Rambling Queen Ann statement incoming...

[Onion]

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So it's nothing but posturing then,inconvenience some folk for a few weeks to make out like your doing something.

A cheap PR exercise. The hurt and hate goes much deeper than a few folk sitting at n the corner.

And where are they going to re-seat them when the PBS is always a full house ? Or just maybe ... it’s not 😳

[HibsGW]

The amount of replies on both Hibs and Hearts side to our statements condemning the recent poor behaviour of fans is absolutely embarrassing. Grown adults actively defending people racially abusing players, singing sectarian songs, throwing things on the pitch at players, which by the way could hit your own fans on the way. If this is what going to support Hibs or Hearts is to you, you should probably stop going to the football and go somewhere else where you can take your anger out in an appropriate manner. Maybe train boxing or MMA or something, although I suppose there’s consequences when you act like a roaster in these things so maybe that’d put people off too.

[oldbutdim]

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I would love to know what behaviour folk do at the football that they think will be stopped by this, individually.

I can't think of a single thing I do that I would expect to be told not to.

I read someone say they would be afraid to fart.

I'm not suggesting that you suffer from flatulence any more than the next guy.

But the next guy is forever letting off, and if it stops that then my viewing pleasure will be increased substantially.

[NAE NOOKIE]

I've made no secret of the fact that I have a sneaky wee liking for smoke bombs …. but unfortunately they have to go.

As other posters have pointed out you can create a brilliant atmosphere at a game without descending into stupidity and anti social behaviour.

Fair play to Budge for her actions here, clearly following the lead from Leeann Dempster. Its a shame that we have gotten to this stage where clubs are having to spend thousands on non football related equipment. But as others have said, this is a statement of intent from both Edinburgh clubs who are prepared to call out the racists and bigots in their own support publicly. I still maintain its a small problem and perhaps more evident at Tynecastle than it is at Easter Road …. but the idea has to be to nip it in the bud before it does become a major issue.

But lets be clear here …. If we are to go down this road then every time we play Sevco or Celtic both Hibs and Hearts must at the very least comment on the sectarian singing and abuse spewing out of the away stands … they cant be calling out their own supports and then turn a blind eye to the far far worse behaviour from away fans of the bigot brothers.

It will be interesting to see what happens next season, because in view of recent events I cant see fans of Hibs or Hearts taking kindly to our clubs railing against their own supports and then failing to take the next very obvious step, because if that were to happen it would not be unreasonable for accusations of hypocrisy and cowardice to be bandied about.

[matty_f]

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I read someone say they would be afraid to fart.

I'm not suggesting that you suffer from flatulence any more than the next guy.

But the next guy is forever letting off, and if it stops that then my viewing pleasure will be increased substantially.

If I'm going to be held accountable for my farts, then I'll be cancelling my season ticket with immediate effect.

It's the sniffer dogs I feel sorry for, if true.

[where'stheslope]

From what i've seen and heard about tynie, the section she has shut holds about 200 fans, although not all implicated in the bother, shutting this area means its harder for their fans to taunt and hurl abuse at the away fans!
I think it would maybe be advisable to close the adjacent section in the away fans end at the same time.
For years now it has become a battle ground of venom from both fans in this area.
Unfortunately this will not curb things being thrown as the culprits will be in another area of the ground and still be able to throw things!!!

[hibsbollah]

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I've made no secret of the fact that I have a sneaky wee liking for smoke bombs …. but unfortunately they have to go.

As other posters have pointed out you can create a brilliant atmosphere at a game without descending into stupidity and anti social behaviour.

Fair play to Budge for her actions here, clearly following the lead from Leeann Dempster. Its a shame that we have gotten to this stage where clubs are having to spend thousands on non football related equipment. But as others have said, this is a statement of intent from both Edinburgh clubs who are prepared to call out the racists and bigots in their own support publicly. I still maintain its a small problem and perhaps more evident at Tynecastle than it is at Easter Road …. but the idea has to be to nip it in the bud before it does become a major issue.

But lets be clear here …. If we are to go down this road then every time we play Sevco or Celtic both Hibs and Hearts must at the very least comment on the sectarian singing and abuse spewing out of the away stands … they cant be calling out their own supports and then turn a blind eye to the far far worse behaviour from away fans of the bigot brothers. It will be interesting to see what happens next season, because in view of recent events I cant see fans of Hibs or Hearts taking kindly to our clubs railing against their own supports and then failing to take the next very obvious step.

Absolutely agree with all of this. The excellent steps taken by the Edinburgh clubs today have to be partnered with a zero tolerance approach to the Glasgow two; identifying every occasion of sectarianism by using film evidence and then reporting it as a hate crime, if necessary. Why not? There serms to be a new report of racial abuse at every major game down south at the moment (Koulibaly at Arsenal last night now), why do we not take the lead and report it ourselves, as a club, a f the journalists are too spineless to do it?

[j'adore hibs]

this was discussed on talk sport this morning by brazil and mcoist. brazil admitted to saying silly things on the past which I can only assume were sectarian by nature . mcoist never said a word. they appeared positive about what hibs and hearts were doing but didn't really touch on the old firm issues at all.

my tuppence, I think its a good thing what the Edinburgh clubs are doing and who knows maybe it will lead to more scrutiny on the old firm. Im quite bemused by the comments on here re prawn sandwich brigade and end of atmosphere. It primarily suggests these are the people that want to shout offensive bile and throw stuff. This will not stop people jumping about an enjoying themselves, it will stop racism etc and people throwing things which may cause danger to others or damage property....bet nobody though about the cost of damage to pitch these flares cost.

[JeMeSouviens]

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I've made no secret of the fact that I have a sneaky wee liking for smoke bombs …. but unfortunately they have to go.

As other posters have pointed out you can create a brilliant atmosphere at a game without descending into stupidity and anti social behaviour.

Fair play to Budge for her actions here, clearly following the lead from Leeann Dempster. Its a shame that we have gotten to this stage where clubs are having to spend thousands on non football related equipment. But as others have said, this is a statement of intent from both Edinburgh clubs who are prepared to call out the racists and bigots in their own support publicly. I still maintain its a small problem and perhaps more evident at Tynecastle than it is at Easter Road …. but the idea has to be to nip it in the bud before it does become a major issue.

But lets be clear here …. If we are to go down this road then every time we play Sevco or Celtic both Hibs and Hearts must at the very least comment on the sectarian singing and abuse spewing out of the away stands … they cant be calling out their own supports and then turn a blind eye to the far far worse behaviour from away fans of the bigot brothers.

It will be interesting to see what happens next season, because in view of recent events I cant see fans of Hibs or Hearts taking kindly to our clubs railing against their own supports and then failing to take the next very obvious step, because if that were to happen it would not be unreasonable for accusations of hypocrisy and cowardice to be bandied about.

Well said - by all means call out our own idiots, but don't miss theirs.

[Moulin Yarns]

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From what i've seen and heard about tynie, the section she has shut holds about 200 fans, although not all implicated in the bother, shutting this area means its harder for their fans to taunt and hurl abuse at the away fans!
I think it would maybe be advisable to close the adjacent section in the away fans end at the same time.
For years now it has become a battle ground of venom from both fans in this area.
Unfortunately this will not curb things being thrown as the culprits will be in another area of the ground and still be able to throw things!!!

The front corner sections of the Roseburn stand are already closed to away fans as was clear at the derby

[BILLYHIBS]

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I've made no secret of the fact that I have a sneaky wee liking for smoke bombs …. but unfortunately they have to go.

As other posters have pointed out you can create a brilliant atmosphere at a game without descending into stupidity and anti social behaviour.

Fair play to Budge for her actions here, clearly following the lead from Leeann Dempster. Its a shame that we have gotten to this stage where clubs are having to spend thousands on non football related equipment. But as others have said, this is a statement of intent from both Edinburgh clubs who are prepared to call out the racists and bigots in their own support publicly. I still maintain its a small problem and perhaps more evident at Tynecastle than it is at Easter Road …. but the idea has to be to nip it in the bud before it does become a major issue.

But lets be clear here …. If we are to go down this road then every time we play Sevco or Celtic both Hibs and Hearts must at the very least comment on the sectarian singing and abuse spewing out of the away stands … they cant be calling out their own supports and then turn a blind eye to the far far worse behaviour from away fans of the bigot brothers. It will be interesting to see what happens next season, because in view of recent events I cant see fans of Hibs or Hearts taking kindly to our clubs railing against their own supports and then failing to take the next very obvious step.

When England recently played Montenegro and certain English players suffered racist abuse from a section of the Montenegro support UEFA said that one of the options available to the Referee was to remove both teams from the field of play due to the unacceptable behaviour of some Montenegro fans

Surely this must be an option open for us when the Ugly sisters come calling and sing their political and sectarian bile enmasse unchecked?

You are correct next season will be very interesting and the time is coming to call out the bigot brothers for their inbuilt sectarianism racism and political beliefs that have nothing to do with football or modern society

[jgl07]

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No, that's Section N(azi).

Hasn't that been closed on and off for years? It certainly was before the new stand was built.

[matty_f]

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Well said - by all means call out our own idiots, but don't miss theirs.

I think by taking action to deal with the incidents in our own support, it makes it significantly easier to call out other teams and ask them to deal with their fans.

As things stood it would have been very hollow to call out Rangers fans for anything while we've had a fan run on and confront one of their players, or Celtic fans after a Buckfast bottle was thrown at one of thier players and so on...

I am proud of Hibs for doing something that isn't universally popular in order to be the ones that set the tone in this debate.

We will get our house in order, ideally folk would have had enough self control and awareness to modify their behaviour so that they don't damage the club, but as that opportunity wasn't taken, I think it's right that the club act.

For the vasy majority of people that attend the games, their enjoyment won't in any way be diminished by the club's steps. In many cases, if it helps deal with behaviour that takes away from someone's enjoyment, the experience and atmosphere will be much better.

[pacoluna]

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When or if? I’m pretty sure the hefty sentence imposed to the young fan should get the ball rolling so to speak. The rise of social media is also a good way to shame these Neanderthals. It’s certainly a work in progress

I ask again what happened to the "old we guy" who was caught racially abusing the hearts player.

There seems to an emphasis on this being a generational issue within our support "younger supporters" which is absolutely nonsence and completely hypocritical given it was much, MUCH worse in the past. Would be interesting to hear their stories and the remorse they hold.

That's not deflecting btw it's just stating a fact that noone regardless of age should be taking a moral high ground.

[NAE NOOKIE]

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When England recently played Montenegro and certain English players suffered racist abuse from a section of the Montenegro support UEFA said that one of the options available to the Referee was to remove both teams from the field of play due to the unacceptable behaviour of some Montenegro fans

Surely this must be an option open for us when the Ugly sisters come calling and sing their political and sectarian bile enmasse unchecked?

You are correct next season will be very interesting and the time is coming to call out the bigot brothers for their inbuilt sectarianism racism and political beliefs that have nothing to do with football or modern society

In all honesty I cant ever see a time where the ref will remove the players from the pitch over sectarian singing, or any event where a team will decide arbitrarily to leave the field over it.

But as I said there has to come a time where clubs condemn sectarian behaviour. There is no merit whatsoever in any club saying that its up to the Ugly sisters to put their own house in order either, in their own stadiums yes, but you wouldn't invite somebody to a party in your own house and do nothing if they behaved in such a way as to ruin the event for everybody else there, and that's exactly what happens at Easter Road when they come calling. At that point we have the right, in fact a responsibility, to publicly condemn their behaviour and that's exactly what we should be doing if we are in any way serious about tackling this blight on our game.

It also means that our own fans should be above reproach and that's the message both Hibs and Hearts should be attempting to get over to their respective supports. Its not just about the image of individual clubs, its about the good of the whole of Scottish football. Part of that outlook is for something to happen which I've brought up before, it wont prove popular with sections of our support or the Hearts support but in my opinion its has to happen:

Yes we have the right to fly tricolours and Erin go Bragh flags, both are connected to our clubs foundations …. yes the Jambos have the right to wave union flags, after all ( for now at least ) it is the flag of the country they belong to. But the fact is that by doing so and whether we like it or not the use of these symbols at our matches is helping to perpetuate the sectarianism which has blighted our game for a century. Its not a question of whether you can, its a question of whether you should.

[B.H.F.C]

It’s not just Hibs and Hearts who have problems.

Spurs have banned a number of fans......for persistently standing at their new stadium. After two games!

[BILLYHIBS]

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In all honesty I cant ever see a time where the ref will remove the players from the pitch over sectarian singing, or any event where a team will decide arbitrarily to leave the field over it.

But as I said there has to come a time where clubs condemn sectarian behaviour. There is no merit whatsoever in any club saying that its up to the Ugly sisters to put their own house in order either, in their own stadiums yes, but you wouldn't invite somebody to a party in your own house and do nothing if they behaved in such a way as to ruin the event for everybody else there, and that's exactly what happens at Easter Road when they come calling. At that point we have the right, in fact a responsibility, to publicly condemn their behaviour and that's exactly what we should be doing if we are in any way serious about tackling this blight on our game.

It also means that our own fans should be above reproach and that's the message both Hibs and Hearts should be attempting to get over to their respective supports. Its not just about the image of individual clubs, its about the good of the whole of Scottish football. Part of that outlook is for something to happen which I've brought up before, it wont prove popular with sections of our support or the Hearts support but in my opinion its has to happen:

Yes we have the right to fly tricolours and Erin go Bragh flags, both are connected to our clubs foundations …. yes the Jambos have the right to wave union flags, after all ( for now at least ) it is the flag of the country they belong to. But the fact is that by doing so and whether we like it or not the use of these symbols at our matches is helping to perpetuate the sectarianism which has blighted our game for a century. Its not a question of whether you can, its a question of whether you should.

Agree!

It tickles me that The Rangers call out Aberdeen for allegedly singing sectarian songs about their Roman Catholic Manager

Stevie Clarke was obviously genuinely in deep shock at the level of sectarian abuse he was subjected to at Ibrox

We know first hand the level of sectarian abuse Neil Lennon received in his time at Easter Road which must have done little for his mental health and well being

The political and sectarian agenda brought by the Green Brigade to Easter Road

The SFA and the Old Firm sweep all of these issues under the carpet hoping they will simply disappear

It is never their fault yet they are both the main perpetrators of the sectarian bile that blights our national sport

It smacks of pot kettle hypocrisy

As you say if we can get our own house in order then we can call out the Bigot Brothers

In fifty years of supporting HIBS I cannot remember singing any sectarian or political songs

[silverhibee]

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I would love to know what behaviour folk do at the football that they think will be stopped by this, individually.

I can't think of a single thing I do that I would expect to be told not to.

For anyone standing at games at ER beware, Spurs have already banned several fans from there new stadium for standing during the game.

[superfurryhibby]

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Yes we have the right to fly tricolours and Erin go Bragh flags, both are connected to our clubs foundations …. yes the Jambos have the right to wave union flags, after all ( for now at least ) it is the flag of the country they belong to. But the fact is that by doing so and whether we like it or not the use of these symbols at our matches is helping to perpetuate the sectarianism which has blighted our game for a century. Its not a question of whether you can, its a question of whether you should.

Sorry, not really buying into this. The Erin gu Bragh flags reflect the original club crest at Hibs and should only ever offend the very narrowest of minds. The tricolour is more tenuous, but it’s not exactly prolific, is it? When you compare that to the massed singing of sectarian songs by The Rangers, that horrible club’s pandering to bigotry in the form of an Orange away kit etc, etc.....I think we should not be too worried about perpetuating sectarianism at Easter Road.

When mentioning Hearts you omitted the Red Hand of Ulster flags? I’m also wondering why it’s ok for Hearts fans to wave union flags? For me that flag at Hearts matches is a reflection of a small, but prominent hardcore religious bampot element associated with Hearts. The kind of guys who form their own flute band and wear Maroon whilst parading the streets proclaiming themselves as the Heart of Midlothian Loyal. I’m not aware of any Hibernian focussed Anti Protestant groups, nor have I heard any massed singing of anti Orange songs at Easter Road in decades.

[Onion]

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Agree!

It tickles me that The Rangers call out Aberdeen for allegedly singing sectarian songs about their Roman Catholic Manager

Stevie Clarke was obviously genuinely in deep shock at the level of sectarian abuse he was subjected to at Ibrox

We know first hand the level of sectarian abuse Neil Lennon received in his time at Easter Road which must have done little for his mental health and well being

The political and sectarian agenda brought by the Green Brigade to Easter Road

The SFA and the Old Firm sweep all of these issues under the carpet hoping they will simply disappear

It is never their fault yet they are both the main perpetrators of the sectarian bile that blights our national sport

It smacks of pot kettle hypocrisy

As you say if we can get our own house in order then we can call out the Bigot Brothers

In fifty years of supporting HIBS I cannot remember singing any sectarian or political songs

That only works if the authorities, police, media, politicians and SFA are prepared to do the right thing when the main perpetrators are called out. For more years than I can remember the OF have been accused of unacceptable, sectarianism and the authorities who have been able to do something about this have done... nothing. In fact, the MSM have celebrated, advertised and suckled on this "special atmosphere" for years and would clearly HATE to see it addressed.

Nope, for me, the recent events involving other clubs like Hibs, Hearts, Motherwell and other so called smaller clubs (where no one has been injured) may well develop into the silver bullet that kills the bigger issue of sectarianism. These incident are forcing the media, clubs and authorities to face up to the wider - much more disturbing - OF "problem".

[eastcoasthibby]

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Bit over the top reaction by Budge i would say.

Howz it over the top ? its exactly the position we should be getting from all of the key people in the clubs, this immature pathetic nonsense needs to stop, as we have found its costing us hard cash that should be getting spent on the playing side.

[SuperAllyMcleod]

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Albeit with better punctuation.

I’d hope it would be better written - she used “being thrown” three times in one sentence! There were a quite a few basic errors in there.

Fair play for taking action though.

[NAE NOOKIE]

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Sorry, not really buying into this. The Erin gu Bragh flags reflect the original club crest at Hibs and should only ever offend the very narrowest of minds. The tricolour is more tenuous, but it’s not exactly prolific, is it? When you compare that to the massed singing of sectarian songs by The Rangers, that horrible club’s pandering to bigotry in the form of an Orange away kit etc, etc.....I think we should not be too worried about perpetuating sectarianism at Easter Road.

When mentioning Hearts you omitted the Red Hand of Ulster flags? I’m also wondering why it’s ok for Hearts fans to wave union flags? For me that flag at Hearts matches is a reflection of a small, but prominent hardcore religious bampot element associated with Hearts. The kind of guys who form their own flute band and wear Maroon whilst parading the streets proclaiming themselves as the Heart of Midlothian Loyal. I’m not aware of any Hibernian focussed Anti Protestant groups, nor have I heard any massed singing of anti Orange songs at Easter Road in decades.

This post explains more than I ever could why sectarianism will never be eradicated from Scottish football.

[BILLYHIBS]

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This post explains more than I ever could why sectarianism will never be eradicated from Scottish football.

Agree deep built into our society engrained and will be almost impossible to eradicate

No one said it would be easy

I would say that Hibernian Football Club is one of the least sectarian football clubs I know

Open to all. Catholic Protestant Muslim Hindhu. All religions colours creeds totally inclusive to embrace all cultures and nationalities

I remember during the early eighties during a rise of Irish nationalism in Scotland Tom Hart banned the Irish tricolour from our ground

It seemed to work at the time but seems to be making a come back but of course it is as you quite rightly point out it is part of our heritage a club founded by immigrants rejected by the authorities at the time now mutually inclusive a club open for all and most importantly the local community

What gets me is that anytime football violence is mentioned on TV you get images of pitch invasions fans attacking players green flares and coconuts all HIBS related

Yes every club has their radges but the real perpetrators the instigators agitators of sectarianism in Scotland are still whiter than white and are getting off scott free while they continue to pedal their own particular version of sectarian hatred in every ground in Scotland

[superfurryhibby]

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This post explains more than I ever could why sectarianism will never be eradicated from Scottish football.

A laughable and lazy response. Usually you’re not short on words and I enjoy your posts.

How does a handful of tricolours and a few Erin Gu Bragh at ER compare to the majority endorsement of religious hatred found in the singing and barely disguised official endorsement of religious division at Ibrox( the Orange away strip- contemptible pandering to the loyalist pound).

The hardcore Hearts fans interest in sectarianism, as per the flute band using their name and colours, has no parallel at Hibs. What historical attachment do Hearts fans have to the Red Hand flag? Once again overt displays of sectarianism?

The problem of perpetuating sectarianism partly with people who fail to see where the problem lies and you appear to be one of them.

When did you last here a religious hate based song at Easter Road? In my book it must be 30 years ago.

I genuinely don’t believe Hibs have a prominent group of fans with overt sectarian tendencies. Unfortunately, this is not the case at Ibrox, Celtic Park or Tynecastle.

The situations are different and pretending it is otherwise lends strength to status quo.

[Paisley Hibby]

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Sorry, not really buying into this. The Erin gu Bragh flags reflect the original club crest at Hibs and should only ever offend the very narrowest of minds. The tricolour is more tenuous, but it’s not exactly prolific, is it? When you compare that to the massed singing of sectarian songs by The Rangers, that horrible club’s pandering to bigotry in the form of an Orange away kit etc, etc.....I think we should not be too worried about perpetuating sectarianism at Easter Road.

When mentioning Hearts you omitted the Red Hand of Ulster flags? I’m also wondering why it’s ok for Hearts fans to wave union flags? For me that flag at Hearts matches is a reflection of a small, but prominent hardcore religious bampot element associated with Hearts. The kind of guys who form their own flute band and wear Maroon whilst parading the streets proclaiming themselves as the Heart of Midlothian Loyal. I’m not aware of any Hibernian focussed Anti Protestant groups, nor have I heard any massed singing of anti Orange songs at Easter Road in decades.

Just to play devil's advocate - if you believe The Rangers are not the same club as the one which went bust in 2012, then you'd have to accept that the Erin Gu Bragh flags also relate to a different club from ours.

I've certainly heard an anti-orange song regularly by Hibs fans within the past few decades - it starts "The Edinburgh Hibees, the Tim Mallory, for we'll not be mastered....". While we don't have the same level of sectarian problem of other some clubs, let's not pretend it doesn't exist. And as for the Tricolours - I hate to see that (and I'm a Catholic by the way).

[Diclonius]

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Just to play devil's advocate - if you believe The Rangers are not the same club as the one which went bust in 2012, then you'd have to accept that the Erin Gu Bragh flags also relate to a different club from ours.

I've certainly heard an anti-orange song regularly by Hibs fans within the past few decades - it starts "The Edinburgh Hibees, the Tim Mallory, for we'll not be mastered....". While we don't have the same level of sectarian problem of other some clubs, let's not pretend it doesn't exist. And as for the Tricolours - I hate to see that (and I'm a Catholic by the way).

Yup. The reason why sectarianism won't be eradicated in Scotland is that the prevailing attitude to it is "it's not us that's bad, it's everyone else". And that includes elements of our support too.

Collective responsibility won't happen because we all want to be the victim.

[matty_f]

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For anyone standing at games at ER beware, Spurs have already banned several fans from there new stadium for standing during the game.

I think we'd have known about it by now if it was going to be happening at Easter Road


No other takers to say what they do now that they think they'll be stopped from doing?

[BILLYHIBS]

OK I admit I might have sung “ For we will be mastered by no orange b......” about 30 years ago but no way are we as bad nowadays as the Huns the diets or the smellies.

[Paisley Hibby]

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OK I admit I might have sung “ For we will be mastered by no orange b......” about 30 years ago but no way are we as bad nowadays as the Huns the diets or the smellies.

And there is the problem folks....