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  1. #721
    @hibs.net private member McD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    I disagree, all he has to do is follow the rules.

    just remove the ability of the teams to directly contact him

    in the event of an incident, he/his team simply publish publicly an email/communication as to what judgement was made and why


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  3. #722
    @hibs.net private member lord bunberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    I think the only thing they can do is take the race result from lap 57 as lap 58 didnít follow racing regulations and as much as I think heís dangerous, Iíd truly feel for Max. Lewis too.

    Itís hugely damaging to the sport, either way. I donít know how they retain trust or credibility from that.

    My beef isnít with Max here as other than the incident at the start of the race he did nothing wrong, itís with the sport in general. Nobody wins from this, irrelevant of how it pans out.
    What did he do wrong in the incident at the start of the race? On your last point of course someone wins, a world champion is declared and will enter the history books.

    United we stand here....

  4. #723
    That was probably the most exciting end to a season I can remember. In the end the best man won, the sport needed a new champion and its good to see Honda putting out a championship winning engine again.

  5. #724
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    Max is champion...for now lol

  6. #725
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    Quote Originally Posted by lord bunberry View Post
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    What did he do wrong in the incident at the start of the race? On your last point of course someone wins, a world champion is declared and will enter the history books.
    I think weíll leave it there as thereís no talking sense with you.


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  7. #726
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    In future id like them to follow NASCAR in that they'll try finish race under green by adding 3 laps, green, white chequer they call it...

  8. #727
    @hibs.net private member lord bunberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    I think weíll leave it there as thereís no talking sense with you.
    So anyone who disagrees with you isnít talking sense. You are incredibly childish, throwing your toys out the pram when the result didnít go the way you wanted it to. Enjoy the touring cars next season.

    United we stand here....

  9. #728
    @hibs.net private member Radium's Avatar
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    From the stewards determination.

    Masi changed how the restart was done and as mentioned above now has the ignominy that he tried to avoid.

    Neither team or driver has done anything wrong but Masi and his team have opened the sport to ridicule. Not because Max won, but by making last second changes to the restart that he did, he made that the only likely outcome.

    I must admit that I feel a bit cheated but not by RB, Max or any of the drivers but by a sense that it was just too stage managed. Will Liberty be able to squeeze a bit more money out of sponsors for the revenge title series next year?


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  10. #729
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    Quote Originally Posted by lord bunberry View Post
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    What did he do wrong in the incident at the start of the race? On your last point of course someone wins, a world champion is declared and will enter the history books.
    Wondered the same thing regarding the incident at the start,struggling to see what MV done wrong

  11. #730
    @hibs.net private member Radium's Avatar
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    Mercedes have submitted their intention to appeal.


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  12. #731
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radium View Post
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    Mercedes have submitted their intention to appeal.


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    Mercedes have gone from undignified to desperate, practically a laughing stock.
    ​#PERSEVERED


  13. #732
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibs Class View Post
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    Mercedes have gone from undignified to desperate, practically a laughing stock.
    Hardly.

    The Stewards themselves has stated that the rules were Ďnot applied fullyíÖitís the Ďwell what do you do about thatí? question that they then answer as being not to revert to the lap before positions.

    Merc have been done over by Masi not applying the rules correctlyÖthat much is clear.

    Quite what should be done about that is not clear and therefore the Stewards have decided that shortening the race to discount Masiís blunder was not appropriate but Iím sure Merc will be asking the question again!

    Masi has to go after this disaster and the other rather questionable decisions this season (the Spa debacle being another one where he seemed all to happy to have a whole race behind a safety car!)

  14. #733
    Quote Originally Posted by Radium View Post
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    From the stewards determination.

    Masi changed how the restart was done and as mentioned above now has the ignominy that he tried to avoid.

    Neither team or driver has done anything wrong but Masi and his team have opened the sport to ridicule. Not because Max won, but by making last second changes to the restart that he did, he made that the only likely outcome.

    I must admit that I feel a bit cheated but not by RB, Max or any of the drivers but by a sense that it was just too stage managed. Will Liberty be able to squeeze a bit more money out of sponsors for the revenge title series next year?


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    Bang on the money there mate.

  15. #734
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibs Class View Post
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    Mercedes have gone from undignified to desperate, practically a laughing stock.
    The Race Director manipulated the rules to an unprecedented degree to generate a last race sprint.

    He had at least two options to avoid this situation: red flag the race or donít let any cars pass. He did neither and blew it.

    If it was the other way around RB would be doing the same and I wouldnít blame them.

    I agree that it is totally undignified but the application of the two rule books have always courted challenge from all teams


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  16. #735
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    Quote Originally Posted by JXM73 View Post
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    In future id like them to follow NASCAR in that they'll try finish race under green by adding 3 laps, green, white chequer they call it...
    They'd all run out of fuel!

    I know you'll come back and say they should put more fuel in but they're restricted in the amount of fuel they are allowed and already some cars, like Ferrari, struggle to make it to the end of some races.
    Space to let

  17. #736
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    Quote Originally Posted by RyeSloan View Post
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    Hardly.

    The Stewards themselves has stated that the rules were Ďnot applied fullyíÖitís the Ďwell what do you do about thatí? question that they then answer as being not to revert to the lap before positions.

    Merc have been done over by Masi not applying the rules correctlyÖthat much is clear.

    Quite what should be done about that is not clear and therefore the Stewards have decided that shortening the race to discount Masiís blunder was not appropriate but Iím sure Merc will be asking the question again!

    Masi has to go after this disaster and the other rather questionable decisions this season (the Spa debacle being another one where he seemed all to happy to have a whole race behind a safety car!)
    The stewards explained that Article 48.13 overrides the possibility that the earlier rule MAY have not been applied fully. My reading is that because of that override the need to rule on 48.12 became moot, so I disagree with your first point.
    ​#PERSEVERED


  18. #737
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
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    They'd all run out of fuel!

    I know you'll come back and say they should put more fuel in but they're restricted in the amount of fuel they are allowed and already some cars, like Ferrari, struggle to make it to the end of some races.
    forgot they run the cars almost empty..but again is that not the risk you have to take, will tyres last longer etc. Something has to be better than making it up as you go?

  19. #738
    @hibs.net private member Radium's Avatar
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    Hadnít considered this. He did seem to be delighted to be on the podium and is probably happy not to be part of the mess


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  20. #739
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
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    They'd all run out of fuel!

    I know you'll come back and say they should put more fuel in but they're restricted in the amount of fuel they are allowed and already some cars, like Ferrari, struggle to make it to the end of some races.
    Bring back refuling

  21. #740
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    Embarrassing. Just like being in Glasgow when the Race Director/referee has the final say in how the rules are interpreted. Porto being sent off for sneezing in the box and giving away penalties for smiling at people

  22. #741
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    Not really a fan of Formula 1 now (it always seems to be more about technology and strategy more than driving ability) or Lewis Hamilton. I can understand wanting to give the race director discretion but there was no fair way of him exercising this given the different strategies adopted by the drivers. Accordingly, you need hard and fast rules so the teams know what will happen.

    It also doesn't seem sporting to be able to nip in for new tyres when your opponent can't do it because the race might not even continue. It definitely wasn't a level playing field which is what apart should be about - but I guess Formula 1 is anything but a level playing field.

    Have to say I admire Lewis H a lot more for the way he handled everything.

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  23. #742
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibs Class View Post
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    The stewards explained that Article 48.13 overrides the possibility that the earlier rule MAY have not been applied fully. My reading is that because of that override the need to rule on 48.12 became moot, so I disagree with your first point.
    It wasnít applied fullyÖanybody can see that. Itís crystal clear on the fact that the safety car needed to do another lap.

    They decided that the Race Director has control of the safety car..that is also true.

    But surely he needs to exercise that control within the rules?

    Suppose this season was always going to end in controversy!

  24. #743
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radium View Post
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    Hadnít considered this. He did seem to be delighted to be on the podium and is probably happy not to be part of the mess


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    Yeah donít think he will be too bothered but it does show that the decision was a poor one in that it only benefited one driver!

  25. #744
    @hibs.net private member Radium's Avatar
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    Mercedes have withdrawn their appeal with the FIA announcing a full review of the last 5 laps of the race.

    This from the FIA



    Probably as dignified a solution as could have been achieved


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  26. #745
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/59691827


    Verstappen said: "I can understand the first few days after a race like that you're not happy.


    "But you should also understand this is racing and these things can happen."


    "I don't feel sorry [for him] but I can understand that it can be very painful but at the end of the day," he said. "He also won a championship like that."

    Max Verstappen doesn't do emotional intelligence or reading a room. Gone to feeling sorry for him as to how this has gone down to completely not.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  27. #746
    @hibs.net private member Jack's Avatar
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    Lewis Hamilton: Mercedes driver to decide on F1 future after Abu Dhabi inquiry

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/59951382
    Space to let

  28. #747
    Would be very surprised if he walked away.

  29. #748
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    Quote Originally Posted by patch1875 View Post
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    Would be very surprised if he walked away.
    He wonít, heís trying to pressure the inquiry into finding that he was cheated out of the world championship. Like all F1 drivers he needs excuses for things not going his way. The verdict wonít change anything, it will be designed to keep everyone happy.

    United we stand here....

  30. #749
    @hibs.net private member Radium's Avatar
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    If I am honest, Hamilton back or not isnít the real issue.

    The FIA screwed up by making it all about the drama. An unsupported race director was exposed for entertainment value to the rants of Team Principals so that they could broadcast a 15 second soundbite. It led to a loss of clarity around rules and penalties and ultimately led to at best a novel use of the rule book in the last race.

    What needs to come out is a whole lot of clarity around restarts, track limits, stewarding and running other drivers off the track. I stand by my opinion that Masi got it wrong but his paymasters hung him out there.

    As a Hamilton fan I would like to see him race again but if he doesnít there are plenty of other drivers that will make it worth watching.


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  31. #750
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    I wonder who Mercedes would go for driver wise if Hamilton does walk away. Could see them offering bundles of cash to buy out Pierre Gasly's contract.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

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