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  1. #61
    @hibs.net private member Stevie Reid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by My_Wife_Camille View Post
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    Totally agree with this.

    Strange how this view seems to be generally accepted assessment of events during Neil Lennons time at Hibs these days but anyone who dared say it at the time was a Lennon hating troll who was revelling in negativity.
    Only by people who are prepared to ignore important details and try and frame his tenure to fit their own argument. Those who take a more balanced view will disagree.

    FWIW he's gone, it definitely seems like it's for the best, and I care not one bit what he does at Celtic. But he gave me some of my most favourite times as a Hibs supporter, and I'm grateful for that.


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  3. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevie Reid View Post
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    Only by people who are prepared to ignore important details and try and frame his tenure to fit their own argument. Those who take a more balanced view will disagree.

    FWIW he's gone, it definitely seems like it's for the best, and I care not one bit what he does at Celtic. But he gave me some of my most favourite times as a Hibs supporter, and I'm grateful for that.
    You canít get more balanced than giving credit where itís due and, in turn, criticism where itís due. That assessment of Lennons time at Hibs is as balanced as you can get in 100 or so words.

    A lot of people on here appear to confuse Ďbalancedí for Ďpositiveí and donít realise that it is perfectly possible to have a completely fair, rational and balanced view on something and still reach a Ďnegativeí conclusion.

  4. #63
    @hibs.net private member Sean1875's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obscene Omeonga View Post
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    We were utter mince all bar 6 months.
    In a championship which didn't include Sevco or Hearts and with a team that had just won a Scottish Cup we still managed to draw 14 games. Said it all along but bar the second half of our first season back in the top league we were incredibly average under Lennon.

  5. #64
    Oli Burke is pish and from what I seen of him at Celtic, blows my mind that he is a professional footballer

  6. #65
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    Neil Lennon is cut from the same managerial cloth as Terry Butcher with admittedly a bit more tactical nous (but not much). Lennon just managed to keep his winning streak going longer than a few games because as soon as a manager like that starts losing a few games on the bounce they have no idea whatsoever to turn around a slump.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  7. #66
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MagicSwirlingShip View Post
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    Whoís Hibs team produced some of the best football Iíve seen at Easter Road.
    And also some of the worst.

    That five month spell in the 17/18 season was fantastic. The rest was absolutely dismal.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  8. #67
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibernian32 View Post
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    Its no reason only the mentality strong are succesful
    Some of the most successful people in life suffer from depression, anxiety and other mental illnesses and are able to say when they feel mistreated or that what they are being put under is not acceptable.

    I'd love to put together a proper argument, but seriously, get to ****.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  9. #68
    @hibs.net private member J-C's Avatar
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    Once again when there's a Lennon thread it's either people who hate or love him. Let's be really honest here and just say he was a decidedly average manger who had a 4 month spell where it just sort of clicked due to the players he had.

    Got us promoted by playing dull as dishwater football all bar a couple of games, his players recruitment was in the main very poor, remember the scouting team can only suggest players, the final decision was down to Lennon. Allowed certain favourite players far too much leeway with training etc and lost the core of the senior players due to this and his bully boy style management, training atmosphere was poisonous seemingly with players not enjoying going into training due to the unknown of Lennon's mood swings.

    Laid the blame at everyone's feet except his with his bizarre treatment of players, extraordinary team selections and his own weird temperament.

    I'm happy he has gone as he just wasn't the model LD and Craig had spoken about, seemingly Lennon approached us about the job as he was never on our radar but due to his reputation it looked a decent option. Heckingbottom like Stubbs is the model we were meant to be going for, young modern up and coming coaches with new ideas, Lennon was not that, he wanted more hands on manager style and not the head coach role, he stepped on too many peoples toes at Hibs, until he over stepped the mark.

  10. #69
    @hibs.net private member BILLYHIBS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenNWhiteArmy View Post
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    Oli Burke is pish and from what I seen of him at Celtic, blows my mind that he is a professional footballer
    Agree but very fast for such a tall guy but still pish

    15m x 2 ??

  11. #70
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Horde View Post
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    The stars aligned for Lennon. He had one of the best midfields we've probably ever had at his disposal and once they all left he'd no idea how to adapt.
    We 100% should have finished second that season. The best midfield in the country and yet again his baffling team selection at Tynecastle blew it.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  12. #71
    @hibs.net private member BILLYHIBS's Avatar
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    That reminds me whatever happened to Shane McGowan?

    Started off as good cop bad cop and then became bad cop bad cop

  13. #72
    @hibs.net private member BILLYHIBS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    We 100% should have finished second that season. The best midfield in the country and yet again his baffling team selection at Tynecastle blew it.
    Agree

    Shudda just kept a winning team

    He had to draw a line under a missed penalty at t sheep but didnít

    S*** happens!

  14. #73
    @hibs.net private member Stevie Reid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by My_Wife_Camille View Post
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    You can’t get more balanced than giving credit where it’s due and, in turn, criticism where it’s due. That assessment of Lennons time at Hibs is as balanced as you can get in 100 or so words.

    A lot of people on here appear to confuse ‘balanced’ for ‘positive’ and don’t realise that it is perfectly possible to have a completely fair, rational and balanced view on something and still reach a ‘negative’ conclusion.
    I'm not confusing being balanced for being positive. That assessment is fairly balanced, but is ruined by the 'huffed and puffed until the January transfer window' line. This is continually trotted out and is total bollocks.

    By that January window were in 4th place, where we finished, and had 35 points from 22 games - 1.59 points per game, on track for 60 points. We had also been to a League Cup semi final, scored three goals when beating Rangers at Ibrox in the first game since the cup final, beaten Hearts at home, and won five away games in the league. Our league and cup record up to that point was P 29 W 14 D 9 L 6 F 54 A 35 - we scored 23 goals in the League Cup alone.

    Whilst there were a couple of disappointing results in the period, I don't know how anyone couldn't make an assessment that wasn't positive overall about that spell. The second half of the season was even better, and I think that some people have now compartmentalised the first part as 'bad' because it wasn't as good as the superb form in the last 16 games (the reality of course, is that many are just using the excellent spell against him, and are simply claiming that the rest is rubbish in comparison).

    The second half of the season was excellent. The first part was good, at the very least. Saying that we huffed and puffed through it is not a balanced assessment of that time. It is far more balanced than other comments describing it as 'dismal' and 'mince' though, I'll give you that.
    Last edited by Stevie Reid; 25-06-2019 at 12:19 PM.

  15. #74
    @hibs.net private member One Day Soon's Avatar
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    This single transferable thread theme - because that's what it is regardless of the title and intended subject - recurs every time Neil Lennon is discussed.

    It's been done to death previously and repeatedly, is never going to reach an agreed conclusion and serves no useful purpose except one - it every so often allows the Lennon-phobes to scratch that itch they are clearly so desperate to get at.

    Actually that probably fills some useful psychological purpose.

  16. #75
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BILLYHIBS View Post
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    Agree

    Shudda just kept a winning team

    He had to draw a line under a missed penalty at t sheep but didnít

    S*** happens!
    Wasn't a good penalty from MacLaren but when the goalie is so far off his line then the odds dramatically lengthen.

    Jamie MacLaren proved that with confidence, played consistently and getting decent service he scores goals. I honestly don't think Mark McNulty is much better than him, just our quality of supply improved with Heckingbottom coming in.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  17. #76
    @hibs.net private member BILLYHIBS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    Wasn't a good penalty from MacLaren but when the goalie is so far off his line then the odds dramatically lengthen.

    Jamie MacLaren proved that with confidence, played consistently and getting decent service he scores goals. I honestly don't think Mark McNulty is much better than him, just our quality of supply improved with Heckingbottom coming in.
    Wasnít a good penalty from Jamie

    He was lucky with his penalty at Ibroke sheer power took it over the line

    At Tinycastle the camera kept panning to Jamie MAC on the bench

    Brandon up front?

    Dearie me

    People forget that Jamie MAC scored a hatrick versus t Hun to prove Lenny wrong and launch the aeroplane 😁

  18. #77
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BILLYHIBS View Post
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    Wasnít a good penalty from Jamie

    He was lucky with his penalty at Ibroke sheer power took it over the line

    At Tinycastle the camera kept panning to Jamie MAC on the bench

    Brandon up front?

    Dearie me

    People forget that Jamie MAC scored a hatrick versus t Hun to prove Lenny wrong and launch the aeroplane 😁
    Was that the first or the second time the "natural born winner" celebrated a draw?


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  19. #78
    Coaching Staff MWHIBBIES's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BILLYHIBS View Post
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    Wasnít a good penalty from Jamie

    He was lucky with his penalty at Ibroke sheer power took it over the line

    At Tinycastle the camera kept panning to Jamie MAC on the bench

    Brandon up front?

    Dearie me

    People forget that Jamie MAC scored a hatrick versus t Hun to prove Lenny wrong and launch the aeroplane 😁
    Barker wasn't up front, he was wide in a front 3 with Boyle on the other side.

    Don't think anyone forgets his hatrick. Its only scoring one goal in 6 months after that that bothered people.

    Starting Whittaker over Bartley or McGeouch was a big error that night as well.

  20. #79
    I see there's been a statement released from the chamber of secrets. Celtic off to an early flyer in the statement table.

  21. #80
    @hibs.net private member BILLYHIBS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES View Post
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    Barker wasn't up front, he was wide in a front 3 with Boyle on the other side.

    Don't think anyone forgets his hatrick. Its only scoring one goal in 6 months after that that bothered people.

    Starting Whittaker over Bartley or McGeouch was a big error that night as well.
    Whatever it was it didnae work

    I remember Boyle and Brandon interchanging that night and conspiring to miss any chances that did come their way

    Potter and his cronies must have been laughing their socks off when the team lines came in

    Their mind games worked

    I agree with you over Bartley and Whittaker

    Flo and Jamie last year is a mystery

    Maybe one day the real story will come out but NDAs have been signed

    😁

  22. #81
    @hibs.net private member calumhibee1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevie Reid View Post
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    I'm not confusing being balanced for being positive. That assessment is fairly balanced, but is ruined by the 'huffed and puffed until the January transfer window' line. This is continually trotted out and is total bollocks.

    By that January window were in 4th place, where we finished, and had 33 points from 22 games - 1.5 points per game, on track for 57 points. We had also been to a League Cup semi final, scored three goals when beating Rangers at Ibrox in the first game since the cup final, beaten Hearts at home, and won five away games in the league. Our league and cup record up to that point was P 29 W 14 D 9 L 6 F 54 A 35 - we scored 23 goals in the League Cup alone.

    Whilst there were a couple of disappointing results in the period, I don't know how anyone couldn't make an assessment that wasn't positive overall about that spell. The second half of the season was even better, and I think that some people have now compartmentalised the first part as 'bad' because it wasn't as good as the superb form in the last 16 games (the reality of course, is that many are just using the excellent spell against him, and are simply claiming that the rest is rubbish in comparison).

    The second half of the season was excellent. The first part was good, at the very least. Saying that we huffed and puffed through it is not a balanced assessment of that time. It is far more balanced than other comments describing it as 'dismal' and 'mince' though, I'll give you that.
    If the first part of the season was good then we would have strolled second as the second part of the season was league winning material. The fact we finished fourth despite an extended run of league winning form in the second half of the season would suggest the first part of that season was average.

  23. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by My_Wife_Camille View Post
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    Totally agree with this.

    Strange how this view seems to be generally accepted assessment of events during Neil Lennons time at Hibs these days but anyone who dared say it at the time was a Lennon hating troll who was revelling in negativity.
    I can't pretend to be a huge fan of a number of posts or indeed your posting style however I agree with this.

    I think the hibs.net exaggeration during Lennon's tenure is as much to blame as Lennon himself for the polarised threads we still have on him today. There were literally comments every single week, for a spell, insisting he was the best manager we've ever had and should enjoy him while we can. There were posters put-down for suggesting otherwise.

    Lennon did alright. And to begin with he definitely improved my opinion on him as a person.

  24. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by The Modfather View Post
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    Why are you focusing on the points total? Yes it is an achievement, but if Heckingbottom was to finish 3rd with a lower points total is that a lesser achievement? Lennon finished 4th, that was a good finish but hardly unrepeatable.
    I'll guess that the same people who like the points total record line also don't like people bringing up the points total comparison with Stubbs in the championship (Lennon's season being without Huns/Hertz).

  25. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by Lester B View Post
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    Seriously? Care to elaborate on that?
    Grown men who can't handle a few home truths or a bit hairdryer treatment.

    Jessie's / mouse's. Is this type of elaboration good enough?

  26. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by Hibernian32 View Post
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    Grown men who can't handle a few home truths or a bit hairdryer treatment.

    Jessie's / mouse's. Is this type of elaboration good enough?
    Do you accept that there are a number of good players, players at the very top even, who most likely excel under a different management/interaction style?

  27. #86
    @hibs.net private member Stevie Reid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by calumhibee1 View Post
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    If the first part of the season was good then we would have strolled second as the second part of the season was league winning material. The fact we finished fourth despite an extended run of league winning form in the second half of the season would suggest the first part of that season was average.
    We didn't finish higher because Aberdeen and Rangers were above us and won nine of their last 16 matches as well. Again, something not being as good as excellent, doesn't make it average.

  28. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by 90+2 View Post
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    In all the other media too. Surprised the media are going against Lennon and Celtic here but itís spot on.
    Have you seen or heard any further details? Article quoted by OP suggests West Brom really aren't happy at treatment of their player by Lennon, but can't see any specifics as to what the "treatment" was.

  29. #88
    @hibs.net private member Stevie Reid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BILLYHIBS View Post
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    Whatever it was it didnae work

    I remember Boyle and Brandon interchanging that night and conspiring to miss any chances that did come their way

    Potter and his cronies must have been laughing their socks off when the team lines came in

    Their mind games worked

    I agree with you over Bartley and Whittaker

    Flo and Jamie last year is a mystery

    Maybe one day the real story will come out but NDAs have been signed

    ��
    We were doing fine and in control of that game before an uncharacteristic mistake by Lewis let them into score - we were creaking after that up until half time though. Second half we were the better team and lost to a goal from a free kick that never was, scored by a guy who should have been suspended. Not one of our best performances of the season, but we definitely did show up that night.

    Interestingly the way we set up at the start of that game is exactly how many people expect us to be, formation-wise, under PH next season. His lineup in the win at Tynie recent was possibly the same formation too?
    Last edited by Stevie Reid; 25-06-2019 at 12:20 PM.

  30. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by WeeRussell View Post
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    Do you accept that there are a number of good players, players at the very top even, who most likely excel under a different management/interaction style?
    I do look at klopp for a example.

    But I feel most managers loose the top sometimes and players go running to the board etc or the papers or release books after there careers.

    Could also say Roy Keane, a mad ******* not a good manager I'm no saying it's the only way to manage a player but it's defo needed and little boys get the hump to easy.

  31. #90
    Coaching Staff Smartie's Avatar
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    Burke should come on loan to us.

    He's bumped around big clubs, has moved for a few big transfer fees yet never really played that much football.

    Burke would be better served going somewhere where he has a good man manager, a crowd behind him and somewhere where he can play every week to get confidence and experience.

    It would never happen, as everyone to do with him and his club will convince him that he needs to be playing at a higher level for a bigger club, even though that will only lead to him playing handfuls of games (most off the bench) and his career dwindling away to nothing (whilst he'll still probably move for a few big transfer fees yet).

    The McGinn factor, a player of similar ability. We were the right club for him at that stage in his career.

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