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Thread: Boris Johnston

  1. #31
    @hibs.net private member allmodcons's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    If Johnson wins, then Corbyn is largely at fault.

    I think you choose 1951 as a starting point to reinforce your argument. That seems to be a convenient vehicle for ignoring the Attlee government. Fair enough, we can ignore them.

    You claim Labour governments were supine ever since.

    Was decriminalising homosexuality supine?

    Was abolishing the death penalty supine?

    Was legalising abortion supine?

    Was creating the Open University supine?

    Was introducing the Race Relations Act, The Equal Pay Act, the Sexual Discrimination Act and the Health and Safety at Work Act supine?

    Was introducing the minimum wage supine?

    Was bringing about the Good Friday agremeent supine?

    Were SureStart, child tax credits and pension tax credits supine?

    I can throw in plenty more.

    Maybe one thing from you though - how do you define ‘supine’ because at the moment you are struggling to show you understand the word.
    I'm not sure that I agree with your first sentence.

    Corbyn was appointed leader by Labour party members, most of whom support his form of Keynesian Economics.

    The appointment of a left wing leader of the Labour Party came about for number of reasons but the main reason was because regular party members had become detached from Tony Blair's moderate Labour Party.

    The single biggest issue facing the Labour Party is that their members are predominantly well left of centre and their prospective supporters are moderates. It's a real catch 22 issue for them and something they have grappled with (unsuccessfully) for years now, culminating in the appointment of a poor ultra left wing leader.

    The rise of the right and highly likely and frightening prospect of a Johnston led majority Government has little to do with Corbyn and a lot to do with a Conservative Party ripping itself to bits over Europe culminating, sadly, in a right wing cabal taking Scotland and the wider UK into uncharted territory.


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  3. #32
    Testimonial Due Cataplana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    If Johnson wins, then Corbyn is largely at fault.

    I think you choose 1951 as a starting point to reinforce your argument. That seems to be a convenient vehicle for ignoring the Attlee government. Fair enough, we can ignore them.

    You claim Labour governments were supine ever since.

    Was decriminalising homosexuality supine?

    Was abolishing the death penalty supine?

    Was legalising abortion supine?

    Was creating the Open University supine?

    Was introducing the Race Relations Act, The Equal Pay Act, the Sexual Discrimination Act and the Health and Safety at Work Act supine?

    Was introducing the minimum wage supine?

    Was bringing about the Good Friday agremeent supine?

    Were SureStart, child tax credits and pension tax credits supine?

    I can throw in plenty more.

    Maybe one thing from you though - how do you define ‘supine’ because at the moment you are struggling to show you understand the word.
    All laudable, but failure to fundamentally alter the way in which wealth is distributed or dismantle the apparatus of professional privilege such as the monarchy, or public schools, is a failure for a socialist party.

  4. #33
    Testimonial Due Glory Lurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    ”Where to start with that.”

    How about just starting you got it massively wrong.

    And when you want come back to and argue that the more than a dozen examples I listed were supine, then we can try and establish why you think why.

    Why do you think why?

    Abortion, homosexuality, equal rights etc etc, all supine?

    Action on child poverty, pensioner poverty, low-paid work all supine?

    The minimum wage and civil partnerships and Good Friday, all supine?

    You haven’t answered how you define supine and why the policies and acts I have mentioned, plus the dozens of others I could, are far from ‘supine’.

    But like you say, where to start.......
    It's all about the flow to the right though, the trend, the direction of travel. It's accelerated since the 80s, since Labour sounded the retreat.

  5. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    Couple of more personal things that jumped out for me in the debate.

    I am sure I heard this right but at one point during the debate Corbyn seemed to refer to the Holocaust as having taken place during the 19th century. FFS!

    At a later stage, Johnson referred to McDonnell as the intellectual powerhouse in the current Labour leadership. This sound like a not-too-unsubtle reference to something that doesn’t get widely reported but seems to be generally accepted as true. Corbyn isn’t very bright. The awkward squad challenge to the centrist Labour leader candidates rotated amongst the likes of McDonnell, Abbott etc and Corbyn struck lucky in timing with Miliband’s decision to open up the party, which allowed entryists galore to come in or return, with swivel head attitudes.

    He is described on all sides as not exactly being an intellectual giant, more the opposite and actually not that intelligent or acute. It shows in his interviews, must drive Seumas Milne mad (or actually, probably not).
    You did hear it right, it was shortly after one of Johnson's many errors and misuse of words, as I recall commenting on them both.

    But are you seriously telling us that Corbyn's slip of the tongue in saying 19th century instead of 1900s and him being "not that intelligent" are the big things you took from that. No thoughts at all on Boris?

    Did you say previously that you have no political leanings and just like to see balanced debate? I may have that wrong and it might be that you just said you weren't a conservative voter.

  6. #35
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WeeRussell View Post
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    You did hear it right, it was shortly after one of Johnson's many errors and misuse of words, as I recall commenting on them both.

    But are you seriously telling us that Corbyn's slip of the tongue in saying 19th century instead of 1900s and him being "not that intelligent" are the big things you took from that. No thoughts at all on Boris?

    Did you say previously that you have no political leanings and just like to see balanced debate? I may have that wrong and it might be that you just said you weren't a conservative voter.
    No, I have said a number of times on here that I am a paid-up Labour Party member.
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  7. #36
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WeeRussell View Post
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    You did hear it right, it was shortly after one of Johnson's many errors and misuse of words, as I recall commenting on them both.

    But are you seriously telling us that Corbyn's slip of the tongue in saying 19th century instead of 1900s and him being "not that intelligent" are the big things you took from that. No thoughts at all on Boris?

    Did you say previously that you have no political leanings and just like to see balanced debate? I may have that wrong and it might be that you just said you weren't a conservative voter.
    And I didn’t say they were the ‘big things’. I made a post with the ‘big things’ then I made a second post, which you quoted saying ‘couple of more personal things’, which you decided to use.

    Get it right.
    There's only one thing better than a Hibs calendar and that's two Hibs calendars

  8. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    No, I have said a number of times on here that I am a paid-up Labour Party member.
    Ah I see - cheers.

  9. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Mibbes Aye View Post
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    And I didn’t say they were the ‘big things’. I made a post with the ‘big things’ then I made a second post, which you quoted saying ‘couple of more personal things’, which you decided to use.

    Get it right.
    You're correct actually, that was the wrong post to quote.

    Ok, now that I've got it right.

    Were none of your 'big things' about how much of a lying, stumbling buffoon Boris comes across as? I appreciate that's nothing new but if we're criticising Corbyn on this performance, I just don't see any way that Boris comes out smelling of roses. (With the exception of the blind "let's get brexit" done followers who would applaud his performance regardless - but I'm well aware you're far too intellectual and politically astute for that.)

    It may well just be that it goes without saying that Boris is what Boris is, and you're just pointing out (as a labour supporter) Corbyn's failings on the other side.

    I was just interested.

  10. #39
    @hibs.net private member Mibbes Aye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WeeRussell View Post
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    You're correct actually, that was the wrong post to quote.

    Ok, now that I've got it right.

    Were none of your 'big things' about how much of a lying, stumbling buffoon Boris comes across as? I appreciate that's nothing new but if we're criticising Corbyn on this performance, I just don't see any way that Boris comes out smelling of roses. (With the exception of the blind "let's get brexit" done followers who would applaud his performance regardless - but I'm well aware you're far too intellectual and politically astute for that.)

    It may well just be that it goes without saying that Boris is what Boris is, and you're just pointing out (as a labour supporter) Corbyn's failings on the other side.

    I was just interested.
    Yeah, something like that.
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  11. #40
    @hibs.net private member Dalianwanda's Avatar
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    How people can say corbyn is unelectable but johnston is is beyond me...

  12. #41
    Administrator matty_f's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dalianwanda View Post
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    How people can say corbyn is unelectable but johnston is is beyond me...
    100% this, it's almost inconceivable that people would decide that a proven liar, racist, sexist, you-name-it-ist is the better option.

    I'm no fan of Corbyn at all, but if it was a straight choice between the two I'd side with my morals every single time and Boris wouldn't get a look in.
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  13. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dalianwanda View Post
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    How people can say corbyn is unelectable but johnston is is beyond me...
    I heard this being discussed this past weekend; the rationale given was that, if Corbyn wins the election he'll be running the country, if Johnson wins he won't be.

  14. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Future17 View Post
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    I heard this being discussed this past weekend; the rationale given was that, if Corbyn wins the election he'll be running the country, if Johnson wins he won't be.
    If Johnson wins I'm fully expecting him to be ditched, having served his purpose, and replaced by something much worse. Redwood maybe, or at least someone far more ideologically pure than Johnson.

  15. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by lapsedhibee View Post
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    If Johnson wins I'm fully expecting him to be ditched, having served his purpose, and replaced by something much worse. Redwood maybe, or at least someone far more ideologically pure than Johnson.
    I think he'll get a majority and be gone within a year.

  16. #45
    @hibs.net private member Bostonhibby's Avatar
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    Not many more loyal Tories than Max Hastings

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  17. #46
    @hibs.net private member Hibernia&Alba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bostonhibby View Post
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    Not many more loyal Tories than Max Hastings

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    Max Hastings also said "the only people who like Boris are those who don't know him". He was Johnson's boss at the Evening Standard and says Johnson was completely untrustworthy.
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  18. #47
    @hibs.net private member Dalianwanda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Future17 View Post
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    I heard this being discussed this past weekend; the rationale given was that, if Corbyn wins the election he'll be running the country, if Johnson wins he won't be.
    Makes sense, although I’m not sure half the folk i’ve heard it from have thought about it that way.

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