Marvin Bartley on Hecky

[Since452]

When asked who was the best manager he played under - Twitter.

"To be honest, it will sound like sitting on the fence I know, I enjoyed parts of all of them! Best on the training ground for sessions and learning was Paul though and he was the least successful!"

No surprise as he is widely regarded as an excellent coach. Maybe suited to that instead of manager.

[Niffy]

Makes you wonder learning what ???

No evidence of amazing skill or knowledge on the pitch.

I mind when we ran a family pub, customers always said this lass was the best barmaid ever.
Turns out she was giving out free booze all the time.
That’s why she was the best barmaid.

So being best , but best why ???

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Hecky will in time admit he should not have given out those tequila shots.

[ian cruise]

Looking at the St Johnstone game the main failing with Heckingbottom during his time here was his tactics. Play two upfront and have a go and he'd probably have been much more successful. Unfortunately he was too afraid to lose games and it's a massive failing as a, manager if you can't get the tactics right. I don't find it hard to believe he was excellent on the training ground, there were plenty stories during his time that players liked working with them. He's probably ideal for someone as a youth academy or sporting director.

[McKenzie]

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Makes you wonder learning what ???

No evidence of amazing skill or knowledge on the pitch.

I mind when we ran a family pub, customers always said this lass was the best barmaid ever.
Turns out she was giving out free booze all the time.
That’s why she was the best barmaid.

So being best , but best why ???

It literally says it in the quote. Best for quality of training sessions and learning eg developing players. It’s not always easy when you’re trying to implement a style which is completely different to what’s went before as well as gelling a new team together.

Guy tried his best, just didn’t work out for him

[McKenzie]

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Looking at the St Johnstone game the main failing with Heckingbottom during his time here was his tactics. Play two upfront and have a go and he'd probably have been much more successful. Unfortunately he was too afraid to lose games and it's a massive failing as a, manager if you can't get the tactics right. I don't find it hard to believe he was excellent on the training ground, there were plenty stories during his time that players liked working with them. He's probably ideal for someone as a youth academy or sporting director.

Correct. He needed somewhere more experienced beside him who could guide him through games as he is clearly a very knowledgeable coach.

[gorgie greens]

bit unsure about this as I heard that they never did set pieces this season at all ,or spoken about the opposition prior to playing them and it was all about do our job and let the opposition worry about us

[Allant1981]

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bit unsure about this as I heard that they never did set pieces this season at all ,or spoken about the opposition prior to playing them and it was all about do our job and let the opposition worry about us

Bartley hasnt been here this season though so he is basing it on the back end of last season

[The Captain....]

It's strange how highly regarded Heckingbottom is by the players/ex players Usually when results are as poor players will blame the manager as the alternative is that the blame lies with them. Generalising maybe but its often a truism.

A common theme from supporters, that I agree with, is that he seemed to talk a good game but everyone struggled to see any of the things he talked about being played out on the pitch. There was some sort of disconnect between ideas and execution. I've no doubt Heckingbottom was a decent bloke who treated the players well but I find this insistence that he was a good coach hard to swallow, as the evidence of my eyes (when I didn't have my head in my hands) told me something completely different. The team set up was a mess..without the ball we were shapeless and.our formation didn't seem to accommodate our better players in their best positions. Ex and current pros I've spoken to were also pretty damning on the team set up. Maybe I'm missing something on Heckingbottom but I cant see how he was a good coach at all.






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[ian cruise]

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It's strange how highly regarded Heckingbottom is by the players/ex players Usually when results are as poor players will blame the manager as the alternative is that the blame lies with them. Generalising maybe but its often a truism.

A common theme from supporters, that I agree with, is that he seemed to talk a good game but everyone struggled to see any of the things he talked about being played out on the pitch. There was some sort of disconnect between ideas and execution. I've no doubt Heckingbottom was a decent bloke who treated the players well but I find this insistence that he was a good coach hard to swallow, as the evidence of my eyes (when I didn't have my head in my hands) told me something completely different. The team set up was a mess..without the ball we were shapeless and.our formation didn't seem to accommodate our better players in their best positions. Ex and current pros I've spoken to were also pretty damning on the team set up. Maybe I'm missing something on Heckingbottom but I cant see how he was a good coach at all.






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If the players are talking about coaching to improve skill and fitness and he's bringing new ideas and keeping it varied rather than the same old stuff they've been doing for years you can see how they'd feel they were benefiting individually. They're maybe not talking about tactical coaching and thinking about their own individual improvements.

[jacomo]

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It literally says it in the quote. Best for quality of training sessions and learning eg developing players. It’s not always easy when you’re trying to implement a style which is completely different to what’s went before as well as gelling a new team together.

Guy tried his best, just didn’t work out for him

I’m struggling to think of a single player who noticeably improved under Hecky. The players might have enjoyed going to work, but what did it produce? Certainly none of our younger players have developed under his charge.

[lucky]

Bartley seems to be in the press every week talking about Hibs. I’d be pissed off if an ex Old Firm player who was now at Hibs talked constantly about their old club. He should be concentrating on his new club instead looking backwards all the time.

[Vault Boy]

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Bartley seems to be in the press every week talking about Hibs. I’d be pissed off if an ex Old Firm player who was now at Hibs talked constantly about their old club. He should be concentrating on his new club instead looking backwards all the time.

He's been branching out and doing a lot of media work to be fair, he's gonna be talking about more than just his current club. I'm sure Livi will be fine with it so long as he keeps performing for them!

[TimeForHeroes16]

Didn't griffiths also come out and say Fenlon was the best coach he'd ever worked under and was owe a lot to him

[Brightside]

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bit unsure about this as I heard that they never did set pieces this season at all ,or spoken about the opposition prior to playing them and it was all about do our job and let the opposition worry about us

Dont think thats true at all. Ive watched them working on corners loads of times before he left. And the teams meetings prior to games after training was all about the oppo. He'd be probably the first manager ever to ignore the oppo!

[eastcoasthibby]

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Looking at the St Johnstone game the main failing with Heckingbottom during his time here was his tactics. Play two upfront and have a go and he'd probably have been much more successful. Unfortunately he was too afraid to lose games and it's a massive failing as a, manager if you can't get the tactics right. I don't find it hard to believe he was excellent on the training ground, there were plenty stories during his time that players liked working with them. He's probably ideal for someone as a youth academy or sporting director.

Also main failings was persistence in trying to shoehorn players into a team like Mallan and Vela ..who just don't give us enough of the attributes needed in a midfielder ....Mallan has a couple of attributes, that we can benefit from as a sub coming on in games, Vela needs to find a sharpness and awareness of how the game plays up here, both also need to find an extra yard of pace ! Hecky couldn't play 2 up front cos he wanted at least Mallan starting would love him to tell us all what he thought he gave us ..that outweighed what we lost with him playing !!

[Just_Jimmy]

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Bartley seems to be in the press every week talking about Hibs. I’d be pissed off if an ex Old Firm player who was now at Hibs talked constantly about their old club. He should be concentrating on his new club instead looking backwards all the time.

Old firm sells more papers or gets more clicks than Hibs.

Hibs sells more papers or gets more clicks than livvy...

That's how it works.

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[Tyler Durden]

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bit unsure about this as I heard that they never did set pieces this season at all ,or spoken about the opposition prior to playing them and it was all about do our job and let the opposition worry about us

Can’t believe that.

Our goal at Aberdeen was a move clearly from the training ground (with a bit of luck also).

[jacomo]

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Didn't griffiths also come out and say Fenlon was the best coach he'd ever worked under and was owe a lot to him

Pat was great with Leigh to be fair. Managed him brilliantly. One of his biggest achievements imo.

[ian cruise]

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I’m struggling to think of a single player who noticeably improved under Hecky. The players might have enjoyed going to work, but what did it produce? Certainly none of our younger players have developed under his charge.

I know I've made this point before, so apologies, but I think his poor tactics will have led to an improvement in skill or fitness not being noticed. Given May only had a week with the players and the performance we witnessed in Perth I'm fairly confident the training, etc was all pretty good, it was just the tactical dude if things on match day that let us down badly. Ultimately Hecky cost himself his job with his poor decision making tactically.

[ian cruise]

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Also main failings was persistence in trying to shoehorn players into a team like Mallan and Vela ..who just don't give us enough of the attributes needed in a midfielder ....Mallan has a couple of attributes, that we can benefit from as a sub coming on in games, Vela needs to find a sharpness and awareness of how the game plays up here, both also need to find an extra yard of pace ! Hecky couldn't play 2 up front cos he wanted at least Mallan starting would love him to tell us all what he thought he gave us ..that outweighed what we lost with him playing !!

Absolutely agree, I was including team set up as tactical decision making. Same issue the English national team had for years, just because you've two players who are great in the same role doesn't mean you play them both and go out with an unbalanced team.

I actually think most, if not all of his signings will come good, they've shown it in flashes while with us, the most frustrating part of his reign for me was the insistence on trying to just shoehorn players in to the team and hope a formation could be made out of it.

[patlowe]

It's a strange one as it was made clear to me by a first team player how much more tactical work was done under Hecky than under Lennon, ie an awful lot! But it clearly didn't translate into results and you have to wonder whether it might be better, under our current structure, for the first team manager to be more of a motivational figurehead with a simple footballing identity, backed up by a strategic/coaching team who concentrate on the minutiae.

The failure of Hecky doesn't necessarily mean his model is intrinsically wrong by the way, and the Lennon model (if we can call it that) was certainly creaking badly towards the end. But it's thrown into question any assumptions I'd made that having a manager with a laser-like focus on the detail is the only way forward for us.

[007]

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bit unsure about this as I heard that they never did set pieces this season at all ,or spoken about the opposition prior to playing them and it was all about do our job and let the opposition worry about us

Heard from who? A Jambo by any chance?

[FilipinoHibs]

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Looking at the St Johnstone game the main failing with Heckingbottom during his time here was his tactics. Play two upfront and have a go and he'd probably have been much more successful. Unfortunately he was too afraid to lose games and it's a massive failing as a, manager if you can't get the tactics right. I don't find it hard to believe he was excellent on the training ground, there were plenty stories during his time that players liked working with them. He's probably ideal for someone as a youth academy or sporting director.

Think there was too much detail and instruction. We played with an energetic gay abandon on Saturday. Bill Shankly once said football is a simple game made complicated by managers.

[lord bunberry]

Heckingbottom obviously was a good coach with good ideas, his problem is he didn’t bring in the right players to implement what he wanted to do. When it was obvious this was the case he stubbornly carried on with tactics that weren’t working.

[Since452]

I think he'll get a good coaching job down south. For whatever reason it's not worked as manager. Hibs and Leeds saw it very quickly and he was on the slide towards the end with Barnsley. Sure he'll realise that himself now.

[Keith_M]

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Bartley hasnt been here this season though so he is basing it on the back end of last season

Yep, and results under Hecky last season were much better than this.

W: 6, D: 4, L: 3 (league games only)


For whatever reason, it just hasn't worked out here. I'm happy he's gone but don't feel any ill will towards him.

[hibeerealist]

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Heckingbottom obviously was a good coach with good ideas, his problem is he didn’t bring in the right players to implement what he wanted to do. When it was obvious this was the case he stubbornly carried on with tactics that weren’t working.

Good post LB, agree with all of that.

[davhibby]

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bit unsure about this as I heard that they never did set pieces this season at all ,or spoken about the opposition prior to playing them and it was all about do our job and let the opposition worry about us

Set piece routines are the only thing we’ve looked good at this season so that would be surprising

[Aim Here]

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bit unsure about this as I heard that they never did set pieces this season at all ,or spoken about the opposition prior to playing them and it was all about do our job and let the opposition worry about us

I dunno about not caring about the opposition. This graphic via some Rangers twitter account suggests that we may have set up to exploit St Johnstone's weak points on Saturday

https://twitter.com/TheGersReport/st...99082128658432