Empty seats in Famous Five Lower solutions ?

[GreenCastle]

Following on from the dot count thread and numerous other threads - felt it was appropriate to create a separate discussion.

What should Hibs be doing to fill the Famous Five Lower ?

Behind the goals should be filled every week including cup games encouraging the team to score but instead we have a load of green seats which obviously don’t generate any atmosphere themselves plus looks poor on TV.

I’ve suggested previously the singing section should be in some of the lower tier sections. The family section is growing and does the FF lower have enough room ? Maybe move it to West Lower ?

Maybe Hibs sell lower tier seats first before opening Upper tier for cup games ?

It’s been an issue which has been going on a while and that includes other league sold out games when seats have been left empty - like derby games etc.

Has the club contemplated safe standing in this section?

[BegbieHSC]

Dedicate elsewhere as a family section (FF Upper?) and move Since 1875 down. Might be able to attract some of the East bams too, and get an atmosphere going, with less noticeable empty seats.

It’s probably not appropriate for us, but Bayern don’t allow ST holders to renew if they miss more than 8 home games. Their issue however is different - ticket touts, as opposed to people buying cheap season tickets to guarantee a home derby ticket, and get a chance of an away derby/Sevco ticket.
They also have a ST waiting list of over 100k, so you can see why.

We do need to something though.

[theonlywayisup]

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Following on from the dot count thread and numerous other threads - felt it was appropriate to create a separate discussion.

What should Hibs be doing to fill the Famous Five Lower ?

Behind the goals should be filled every week including cup games encouraging the team to score but instead we have a load of green seats which obviously don’t generate any atmosphere themselves plus looks poor on TV.

I’ve suggested previously the singing section should be in some of the lower tier sections. The family section is growing and does the FF lower have enough room ? Maybe move it to West Lower ?

Maybe Hibs sell lower tier seats first before opening Upper tier for cup games ?

It’s been an issue which has been going on a while and that includes other league sold out games when seats have been left empty - like derby games etc.

Has the club contemplated safe standing in this section?

Why piss off/alienate a group of fans just to get a better atmosphere?

[BoomtownHibees]

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Why piss off/alienate a group of fans just to get a better atmosphere?

Because sometimes things need to be done for the greater good.

Surely everyone wants a better atmosphere at games no?

[Real Emerald]

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Why piss off/alienate a group of fans just to get a better atmosphere?

They must already be pissed off because they never turn up

[theonlywayisup]

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Because sometimes things need to be done for the greater good.

Surely everyone wants a better atmosphere at games no?

I want to see a winning Hibs team, with as many people in the ground to watch it. Atmosphere comes after that.

All three are linked, but crap team = crap atmosphere and small crowd = crap atmosphere.

The way things are going, we could be heading back to the days of 10,000 fans of less. Why would any business alienate customers just to improve atmosphere.

[theonlywayisup]

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They must already be pissed off because they never turn up

They must sort out the cheap seats issue, granted. After that the FFL will be full.

[BoomtownHibees]

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I want to see a winning Hibs team, with as many people in the ground to watch it. Atmosphere comes after that.

All three are linked, but crap team = crap atmosphere and small crowd = crap atmosphere.

The way things are going, we could be heading back to the days of 10,000 fans of less. Why would any business alienate customers just to improve atmosphere.

The crowd last night was almost 16,000 but the atmosphere was crap. We need to be looking at ways of improving that. A better performance on the park would certainly have helped however the players may well have been inspired by a better atmosphere to pull them through the latter part of the game. The singing section being in the FFL for example would have helped that

[K.Marx]

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Why piss off/alienate a group of fans just to get a better atmosphere?

Ask heckingbottom and all the players what kind of crowd they want to play in front of? Atmosphere is hugely important and shouldn’t really be an afterthought.

[theonlywayisup]

Taken from another thread, but has anyone thought that many who would normally sit in the FFL may have moved elsewhere.

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Yip, 8 of us who normally sit in FF lower were in the West and East.

After all, the price of the tickets were the same in all three home stands.

[hibee]

Kids tickets should be the same price anywhere in the stadium, it’s crazy having one section with prices so cheap that people don’t care if they use them or not.

I’ve sat in the FF upper for many years so when my kids came along that’s where I got their season tickets and they are still there now.

I didn’t want to move to the lower for various reasons but the main one was I’d potentially lose my seat with my mates once the kids either give up going or start going with their own mates.

[theonlywayisup]

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The crowd last night was almost 16,000 but the atmosphere was crap. We need to be looking at ways of improving that. A better performance on the park would certainly have helped however the players may well have been inspired by a better atmosphere to pull them through the latter part of the game. The singing section being in the FFL for example would have helped that

Highly unlikely, but you believe it if you wish.

We had 20,000 Hibees in a relegation decider against Hamilton and that worked out well.

Equally, I've seen Hibs turn around two goal deficits in a sparsely filled stadium that was rocking by the end.

[PatHead]

The club are moving fans who do not have children out of the famous 5 lower. It is planned to make it more family friendly to make it more of an event for children. They are the future and we have to attract the next generation.

There is no chance the singing section will move there.

[Bobo]

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The family section is growing and does the FF lower have enough room ? Maybe move it to West Lower?

So what do you anticipate happens to existing season ticket holders who already sit in the West Lower? I, along with many others who sit there, have no desire to move seat from the West or to be surround by kids.

[Fuzzywuzzy]

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The club are moving fans who do not have children out of the famous 5 lower. It is planned to make it more family friendly to make it more of an event for children. They are the future and we have to attract the next generation.

There is no chance the singing section will move there.

Boy that sits near me in FFL spends the entire game either shouting '****ing rubbish' or '****ing terrible'. This is mainly for the 90 mins. Hope to **** he's one of the ones they move for the sanity of all those around him

[Brooster]

The solution is simple....put the prices up. That will stop so many folk taking advantage.

[wookie70]

Why will having the very small singing section lower down make a difference to atmosphere. I'm at the game I don't care what it looks like on TV There are more families in the FFL than there is in the singing section so why move them. The SS wanted a move and got it.

[Swedish hibee]

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Why piss off/alienate a group of fans just to get a better atmosphere?

Why piss off/alienate a group of fans who turn up to every home game & try create a better atmosphere to please folk who don't do this?

[derekduval]

I would make the really cheap kids season ticket cat b games only and in the south stand. That way people might be more inclined to use their seat in the famous five lower and would encourage a few who buy it and use it twice a season to decide wether it’s worth the higher kids price. Might also encourage a few to move to the east or west as well if it’s the same price. The only down side is people who can’t afford the higher price missing the cat a games but to be fair it’s ridiculously cheap

[GreenCastle]

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They must already be pissed off because they never turn up

Very good :)

[Hermit Crab]

Convert it to safe standing and move the family section to the wing of the East stand North end.

[Mikey]

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The club are moving fans who do not have children out of the famous 5 lower. It is planned to make it more family friendly to make it more of an event for children. They are the future and we have to attract the next generation.

There is no chance the singing section will move there.

Will that take effect from next season?

[Carheenlea]

What happens if the singing section wasn’t to work in there either? Can’t keep moving them about and inconveniencing fans who have chosen to sit with family and friends for years in certain areas of the ground. The natural home for the singing section is the East IMO.

[GreenCastle]

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I would make the really cheap kids season ticket cat b games only and in the south stand. That way people might be more inclined to use their seat in the famous five lower and would encourage a few who buy it and use it twice a season to decide wether it’s worth the higher kids price. Might also encourage a few to move to the east or west as well if it’s the same price. The only down side is people who can’t afford the higher price missing the cat a games but to be fair it’s ridiculously cheap

Making the South Stand Lower the family stand isn’t worst idea though it would mean sitting next to Away fans and then issue of Cat A - would they get priority for other parts of stadium ?

I’m not looking at ways of annoying fans in ff lower or / west but trying to find a solution that helps the team and improve atmosphere at stadium - while also getting away from the numerous empty seats which are bought and aren’t always sat in.

[NAE NOOKIE]

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Highly unlikely, but you believe it if you wish.

We had 20,000 Hibees in a relegation decider against Hamilton and that worked out well.

Equally, I've seen Hibs turn around two goal deficits in a sparsely filled stadium that was rocking by the end.

This is absolutely true … I've been at a few games at ER where the crowd was around 8,000 but events on the park as you say had the place rocking.

But games like that are so few and far between they happen once or twice every few seasons. What we are talking about is the empty seats in the FF lower which are there on a regular basis and inevitably their affect on the stadiums atmosphere, not to mention the club's image on TV.

Atmosphere not only encourages the team it also makes the game in general more entertaining for the crowd. If you watch games from the likes of Germany their 'ultras' keep the singing and noise going even when their team is getting beat, this is what we should be aiming for, not a few chants of 'green & white army' or 'Hibees' 'Hibees' when the team goes a goal up.

The club need to get a grip on this. There is nothing wrong with moving the family section ( if they absolutely have to have a dedicated area for it ) to the north end of the east … the view from anywhere in the east is very good and they could facilitate the transition by giving anybody currently in receipt of a family season ticket package their kids tickets for free next season as compensation …. how many kids at £25 a pop sit in the FF lower anyway? about 1000, that comes in at a cost of £25,000 … which is less than we pay to rent the ticket office and less than a weeks wages for the first team matchday squad.

If we could attract even 1,500 singers to the FF lower it would solve the image problem at a stroke because they would all be standing and probably ignore the first few rows of seats at the front, making the stand look practically full. They would also have carte blanche to do what they wanted, within reason, in a section where they are not affecting any other fans. That to my mind along with the far more prominent location, better than both the FF upper or back of the east, would eventually see that section full to capacity for most games and make the stadium's atmosphere far far better.

That's one of the problems with this club … too many folk are more concerned with jealously preserving 'their seat' than thinking about making a small sacrifice which just might improve the club's chances on the park and certainly its image off it. I by the way would be one of the folk moving to make way for an FF lower singing section.

The fact that the club continues to pig headedly ignore this issue which may well in the long run be of benefit to it for me flies directly in the face of the mantra espoused by Leeann Dempster and George Craig et al from the very beginning, that even small and seemingly insignificant changes which may be of benefit will not be ignored because their cumulative affect will lead to big benefits … so much for that.

[Brightside]

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So what do you anticipate happens to existing season ticket holders who already sit in the West Lower? I, along with many others who sit there, have no desire to move seat from the West or to be surround by kids.

Yep. No idea why people keep suggesting the West. The family tickets will always be sold in the cheapest area of the stadium and that will always be behind the goals. West are the best seats so will always be more expensive.

[GreenCastle]

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Yep. No idea why people keep suggesting the West. The family tickets will always be sold in the cheapest area of the stadium and that will always be behind the goals. West are the best seats so will always be more expensive.

I said last week - the East Stand Seats provide just as good a view and better leg room then West Stand Lower.

They should look at doing kids / family deals around the the full stadium.

Surely parents have to move seats when their kids grow too old for Famous Five Lower ?

I agree about kids being future and I think having FF lower near club shop also helps improve sales in shop.

The FF lower looked awful on TV when away end is full at other end and our home end looks like no one wants to attend.

[G B Young]

This gripe that that it 'looks bad' when there are lot of empty seats in the FF is something that applies to all clubs outwith the OF. Pittodrie usually has swathes of red seats on show at the Merkland Road end, Rugby Park always looks empty, Tynecastle is always way less populated than the attendance states (it's only the murky maroon seat blending into the background that makes it look fuller)...and so on at Livi, St Mirren, Dens Park etc. Prior to all seated stadia when the TV cameras at ER were on the East Terrace, the away end was regularly populated by a mere handful of fans, while the Cowshed at the other end was a crap place to sit and looked way worse than the FF does today. Bottom line, folk these days seem far more obsessed with how full a stadium looks.

However, if it really is so important to fill that particular section of the ground for the sake of the cameras then I guess moving the singing section in there and possibly introducing a safe standing section would entice more folk to go there.

Overall, though, the only way for Hibs to ensure bigger crowds is to put a successful team on the park.

[Moulin Yarns]

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I would make the really cheap kids season ticket cat b games only and in the south stand. That way people might be more inclined to use their seat in the famous five lower and would encourage a few who buy it and use it twice a season to decide wether it’s worth the higher kids price. Might also encourage a few to move to the east or west as well if it’s the same price. The only down side is people who can’t afford the higher price missing the cat a games but to be fair it’s ridiculously cheap

That is one of the most sensible ideas I've seen to solve the FFL problem, are you standing for Fans Rep?

[Keith_M]

If empty seats are the problem, then take a few hundred of them out.

If they're not there, they can't be empty, ergo no more problem.

Simple.