Sunderland til I die

[TelaStella]

Binged it all in one go on Wednesday and from the first episode had my suspicions of Methven. Was quite surprised to see how quickly a support like Sunderland’s seemed to endorse him as well though as it series goes on you simply put it down to sheer desperation than anything else. Whole thing came across as a massive cringe really, fans being mugged off left, right n centre. The whole fetch me a beer, unneeded swearing in press conferences and functions along with the “I’m from Oxford but...” & “people say things about the North East but...” was just condescending and if I was a fan I’d be left pretty embarrassed and pissed after that showing of the club. Not a team I’ve got high thoughts for but my heart really does go out to some of the fans and hope one day soon they have a bit more to shout about on and off the park. Anyone know if Methven and Co are still involved down there?


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[Billy Whizz]

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Binged it all in one go on Wednesday and from the first episode had my suspicions of Methven. Was quite surprised to see how quickly a support like Sunderland’s seemed to endorse him as well though as it series goes on you simply put it down to sheer desperation than anything else. Whole thing came across as a massive cringe really, fans being mugged off left, right n centre. The whole fetch me a beer, unneeded swearing in press conferences and functions along with the “I’m from Oxford but...” & “people say things about the North East but...” was just condescending and if I was a fan I’d be left pretty embarrassed and pissed after that showing of the club. Not a team I’ve got high thoughts for but my heart really does go out to some of the fans and hope one day soon they have a bit more to shout about on and off the park. Anyone know if Methven and Co are still involved down there?


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Donald still around, Methven gone

[BILLYHIBS]

Sure I read that Methven now gone but still retains a 5% stake in the club

[LancashireHibby]

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The footage where he is obnoxious towards his female assistant on the touchline at the boxing day game where he demands the attendance figure was beyond the pale. If I was her husband or father I would be fuming and looking to chin him. Disrespectful in the extreme. Imagine how he behaves towards staff when the camera isn't rolling.
Been rationing myself and will watch the last 2 episodes tonight.

Although he undoubtedly behaved like a tool at that point (and plenty of others), I was very surprised that they weren’t able to get the figure at the click of a finger. In a near sell out, there presumably wouldn’t be any cash turnstiles which would be the only process that would require a manual reconciliation rather than simply being a report direct from the ticketing system. Not that I know a thing or two about this kind of thing, I promise!

[Peevemor]

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Although he undoubtedly behaved like a tool at that point (and plenty of others), I was very surprised that they weren’t able to get the figure at the click of a finger. In a near sell out, there presumably wouldn’t be any cash turnstiles which would be the only process that would require a manual reconciliation rather than simply being a report direct from the ticketing system. Not that I know a thing or two about this kind of thing, I promise!

I found that strange too. They also showed a woman counting a huge batch of unsold tickets (stubs still attached), although that could have been dodgy editing.

[Perd Hapley]

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I found that strange too. They also showed a woman counting a huge batch of unsold tickets (stubs still attached), although that could have been dodgy editing.

Was unconvinced with the editing indeed - I'd need to watch it again but I'm sure in the play-off final it showed and possibly mentioned in commentary Lewis Morgan playing at the start, only for him to come on as Power's injury sub minutes later. Also agree with others that the framing of certain parts left a little to be desired but it's still a unique look at a club on that level.

Agree with the broad consensus that Ross came across well, Stewart Donald seemed out of his depth, and Methven came across as a smarmy Eton/Oxford finance and PR corporate sociopath git. When the fans' rep suggested ticket discounts for ST holders who'd been to earlier cup rounds and he cut him off to say 'good idea, but I want to get back to mine which makes more money' or words to that effect - it's a toss-up for me between that and him losing his nerve and verbally abusing his employee on the sideline over the gate receipts as to which moment disgusted me more.

Would never wish someone harm but I have to say the look on his face as reality hit in the end was schadenfreude incarnate - much as I feel for the fans and staff it's always nice to see a hubristic numpty humbled. I do accept though that my opinion of this man has been formed in one afternoon from one television programme so I won't condemn him to the dogs just yet. I will nevertheless however severely judge him because as a bored and quarantined consumer in the same economy that put him in charge of a football club I have paid for that right. Tosser.

His Wikipedia page is a laugh too - given the fawning tone of the thing, the random slogan in the intro and the guy's history in PR I don't think it's unreasonable to suggest there may have been some autobiographing going on

[LancashireHibby]

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Was unconvinced with the editing indeed - I'd need to watch it again but I'm sure in the play-off final it showed and possibly mentioned in commentary Lewis Morgan playing at the start, only for him to come on as Power's injury sub minutes later. Also agree with others that the framing of certain parts left a little to be desired but it's still a unique look at a club on that level.

Agree with the broad consensus that Ross came across well, Stewart Donald seemed out of his depth, and Methven came across as a smarmy Eton/Oxford finance and PR corporate sociopath git. When the fans' rep suggested ticket discounts for ST holders who'd been to earlier cup rounds and he cut him off to say 'good idea, but I want to get back to mine which makes more money' or words to that effect - it's a toss-up for me between that and him losing his nerve and verbally abusing his employee on the sideline over the gate receipts as to which moment disgusted me more.

Would never wish someone harm but I have to say the look on his face as reality hit in the end was schadenfreude incarnate - much as I feel for the fans and staff it's always nice to see a hubristic numpty humbled. I do accept though that my opinion of this man has been formed in one afternoon from one television programme so I won't condemn him to the dogs just yet. I will nevertheless however severely judge him because as a bored and quarantined consumer in the same economy that put him in charge of a football club I have paid for that right. Tosser.

His Wikipedia page is a laugh too - given the fawning tone of the thing, the random slogan in the intro and the guy's history in PR I don't think it's unreasonable to suggest there may have been some autobiographing going on

Wasn’t even a discount for those who had been to games in earlier rounds and just a case of offering priority to them ahead of a general sale for Wembley. Can only assume they had a paid membership scheme to flog to get people to jump ahead of general sale. Such conversations happen every year up and down the country (I know, I’ve been in a couple of them) and undoubtedly at Easter Road on more than one occasions given the various combinations of sales priority we’ve had over the years.

[Andy74]

It certainly brings home that in modern football you have real football people, managers, being judged by people with some money but no football knowledge. They do think they are the most passionate football people imaginable though. The fact they’ve been passionate about 4 or 5 teams previously says they probably aren’t really.

[chrisski33]

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Agreed, he was acting like a total tool. Ego driven, wanted to announce the record crowd to the crowd. Fair enough, but as with most things in life, no need to come the ****.

Is this tool still involved with Sunderland?

It also shows how precarious football management is. Methven and the other guy clearly decided to sell Maja late in the day, not allowing time for the football operations to identify a suitable replacement. I'm sure Ross would have preferred the laddie stayed and went for nowt at the end of the season.

That kind of stuff undermines the credibility of the series for me. A very glossed over version of the reality of running a football team.

Methven has stepped down but has a share in the club still

[givescotlandfreedom]

Agree with the comments about Methven seeming a right tosser from his arrogance, giving the staff a hard time, to his patronising of the support that he didn't seem to have any respect for.
In the cup final though he was right and it's bothered me too how deep we sit at times holding a result and lose it.

[Heisenberg]

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Agree with the comments about Methven seeming a right tosser from his arrogance, giving the staff a hard time, to his patronising of the support that he didn't seem to have any respect for.
In the cup final though he was right and it's bothered me too how deep we sit at times holding a result and lose it.

I think that’s been an issue with us all season and isn’t something that started under Ross, although he didn’t manage to rectify it. The amount of points we’ve dropped from winning positions is ridiculous. Not sure what it comes down to.

I felt sorry for the two Sunderland centre halves (Flanagan and Baldwin?) as they seemed nice enough but were massively out of their depth at such a big club.

[hibbydog]

Methven can’t help being posh. It’s his background which he didn’t choose and we shouldn’t hold it against him.

But it’s the swearing, disrespecting his staff, bullying and arrogance. Totally not on and he should be thoroughly ashamed.

Stewart Donald also didn’t come across well. Asking the manager how much a player is worth, then buying him for £3m after being told not to go above £1.2m!

The pair of them suddenly become experts in football tactics when the tram is losing at half time, despite zero notable experience of playing or managing?

Very poor.

It was good tv however. If only to remind everyone how not to behave.

Humility and respect are great qualities for anyone in the workplace and life in general.

[hibsbollah]

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Methven can’t help being posh. It’s his background which he didn’t choose and we shouldn’t hold it against him.

But it’s the swearing, disrespecting his staff, bullying and arrogance. Totally not on and he should be thoroughly ashamed.

Stewart Donald also didn’t come across well. Asking the manager how much a player is worth, then buying him for £3m after being told not to go above £1.2m!

The pair of them suddenly become experts in football tactics when the tram is losing at half time, despite zero notable experience of playing or managing?

Very poor.

It was good tv however. If only to remind everyone how not to behave.

Humility and respect are great qualities for anyone in the workplace and life in general.

You could tell they were both going to be complete dicks when they appeared at the end of the last series.

I've enjoyed this series less. There is less one on one engagement with the players, which was the real eye opener last time round. It's as if they've wised up to the PR consequences of coming across like Jack Rodwell.

Also, Honeyman is their Lewis Stevenson.

[Pretty Boy]

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You could tell they were both going to be complete dicks when they appeared at the end of the last series.

I've enjoyed this series less. There is less one on one engagement with the players, which was the real eye opener last time round. It's as if they've wised up to the PR consequences of coming across like Jack Rodwell.

Also, Honeyman is their Lewis Stevenson.

Was their Lewis Stevenson.

He plays for Hull now.

[JimBHibees]

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You could tell they were both going to be complete dicks when they appeared at the end of the last series.

I've enjoyed this series less. There is less one on one engagement with the players, which was the real eye opener last time round. It's as if they've wised up to the PR consequences of coming across like Jack Rodwell.

Also, Honeyman is their Lewis Stevenson.

Agree much less engagement with players and coaches which devalues it a bit. Have probably realised the mistake of doing the show in the first place and are just seeing out the contract.

[hibbydog]

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You could tell they were both going to be complete dicks when they appeared at the end of the last series.

I've enjoyed this series less. There is less one on one engagement with the players, which was the real eye opener last time round. It's as if they've wised up to the PR consequences of coming across like Jack Rodwell.

Also, Honeyman is their Lewis Stevenson.

That’s a good shout. The first series was more focussed on the community, the players and the fans so much easier to relate to.

This one was dominated by the owners and their egos,

Plums

[JimBHibees]

Was at Sunderland for 14 years before he moved to Hull.

[CMurdoch]

They didn't have a lot of quality in their team and the loss of Maja was simply madness.
McGeady seemed to be their only other game changer and he was hampered by injury at the business end of the season.
The last of the big earners, Oviedo and Cattermole didn't seem to make much impression either.
The owner seemed a decent guy but blinked under pressure in January and blew it.

[Tomsk]

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They didn't have a lot of quality in their team and the loss of Maja was the final straw.
McGeady seemed to be the only other game changer and he was hampered by injury at the business end of their season.
The last of the big earners, Oviedo and Cattermole didn't seem to make much impression either.
The owner seemed a decent guy but blinked under pressure and blew it.

I thought that too. The Maja/Gigg situation exposed his lack of experience and understanding. He ended up making a bad situation worse and ultimately the club paid the price.

Was there a practical solution? Doubt it. The problems were systemic. With a set-up designed for the Premiership they were trying to operate on League One revenues. Methven's behaviour left a sour taste at times but he was consistently accurate in his assessments, not least when he observed that a change of culture was needed as the cheques from Ellis Short were no longer forthcoming.

Fascinating series. But still only a snapshot I imagine of everything that goes on.

[007]

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Methven can’t help being posh. It’s his background which he didn’t choose and we shouldn’t hold it against him.

But it’s the swearing, disrespecting his staff, bullying and arrogance. Totally not on and he should be thoroughly ashamed.

Stewart Donald also didn’t come across well. Asking the manager how much a player is worth, then buying him for £3m after being told not to go above £1.2m!

The pair of them suddenly become experts in football tactics when the tram is losing at half time, despite zero notable experience of playing or managing?

Very poor.

It was good tv however. If only to remind everyone how not to behave.

Humility and respect are great qualities for anyone in the workplace and life in general.

I have sympathy for Stewart Donald, they needed 2 strikers and were going to end up with none. If he hadn't got Griggs they would have been hugely criticised. He acknowledged he'd paid over the odds but was backing his manager. Imagine the outrage on here if Doidge was to leave and wasn't replaced. I get that they could have insisted Maja's sees out his contract however they could easily have ended up like Rangers with Morelos who I reckon wanted away in January but wasn't allowed to and has thrown the toys out the pram.

[Carheenlea]

Getting through the second season, and noted that we hadn’t seen a lot of the taxi driver who was good value in the first season. Had to laugh when there he was at Nigel Farage’s Brexit March to Westminster departed with a couple of hundred North East brexiteers in pissing rain!

[hibby rae]

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I have sympathy for Stewart Donald, they needed 2 strikers and were going to end up with none. If he hadn't got Griggs they would have been hugely criticised. He acknowledged he'd paid over the odds but was backing his manager. Imagine the outrage on here if Doidge was to leave and wasn't replaced. I get that they could have insisted Maja's sees out his contract however they could easily have ended up like Rangers with Morelos who I reckon wanted away in January but wasn't allowed to and has thrown the toys out the pram.

I think it's a case of appealing to the player. 'Stay with us for the rest of the season, feel free to sign a pre-season with Bordeaux now, you have our blessing. Can even chuck in a raise for the remainder of the contract if need be.'

Instead they panic and accept peanuts which is then wiped by spending three times more on a player the manager doesn't even seem arsed about having.

[Since452]

The worst thing they did was punt Jack Ross. Did a good job all things considered. A perfect example of be careful what you wish for. Ended up with Phil Parkinson and seriously doubt they'd have gone up if the season had played out normally

[hibby rae]

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Methven can’t help being posh. It’s his background which he didn’t choose and we shouldn’t hold it against him.

But it’s the swearing, disrespecting his staff, bullying and arrogance. Totally not on and he should be thoroughly ashamed.

Stewart Donald also didn’t come across well. Asking the manager how much a player is worth, then buying him for £3m after being told not to go above £1.2m!

The pair of them suddenly become experts in football tactics when the tram is losing at half time, despite zero notable experience of playing or managing?

Very poor.

It was good tv however. If only to remind everyone how not to behave.

Humility and respect are great qualities for anyone in the workplace and life in general.

I'd say his bavkground probably feeds into that behaviour. Eton, Oxford etc. Lived in a bubble his whole life, probably with a sense of entitlement. Devoid of empathy and unable to understand the challenges their staff face.

One example, they are both complaining the marketing team aren't rising to the challenge, not taking responsibility etc.

They are told they are asking them to do something they've never done before, with no support, never been given the responsibility but that doesn't seem to sink in.

[Robbo6-2]

Donald tried to fling Jack Ross under a bus a few times about Greg. He said he was jacks choice in a interview with fans

[Since452]

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Donald tried to fling Jack Ross under a bus a few times about Greg. He said he was jacks choice in a interview with fans

Yeah noticed that. The fact they *****ed 3/4 million on him when Ross said not to go higher than 1.2 was a joke. He'd probably have had Grigg and another couple in to compliment him. Not *****ed all the money they didn't even have on him. Must have infuriated Ross. And to replace a boy who was scoring for fun. Makes it even worse.

[tamig]

I haven’t watched a single episode of this yet so would you say it would be easy enough to dive straight into series two without watching the first?

[Northernhibee]

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I haven’t watched a single episode of this yet so would you say it would be easy enough to dive straight into series two without watching the first?

I just leapt into season 2 and don't feel like I've missed anything.

[tamig]

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I just leapt into season 2 and don't feel like I've missed anything.

Cheers bud. I’ll start it tonight.

[Smartie]

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I haven’t watched a single episode of this yet so would you say it would be easy enough to dive straight into series two without watching the first?

I’ve not watched all of series 2 yet but I probably enjoyed the first series better.

If I were you I’d watch series 1 first, it’s good and sets the scene for the second series.

In my opinion most of the harm at Sunderland was done prior to these 2 series / seasons. It just shows you how hard it is to turn around a struggling football club - and how mental English football is with all the money swishing around at the top.