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  1. #31
    @hibs.net private member Fife-Hibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    When I left the Labour party I had so many people telling me how Corbyn was a proper leader, working towards remaining and literally couldn't see anything wrong with him. An opposition leader who neither opposes or leads, yet some still see him as beyond criticism.

    Bizarre.
    Some Hibs fans think Hibs are beyond criticism. Those who generally invest the most time and energy into supporting their side/cause don't want to believe that it's flawed in any kind of way.

    When you put so much into something, the last thing you want to hear about it is criticism.


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  3. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Fife-Hibee View Post
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    Some Hibs fans think Hibs are beyond criticism. Those who generally invest the most time and energy into supporting their side/cause don't want to believe that it's flawed in any kind of way.

    When you put so much into something, the last thing you want to hear about it is criticism.
    Then those people are fools who are destined to fail.

    Very few successful ventures succeed with their 1st attempt. It's learning from mistakes, taking criticism on board and adapting accordingly that drives future success.

  4. #33
    3pts away from home - i'm a happy glory hunter. jonty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pretty Boy View Post
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    Then those people are fools who are destined to fail.

    Very few successful ventures succeed with their 1st attempt. It's learning from mistakes, taking criticism on board and adapting accordingly that drives future success.
    When are we re-branding the Holy Ground and punting half the posters?

  5. #34
    @hibs.net private member Hibbyradge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonty View Post
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    That's why i said hibs fans . we are, after all, one big happy family.
    Calling them out on a dedicated thread is below HRs usual standard.


    The rest are just cannon fodder.
    I thought it was a good article because it described exactly the frustration many of us feel when faced with unreasonable rantings of people who are supposed to have the same goal in mind.

    I thought that was a subject worth discussing and I called no-one out. If people recognise themselves in his article, that's for them to rationalise. If some people recognise others, then that tells you something too.

    I was originally going to title the thread "Remind you of anyone", but I decided that was too clickbaity so I deliberately explained it more fully by adding the author's description.

    The description he gives isn't even insulting and compared to some of the vitriol posted on this forum, it's almost a compliment!

    I've often found myself almost turning against independence because of the unreasonable attitudes and antagonism I've read on social media. Fortunately, I've always been able to calm down but I'm certain that other folk have been put off altogether.

    They're destructive and dangerous to a cause I hold very dearly.

    If that's not a Holy Ground issue, I don't know what is.
    Last edited by Hibbyradge; 20-08-2019 at 03:25 PM.

  6. #35
    @hibs.net private member Fife-Hibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pretty Boy View Post
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    Then those people are fools who are destined to fail.

    Very few successful ventures succeed with their 1st attempt. It's learning from mistakes, taking criticism on board and adapting accordingly that drives future success.
    They may well be fools. But their protectionism is perfectly natural. If somebody criticized your kids, you'd be set to give them a bloody nose for doing so. We're naturally wired to protect the things we invest in most.

  7. #36
    @hibs.net private member Hibbyradge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonty View Post
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    Of course, if its not then great. your previous low holds (whatever that was) for the moment
    Yes, I was meaning to ask you about that ..
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  8. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by jonty View Post
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    When are we re-branding the Holy Ground and punting half the posters?
    I'd have to punt myself if I expressed my opinion on what should happen to the Holy Ground publicly.
    PM Awards General Poster of The Year 2015, 2016, 2017. Probably robbed in other years

  9. #38
    @hibs.net private member ronaldo7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pretty Boy View Post
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    I'd have to punt myself if I expressed my opinion on what should happen to the Holy Ground publicly.
    It's never stopped you in the past. Why so shy?


    SCOTLAND CAN.

  10. #39
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pretty Boy View Post
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    I'd have to punt myself if I expressed my opinion on what should happen to the Holy Ground publicly.
    Have you considered ignoring yourself? Apparently that would work a treat too


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  11. #40
    3pts away from home - i'm a happy glory hunter. jonty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pretty Boy View Post
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    I'd have to punt myself if I expressed my opinion on what should happen to the Holy Ground publicly.
    Time for a pint.....

  12. #41
    @hibs.net private member ronaldo7's Avatar
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    His piece is a dig at AUOB, whom he fell out with a while ago. Some things in the article ring true, and some could be directed at the Unionist zoom bots currently trolling both him and others from the Indy movement.

    His dig at AUOB is probably due to the success they're getting with the open and inclusive marches happening throughout Scotland at the moment, and he's feeling excluded.

    Next one in Perth on September 7th, but the BIG ONE in Auld Reekie on Saturday October 5th.


    SCOTLAND CAN.

  13. #42
    @hibs.net private member Fife-Hibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ronaldo7 View Post
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    His piece is a dig at AUOB, whom he fell out with a while ago. Some things in the article ring true, and some could be directed at the Unionist zoom bots currently trolling both him and others from the Indy movement.

    His dig at AUOB is probably due to the success they're getting with the open and inclusive marches happening throughout Scotland at the moment, and he's feeling excluded.

    Next one in Perth on September 7th, but the BIG ONE in Auld Reekie on Saturday October 5th.
    Must admit, i've never actually been to any of the marches. May decide to go along to the one in October just for the experience of it. Should be quite an atmosphere.

  14. #43
    @hibs.net private member Diclonius's Avatar
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    I thought zoomers were people from Gen Z?

  15. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Fife-Hibee View Post
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    Must admit, i've never actually been to any of the marches. May decide to go along to the one in October just for the experience of it. Should be quite an atmosphere.
    Make sure and ask where your money is going if you pop any in the collection bucket.

    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/s...under-18788456

  16. #45
    First Team Regular Cataplana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by James310 View Post
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    Make sure and ask where your money is going if you pop any in the collection bucket.

    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/s...under-18788456
    The Daily Record has never asked where money in collection buckets goes before. Pity, it could have saved a few lives back in the day.

  17. #46
    @hibs.net private member Fife-Hibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by James310 View Post
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    Make sure and ask where your money is going if you pop any in the collection bucket.

    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/s...under-18788456
    Make sure to ask where our money is going when Scotland pops another £30bn into the rUK collection bucket.

  18. #47
    ADMIN marinello59's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by James310 View Post
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    Make sure and ask where your money is going if you pop any in the collection bucket.

    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/s...under-18788456
    The money from the March at Aberdeen on Saturday was signalled up in advance as going to local food banks so Iíd say give generously.
    Every gimmick hungry yob,
    Digging gold from rock and roll
    Grabs the mic to tell us,
    He'll die before he's sold.

  19. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by marinello59 View Post
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    The money from the March at Aberdeen on Saturday was signalled up in advance as going to local food banks so Iíd say give generously.
    Well that's why I said ask where your money was going. Glad to see they have changed their policy.

  20. #49
    @hibs.net private member allmodcons's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibbyradge View Post
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    I thought it was a good article because it described exactly the frustration many of us feel when faced with unreasonable rantings of people who are supposed to have the same goal in mind.

    I thought that was a subject worth discussing and I called no-one out. If people recognise themselves in his article, that's for them to rationalise. If some people recognise others, then that tells you something too.

    I was originally going to title the thread "Remind you of anyone", but I decided that was too clickbaity so I deliberately explained it more fully by adding the author's description.

    The description he gives isn't even insulting and compared to some of the vitriol posted on this forum, it's almost a compliment!

    I've often found myself almost turning against independence because of the unreasonable attitudes and antagonism I've read on social media. Fortunately, I've always been able to calm down but I'm certain that other folk have been put off altogether.

    They're destructive and dangerous to a cause I hold very dearly.

    If that's not a Holy Ground issue, I don't know what is.
    I think it's a really poor article by someone with a grievance of his own.

    As has been said on here many times before there are extremists on both sides of the debate. Call them "zoomers" if you like. I've always found that the best way to deal with extremists who are Yes supporters is to challenge them.

    I have to say I was surprised as to why an Independence supporter would write an article decrying Yes "zoomers" with little or no reference to No "zoomers".

    For me this just reinforces my first sentence (i.e. - the writer has a personal grievance).

  21. #50
    @hibs.net private member lord bunberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by allmodcons View Post
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    I think it's a really poor article by someone with a grievance of his own.

    As has been said on here many times before there are extremists on both sides of the debate. Call them "zoomers" if you like. I've always found that the best way to deal with extremists who are Yes supporters is to challenge them.

    I have to say I was surprised as to why an Independence supporter would write an article decrying Yes "zoomers" with little or no reference to No "zoomers".

    For me this just reinforces my first sentence (i.e. - the writer has a personal grievance).
    Itís not like itís the first time heís come out with this sort of thing. I donít believe heís a supporter of independence.

    United we stand here....

  22. #51
    @hibs.net private member Hibbyradge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by allmodcons View Post
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    I think it's a really poor article by someone with a grievance of his own.

    As has been said on here many times before there are extremists on both sides of the debate. Call them "zoomers" if you like. I've always found that the best way to deal with extremists who are Yes supporters is to challenge them.

    I have to say I was surprised as to why an Independence supporter would write an article decrying Yes "zoomers" with little or no reference to No "zoomers".

    For me this just reinforces my first sentence (i.e. - the writer has a personal grievance).
    The point he's making is that the aggression and antagonism from some in the Yes camp are putting people's backs up. People who's votes we hope to win.

    That's an issue for the pro-indy movement.

    The No camp can be as zoomy as they want. Their behaviour is of no concern because the more potential No voters they piss off the better.
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  23. #52
    @hibs.net private member lord bunberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibbyradge View Post
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    The point he's making is that the aggression and antagonism from some in the Yes camp are putting people's backs up. People who's votes we hope to win.

    That's an issue for the pro-indy movement.

    The No camp can be as zoomy as they want. Their behaviour is of no concern because the more potential No voters they piss off the better.
    He greatly exaggerates things though in an attempt to convince no voters that read his unionist newspaper that all yes voters are as he calls us zoomers.

    United we stand here....

  24. #53
    @hibs.net private member Hibbyradge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lord bunberry View Post
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    He greatly exaggerates things though in an attempt to convince no voters that read his unionist newspaper that all yes voters are as he calls us zoomers.
    That's not what I got from it at all.

    I don't know who he is, so I've no preconceived ideas about him and I've certainly no axe to grind, but what he says echoes with my own experience.

    He doesn't tar all yes voters with the same brush or else I'd be annoyed. He clearly talks about a minority.

    Regarding the previous comments, he actually does discuss "No zoomers" even though they're not the subject under discussion.

    "When you tell them that online Unionist trolls are just as bad, they simply donít believe you. The experience of Yes supporters may be one of Unionist abuse and bullying, but if youíre a Unionist your experience will be one of bullying and abuse from nationalists. Thatís how social media bubbles work.

    The bottom line is that soft No voters, who hold the balance of power in any future referendum, are being deterred from shifting their position because of the nastiness of a vocal minority in the Yes movement."

  25. #54
    @hibs.net private member lord bunberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibbyradge View Post
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    That's not what I got from it at all.

    I don't know who he is, so I've no preconceived ideas about him and I've certainly no axe to grind, but what he says echoes with my own experience.

    He doesn't tar all yes voters with the same brush or else I'd be annoyed. He clearly talks about a minority.

    Regarding the previous comments, he actually does discuss "No zoomers" even though they're not the subject under discussion.

    "When you tell them that online Unionist trolls are just as bad, they simply donít believe you. The experience of Yes supporters may be one of Unionist abuse and bullying, but if youíre a Unionist your experience will be one of bullying and abuse from nationalists. Thatís how social media bubbles work.

    The bottom line is that soft No voters, who hold the balance of power in any future referendum, are being deterred from shifting their position because of the nastiness of a vocal minority in the Yes movement."
    As I said in my first response to this article it makes a lot of points that will ring true with many people on both sides of the debate, but when I saw who had written it i knew right away what the content would be. The guy has a long history of saying he supports independence, but constantly writes articles and posts things on Twitter criticising the yes movement. His articles are designed to appeal to his readership which is predominantly on the unionist side along with the paper he writes for.

    United we stand here....

  26. #55
    @hibs.net private member allmodcons's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibbyradge View Post
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    The point he's making is that the aggression and antagonism from some in the Yes camp are putting people's backs up. People who's votes we hope to win.

    That's an issue for the pro-indy movement.

    The No camp can be as zoomy as they want. Their behaviour is of no concern because the more potential No voters they piss off the better.
    He's over egging the pudding. There isn't much anybody can do about these people other than challenge them and explain to soft no voters that they are a vocal minority who do not represent the wider Yes community.

  27. #56
    @hibs.net private member Hibbyradge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lord bunberry View Post
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    As I said in my first response to this article it makes a lot of points that will ring true with many people on both sides of the debate, but when I saw who had written it i knew right away what the content would be. The guy has a long history of saying he supports independence, but constantly writes articles and posts things on Twitter criticising the yes movement. His articles are designed to appeal to his readership which is predominantly on the unionist side along with the paper he writes for.
    As I said, I've not encountered him before so I have no idea what his motivations might or might not be.

    The question is that if Jimmy Ordinary had written the article, maybe in the Herald, would you have been able to agree with it?

    It certainly rings loud bells with me and it seems, several others on this thread.
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  28. #57
    @hibs.net private member lord bunberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibbyradge View Post
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    As I said, I've not encountered him before so I have no idea what his motivations might or might not be.

    The question is that if Jimmy Ordinary had written the article, maybe in the Herald, would you have been able to agree with it?

    It certainly rings loud bells with me and it seems, several others on this thread.
    I already gave my analysis of the article earlier in the thread and Iíve said numerous times since that what he says has some merit, but my problem with the article is the person writing it. If you had encountered this guy before you would also take everything he says with a huge pinch of salt. You have a so called independence supporter writing for a unionist paper. He knows which side his bread is buttered and anything positive he has to say about independence (which is very little) has to be countered by numerous accusations of independence supporters being total zoomers. The spat with the journalist that said it was wee jimmy krankie appearing at the event was a classic example. People rightly called her out for it as itís a jibe used by unionist trolls to insult Nicola Sturgeon. Nicola stepped in to defuse the situation as any decent politician would. thereís no doubt in my mind that the bbc journalist knew exactly what she was doing. Maybe it was a joke, but it completely backfired. The reaction was predictable, but from what I saw not in any way abusive.

    United we stand here....

  29. #58
    Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaargh.


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