Well done UEFA

[WhileTheChief..]

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Make them play behind closed doors. It would only have to happen once or twice, sevco would start self policing due to the lost revenue.

That’s probably as good a way as any.

Here’s another thought though.

Where do we draw the line and who draws it?

“Oh the Hibees are gay”

”Scatchel’s a .....”

Mercer...

We could end up fighting over the singing in the stands more than watching the football.

Motherwell fans would find something offensive about songs Hamilton fans sing and so on.

I know I’m hugely in the minority here but I don’t think it’s as black and white as some people think.

[ancient hibee]

We

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Which just makes a mockery of the whole thing with regard to the merits of Strict Liability in the domestic game.

UEFA game > sectarian singing > UEFA issues sanction(s) > singing stops or club ejected (same effect)

SFA game > sectarian singing > SFA do nothing > sectarian singing continues >SFA do nothing > sectarian singing continues > SFA do nothing > sectarian singing continues > SFA do nothing > sectarian singing continues > SFA do nothing > sectarian singing continues > SFA do nothing > sectarian singing continues > SFA do nothing > sectarian singing continues > SFA do nothing > sectarian singing continues > SFA do nothing > sectarian singing continues ......(ie current situation we endure today)

Makes the case for Strict Liability in Scotland compelling.

Chances of the clubs bringing that in? Zero.

[Bostonhibby]

Can't this just be solved by BT and SKY turning the volume down when they start singing then getting the BBC to swiftly follow it up with a positive story about the "atmosphere" whilst not mentioning the legally banned hate stuff, however inconvenient?

Well played the European regulators.

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[ginger_rice]

If Rangers are serious about stopping this behaviour they could start by not having Orange 3rd strips, banning those supporters who wear King Billy scarves, having the street vendors who peddle this stuff moved on by the police, and closing the section where the Vanguard Bears congregate. And in the interests of balance Celtic should be made to do the same with the Green Brigade.

[Topographic Hibby]

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I thought Garry had stepped in to a club role at Killie recently.
Are you sure he was the delegate?

Turns out the UEFA delegate was Norwegian. Gary O’Hagan was there in a learning/trainee capacity.

http://law5-theref.blogspot.com/2019...ifying_15.html

[JimBHibees]

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From the horses mouth (well, a police inspector outside Govan Underground).

"How are we supposed to arrest 50,000 people?"

You don't you arrest 20 publicise it then arrest another 20 the next week.

[JimBHibees]

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It’s a fair point though.

I don’t even know how rangers can stop it. They can’t ban their whole fan base, can they?

The only solution that I see would be a points deduction but even that would be a nightmare to enforce.

In an ideal world, what do we want the SFA or SPFL to do about it?

Highlight that the club will be punished. The club ask the fans to desist and if they don't ban them.

[Killiehibbie]

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You don't you arrest 20 publicise it then arrest another 20 the next week.

They don't even need to wade in to the crowd. Film, identify then round them up at home early one morning.

[Bostonhibby]

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You don't you arrest 20 publicise it then arrest another 20 the next week.

Easy peasy, if they can put all that time and effort into chasing down dodgy images of exuberant hibbies, even plod Glasgow's elite find the elephant in a phone box squad should be able to whizz a camera round Ibrox and capture 40,000 or so purple faces with their eyes popping out their heads singing the banned songs.

If there was a will, there's definitely a way.

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[1875-Hibernia]

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That’s probably as good a way as any.

Here’s another thought though.

Where do we draw the line and who draws it?

“Oh the Hibees are gay”

”Scatchel’s a .....”

Mercer...

We could end up fighting over the singing in the stands more than watching the football.

Motherwell fans would find something offensive about songs Hamilton fans sing and so on.

I know I’m hugely in the minority here but I don’t think it’s as black and white as some people think.

You’ve used three very good, yet different examples. General perception though, is if it’s not the Glasgow two it’s not offensive.

I think there’s an element of jealousy from rest of league for the two clubs and that plays a part in where people become offended. Personally I’ve no issues with most songs being sung in the pubs/stands. Never liked the Skacel one though, it reeks of ignorance. I understand The Rangers songs about Fenians causing offence, but that’s more my hatred for the Orange Walk.

I wouldn’t want to see all songs stop and there lies the issue of who is offended by what and how the powers that be determine what is offensive or not for disciplinary action!

[Rumble de Thump]

Sevco launched an orange third strip last season because the people running the club wanted to make money from its bigoted supporters. The owners of Rangers and Sevco have made vast sums of money from bigotry over the years.

[NORTHERNHIBBY]

I don't think that Gerrard will have any real impact with his comments. The football is not the reason that this effluent gathers every other Saturday in Govan.

[WhileTheChief..]

Here’s a thought.

If it’s too difficult to make the singing illegal or policing it, make it illegal to broadcast it.

Sky and the Beeb etc would either have to use loads of bleeps and explain why to their viewers and listeners or they’d very quickly be telling the clubs to sort it out.

They bleep out offensive song lyrics no problem so it could easily be done.

[JimBHibees]

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Easy peasy, if they can put all that time and effort into chasing down dodgy images of exuberant hibbies, even plod Glasgow's elite find the elephant in a phone box squad should be able to whizz a camera round Ibrox and capture 40,000 or so purple faces with their eyes popping out their heads singing the banned songs.

If there was a will, there's definitely a way.

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Can remember the same day the Hibs fan got done for racist comment caught on tv at end of Derby game just after xmas. Same day end of the old firm game there was a similar close up of a rangers fan clearly mouthing an obviously sectarian song, nothing at all said. Contrast between the two incidents was frightening.

[Sir David Gray]

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Here’s a thought.

If it’s too difficult to make the singing illegal or policing it, make it illegal to broadcast it.

Sky and the Beeb etc would either have to use loads of bleeps and explain why to their viewers and listeners or they’d very quickly be telling the clubs to sort it out.

They bleep out offensive song lyrics no problem so it could easily be done.

I've said for years that every time there's a dodgy song sung, the commentators should be saying "I'm sorry but due to the unacceptable conduct of the supporters, we're having to temporarily suspend the broadcasting of this match." Then they should go back to the studio or an advert break until it stops.

The TV companies would soon get fed up with that.

The commentators regularly apologise when bad language can be heard over the microphones but there's complete silence when sectarian songs are sung.

[tonyrougier123]

If they qualify for the group stages hopefully they will be playing in front of more referees than supporters.
Its high time somebody done something about that nonsense they spout.

[jakedance]

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Sevco launched an orange third strip last season because the people running the club wanted to make money from its bigoted supporters. The owners of Rangers and Sevco have made vast sums of money from bigotry over the years.

Don’t forget the third kit with a sash the same year. They weren’t even subtle about.

What this thread proves is that there are loads of things Rangers, the SFA, the broadcasters and the authorities could do about bigotry but none of them want to do it.

[Lancs Harp]

Have they blamed us yet?

[neil7908]

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You’ve used three very good, yet different examples. General perception though, is if it’s not the Glasgow two it’s not offensive.

I think there’s an element of jealousy from rest of league for the two clubs and that plays a part in where people become offended. Personally I’ve no issues with most songs being sung in the pubs/stands. Never liked the Skacel one though, it reeks of ignorance. I understand The Rangers songs about Fenians causing offence, but that’s more my hatred for the Orange Walk.

I wouldn’t want to see all songs stop and there lies the issue of who is offended by what and how the powers that be determine what is offensive or not for disciplinary action!

It's pretty simple for me. Offense doesn't come into it. There are laws covering racism, homophobia etc that are prosecuted every day in the courts. Why should being in an football stadium invalidate these? There is no law against calling someone an f***ing idiot. Bit throw in a racial slur and you have a problem. Outside a stadium police, courts and employers deal with this all the time - why can't these laws be enforced at Ibrox, Celtic Park or Easter Road?

And for what it's worth any Hibs fan singing the Skacel song should be nowhere near Easter Road.

[monktonharp]

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BREAKING NEWS

@RangersFC chairman Dave King:

“Rangers has players & supporters from many religions, cultures and backgrounds, but we are one and the same when we gather to support our club. If any supporter can not accept that then Rangers is not the club for them.”

wow, suddenly they went multicultural. when did this officially happen?

[monktonharp]

maybe he should have inserted, as long as yer no a Cafflik! .

[monktonharp]

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That’s probably as good a way as any.

Here’s another thought though.

Where do we draw the line and who draws it?

“Oh the Hibees are gay”

”Scatchel’s a .....”

Mercer...

We could end up fighting over the singing in the stands more than watching the football.

Motherwell fans would find something offensive about songs Hamilton fans sing and so on.

I know I’m hugely in the minority here but I don’t think it’s as black and white as some people think.

there's always a grey area

[monktonharp]

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Here’s a thought.

If it’s too difficult to make the singing illegal or policing it, make it illegal to broadcast it.

Sky and the Beeb etc would either have to use loads of bleeps and explain why to their viewers and listeners or they’d very quickly be telling the clubs to sort it out.

They bleep out offensive song lyrics no problem so it could easily be done.

the bbc in particular have bee using a system for years by diffusing the volume when naughty songs are sung during their broadcasts. get wi the programme man, it's been going on for many years

[One Day In Time]

Good for UEFA. Not often I’ll say that. Puts the SFA to shame. Scotland’s shame along with the other butt cheeks.

Hope the knuckle draggers keep doing what they do

[FilipinoHibs]

Good to see UEFA lumping sectarianism in with racism. Preseeure in SFA to act. Not just Ibrix but Tynecastle.

[monktonharp]

we have all waited with baited breath, for the eventual action(s) from the authourities regarding racial and religious bigoted songs in Scottish /euro games. this looks like a start. next,, the Scottish government and police Scotland need to do more. imho, lower the amount of visiting fans from clubs that are known to perputate these offences. put them into areas that can be monitored properly and measured as to what they are actually doing. we all know what they are singing, so reduce the numbers gradually and call them to account by arresting the main culprits or at least reduce their chance of not being spotted

[One Day In Time]

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we have all waited with baited breath, for the eventual action(s) from the authourities regarding racial and religious bigoted songs in Scottish /euro games. this looks like a start. next,, the Scottish government and police Scotland need to do more. imho, lower the amount of visiting fans from clubs that are known to perputate these offences. put them into areas that can be monitored properly and measured as to what they are actually doing. we all know what they are singing, so reduce the numbers gradually and call them to account by arresting the main culprits or at least reduce their chance of not being spotted

Couldn’t agree more. Clubs need to cut their allocations to the bare minimum. I think we all probably know folks who won’t go to the game when the Uglies are in town

[madhibby70]

The Scottish FA and Scottish Professional Football League have declined to comment.

[CMurdoch]

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A car crash of lunatics, conspiracy theorists and unreconstructed bigots. They live in a bubble, like Donald Trump supporters: UEFA are pushing fake news and are anti-Protestant. A madhouse.

I should add, kudos to the minority who trying to knock some sense into the nutters. It's a hopeless task, but well done for trying.

If you go onto the Rangers twitter account you will find quite a few decent Rangers supporters getting fired into the bigots.
You can feel their utter utter frustration but the bigots just can't or won't accept it and chime back with abuse or whataboutary

The great thing about UEFA is that the European tournaments that all clubs aspire to are theirs so no bull **** and appeals etc holds any sway. Just their way or the highway. The bigots and thicko's are struggling with this big time, slavering about appeals and conspiracy.

P.S. The twitter arguments above reminded me of flag debates on here.

[NASAHIBS]

UEFA have grown a pair of balls, while the SPL and SFA have had the chance and not dealt with it for years. Honestly how this leads to something major🤣🤣