Rice on Gambling charges

[H18 SFR]

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https://www.csoonline.com/article/32...oull-find.html

Wow!

[hibbysam]

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Because the could have access to inside information.


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So could anyone, so they should stop gambling on football altogether?

[Pretty Boy]

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That's a dangerous place to be sending folk!

My post wasn't meant as a serious suggestion, although there is a lot of interesting things to see on the DW. I'm just pointing out that corruption in football gambling exists and some players and managers are almost certainly in on it.

Of course that requires a certain level of trust of strangers on an anonymous platform. Those claiming they have access to 'fixed matches' are probably scammers looking to exploit a naive soul who thinks they have joined some mysterious underworld (in some cases they have, they just don't realise they are the victim). Information regarding controllable incidentals in a game is also shared, that's far more likely to be legit (whilst still being an easy hunting ground for scammers).

[hibsbollah]

Hibs.net Administrator Incriminated in Distributing Dark Web Guide Scandal.

[CockneyRebel]

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If you read between the lines in the bbc report, and I dare say on the sfa website notice of complaint if its up the logical conclusion is that information relating to private transactions between an individual and a bookmaker - or bookmakers - has reached the sfa.

I think you would have to be a bit naive to believe that information has been freely offered to the sfa by the individual.

What I'm not sure of - although perhaps others are - is bookmakers responsibilities in reporting transgressions by footballers to the appropriate bodies because FIFA code of ethics is very clear on this. My suspicion is that bookmakers will report as and when they become aware of it.

If he had a few hefty wins and was sussed by the bookie as a manager then it's not a giant leap for said bookie to go crying to mamma. How do they get caught though? surely if you did this you would get a mate to put the bet on and he would get a share so he wouldn't kill the golden goose.

[CMurdoch]

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Statement by Rice and the club - https://www.hamiltonacciesfc.co.uk/c...nt-sfa-notice/

No way Brian Rice wrote that statement.
Both, I suspect, brilliantly written by the chief executive.

Hopefully Rice has self reported because the addiction was getting out of control again and this action stops him dead in his tracks and forces him back into getting treatment.

Online betting is mental, could see an addict just about being able to keep out of betting shops but no chance they can resist an online presence.

[Cataplana]

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No way Brian Rice wrote that statement.
Both, I suspect, brilliantly written by the chief executive.

Hopefully Rice has self reported because the addiction was getting out of control again and this action stops him dead in his tracks and forces him back into getting treatment.

Online betting is mental, could see an addict just about being able to keep out of betting shops but no chance they can resist an online presence.

Would it not take the same will power to avoid both?

[Hibeesmad]

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I'm sure Robbie Fowler once suspiciously hoofed the ball out for a throw in straight from kick-off (it wasn't a tactic at the time). Thereafter the bookies only accepted spreads on timed events outwith the first 2 minutes.

I'm sure I heard we used to do that during the days of Riordan and O'Connor.

[McKenzie]

If players wanted to get around the betting habit in order to make money, they have mates who will do it for them. Really not that difficult. This guy obviously has an addiction which takes balls to admit so fully deserves the football community to come around him and support him. Something 100% needs done with bookmakers advertising in football, you hear Simon Jordan on talksport preach about it but more pressure needs putting on those in charge.

[Danderhall Hibs]

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If you work in football then you shouldn’t be able to bet on football. It’s the equivalent of insider trading.


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You can work in financial services and still invest your money or buy shares. Insider dealing’s only when you know something’s going to happen and take advantage of it.

Putting a tenner on Liverpool to beat Man U while you’re the Hamilton manager isn’t the equivalent of selling your RBS shares just before the bank goes bust.

[Purple & Green]

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If he had a few hefty wins and was sussed by the bookie as a manager then it's not a giant leap for said bookie to go crying to mamma. How do they get caught though? surely if you did this you would get a mate to put the bet on and he would get a share so he wouldn't kill the golden goose.

In this case he had substantial losses.

[Purple & Green]

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You can work in financial services and still invest your money or buy shares. Insider dealing’s only when you know something’s going to happen and take advantage of it.

Putting a tenner on Liverpool to beat Man U while you’re the Hamilton manager isn’t the equivalent of selling your RBS shares just before the bank goes bust.

I agree, but my reading of the Fifa ethics is Brian Rice was explicitly prohibited from betting on any football match or activity. It’s impossible to believe he wasn’t aware of that.

[Greentinted]

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Excellent statement and really great that both the chairman and Brian Rice are doing what they can to remove the stigma of gambling addiction.

Companies who sell alcohol and tobacco are heavily restricted on who they can target in terms of advertising, where and also who they sell to and at what times. Although it's everywhere the amount of effort to ensure that these laws are adhered to ensure that although lapsing back into addiction will always be a possibility, there are public groups where people can get confidential advice and help. Crucially, if someone is drunk then it is illegal to serve them more alcohol and if you know someone is a recovering alcoholic then it is illegal to serve them as well.

Gambling companies will have every third shop in impoverished areas, filled with FOBT's and will advertise as much as possible around sports events on the TV and live too. They will fund the likes of Wayne Rooney for a second tier club. There have to be options to self exclude but having known a couple of gambling addicts this never seemed too difficult to get removed or circumvent and unlike if someone is drunk, the bookies seem to have no problem in taking thousands off someone who doesn't have thousands to waste. Putting a "When the fun stops stop" banner at the bottom of your posters is meaningless when so much effort is put into getting people to bet in the first place.

It's time that the gambling companies are restricted as much as the alcohol and tobacco companies are. It seems far more acceptable for a bookies to take money off a gambling addict than it is for a bar to serve a recovering alcoholic IMO.

FOBTs and the sheer amount of betting shops in impoverished areas would be the equivalent of opening a number of bars around an AA meeting and flyering adverts for beer for those attending. It's completely immoral.

Excellent post. Some very salient points, well said.

[The 90+2]

All the best BR. Gambling is the worst addiction ever. He’s proven he’s a good head coach/manager and I think Hamilton will stick by him.

[FilipinoHibs]

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It’s not the same as insider trading as that’s illegal. There is no law that says someone working in a certain sport can’t gamble on it. It’s only illegal if you’re fixing the outcome to win money.

But you are likely to have inside information that the general public does not have and sets a bad example to players. Takes your focus off your job and can get you down affecting how you manage. Managers and players well enough paid and don't need to gamble.

I worked in financial services and never traded shares on my account. I felt in a privileged position and privy to lots of expert opinion and insights. Felt I should focus on my job for the company and my clients and not have distractions that would take my focus away.

[hibbysam]

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But you are likely to have inside information that the general public does not have and sets a bad example to players. Takes your focus off your job and can get you down affecting how you manage. Managers and players well enough paid and don't need to gamble.

I worked in financial services and never traded shares on my account. I felt in a privileged position and privy to lots of expert opinion and insights. Felt I should focus on my job for the company and my clients and not have distractions that would take my focus away.

Easy to say they’re well enough paid and shouldn’t gamble, but a disease like that it doesn’t matter how much you earn, and in some cases it is even worse when you earn even more as you have a lot more disposable income.

[HIBERNIAN-0762]

Would be nice if Hibs fans give him a bit support from the stands tomorrow night, a good Hibee and an excellent player in his time at Easter Road 👍

[FilipinoHibs]

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Would be nice if Hibs fans give him a bit support from the stands tomorrow night, a good Hibee and an excellent player in his time at Easter Road 👍

Agree. Sympathy for his condition. Good to rid this from the game at the same time.

[Northernhibee]

The two things that need removed from the game in Scotland are gambling and cocaine. The two also go hand in hand, the feeling of invincibility combined with the ability to pish hundreds or even thousands of your money up the wall with extreme ease is a dangerous combination.

The gambling part of it is easier - remove all betting company sponsorship from the leagues, competitions and clubs. Long term there should be much tighter controls of how many businesses that are gambling companies can operate in a certain area, and although it'd never happen I'd ban online gambling full stop. Going to a bingo hall with friends and having a few drinks is a sociable thing, pissing money into your smartphone on a Tuesday night isn't.

The true effects of the cocaine epidemic haven't fully yet been realised IMO but in terms of mental health, anti-social behaviour at football games, and physical health I wouldn't be against having sniffer dogs trained for cocaine at all category A games and randomly appearing at other games. It's a destructive drug but will be far more difficult to remove from football.

[Rugy07]

I think the problem with the rule is that it's pretty much unenforceable. The vast majority of footballers outside the top divisions could walk into any bookies and have a bet with no problems. This is even more true of backroom staff. I also think the blanket ban is a massive overkill. While there is certainly the potential for some inside dealing, the chances of this happening in top matches is very small given the public information available and the salaries of the players involved. Bookies will not accept large bets on markets they know could be manipulated or which they don't know too much about. I'm not sure what the solution is, but the ban as it is at the moment, in my opinion is a complete farce.

[Northernhibee]

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I think the problem with the rule is that it's pretty much unenforceable. The vast majority of footballers outside the top divisions could walk into any bookies and have a bet with no problems. This is even more true of backroom staff. I also think the blanket ban is a massive overkill. While there is certainly the potential for some inside dealing, the chances of this happening in top matches is very small given the public information available and the salaries of the players involved. Bookies will not accept large bets on markets they know could be manipulated or which they don't know too much about. I'm not sure what the solution is, but the ban as it is at the moment, in my opinion is a complete farce.

It'd be incredibly naive to think that an ageing pro near the end of his career at a team who are at the bottom end of the table wouldn't be tempted to pocket a big payday.

[Aim Here]

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I worked in financial services and never traded shares on my account. I felt in a privileged position and privy to lots of expert opinion and insights. Felt I should focus on my job for the company and my clients and not have distractions that would take my focus away.

That's not the right argument. Arguments about insider information and abusing your privileges are arguments from the point of view of supporting the gambling industry and protecting it from the malign influence of, errr, football, and those can GTF. If folks with insider information in fitba' are able to shaft Ladbrokes or Bet365, it's not any kind of a problem - I totally approve of scamming the bookies. If they don't like it, they can find a less evil and unhealthy way of making a profit. (The evilness and healthiness or otherwise of the financial services industries is not something I'll comment on!)

The problem is when folks who have a material influence on the outcome of a football match are involved in gambling on football matches, because that ruins the integrity of fitba'.

[Northernhibee]

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That's not the right argument. Arguments about insider information and abusing your privileges are arguments from the point of view of supporting the gambling industry and protecting it from the malign influence of, errr, football, and those can GTF. If folks with insider information in fitba' are able to shaft Ladbrokes or Bet365, it's not any kind of a problem - I totally approve of scamming the bookies. If they don't like it, they can find a less evil and unhealthy way of making a profit. (The evilness and healthiness or otherwise of the financial services industries is not something I'll comment on!)

The problem is when folks who have a material influence on the outcome of a football match are involved in gambling on football matches, because that ruins the integrity of fitba'.

I mentioned it before but when that non league goalie who ate a pie on the bench because a bookies put a price of 25/1 on him doing so found himself banned and fined heavily from football, that was pathetic from the bookies. They wanted to have a laugh at his weight and he had the last word and made his mates some money in the process.

Didn't affect the outcome of the game, didn't affect anything, the bookies thought they'd take the piss out of him and he took the piss back. When they complained about it and affected his personal work with his club, they showed themselves for the ****bags they are behind all the friendly banter and funny social media videos they hide behind. The bookies are nasty pieces of work.

[Rugy07]

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I mentioned it before but when that non league goalie who ate a pie on the bench because a bookies put a price of 25/1 on him doing so found himself banned and fined heavily from football, that was pathetic from the bookies. They wanted to have a laugh at his weight and he had the last word and made his mates some money in the process.

Didn't affect the outcome of the game, didn't affect anything, the bookies thought they'd take the piss out of him and he took the piss back. When they complained about it and affected his personal work with his club, they showed themselves for the ****bags they are behind all the friendly banter and funny social media videos they hide behind. The bookies are nasty pieces of work.

The Sutton goalie thing was a disgrace. The bet was that he would eat a pie during the game. Had he not eaten a pie, Sun Bet would have won and all the fans would have lost. Whatever he did, there would be a winner and a loser yet he still lost his job. Who would have thought a company with as fine a reputation as The Sun would do something like this....

[lord bunberry]

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But you are likely to have inside information that the general public does not have and sets a bad example to players. Takes your focus off your job and can get you down affecting how you manage. Managers and players well enough paid and don't need to gamble.

I worked in financial services and never traded shares on my account. I felt in a privileged position and privy to lots of expert opinion and insights. Felt I should focus on my job for the company and my clients and not have distractions that would take my focus away.

There is absolutely nothing illegal about having inside information when putting a bet on the football or any other sport for that matter. Horse racing is a prime example of this, you constantly have trainers, owners and stable staff betting on the races.

[ancient hibee]

With gambling addicts the winning or losing doesn't matter.It's the putting the bet on that is the big thrill.

[Scouse Hibee]

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If you read between the lines in the bbc report, and I dare say on the sfa website notice of complaint if its up the logical conclusion is that information relating to private transactions between an individual and a bookmaker - or bookmakers - has reached the sfa.

I think you would have to be a bit naive to believe that information has been freely offered to the sfa by the individual.

What I'm not sure of - although perhaps others are - is bookmakers responsibilities in reporting transgressions by footballers to the appropriate bodies because FIFA code of ethics is very clear on this. My suspicion is that bookmakers will report as and when they become aware of it.

He turned himself in, the information cane from Rice himself.

[Hibbyradge]

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I think the problem with the rule is that it's pretty much unenforceable. The vast majority of footballers outside the top divisions could walk into any bookies and have a bet with no problems. This is even more true of backroom staff. I also think the blanket ban is a massive overkill. While there is certainly the potential for some inside dealing, the chances of this happening in top matches is very small given the public information available and the salaries of the players involved. Bookies will not accept large bets on markets they know could be manipulated or which they don't know too much about. I'm not sure what the solution is, but the ban as it is at the moment, in my opinion is a complete farce.

Why is it a farce?

Are footballers being denied a fundamental right? Are their lives being ruined because they can't have a £2 Super Yankee on a Saturday? No, it's quite the reverse given the well publicised problems so many footballers experience.

The rule is in place to help protect the integrity of our national game and there's nothing farcical about that objective.

[Rugy07]

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Why is it a farce?

Are footballers being denied a fundamental right? Are their lives being ruined because they can't have a £2 Super Yankee on a Saturday? No, it's quite the reverse given the well publicised problems so many footballers experience.

The rule is in place to help protect the integrity of our national game and there's nothing farcical about that objective.

I don't think the intent is a farce, I think the way it is done is a farce. It's so so easy to break without getting caught and according to the BBC today, there are 4-5 people openly gambling in every changing room in Scotland, so it is clearly not working in its current form.

[Hibbyradge]

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I don't think the intent is a farce, I think the way it is done is a farce. It's so so easy to break without getting caught and according to the BBC today, there are 4-5 people openly gambling in every changing room in Scotland, so it is clearly not working in its current form.

The farce, therefore, is that players are blatantly breaking the rules and risking their careers.

Relaxing or removing the rule certainly won't improve the integrity of football.

I'm finding it difficult to get a hold of Scottish football's rules on this, but the FA document is an interesting, and easy, read.

http://www.thefa.com/football-rules-governance/policies/