This stupid bloody split.

***greenlex*** · 23-02-2020 01:34 PM

If the top six and bottom six stay as is it will mean Celtic have played the other five twice away and once at home. Rangers will be the opposite having played the other five twice at home and once away. In an equitable world Celtic will face them all at home and Rangers all of them away. This won’t however happen. Bollocks.

**hibbysam** · 23-02-2020 01:38 PM

Originally Posted by greenlex

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If the top six and bottom six stay as is it will mean Celtic have played the other five twice away and once at home. Rangers will be the opposite having played the other five twice at home and once away. In an equitable world Celtic will face them all at home and Rangers all of them away. This won’t however happen. Bollocks.

Forgive me for not worrying about rangers and Celtic and fairness. The split for all its flaws gives many teams plenty to play for until at worst 5 games to go and then means everyone that’s either playing for Europe/league/relegation are playing against the others in that position.

**Since452** · 23-02-2020 01:43 PM

I actually quite like the split. Keeps things interesting

***greenlex*** · 23-02-2020 01:44 PM

Originally Posted by May2116

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Forgive me for not worrying about rangers and Celtic and fairness. The split for all its flaws gives many teams plenty to play for until at worst 5 games to go and then means everyone that’s either playing for Europe/league/relegation are playing against the others in that position.

I’m not worried about them either mate. If either or both of them are getting messed around so will the rest. At least two will be going to Ibrox for a third time chasing Europe and conversely two wont have to go to Parkhead more than once over the season. It’s a pile of poo.

**Wakeyhibee** · 23-02-2020 02:02 PM

Originally Posted by greenlex

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If the top six and bottom six stay as is it will mean Celtic have played the other five twice away and once at home. Rangers will be the opposite having played the other five twice at home and once away. In an equitable world Celtic will face them all at home and Rangers all of them away. This won’t however happen. Bollocks.

Whether you're a fan of the split or not, you would have thought the organisers would have known this given the expectation of Rangers, Aberdeen, and Hibs all being likely to finish top 6 at the beginning off the campaign.

Maybe they thought Hearts + 1 other would have been there too

(dont know if that would make a difference).

It's not ideal and I'm no fan either, maybe the fixtures should be announced for the first 2 rounds of games. Then the 3rd and split done later once they see who's more likely to be there.

**JeMeSouviens** · 23-02-2020 02:15 PM

Originally Posted by greenlex

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If the top six and bottom six stay as is it will mean Celtic have played the other five twice away and once at home. Rangers will be the opposite having played the other five twice at home and once away. In an equitable world Celtic will face them all at home and Rangers all of them away. This won’t however happen. Bollocks.

Except that wouldn’t be equitable either because Celtc would have 22 home games over the season. It’s just pish.

**hibbysam** · 23-02-2020 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by Wakeyhibee

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Whether you're a fan of the split or not, you would have thought the organisers would have known this given the expectation of Rangers, Aberdeen, and Hibs all being likely to finish top 6 at the beginning off the campaign.

Maybe they thought Hearts + 1 other would have been there too

(dont know if that would make a difference).

It's not ideal and I'm no fan either, maybe the fixtures should be announced for the first 2 rounds of games. Then the 3rd and split done later once they see who's more likely to be there.

It’s all based on previous seasons league placings. Presuming if hearts and Killie had made the top 6 instead of Livingston and Motherwell that it would’ve worked out correctly.

***wookie70*** · 23-02-2020 03:04 PM

The most important thing is to get 19 home games. It doesn't matter a great deal to us if we miss an uglies fixture at home as it is only a couple of thousand extra tickets. More a difference for Livi. I'm more concerned about the 3 teams outwith the Uglies as they may be 6 pointers and I'd like 2 of them at home if we get top 6.

***Eyrie*** · 23-02-2020 04:42 PM

The correct time to have a split (if there has to be one) is after the second round of fixtures, when everyone has played each team home and away for a total of 22 games. This provides a natural time to hold the winter break.

Then the top eight clubs can play each other home and away again for a further 14 matches and a total of 36 games. Two less than at present, which means fewer midweek fixtures after the break. The final placings will determine the title and European football.

The bottom four clubs would also play a mini-league of 14 games with the top four from the Championship, with the top four clubs getting promoted for the next season. Relegation would therefore be much easier to recover from.

The Championship would need expanded to twelve teams so that its bottom eight sides would also form a mini-league.

Below that would be a national league of the remaining eighteen teams playing home and away for 34 matches.

If we wanted to be truly radical then whoever is top at the split gets a Europa League place and the points are reset at nil for the second part of the season. This could result in someone outwith the Ugly Sisters having a chance at the title so expect it to be a non-starter.

**DH1875** · 23-02-2020 04:49 PM

Not a fan of the split. 6th or 7th, it's the same to me. Rubbish.
As for Celtic.....will work in our favour this time around. We will play them at ER 3 times.

***wookie70*** · 23-02-2020 07:55 PM

Originally Posted by Eyrie

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The correct time to have a split (if there has to be one) is after the second round of fixtures, when everyone has played each team home and away for a total of 22 games. This provides a natural time to hold the winter break.

Then the top eight clubs can play each other home and away again for a further 14 matches and a total of 36 games. Two less than at present, which means fewer midweek fixtures after the break. The final placings will determine the title and European football.

The bottom four clubs would also play a mini-league of 14 games with the top four from the Championship, with the top four clubs getting promoted for the next season. Relegation would therefore be much easier to recover from.

The Championship would need expanded to twelve teams so that its bottom eight sides would also form a mini-league.

Below that would be a national league of the remaining eighteen teams playing home and away for 34 matches.

If we wanted to be truly radical then whoever is top at the split gets a Europa League place and the points are reset at nil for the second part of the season. This could result in someone outwith the Ugly Sisters having a chance at the title so expect it to be a non-starter.

I like that as an idea. Clubs could try and build knowing it is likely any relegation would likely be for just a season.

***ACLeith*** · 24-02-2020 06:16 AM

Originally Posted by Eyrie

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The correct time to have a split (if there has to be one) is after the second round of fixtures, when everyone has played each team home and away for a total of 22 games. This provides a natural time to hold the winter break.

Then the top eight clubs can play each other home and away again for a further 14 matches and a total of 36 games. Two less than at present, which means fewer midweek fixtures after the break. The final placings will determine the title and European football.

The bottom four clubs would also play a mini-league of 14 games with the top four from the Championship, with the top four clubs getting promoted for the next season. Relegation would therefore be much easier to recover from.

The Championship would need expanded to twelve teams so that its bottom eight sides would also form a mini-league.

Below that would be a national league of the remaining eighteen teams playing home and away for 34 matches.

If we wanted to be truly radical then whoever is top at the split gets a Europa League place and the points are reset at nil for the second part of the season. This could result in someone outwith the Ugly Sisters having a chance at the title so expect it to be a non-starter.

What an interesting and radical solution. Loads of common sense so no chance of SPFL considering it!

**dalkeith stu** · 24-02-2020 08:16 AM

This happens every yearbut it only becomes a problem when it affects the OF!! ***** them!!!

***Hibbyradge*** · 24-02-2020 08:38 AM

Originally Posted by ACLeith

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What an interesting and radical solution. Loads of common sense so no chance of SPFL considering it!

The SPFL could consider it until the cows came home, but there's not a chance the clubs would agree to it.

***jonny*** · 24-02-2020 09:07 AM

Originally Posted by Eyrie

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The correct time to have a split (if there has to be one) is after the second round of fixtures, when everyone has played each team home and away for a total of 22 games. This provides a natural time to hold the winter break.

Then the top eight clubs can play each other home and away again for a further 14 matches and a total of 36 games. Two less than at present, which means fewer midweek fixtures after the break. The final placings will determine the title and European football.

The bottom four clubs would also play a mini-league of 14 games with the top four from the Championship, with the top four clubs getting promoted for the next season. Relegation would therefore be much easier to recover from.

The Championship would need expanded to twelve teams so that its bottom eight sides would also form a mini-league.

Below that would be a national league of the remaining eighteen teams playing home and away for 34 matches.

If we wanted to be truly radical then whoever is top at the split gets a Europa League place and the points are reset at nil for the second part of the season. This could result in someone outwith the Ugly Sisters having a chance at the title so expect it to be a non-starter.

Some of this concept sounds pretty good but you'll then have 8 championship teams playing for relegation survival - chances are 2 go down?
That leaves a good chance about 4 teams who will be more or less safe before the split have half a season playing for practically nothing. What's the incentive to finish top of that group?
No chance of going up, no / very little chance of going down and will literally be going through the motions. Half a season is too long for that unless there was some sort of incentive for the top 2/3 of that group.

**~~The 90+2~~** · 24-02-2020 09:12 AM

The splits good. Best teams play each other looking for Europe the league etc and the ***** sides battle relegation against each other. Who cares if the fixtures inconvenience some, some of the time? We finish top six play the best sides in good games or if we miss out play the 21s apart from hearts and play a big part in relegating they ****s.

**~~The 90+2~~** · 24-02-2020 09:13 AM

Originally Posted by ACLeith

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What an interesting and radical solution. Loads of common sense so no chance of SPFL considering it!

Clubs would sell a lot less season tickets this way.

***Diclonius*** · 24-02-2020 10:06 AM

We should get 2 home and 3 away after the split - if the top six stays at it is, we've played the following:
Celtic: two home, one away
Rangers: one home, two away
Motherwell: one home, two away
Aberdeen: one home, two away
Livingston: two home, one away

Therefore we're going to have to play one of Rangers, Motherwell and Aberdeen away three times. I'll take Rangers at Ibrox as we've less chance of a win anyway and I'd be delighted not to see them a second time at ER.

***Hibbyradge*** · 24-02-2020 10:08 AM

Originally Posted by jonny

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Some of this concept sounds pretty good but you'll then have 8 championship teams playing for relegation survival - chances are 2 go down?
That leaves a good chance about 4 teams who will be more or less safe before the split have half a season playing for practically nothing. What's the incentive to finish top of that group?
No chance of going up, no / very little chance of going down and will literally be going through the motions. Half a season is too long for that unless there was some sort of incentive for the top 2/3 of that group.

Correct. Crowds for those clubs would fall, as would ST renewals.

Plus the loss of income from 1 less home game, fewer visits from the bigger teams and less TV money, would potentially bankrupt some clubs.

The split isn't perfect, but the alternatives are worse.

**hibbysam** · 24-02-2020 10:09 AM

Originally Posted by Diclonius

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We should get 2 home and 3 away after the split - if the top six stays at it is, we've played the following:
Celtic: two home, one away
Rangers: one home, two away
Motherwell: one home, two away
Aberdeen: one home, two away
Livingston: two home, one away

Therefore we're going to have to play one of Rangers, Motherwell and Aberdeen away three times. I'll take Rangers at Ibrox as we've less chance of a win anyway and I'd be delighted not to see them a second time at ER.

Think it would be rangers as they will have played everyone at home twice, so they will effectively be ‘looking’ to find 2 teams to travel to ibrox a third time, we will be one of those.

***offshorehibby*** · 24-02-2020 10:16 AM

I like the split, it keeps a bit of excitement going. There are still teams fighting to get into the top 6 with St J and Killie still with an outside chance. After the split the fight for 3 and 4 is still going on and obviously the fight 11th and 12th still going on.

**JeMeSouviens** · 24-02-2020 10:24 AM

A split after 3 rounds of fixtures is just wrong. The whole point of a league with home and away fixtures is everybody ends up having the same set of games. I can't believe it was ever proposed in the first place, let alone accepted. Then again it's Scottish football, so why wouldn't it?

***Hibbyradge*** · 24-02-2020 10:31 AM

Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

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A split after 3 rounds of fixtures is just wrong. The whole point of a league with home and away fixtures is everybody ends up having the same set of games. I can't believe it was ever proposed in the first place, let alone accepted. Then again it's Scottish football, so why wouldn't it?

Several European leagues have a split, some of which are a lot more complicated than ours.

Ireland's system is similar to ours, but they have added playoffs for the Europa place.

**JeMeSouviens** · 24-02-2020 10:38 AM

Originally Posted by Hibbyradge

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Several European leagues have a split, some of which are a lot more complicated than ours.

Ireland's system is similar to ours, but they have added playoffs for the Europa place.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_L...emier_Division

"The Premier Division consists of 10 teams. Each team plays each other four times for a total of 36 matches in the season."

**JeMeSouviens** · 24-02-2020 10:40 AM

Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_L...emier_Division

"The Premier Division consists of 10 teams. Each team plays each other four times for a total of 36 matches in the season."

Ah, you meant Northern Ireland. Daft enough to copy ours it turns out.

***Hibbyradge*** · 24-02-2020 10:44 AM

Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

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Ah, you meant Northern Ireland. Daft enough to copy ours it turns out.

Ah, yes, I did mean Norn Iron.

Have a look at the Danish system. Then have a look at Belgian version.

It'll make you fall in love with our split all over again.

**JeMeSouviens** · 24-02-2020 10:45 AM

Anyway, NI is the only one I've heard of that has an asymmetric split like ours. The Belgians, Danes and so on all have even splits where the pre and post split fixtures are home and away. The Belgian system is truly mental btw, but not systematically unfair like ours.