Enough is Enough

[blackpoolhibs]

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Is that the same mighty St Johnstone that have won their previous two league games at Easter Road or a different one?

The very same one, i suppose things are better now then now we are getting a result against them now.

[The 90+2]

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St Johnstone have spells like the one you describe regularly. They always turn it around. They’ll get points at other venues too.

I can’t remember them losing to lower leave part timers in recent seasons and also usually quite solid against Celtic. They have been a shambles this season until they rock up to Easter Road and play our jumble sale side.

[bawheid]

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Without wanting to start an argument, St J record against us demonstrates that we have been underperforming massively and that needs to change.

We cant use their previous games as a yardstick of where we "should be".

Its been said many times before, regardless of any tweaks, our budget will be maybe 3 times that of St J, Hamilton, St Mirren - we should be blowing these teams away at home and trying to snatch what we can v Celtic / Rangers and competing fully with Hearts and Aberdeen.

That we dont even look like taking points from the crap teams tells you everything.

We are in real bother and it needs addressing - and if that means Hecky goes, then so be it. We simply cant start dropping down the league as we are not equipped for a dogfight.

Dropping down the league? The league is only three games old. It’s a waste of time even looking at the table just now because it changes dramatically with every set of fixtures. For example, if we’d held on yesterday we would have been third. As it is we’re seventh.

[bawheid]

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The very same one, i suppose things are better now then now we are getting a result against them now.

Not necessarily, but at the same time it’s not yet the end of the world.

[bawheid]

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I can’t remember them losing to lower leave part timers in recent seasons and also usually quite solid against Celtic. They have been a shambles this season until they rock up to Easter Road and play our jumble sale side.

Eh....

18/19 season.

Celtic 5-0 St Johnstone
St Johnstone 0-6 Celtic

[The 90+2]

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Dropping down the league? The league is only three games old. It’s a waste of time even looking at the table just now because it changes dramatically with every set of fixtures. For example, if we’d held on yesterday we would have been third. As it is we’re seventh.

Everyone can see how alarming it is and predictable it’s going to be. Our next here fixtures are massive now.

[The 90+2]

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Eh....

18/19 season.

Celtic 5-0 St Johnstone
St Johnstone 0-6 Celtic

The same season they made the league cup quarters not dumped out by part timers.

[bawheid]

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Everyone can see how alarming it is and predictable it’s going to be. Our next here fixtures are massive now.

As I said on another thread.

He’ll be judged by his results in the due course of time. I’ll be supporting him and the team in the meantime.

[bawheid]

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The same season they made the league cup quarters not dumped out by part timers.

The point is that they have poor spells regularly. They had one earlier this season.

[Crab apple]

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Not necessarily, but at the same time it’s not yet the end of the world.

Regardless whether this year or last year I think it’s reasonable to expect us to beat St Johnstone at home. The fact that we haven’t means questions should be asked.

[bawheid]

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Regardless whether this year or last year I think it’s reasonable to expect us to beat St Johnstone at home. The fact that we haven’t means questions should be asked.

If you look at budgets then we should generally beat St Johnstone, and finish above them. We don’t always beat them, but we generally finish above them.

[NAE NOOKIE]

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It was one and a half league cup games, Elgin and Arbroath were both good performances.

We haven't been great in the league, I agree, but we very nearly won today and have a winnable league cup quarter.

The reaction has honestly been insane on here considering what has actually happened.

Its not the results that are the real issue. Historically Hibs get a spanking at least once every 5 years or so at Ibrox or Parkhead and even decent Hibs teams have stuttered at home to teams we would hope / expect to be beating.

The issue is the manner in which we are handing the initiative to our opponents … in yesterday's game and to a lesser extent against St Mirren we either by accident or design allowed both our opponents at home in the league to take control of the game, its not a good sign and a lot of us have been over the course before with this, when you see a Hibs team playing like that it never ever has a good long term outcome.

On top of that the team is playing absolutely contrary to the way the manager said he was going to, from the beginning it was his mantra … "play a high pressing game". Well where is it? … from the very beginning that 'high press' consisted of 9 men in our own half against Celtic with a forward and midfielder trying to close down 4 defenders who passed around them easily … he continued that in every big game and it seems has now extended that to whoever we play this season.

At every opposition free kick and corner both against St Mirren and St Johnstone we left nobody up the pitch, with no out ball if you clear it you immediately get it coming back at you.

At yesterday's game it became obvious that what I thought against St Mirren was true, that we are competing, but we aren't playing any football .. where the hell is the passing movement through midfield opening up the chance for a shot from the edge of the box? Where the hell is the quick passing passage of play to spring a wide player in behind? I see very little of that.

We are slow, predictable, unimaginative and worse boring to watch … Saturday was a beautiful day and a 3pm Saturday kick off .. 15,000 + is a good crowd, but it was less than the last home game which had a similar away support and if we continue to serve up this type of game the crowds will diminish without a doubt.

Motherwell are up next and they are in decent form, followed by Killie away who aren't. If we come away from these fixtures with nowt, which looks likely on form like yesterday, and follow that up with a defeat at home to Hearts Heckingbottom will lose the support totally.

[jacomo]

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Its not the results that are the real issue. Historically Hibs get a spanking at least once every 5 years or so at Ibrox or Parkhead and even decent Hibs teams have stuttered at home to teams we would hope / expect to be beating.

The issue is the manner in which we are handing the initiative to our opponents … in yesterday's game and to a lesser extent against St Mirren we either by accident or design allowed both our opponents at home in the league to take control of the game, its not a good sign and a lot of us have been over the course before with this, when you see a Hibs team playing like that it never ever has a good long term outcome.

On top of that the team is playing absolutely contrary to the way the manager said he was going to, from the beginning it was his mantra … "play a high pressing game". Well where is it? … from the very beginning that 'high press' consisted of 9 men in our own half against Celtic with a forward and midfielder trying to close down 4 defenders who passed around them easily … he continued that in every big game and it seems has now extended that to whoever we play this season.

At every opposition free kick and corner both against St Mirren and St Johnstone we left nobody up the pitch, with no out ball if you clear it you immediately get it coming back at you.

At yesterday's game it became obvious that what I thought against St Mirren was true, that we are competing, but we aren't playing any football .. where the hell is the passing movement through midfield opening up the chance for a shot from the edge of the box? Where the hell is the quick passing passage of play to spring a wide player in behind? I see very little of that.

We are slow, predictable, unimaginative and worse boring to watch … Saturday was a beautiful day and a 3pm Saturday kick off .. 15,000 + is a good crowd, but it was less than the last home game which had a similar away support and if we continue to serve up this type of game the crowds will diminish without a doubt.

Motherwell are up next and they are in decent form, followed by Killie away who aren't. If we come away from these fixtures with nowt, which looks likely on form like yesterday, and follow that up with a defeat at home to Hearts Heckingbottom will lose the support totally.

Good rational assessment.

There were a number of times yesterday where St Johnstone passed the ball back to their defence and instead of pressing them we dropped off. In midfield we were trying to win individual battles rather than hunting in packs.

I looked at the bench, expecting to see our manager - given what he has said - giving it the full Klopp. But he just stood with his arms folded as if everything was going to plan.

[Lago]

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Unless you want to argue on semantics, I'm pretty sure its the manager who picks the team and employs the tactics needed to force a draw against the mighty St Johnstone?

I see semantics being argued on here daily not least by you.

[BILLYHIBS]

The best football I have seen at Easter Road in many a year was the second half of Neil Lennon’s second season

Now that was a high press

Ultimately ended in glorious failure but was exciting to watch

A proverbial roller coaster ride

Seems like a long time ago now and far removed from what is being served up now

[The Leith Dutch]

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The best football I have seen at Easter Road in many a year was the second half of Neil Lennon’s second season

Now that was a high press

Ultimately ended in glorious failure but was exciting to watch

A proverbial roller coaster ride

Seems like a long time ago now and far removed from what is being served up now

That was some cracking stuff to be sure.

I'm struggling to remember us ever having a good second half of the season other than that.
I recall Yogi's team having a blinding first half of the season.

I suspect if you stiched those two half seasons together you'd have the SPL trophy in the cabinet ;)

[blackpoolhibs]

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I see semantics being argued on here daily not least by you.

Ah right, so its semantics that are the reason we couldn't win yesterday.

[BILLYHIBS]

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That was some cracking stuff to be sure.

I'm struggling to remember us ever having a good second half of the season other than that.
I recall Yogi's team having a blinding first half of the season.

I suspect if you stiched those two half seasons together you'd have the SPL trophy in the cabinet ;)

I have watched HIBS for over fifty years and historically our title challenge is well and truly forgotten about come the Spring

I naively thought with Heckys high press a resurgent Flo and Scott Allan and Heckys new recruits we would see a return to those heady days but with each passing week it is looking more and more unlikely as we sit far too deep inviting more and more pressure on ourselves and players looking to the bench for answers

I have to say as a HIBS supporter I always expect to beat Celtic The Rangers Hearts and Aberdeen at home I do not think Hecky sees it that way he is far too careful which usually results in a defeat or a draw

[DH1875]

I think he's just your typical English man really. Totally underestimated us/size of the job, the league and Scottish football in general.

[Real Emerald]

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I think he's just your typical English man really. Totally underestimated us/size of the job, the league and Scottish football in general.

Yes, the difference with Stubbs and Mowbray is that they both played in Scotland and knew what the league and passions were all about.

[DH1875]

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I have watched HIBS for over fifty years and historically our title challenge is well and truly forgotten about come the Spring

I naively thought with Heckys high press a resurgent Flo and Scott Allan and Heckys new recruits we would see a return to those heady days but with each passing week it is looking more and more unlikely as we sit far too deep inviting more and more pressure on ourselves and players looking to the bench for answers

I have to say as a HIBS supporter I always expect to beat Celtic The Rangers Hearts and Aberdeen at home I do not think Hecky sees it that way he is far too careful which usually results in a defeat or a draw

IF and at this stage its still an IF he decides to try and sit in at home and try to snatch a point in these games then he really can do one.

[The Leith Dutch]

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IF and at this stage its still an IF he decides to try and sit in at home and try to snatch a point in these games then he really can do one.

With the caveat NL had to go, I felt for most of his tenure that the manager, the team and the opposition in OF games always went in feeling we could win.

[hibeerealist]

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But we are 3 games into the season. We can still finish 3rd or 4th. We've not had a flying start to the season but 4 points is hardly a disaster.

The quoted poster is not wrong. The hysteria on this place is absolutely mental. Entertaining, mind you.

No chance of 3rd or 4th playing as we are and that is probably in the minds of the many fans who are unhappy.

[Heedersnvolleys]

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Take Stubbs back tomorrow.

Silly

[ahibby]

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It’s only a 2-2 draw unluckily. People need to chill.

Agreed but the result isnt the concern its the performance that is.

[Ozyhibby]

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Its not the results that are the real issue. Historically Hibs get a spanking at least once every 5 years or so at Ibrox or Parkhead and even decent Hibs teams have stuttered at home to teams we would hope / expect to be beating.

The issue is the manner in which we are handing the initiative to our opponents … in yesterday's game and to a lesser extent against St Mirren we either by accident or design allowed both our opponents at home in the league to take control of the game, its not a good sign and a lot of us have been over the course before with this, when you see a Hibs team playing like that it never ever has a good long term outcome.

On top of that the team is playing absolutely contrary to the way the manager said he was going to, from the beginning it was his mantra … "play a high pressing game". Well where is it? … from the very beginning that 'high press' consisted of 9 men in our own half against Celtic with a forward and midfielder trying to close down 4 defenders who passed around them easily … he continued that in every big game and it seems has now extended that to whoever we play this season.

At every opposition free kick and corner both against St Mirren and St Johnstone we left nobody up the pitch, with no out ball if you clear it you immediately get it coming back at you.

At yesterday's game it became obvious that what I thought against St Mirren was true, that we are competing, but we aren't playing any football .. where the hell is the passing movement through midfield opening up the chance for a shot from the edge of the box? Where the hell is the quick passing passage of play to spring a wide player in behind? I see very little of that.

We are slow, predictable, unimaginative and worse boring to watch … Saturday was a beautiful day and a 3pm Saturday kick off .. 15,000 + is a good crowd, but it was less than the last home game which had a similar away support and if we continue to serve up this type of game the crowds will diminish without a doubt.

Motherwell are up next and they are in decent form, followed by Killie away who aren't. If we come away from these fixtures with nowt, which looks likely on form like yesterday, and follow that up with a defeat at home to Hearts Heckingbottom will lose the support totally.

100% it’s not the results. It’s the dreadful play that is going to lead to worsening results. Up til now, considering how bad we look, I would say the results have been good.


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[Speedway]

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With the caveat NL had to go, I felt for most of his tenure that the manager, the team and the opposition in OF games always went in feeling we could win.

And in most cases, the opposition was very wary of us.

[Franck Stanton]

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Silly

No it isn't.

[truehibernian]

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Not isn't.

I'd take Stubbs and Doolan back in a heartbeat

[scooby]

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Its not the results that are the real issue. Historically Hibs get a spanking at least once every 5 years or so at Ibrox or Parkhead and even decent Hibs teams have stuttered at home to teams we would hope / expect to be beating.

The issue is the manner in which we are handing the initiative to our opponents … in yesterday's game and to a lesser extent against St Mirren we either by accident or design allowed both our opponents at home in the league to take control of the game, its not a good sign and a lot of us have been over the course before with this, when you see a Hibs team playing like that it never ever has a good long term outcome.

On top of that the team is playing absolutely contrary to the way the manager said he was going to, from the beginning it was his mantra … "play a high pressing game". Well where is it? … from the very beginning that 'high press' consisted of 9 men in our own half against Celtic with a forward and midfielder trying to close down 4 defenders who passed around them easily … he continued that in every big game and it seems has now extended that to whoever we play this season.

At every opposition free kick and corner both against St Mirren and St Johnstone we left nobody up the pitch, with no out ball if you clear it you immediately get it coming back at you.

At yesterday's game it became obvious that what I thought against St Mirren was true, that we are competing, but we aren't playing any football .. where the hell is the passing movement through midfield opening up the chance for a shot from the edge of the box? Where the hell is the quick passing passage of play to spring a wide player in behind? I see very little of that.

We are slow, predictable, unimaginative and worse boring to watch … Saturday was a beautiful day and a 3pm Saturday kick off .. 15,000 + is a good crowd, but it was less than the last home game which had a similar away support and if we continue to serve up this type of game the crowds will diminish without a doubt.

Motherwell are up next and they are in decent form, followed by Killie away who aren't. If we come away from these fixtures with nowt, which looks likely on form like yesterday, and follow that up with a defeat at home to Hearts Heckingbottom will lose the support totally.

Excellent assessment of where we are, and make no mistake, we're in trouble. 👍