How should the SPFL respond to Hearts' threats?

[NASAHIBS]

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The SPFL's first step must be to suspend both clubs until the matter is settled - that would include withholding any payments due to them and prohibiting any contact with other member clubs. Any scheduled league matches during that time should be forfeited. They've gone too high for a negotiated out of court settlement so the court action needs to run its course or be withdrawn. Permanent expulsion should be considered but it probably won't go that far.

Over on JambosKickedoot they were talking about not guaranteeing the safety of certain club officials at Tinycastle. While it probably wouldn't go that far in reverse you can be sure Ann Budge will not be getting a warm welcome at any of the grounds she visits this season. If I was a club CEO I would be considering refusing to play any matches at Tinycastle or Firhill. They've taken the gloves off so the SPFL and member clubs need to do the same.

Agree totally with the first parts there, and then announce the top league fixtures the next day

[Mainstandman]

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If the SFA don’t take action against them then UEFA will take action against the SFA. UEFA always go after the associations rather than clubs. Scotland could be banned from the play offS for UEFA championship and the Nations league and World Cup qualifiers. Clubs must use CAS as their first option of pursuing claims. Hearts and Thistle have really opened a can of worms and are really in the ****. The SPLF will respond vigorously within the next week and then the retreat will begin from Hearts. £8m is laughable but is deliberately high to try and get a few hundred thousand. Cases get settled all the time because it’s cheaper than running them even if you believe you’ve got a good case. But settling the case does not solve the SFA problem or Hearts and Thistles potential punishment.

that the principle but i haven't seen any action in regard of the French court case in this way from the French league or UEFA

[where'stheslope]

Says in this mornings paper, no one has asked for the season to be delayed yet!
The SPFL have 1 week to get back to them on their exuberent claims, if unsuccessful then they can take it further???
Courts never like ganging up on others, it could get messy!!!

[nonshinyfinish]

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If the SFA don’t take action against them then UEFA will take action against the SFA. UEFA always go after the associations rather than clubs. Scotland could be banned from the play offS for UEFA championship and the Nations league and World Cup qualifiers. Clubs must use CAS as their first option of pursuing claims.

Does anyone know how this works in practice?

Does it mean that your first (and only?) court action must be to CAS? Or is there a lower court that's part of the same system? My vague memory is of reading about 'appeals' being heard by CAS so in my head I saw it as a higher court that gets involved later in the process. Is that wrong?

As mentioned above, what about the French/Belgian cases that appear to have gone through those countries civil courts (or equivalent)? Are UEFA just waiting to see the final outcome before they do anything? Or is this UEFA rule being misunderstood?

[neil7908]

Get rid of them both. Tired of all this dragging on.

[mal]

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Does anyone know how this works in practice?

Does it mean that your first (and only?) court action must be to CAS? Or is there a lower court that's part of the same system? My vague memory is of reading about 'appeals' being heard by CAS so in my head I saw it as a higher court that gets involved later in the process. Is that wrong?

As mentioned above, what about the French/Belgian cases that appear to have gone through those countries civil courts (or equivalent)? Are UEFA just waiting to see the final outcome before they do anything? Or is this UEFA rule being misunderstood?

https://disciplinary.uefa.com/casdecisions/

I think this is the relevant part:

"However, as Article 63 of the UEFA Statutes establishes, the CAS is not competent to deal with (i) matters relating to the application of a purely sporting rule, such as the Laws of the Game or the technical modalities of a competition, (ii) decisions through which a natural person is suspended for a period of up to two matches or up to one month, or (iii) awards issued by an independent and impartial court of arbitration in a dispute of a national dimension arising from the application of the statutes or regulations of an association."

[nonshinyfinish]

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https://disciplinary.uefa.com/casdecisions/

I think this is the relevant part:

"However, as Article 63 of the UEFA Statutes establishes, the CAS is not competent to deal with (i) matters relating to the application of a purely sporting rule, such as the Laws of the Game or the technical modalities of a competition, (ii) decisions through which a natural person is suspended for a period of up to two matches or up to one month, or (iii) awards issued by an independent and impartial court of arbitration in a dispute of a national dimension arising from the application of the statutes or regulations of an association."

Meaning that the UEFA angle is a red herring?

[mal]

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Meaning that the UEFA angle is a red herring?

That would be my interpretation of the above.

[nonshinyfinish]

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That would be my interpretation of the above.

Thanks.

[Diclonius]

Suspension, then demotion, then expulsion, in that order, if they continue to refuse to stop legal action.

[Keith_M]

How should the SPFL respond to Hearts' threats?

So, it looks like we're starting to find out...





Hearts and Partick Thistle could face SFA hammering as Clare Whyte probes £10m compensation demand

[lucky]

The anti is about to be upped the SPFL, SFA and the other clubs. So far Budge has been the one to try and control the media narrative through her BBC puppets but as all bullies find out there are always bigger and meaner people around waiting on you. The £10m claim and threat to stop football has made them piranhas within Scottish football.

[Cabbage East]

For those that don't want to click the link





Hearts and Partick Thistle could be hammered by the SFA after holding a £10million gun to the heads of the rest of Scotland’s clubs.

Record Sport understands compliance officer Clare Whyte is currently assessing if the M8 alliance has broken the articles of association by threatening to drag the SPFL into the Court of Session unless they are spared from relegation.

Both clubs have lodged joint papers at Edinburgh’s Court of Session with Hearts demanding an £8m compensation package and Thistle looking for a £2m parachute payment if they are forced to drop down the divisions as a consequence of the coronavirus crisis.

They are also threatening to take out an interdict to prevent the top flight from starting up on August 1 unless their demands are satisfied.

The unprecedented move has provoked a furious response from clubs across the country and yesterday the top brass on Hampden’s sixth floor were busy examining their own rule book to establish if Hearts and Thistle should be dragged up on a charge.

Under article 99 entitled ‘Resolution of Disputes between Members’ the SFA insist any such dispute should be brought before the governing body for arbitration rather than taken into the law courts.

It is also made clear that any club wishing to raise a legal action at the Court of Session must ask for permission from the SFA before doing so.

It reads: “A member, an associated person and/or the SFA shall not take a SFA Dispute to a court of law except with the prior approval of the Board.”

Now Whyte could be set to wade into the civil war which has been ripping through the Scottish game since it was forced into lockdown in March.

Under the rules, any breach of the articles of association is punishable by a raft of sanctions including ranging from fine up to ‘suspension’ and even ‘expulsion’.

The rules state: “A recognised football body, club, official,Team Official or other member of Team Staff, player, referee or other person under the jurisdiction of the SFA if found to have infringed the Articles shall be liable to censure or to a fine or to a suspension or to an expulsion or to ejection from the Challenge Cup Competition, to any combination of these penalties or such other penalty, condition or sanction as the Judicial Panel considers appropriate.”

Meanwhile, Record Sport understands back channel talks between outraged clubs continued yesterday in the wake of the legal move with the potential for a formal request for a vote on whether Hearts and Thistle should be expelled from the SPFL on the table.

One Premiership club told us last night: “There are a lot of discussions going on behind the scenes and the anger is palpable.

“I’ve never known so many clubs to be united by such a sense of fury.”

[eastmainsmsh]

Demote them to the lowland league Gretna and Rangers were hung out to dry so why not them

[calumhibee1]

Well done the SFA. Now follow through on it, please.

[Onion]

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The anti is about to be upped the SPLF, SFA and the other clubs. So far Budge has been the one to try and control the media narrative through her BBC puppets but as all bullies find out there are always bigger and meaner people around waiting on you. The £10m claim and threat to stop football has made them piranhas within Scottish football.

Love that !

[Spike Mandela]

The SFA won’t do anything. They did nothing when Rangers took them to the Court of Session.

It’s all hollow threat with the SFA.

[Onion]

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For those that don't want to click the link





Hearts and Partick Thistle could be hammered by the SFA after holding a £10million gun to the heads of the rest of Scotland’s clubs.

Record Sport understands compliance officer Clare Whyte is currently assessing if the M8 alliance has broken the articles of association by threatening to drag the SPFL into the Court of Session unless they are spared from relegation.

Both clubs have lodged joint papers at Edinburgh’s Court of Session with Hearts demanding an £8m compensation package and Thistle looking for a £2m parachute payment if they are forced to drop down the divisions as a consequence of the coronavirus crisis.

They are also threatening to take out an interdict to prevent the top flight from starting up on August 1 unless their demands are satisfied.

The unprecedented move has provoked a furious response from clubs across the country and yesterday the top brass on Hampden’s sixth floor were busy examining their own rule book to establish if Hearts and Thistle should be dragged up on a charge.

Under article 99 entitled ‘Resolution of Disputes between Members’ the SFA insist any such dispute should be brought before the governing body for arbitration rather than taken into the law courts.

It is also made clear that any club wishing to raise a legal action at the Court of Session must ask for permission from the SFA before doing so.

It reads: “A member, an associated person and/or the SFA shall not take a SFA Dispute to a court of law except with the prior approval of the Board.”

Now Whyte could be set to wade into the civil war which has been ripping through the Scottish game since it was forced into lockdown in March.

Under the rules, any breach of the articles of association is punishable by a raft of sanctions including ranging from fine up to ‘suspension’ and even ‘expulsion’.

The rules state: “A recognised football body, club, official,Team Official or other member of Team Staff, player, referee or other person under the jurisdiction of the SFA if found to have infringed the Articles shall be liable to censure or to a fine or to a suspension or to an expulsion or to ejection from the Challenge Cup Competition, to any combination of these penalties or such other penalty, condition or sanction as the Judicial Panel considers appropriate.”

Meanwhile, Record Sport understands back channel talks between outraged clubs continued yesterday in the wake of the legal move with the potential for a formal request for a vote on whether Hearts and Thistle should be expelled from the SPFL on the table.

One Premiership club told us last night: “There are a lot of discussions going on behind the scenes and the anger is palpable.

“I’ve never known so many clubs to be united by such a sense of fury.”

10 weeks of grandstanding by the worst run club in the Championship is about to catch up on them.

[Ozyhibby]

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Does anyone know how this works in practice?

Does it mean that your first (and only?) court action must be to CAS? Or is there a lower court that's part of the same system? My vague memory is of reading about 'appeals' being heard by CAS so in my head I saw it as a higher court that gets involved later in the process. Is that wrong?

As mentioned above, what about the French/Belgian cases that appear to have gone through those countries civil courts (or equivalent)? Are UEFA just waiting to see the final outcome before they do anything? Or is this UEFA rule being misunderstood?

You should appeal to the SFA first. They haven’t even done that.


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[nonshinyfinish]

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You should appeal to the SFA first. They haven’t even done that.


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So the approved process is take your grievance to your local FA, then appeal to CAS if necessary?

[Ozyhibby]

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The SFA won’t do anything. They did nothing when Rangers took them to the Court of Session.

It’s all hollow threat with the SFA.

Yes, and Hearts know this. It’s another consequence of not dealing with Rangers properly. Anything goes now in Scottish football.


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[Joe6-2]

Showing once again their concern for Scottish football, hinting at forcing a delay to football start (more blackmail)
Also proving money is the only concern with the £8 million figure, they aren’t bothered about relegation, just money!!
Trash!

[Caversham Green]

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So the approved process is take your grievance to your local FA, then appeal to CAS if necessary?

I'm struggling to make sense of the rule quoted by Mal above, but the way I read it is that the CAS can't overrule a decision already made by a 'local' court of arbitration if the matter ruled upon relates to general national matters rather than sporting ones. The Court of Session is not a court of arbitration and I think the SFA rule precludes HoMFC taking their case to any Scottish/UK court of arbitration since the dispute is not related to non sporting matters.

I think the courts that initally heard the French and Belgian cases were courts of arbitration and the matter was a national one because it was government rulings that curtailed their respective leagues.

[northgreen24]

The SFA might have not done anything against The Rangers but this is going to effect the Old firm cash cow, I couldn’t care less about them but the statement about leaving an interdict on the table was a threat and the problem with threats is people take them in different ways, we all think compensation but when you go down this path you have 40 other
Clubs who adhere to the members rules so might think we need to move on and if these 2 don’t accept, while of course if unfortunate Might be best they are suspended

Now UEFA have dates for Europa league etc this cant continue and now bigger than poor hearts and Partick who seem to forget had they not been rubbish would have been fine but it’s all everyone else fault

Must be 15m now they are seeking