it’s always going to be difficult for players to work there way into our side who have been out.

[calumhibee1]

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He wasn't signed with a bad njury he had recovered from that. Very good player imo but been very stop start due to niggles.

Yup. He made his debut 2 days after he signed. I actually thought it was longer but he came off the bench against Brora on 7/10 after signing on 5/10.

[hibbysam]

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Yup. He made his debut 2 days after he signed. I actually thought it was longer but he came off the bench against Brora on 7/10 after signing on 5/10.

That was him building up from nearly 9 months out, he played 4 periods of games before breaking down and missing another month with a muscle injury. He then played another three parts of games building back up after that to then break down again. He then built up 4 times off the bench in the middle of our winning run before being hit with Covid.

A player coming back from that length of time out would normally play a number of friendlies/reserve games slowly building up to full match fitness, Magennis never had that luxury and had to use the league cup games against very physical lower league sides on plastic pitches.

[CMurdoch]

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off topic a tad but where is this other McGinn brother we signed from st.mirren, what's going on


injured ? or what




asking for a friend

Fit but loads of midfielders in the queue before him with the 2 January additions in that area and Allan back.
Billy Whizz mentioned that he was doing scouting work for JR which may or may not be true.
His contract expires in 3 months and can't see him getting another playing contract.
Only 32 so maybe not ready to stop playing.
Next destination?

[calumhibee1]

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That was him building up from nearly 9 months out, he played 4 periods of games before breaking down and missing another month with a muscle injury. He then played another three parts of games building back up after that to then break down again. He then built up 4 times off the bench in the middle of our winning run before being hit with Covid.

A player coming back from that length of time out would normally play a number of friendlies/reserve games slowly building up to full match fitness, Magennis never had that luxury and had to use the league cup games against very physical lower league sides on plastic pitches.

He’s had 14 appearances to get up to speed. Does he now need to get up to speed after every niggle?

Newell has missed a few games - there’ll rightly be no excuses about getting back up to speed made for him.

For the faith we’ve shown in Magennis with the contract we’ve offered he’s been very disappointing, whether that’s being injured frequently or his performances. Hibs will have signed him expecting him to contribute this season. We signed him and played him 2 days later, there’s no way we signed him expecting him to offer next to nothing for the majority of a season when he signed ready to play.

[cabbageandribs1875]

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Fit but loads of midfielders in the cue before him with the 2 January additions in that area and Allan back.
Billy Whizz mentioned that he was doing scouting work for JR which may or may not be true.
His contract expires in 3 months and can't see him getting another playing contract.
Only 32 so maybe not ready to stop playing.
Next destination?

ta for that that is indeed an odd one

according to ihibs he's played 9 and scored one goal, i can only remember him playing one game and he wasn't even very good in that :( oh well

[hibbysam]

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He’s had 14 appearances to get up to speed. Does he now need to get up to speed after every niggle?

Newell has missed a few games - there’ll rightly be no excuses about getting back up to speed made for him.

For the faith we’ve shown in Magennis with the contract we’ve offered he’s been very disappointing, whether that’s being injured frequently or his performances. Hibs will have signed him expecting him to contribute this season. We signed him and played him 2 days later, there’s no way we signed him expecting him to offer next to nothing for the majority of a season when he signed ready to play.

He never signed ready to play, it was clear we were using those games as we would bounce games if he was coming back from that injury. He was out for (I’m going to be kind) 8 months, you don’t just turn up and be ready to play 90 minutes straight away. When he’s been out for so long and not had any pre season, and hasn’t got fully up to speed before breaking down then yes, he does need to come back from every injury.

‘He’s had 14 appearances to get up to speed’ - one of those was 1 minute, one of those was 8 minutes, the majority were 20-30 minutes. He’s played a grand total of 440 minutes which is less than 5 full games, after missing 8 months, 1 month and 1 month with no pre season. Your expectations are so far from reality. Thankfully we’ve a medical and sports science team that will understand his injuries and his fitness far better than Calum on .net.

When he signed the club would’ve wanted more this year, however they’d also have expected we’d be able to play bounce games to help our situation out with recovering from injuries, and we wouldn’t have thought he’d be quite so unlucky with the injuries he has had.

[matty_f]

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He never signed ready to play, it was clear we were using those games as we would bounce games if he was coming back from that injury. He was out for (I’m going to be kind) 8 months, you don’t just turn up and be ready to play 90 minutes straight away. When he’s been out for so long and not had any pre season, and hasn’t got fully up to speed before breaking down then yes, he does need to come back from every injury.

‘He’s had 14 appearances to get up to speed’ - one of those was 1 minute, one of those was 8 minutes, the majority were 20-30 minutes. He’s played a grand total of 440 minutes which is less than 5 full games, after missing 8 months, 1 month and 1 month with no pre season. Your expectations are so far from reality. Thankfully we’ve a medical and sports science team that will understand his injuries and his fitness far better than Calum on .net.

I honestly don’t understand why some people are so unwilling to cut anyone some slack. Magennis’ time at Hibs has been stop start through injury and illness, players need games to hit their peak, he’s not had that yet but he’ll get there.

[calumhibee1]

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He never signed ready to play, it was clear we were using those games as we would bounce games if he was coming back from that injury. He was out for (I’m going to be kind) 8 months, you don’t just turn up and be ready to play 90 minutes straight away. When he’s been out for so long and not had any pre season, and hasn’t got fully up to speed before breaking down then yes, he does need to come back from every injury.

‘He’s had 14 appearances to get up to speed’ - one of those was 1 minute, one of those was 8 minutes, the majority were 20-30 minutes. He’s played a grand total of 440 minutes which is less than 5 full games, after missing 8 months, 1 month and 1 month with no pre season. Your expectations are so far from reality. Thankfully we’ve a medical and sports science team that will understand his injuries and his fitness far better than Calum on .net.

He didn’t sign ready to play yet Hibs played him 2 days later? That would suggest a serious neglect of the players well-being on Hibs part.

If he played 2 days after he signed I’d suggest he had been doing a considerable amount of rehab and been back in full training for a good while - do you really think he wasn’t ready to play, coming back from a serious injury yet Hibs decided to play him anyway, against Brora Rangers who we wouldn’t have needed him against and risked someone who we’ve invested so much in getting another serious injury?

He was deemed by Hibs and JR as being more than fit enough to get on the pitch and contribute, something which he’s not done nearly enough of - whether that’s not being on the pitch which is out of his hands, or contributing on the pitch which is absolutely in his hands.

Ask yourself why he’s only been put on for 1 minute or 8 minutes in some of these games. Was it to get his fitness up? Of course it wasn’t - 1 minute or 8 minutes isn’t going to do that. If he had shown more than he has then he would have got more than one minute or 8 minutes or 20 minutes. Using his injury which he’s been back from for 5 months as the sole excuse for the fact he’s offered so little far is what is so far from reality.

[hibbysam]

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He didn’t sign ready to play yet Hibs played him 2 days later? That would suggest a serious neglect of the players well-being on Hibs part.

If he played 2 days after he signed I’d suggest he had been doing a considerable amount of rehab and been back in full training for a good while - do you really think he wasn’t ready to play, coming back from a serious injury yet Hibs decided to play him anyway, against Brora Rangers who we wouldn’t have needed him against?

He was deemed by Hibs and JR as being more than fit enough to get on the pitch and contribute, something which he’s not done nearly enough of - whether that’s not being on the pitch which is out of his hands, or contributing on the pitch which is absolutely in his hands.

Ask yourself why he’s only been put on for 1 minute or 8 minutes in some of these games. Was it to get his fitness up? Of course it wasn’t - 1 minute or 8 minutes isn’t going to do that. If he had shown more than he has then he would have got more than one minute or 8 minutes or 20 minutes. Using his injury which he’s been back from for 5 months as the sole excuse for the fact he’s offered so little far is what is so far from reality.

To build his fitness, that’s why he played two days after he signed. All part of his rehab to get back to full match fitness. If you think a player is going to hit the ground running after 8+ months out in his first game back and then be flying thereafter your detached from reality.

He would’ve been fit, but being fit and match fit couldn’t be further apart. He needed games, his minutes were building then he got injured for a month. Same again and then injured for a month.

He got 1 minute and 8 minutes because we were winning and it was to run the clock down. He wasn’t fit enough to start and the team were on winning runs. It’s not rocket science.

He’s been injured three times and been out with Covid, he’s not been injury free for 5 months. He’s made appearances to build fitness in between injuries before breaking down and having to start again. Reality.

[cabbageandribs1875]

jackson irvine played just days after signing and after being out of competitive football for several months, i was majorly surprised to say the least i always thought their was a big difference between being fit and match fit, i've no idea if he had been playing bounce games for another club right enough

[calumhibee1]

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To build his fitness, that’s why he played two days after he signed. All part of his rehab to get back to full match fitness. If you think a player is going to hit the ground running after 8+ months out in his first game back and then be flying thereafter your detached from reality.

He would’ve been fit, but being fit and match fit couldn’t be further apart. He needed games, his minutes were building then he got injured for a month. Same again and then injured for a month.

He got 1 minute and 8 minutes because we were winning and it was to run the clock down. He wasn’t fit enough to start and the team were on winning runs. It’s not rocket science.

He’s been injured three times and been out with Covid, he’s not been injury free for 5 months. He’s made appearances to build fitness in between injuries before breaking down and having to start again. Reality.

So he’s went from being injured when he signed to not being fit when he signed to being fit but not being match fit when he signed?

He got 8 minutes after starting the week before - a game in which he was poor. He didn’t get 8 minutes because he wasn’t fit enough to start as he was fit enough to start the week before.

He got 1 minute after coming off the bench for decent lengths of time the 2 games previous. Again, he didn’t get 1 minute because he wasn’t fit enough to start. He got 1 minute and 8 minutes in these games because he hasn’t shown nearly enough to justify much more than that so far. That’s the reality.

[hibbysam]

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So he’s went from being injured when he signed to not being fit when he signed to being fit but not being match fit when he signed?

He got 8 minutes after starting the week before. He didn’t get 8 minutes because he wasn’t fit enough to start as he was fit enough to start the week before.

He got 1 minute after coming off the bench for decent lengths of time the 2 games previous. Again, he didn’t get 1 minute because he wasn’t fit enough to start. He got 1 minute and 8 minutes in these games because he hasn’t shown nearly enough to justify much more than that so far. That’s the reality.

He wasn’t going to start week after week after 8 months out. Managing players back to full fitness is all part of management. He started one week, was on the bench the next week, got injured.

If you wanted him to return to play 90 minutes week after week after 8 months out then fair enough, you’ll be disappointed more often than not. Thankfully he’ll be managed back to full fitness and especially now when he’s suffering from Covid symptoms. The season wasn’t planned to be a write off but the way it has gone for him with injuries it’s ended up that way. He’ll still be a huge player for us for years to come and has shown plenty to prove that over his career to date.

[calumhibee1]

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He wasn’t going to start week after week after 8 months out. Managing players back to full fitness is all part of management. He started one week, was on the bench the next week, got injured.

If you wanted him to return to play 90 minutes week after week after 8 months out then fair enough, you’ll be disappointed more often than not. Thankfully he’ll be managed back to full fitness and especially now when he’s suffering from Covid symptoms. The season wasn’t planned to be a write off but the way it has gone for him with injuries it’s ended up that way. He’ll still be a huge player for us for years to come and has shown plenty to prove that over his career to date.

I can say with a degree of certainty that his rehab wouldn’t have dictated that he could start a game, play 60 minutes and then wouldn’t be able to start the next game a full week later. He would never have started that first game if that was the case - if your body is still that fragile after an injury you’re not starting games. He didn’t start the next game cause he was totally ineffective against County, something which has unfortunately been the story of his appearances for us so far.

Nobody on this thread has suggested he was to play 90 minutes every single game from the off either, regardless of how many times you suggest it.

[hibbysam]

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I can say with a degree of certainty that his rehab wouldn’t have dictated that he could start a game, play 60 minutes and then wouldn’t be able to start the next game a full week later. He would never have started that first game if that was the case - if your body is still that fragile after an injury you’re not starting games. He didn’t start the next game cause he was totally ineffective against County, something which has unfortunately been the story of his appearances for us so far.

Nobody on this thread has suggested he was to play 90 minutes every single game from the off either, regardless of how many times you suggest it.

And have you sat back and thought why he might be ineffective? Your sharpness and match fitness doesn’t just appear. It takes games and time, something that would normally be done in friendlies and bounce games, something we haven’t had. His body isn’t fragile enough that he can’t play, he just isn’t fully up to full match speed, it’s fairly obvious.

Scott Allan came on for a good period against st Johnstone and has barely been seen since. He’s fit enough, he just can’t get games, when he does come on he’s ineffective as he’s off the pace. It’s the same situation.

Players need games to get up to speed but when your in the middle of a season and fighting for 3rd place, we don’t have that luxury to give them.

[calumhibee1]

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And have you sat back and thought why he might be ineffective? Your sharpness and match fitness doesn’t just appear. It takes games and time, something that would normally be done in friendlies and bounce games, something we haven’t had. His body isn’t fragile enough that he can’t play, he just isn’t fully up to full match speed, it’s fairly obvious.

Scott Allan came on for a good period against st Johnstone and has barely been seen since. He’s fit enough, he just can’t get games, when he does come on he’s ineffective as he’s off the pace. It’s the same situation.

Players need games to get up to speed but when your in the middle of a season and fighting for 3rd place, we don’t have that luxury to give them.

You said yourself it was part of managing him back to full fitness not starting him the next week yet now you’re saying he was in fact able to play.

You’re tying yourself in knots here trying to desperately defend what is a fairly innocuous point that some folk have made - that his Hibs career to date has been a real disappointment - both performances on the pitch and injuries/COVID. I would be surprised if he wouldn’t acknowledge that himself.

[hibbysam]

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You said yourself it was part of managing him back to full fitness not starting him the next week yet now you’re saying he was in fact able to play.

You’re tying yourself in knots here trying to desperately defend what is a fairly innocuous point that some folk have made - that his Hibs career to date has been a real disappointment - both performances on the pitch and injuries/COVID. I would be surprised if he wouldn’t acknowledge that himself.

If he’s not fully match fit he’s not going to play week after week. No knots. He started one week, he dropped out the next. Your inferring this is performance related.

He’ll be extremely disappointed that his injuries have destroyed his first season in a Hibs shirt. His ability is unquestionable however. I’m glad we forked out for him and look forward to his career in a Hibs top.

[calumhibee1]

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If he’s not fully match fit he’s not going to play week after week. No knots. He started one week, he dropped out the next. Your inferring this is performance related.

He’ll be extremely disappointed that his injuries have destroyed his first season in a Hibs shirt. His ability is unquestionable however. I’m glad we forked out for him and look forward to his career in a Hibs top.

If he’d played well against County when he started and played 60 minutes then he’d have started the next game a full 7 days later. You’re kidding yourself on if you think he wouldn’t have. That makes it performance related.

[JimBHibees]

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ta for that that is indeed an odd one

according to ihibs he's played 9 and scored one goal, i can only remember him playing one game and he wasn't even very good in that :( oh well

Played in a few of the League cup group games.

[MWHIBBIES]

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He never signed ready to play, it was clear we were using those games as we would bounce games if he was coming back from that injury. He was out for (I’m going to be kind) 8 months, you don’t just turn up and be ready to play 90 minutes straight away. When he’s been out for so long and not had any pre season, and hasn’t got fully up to speed before breaking down then yes, he does need to come back from every injury.

‘He’s had 14 appearances to get up to speed’ - one of those was 1 minute, one of those was 8 minutes, the majority were 20-30 minutes. He’s played a grand total of 440 minutes which is less than 5 full games, after missing 8 months, 1 month and 1 month with no pre season. Your expectations are so far from reality. Thankfully we’ve a medical and sports science team that will understand his injuries and his fitness far better than Calum on .net.

When he signed the club would’ve wanted more this year, however they’d also have expected we’d be able to play bounce games to help our situation out with recovering from injuries, and we wouldn’t have thought he’d be quite so unlucky with the injuries he has had.

Spot on. Don't get how this is hard to understand.

[Crunchie]

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I honestly don’t understand why some people are so unwilling to cut anyone some slack. Magennis’ time at Hibs has been stop start through injury and illness, players need games to hit their peak, he’s not had that yet but he’ll get there.

My take on it too, how anyone can even contemplate questioning his ability, or writing him off before he's had any run in the team beggars belief. By all accounts he's a great prospect and I've no doubt he'll prove his worth, and some.

Future captain and star in the making, I predict a great career for the lad.

[calumhibee1]

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Spot on. Don't get how this is hard to understand.

It’s ‘hard to understand’ because the idea that every niggle means Magennis is hitting the reset button on his return from his major injury is nonsense. He’s back from that injury. Hes done the rehab, he’s played games. He’s not still returning from it and when he gets a thigh strain or something similar he’s not “starting again” on his return from it.

[MWHIBBIES]

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It’s ‘hard to understand’ because the idea that every niggle means Magennis is hitting the reset button on his return from his major injury is nonsense. He’s back from that injury. Hes done the rehab, he’s played games. He’s not still returning from it and when he gets a thigh strain or something similar he’s not “starting again” on his return from it.

No, its quite clear he was never fully up to speed. Scott Allan has made 4 appearances since returning, do you expect him to be fit as well? Its about minutes played and Kyle has sadly struggled to get many.

Him getting injured is no different from Scott Allan. Its unlucky and could happen to anyone. He deserves our support, not being labed a disappointment. Just my opinion, though.

[Andy74]

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It’s ‘hard to understand’ because the idea that every niggle means Magennis is hitting the reset button on his return from his major injury is nonsense. He’s back from that injury. He’s not still returning from it.

You are wasting a lot of energy on something that isn’t that tricky.

He has been signed long term after we’ve also been after him for years.

We knew he was coming off a bad injury. I’m sure we had hoped we could have built his fitness back up and got him back playing more regularly.

As it turned out he has picked up other little niggles, which happens, and now Covid.

We might have hoped he would have been playing more of a part but I’m sure we also knew that these things happen after big injuries. He is a long term signing and will become a good player for us.