NO to reconstruction

[007]

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Did Budge confirm Sky TV are happy with the proposals and would not try to re- negotiate the new media deal. ?

Yes and I think Doncaster did too. Just if it is a 14 team Premiership, nothing re the detail. Presumably Sky happy as long as they get their 4 Glasgow derbies.

[147lothian]

I always felt AB always knew that legal action never had a leg to stand on but IMO she thought she had to make out she would go down that route if all else failed to keep the roasters in her ranks on-side. A no vote tomorrow ends not only the talk of reconstruction with clubs calling for the fixture list to be released but it will also end the grumblings about legal action against Doncaster and the SPFL.

I am quite optimistic that this is Doncasters way of dotting the i's and crossing the t's before we finally draw a line under the old season and start the new one.

[007]

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I always felt AB always knew that legal action never had a leg to stand on but IMO she thought she had to make out she would go down that route if all else failed to keep the roasters in her ranks on-side. A no vote tomorrow ends not only the talk of reconstruction with clubs calling for the fixture list to be released but it will also end the grumblings about legal action against Doncaster and the SPFL.

I am quite optimistic that this is Doncasters way of dotting the i's and crossing the t's before we finally draw a line under the old season and start the new one.

He's certainly not daft. You could tell how sharp he is when he nailed Budge with his email to Sportsound.

[green day]

Regarding people saying the Cormack story not on the website - maybe, but it was the top sports story and they played part of the interview on Radio Scotland this morning.

[Caversham Green]

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Getting away for a second from the Hearts/Hibs argument - would you want a 14 team league?

(I mean regardless that it is the immorally bankrupt serial lying cheats that have been the ****tiest at playing football in Scotlands top league for a year and a half in spite of outspending all their competitors bar 2 that would be the ones to slink and slither away from the consequences of their own arrogance and ineptitude fuelled failings again)

14 team league sounds rubbish.

Some teams playing 36 some playing 40 - what a lot of nonesense. Have you to pay a season ticket for 40 and only get 36. Pay for 36 and get 4 free.
Splits after 26 games - so lots of teams into the meaningless games in February. European football off the agenda with 3 months of the season to go for clubs that fall into the bottom 8. Top 8 and bottom 6 - really! Won't be any point splashing cash in Jan window for 5 or 6 teams with nothing to chase.
Even if you were in relegation trouble you would have the decision to make whether or not to try and buy in Jan or save your funds to pay the avoid relegation fee instead.

If it goes to 14 teams it is a worse product - for 5 years. Season tickets for most fans of most clubs lose their appeal.
All for a league that everyone knows, fans, pundits, clubs and other nations looking in is corrupt to the point you can bribe in full public view.

Hopefully Hibs have enough principle and moral fibre not to accept the maroon pound bribe for the overall good of Scottish football as a whole.

My thoughts exactly. I've never been a fan of the split (or promotion play-offs) because to me they feel artificial. However, they work in the current format - with a 12 team league there's the interest in the lead up to the split, then the five game sprint to decide European places, relegation and sometimes the championship itself so nearly every game has some genuine interest attached. Putting another two lower grade teams and making the split earlier in the season at best dilutes that interest and at worst destroys it.

I've always defended Scottish football against the English football snobs down here but right now I have no argument to defend it with. Scottish football really is a laughing stock thanks to the worst team in the Premiership dictating terms.

[mal]

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Getting away for a second from the Hearts/Hibs argument - would you want a 14 team league?

(I mean regardless that it is the immorally bankrupt serial lying cheats that have been the ****tiest at playing football in Scotlands top league for a year and a half in spite of outspending all their competitors bar 2 that would be the ones to slink and slither away from the consequences of their own arrogance and ineptitude fuelled failings again)

14 team league sounds rubbish.

Some teams playing 36 some playing 40 - what a lot of nonesense. Have you to pay a season ticket for 40 and only get 36. Pay for 36 and get 4 free.
Splits after 26 games - so lots of teams into the meaningless games in February. European football off the agenda with 3 months of the season to go for clubs that fall into the bottom 8. Top 8 and bottom 6 - really! Won't be any point splashing cash in Jan window for 5 or 6 teams with nothing to chase.
Even if you were in relegation trouble you would have the decision to make whether or not to try and buy in Jan or save your funds to pay the avoid relegation fee instead.

If it goes to 14 teams it is a worse product - for 5 years. Season tickets for most fans of most clubs lose their appeal.
All for a league that everyone knows, fans, pundits, clubs and other nations looking in is corrupt to the point you can bribe in full public view.

Hopefully Hibs have enough principle and moral fibre not to accept the maroon pound bribe for the overall good of Scottish football as a whole.

It's a terrible format for the league and, as I've said on another thread, it significantly disadvantages bottom eight clubs should they get to the latter stages of the Scottish Cup as they have to fit so many more matches into the same space of time than the top six. So that's two competitions significantly affected.

[bingo70]

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It's a terrible format for the league and, as I've said on another thread, it significantly disadvantages bottom eight clubs should they get to the latter stages of the Scottish Cup as they have to fit so many more matches into the same space of time than the top six. So that's two competitions significantly affected.

If a bunch of fans on an internet forum can see the disadvantages of it, it’s incredible that professionals who are meant to be doing a proper analysis of it are pushing it so hard.

That ‘proposal’ that budge put out was literally half an hours work with no thought or effort put into it. Why we’re still debating it is beyond me.

Obviously we have a vested interest in seeing it failing but you’ve got to imagine supporters of all clubs are saying the same thing.

[Juniper Greens]

If we are just getting to pick whatever we want, how about a 16 team SPL. 30 games. Top 8 have playoffs home and away 1v8, 2v7 etc to decide champions. Bottom 8 play each other once more in a league format to decide relegation (keeping points from first 30 games).
Would make end of season exciting. Might break the duopoly one year in ten and more often that not, sky will still get it's 4 OF games

[bingo70]

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If we are just getting to pick whatever we want, how about a 16 team SPL. 30 games. Top 8 have playoffs home and away 1v8, 2v7 etc to decide champions. Bottom 8 play each other once more in a league format to decide relegation (keeping points from first 30 games).
Would make end of season exciting. Might break the duopoly one year in ten and more often that not, sky will still get it's 4 OF games

I’m not against the idea of league reconstruction if it was something like this but throwing together a 14 team league just to save one club is a nonsense.

[semaj64]

Surely Championship clubs would be looking at a share of the £2M plus having Hearts in their league would increase their revenue for the season (or 2) via Crowds and sponsorship, assume that more of their games would be on Alba. Why would they want reconstruction at this point in time?

[calumhibee1]

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If we are just getting to pick whatever we want, how about a 16 team SPL. 30 games. Top 8 have playoffs home and away 1v8, 2v7 etc to decide champions. Bottom 8 play each other once more in a league format to decide relegation (keeping points from first 30 games).
Would make end of season exciting. Might break the duopoly one year in ten and more often that not, sky will still get it's 4 OF games

That actually sounds quite enjoyable. No chance of the OF voting for it though. And to be fair that would be understandable.

[Wakeyhibee]

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Getting away for a second from the Hearts/Hibs argument - would you want a 14 team league?

(I mean regardless that it is the immorally bankrupt serial lying cheats that have been the ****tiest at playing football in Scotlands top league for a year and a half in spite of outspending all their competitors bar 2 that would be the ones to slink and slither away from the consequences of their own arrogance and ineptitude fuelled failings again)

14 team league sounds rubbish.

Some teams playing 36 some playing 40 - what a lot of nonesense. Have you to pay a season ticket for 40 and only get 36. Pay for 36 and get 4 free.
Splits after 26 games - so lots of teams into the meaningless games in February. European football off the agenda with 3 months of the season to go for clubs that fall into the bottom 8. Top 8 and bottom 6 - really! Won't be any point splashing cash in Jan window for 5 or 6 teams with nothing to chase.
Even if you were in relegation trouble you would have the decision to make whether or not to try and buy in Jan or save your funds to pay the avoid relegation fee instead.

If it goes to 14 teams it is a worse product - for 5 years. Season tickets for most fans of most clubs lose their appeal.
All for a league that everyone knows, fans, pundits, clubs and other nations looking in is corrupt to the point you can bribe in full public view.

Hopefully Hibs have enough principle and moral fibre not to accept the maroon pound bribe for the overall good of Scottish football as a whole.

If we're gonna have a small league, then the current set is the best out of the 3 versions we"ve tried to date.

14 leaves the season dead far too early for some, and creates fixture headaches in certain circumstances.

[FilipinoHibs]

One more sleep and one last flush and the big jobby will be gone.

[Joe6-2]

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https://bbc.in/3eQtg7j

5 year reconstruction on the table from Doncaster.

Budge only bothered about the Premiership and happy to let the lower leagues do what they please.

This is a f****** joke, and why would Aberdeen want two years and not five?
A total carve up, can only hope the clubs bin this, and Doncaster needs held to account

[jacomo]

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The "club sources" is always just made up via the journalists pen to pad out articles. Unless there is a named source its always best to take with a pinch of salt.

Personally I think Budge has been feeding ‘off the record’ quotes to BBC Scotland and DR on a near-daily basis.

She’s almost certainly responsible for the quotes in the latest story.

What amazes me is that she doesn’t seem to realise that other club chairmen know what she’s up to. Some of the on record criticism of her has been pretty excruciating and humiliating - other chairmen are openly questioning her integrity and motives.

I hope she stops before it gets worse.

[Phil MaGlass]

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Personally I think Budge has been feeding ‘off the record’ quotes to BBC Scotland and DR on a near-daily basis.

She’s almost certainly responsible for the quotes in the latest story.

What amazes me is that she doesn’t seem to realise that other club chairmen know what she’s up to. Some of the on record criticism of her has been pretty excruciating and humiliating - other chairmen are openly questioning her integrity and motives.

I hope she stops before it gets worse.

No let her keep going, its goin tae be great entertainment value when it all comes crashin doon the morn.

[Joe6-2]

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It looks to me like the string attached is ND to push the reconstruction harder. I can't see that changing the prem clubs minds though.

There is of course the part about stating the objections to see of they can be worked through but surely if several clubs state they are not interested in a 14 top league then that's it done. Clubs won't allow this to keep dragging on, Celtic are already calling for fixtures to be announced.

So they want to ‘work through’ objections? Why isn’t yes or no good enough? Sounds like Doncaster wants this pushed through

[JimBHibees]

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Cormack changes his mind every other week it seems. Not to be trusted.

Agree likes the attention without really saying too much but changes with wind. He was saying his players weren't able to furlough then they were.

[JimBHibees]

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If there are any clubs that are genuinely interested in re-rorganising the leagues 'for the good of Scottish Football', then why not make a statement that they are prepared to consider the proposal at a more appropriate time but that just now we need to work solely on getting the leagues restarted (fixtures in place, plans for fans returning, etc) as a top priority.

They can then regroup in January, or whenever Football has returned to some semblance of normality, and discuss it under less pressure... and for the long term benefit of Scottish Football as a whole.

Seems sensible probably why it won't happen.

[jacomo]

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This is a f****** joke, and why would Aberdeen want two years and not five?
A total carve up, can only hope the clubs bin this, and Doncaster needs held to account

It’s great.

Under the pretence of doing everything he can to support Budge, ND has proposed a plan that literally no one except Hearts and ICT can support.

Temporary reconstruction - won’t be backed by the clubs that want permanent change.

5 years - too long for those minded to back a temporary reconstruction.

Ann Budge has made her plan even less popular!

[PatHead]

Is it only the Premiership who have to vote by tomorrow or all leagues?

[Spike Mandela]

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Is it only the Premiership who have to vote by tomorrow or all leagues?

Doesn’t appear to be a vote. Appears to be yet another information gathering exercise entitled ‘How to get to a 14 team league by hook or by crook’.

[PatHead]

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Doesn’t appear to be a vote. Appears to be yet another information gathering exercise entitled ‘How to get to a 14 team league by hook or by crook’.

Thanks but if a majority of clubs are against either option I would expect it to be dead, so a vote in that sense.

[green day]

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Doesn’t appear to be a vote. Appears to be yet another information gathering exercise entitled ‘How to get to a 14 team league by hook or by crook’.

I imagine that a number of clubs (including ours going by Keiran P comments) might say "look guys, enough".

Remember, Doncaster is an employee of the clubs - if the clubs say "no plan has the legs to get the required votes" then its over.

Cormack last night said we only have 8 weeks to prepare for the season and that this 5 year temporary cock and bull doesnt float his boat - and he wont be the only voice at tomorrows meeting.

Deoncaster is - reasonably - giving it every chance................and when it does fail, he cant really be hung out to dry by Budge and her Sportsound apologists.

[Waxy]

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So they want to ‘work through’ objections? Why isn’t yes or no good enough? Sounds like Doncaster wants this pushed through

Either that or he wants to look like he’s trying, knowing it has zero chance.Its up to the clubs at the end of the day.
It has to be voted on or binned asap.

[Spike Mandela]

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Thanks but if a majority of clubs are against either option I would expect it to be dead, so a vote in that sense.

This time though they are being asked what is required to make it more amenable to them. Once this information is gathered, compromises made then and only then will the proposal be put to a vote.

Neil Doncaster is now effectively leading the SPFL reconstruction group doing what Budge’s inept chairmanship of the group could not.

Fuelled by money from the magic money tree if Doncaster can find a way of getting this through he will, no strings attached.

[CapitalGreen]

Has a club ever had a more cringeing set of supporters than Hearts have? Why are they so obsessed with writing open letters.

https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/spor...mpression=true

[StevieC]

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This time though they are being asked what is required to make it more amenable to them. Once this information is gathered, compromises made then and only then will the proposal be put to a vote.

Neil Doncaster is now effectively leading the SPFL reconstruction group doing what Budge’s inept chairmanship of the group could not.

Fuelled by money from the magic money tree if Doncaster can find a way of getting this through he will, no strings attached.

I think that this is the conclusion I am reaching.

The last time it fell through because some wanted temporary, some wanted permanent and some didn’t want it at all.

We’ve already seen from Cormack, who was happy with temporary but has now said NO to something longer, that it is looking very unlikely that this circle can be squared off.

[Springbank]

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I think that this is the conclusion I am reaching.

The last time it fell through because some wanted temporary, some wanted permanent and some didn’t want it at all.

We’ve already seen from Cormack, who was happy with temporary but has now said NO to something longer, that it is looking very unlikely that this circle can be squared off.

Good call from Aberdeen imo

There are arguments for reconstruction, if it is looking at redistribution of money As Well As number of times we play each other per season.

But Budge's 14-14-14 with a bottom 8 split from Feb/Mar onwards fails to address any of these (imo)

It's a discussion for the long term

[Jim44]

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So they want to ‘work through’ objections? Why isn’t yes or no good enough? Sounds like Doncaster wants this pushed through

Of course he does. It’ll make his life easier. I think pre-bribe Doncaster is a different animal than than post-bribe Doncaster.