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  1. #1801
    Quote Originally Posted by speedy_gonzales View Post
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    I've certainly came across salesman that make me walk of the courtyard or out the sofa shop. I can't put my finger on what character trait it is but if there was a group of friends, the salesman I've encountered will be the dick that has seen and done everything before you.
    The best salesman I've encountered was a guy called Eddie that worked with West End Skoda. He reminded me a little of Gil Gunderson from The Simpsons. No pressure whatsoever, appeared to operate with honesty and it was a pleasure doing business with him.

    I bought a car from Eddie!

    I’m ex motor trade so know a few people still so I can usually track someone decent from them.


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  3. #1802
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by speedy_gonzales View Post
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    I've certainly came across salesman that make me walk of the courtyard or out the sofa shop. I can't put my finger on what character trait it is but if there was a group of friends, the salesman I've encountered will be the dick that has seen and done everything before you.
    The best salesman I've encountered was a guy called Eddie that worked with West End Skoda. He reminded me a little of Gil Gunderson from The Simpsons. No pressure whatsoever, appeared to operate with honesty and it was a pleasure doing business with him.
    I sold cars for four or five years or so and to turn this one on its head, a big pet peeve is the amount of people who you'd be completely honest with, and then they'd go and buy from someone who promised them the earth without any thought to how true it actually was.

    Two key examples - someone who wanted a car on PCP that "won't be in negative equity". I explained that for the most part of a PCP that a car will be in negative equity and although some people may word things to claim otherwise, that's twisting the truth at best and an outright lie at worst. Spent two hours on an excellent deal for the customer, found the right car for them, a good test drive that lasted a long time - and then bought from someone who promised them that their car would "never be in negative equity". Guess what happened when they looked to see if they could upgrade to a bigger car a year in because they were expecting another child in the family.

    The other one was when we had a brand new model of a car coming out. Again, like above gave them all the time in the world, no pressure or anything like that. Put together a really strong offer. Customer must have done it as soon as they got home but put it through Carwow and got offered a deal that when we sat down and looked at it, couldn't figure out how someone could offer the deal without losing a whole lot of money. Said that it looked very odd and to get clarification that it was the new model as opposed to the outgoing one, customer didn't do that, took the deal - only to find out two months down the line that it wasn't what they thought they were being offered and tried to order from me but within the same timescale that I'd offered when we'd first sat down two months prior. Went off the handle over the phone when the lead time had gotten as long as six to seven months, saying that I'd offered them delivery within three. Put simply - customer didn't get that model of car that they'd really wanted at all as they had to take something else to get a car within the timescale they needed.

    I'm not going to pretend that I got everything right in my time - every salesperson will have a few horror stories of things that went wrong out of their control - or that everyone in the trade is brilliant, but there are more good salespeople in the trade than bad ones in my experience. Sales managers are a different story and are often the old Swiss Tony types who think that style still works and that everyone should follow their style and that's the big problem.

    Still, there are some customers who absolutely will not listen to the truth and that either gives the salesperson two choices - not sell as many cars and have that sales manager breathing down your neck or take a "if you can't beat them join them" mentality.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  4. #1803
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    I sold cars for four or five years or so and to turn this one on its head, a big pet peeve is the amount of people who you'd be completely honest with, and then they'd go and buy from someone who promised them the earth without any thought to how true it actually was.

    Two key examples - someone who wanted a car on PCP that "won't be in negative equity". I explained that for the most part of a PCP that a car will be in negative equity and although some people may word things to claim otherwise, that's twisting the truth at best and an outright lie at worst. Spent two hours on an excellent deal for the customer, found the right car for them, a good test drive that lasted a long time - and then bought from someone who promised them that their car would "never be in negative equity". Guess what happened when they looked to see if they could upgrade to a bigger car a year in because they were expecting another child in the family.

    The other one was when we had a brand new model of a car coming out. Again, like above gave them all the time in the world, no pressure or anything like that. Put together a really strong offer. Customer must have done it as soon as they got home but put it through Carwow and got offered a deal that when we sat down and looked at it, couldn't figure out how someone could offer the deal without losing a whole lot of money. Said that it looked very odd and to get clarification that it was the new model as opposed to the outgoing one, customer didn't do that, took the deal - only to find out two months down the line that it wasn't what they thought they were being offered and tried to order from me but within the same timescale that I'd offered when we'd first sat down two months prior. Went off the handle over the phone when the lead time had gotten as long as six to seven months, saying that I'd offered them delivery within three. Put simply - customer didn't get that model of car that they'd really wanted at all as they had to take something else to get a car within the timescale they needed.

    I'm not going to pretend that I got everything right in my time - every salesperson will have a few horror stories of things that went wrong out of their control - or that everyone in the trade is brilliant, but there are more good salespeople in the trade than bad ones in my experience. Sales managers are a different story and are often the old Swiss Tony types who think that style still works and that everyone should follow their style and that's the big problem.

    Still, there are some customers who absolutely will not listen to the truth and that either gives the salesperson two choices - not sell as many cars and have that sales manager breathing down your neck or take a "if you can't beat them join them" mentality.
    Unfortunately all I have had are the Swiss Tony types. One thing that is glaringly obvious is a real lack of product knowledge as well. I get that there a lot of variables in cars but I would rather wait 10 minutes for them to research it that be told rubbish. One thing that annoyed me was after telling one what I would be using it for (loads of motorway driving and need all wheel drive) when I was looking at one said, if you were a woman then I'd tell you to buy that but you would be better with a bigger engine. Just left me thinking he was a twat that you couldn't trust.

  5. #1804
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Casey1875 View Post
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    Unfortunately all I have had are the Swiss Tony types. One thing that is glaringly obvious is a real lack of product knowledge as well. I get that there a lot of variables in cars but I would rather wait 10 minutes for them to research it that be told rubbish. One thing that annoyed me was after telling one what I would be using it for (loads of motorway driving and need all wheel drive) when I was looking at one said, if you were a woman then I'd tell you to buy that but you would be better with a bigger engine. Just left me thinking he was a twat that you couldn't trust.
    I think it may come down to who is in charge of recruiting and training for each showroom or dealership group - when I first was hired into the trade there was a big emphasis on finding someone who could meet individual targets yet work as part of a team, but also to put that person through the official manufacturer training (and I’ll go out and say that the BMW training academy is one of the best training facilities in the country, period). Hugely expensive for the business to do so.

    As a result we had an office of people who knew the product but wouldn’t screw each other over. If a customer walked in on someone’s day off then another colleague would help them knowing it’d be reciprocated down the line.

    Got headhunted by another showroom a few years later and the experience was the opposite - dog eat dog, poor training, blame culture (that landed with nobody but the salesperson). Made myself ill within seven months. Horrible experience. The senior salesperson there was a hideous **** who didn’t look after his customers, was a bully and screwed over anyone to get an advantage himself.

    Still, I’d say the majority I met in the trade were good - but good staff tend to attract other good staff to the same showroom so there may be a reason why people tend to find Swiss Toni’s in groups.

  6. #1805
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    Walking in to the Arnold Clark car showroom in Seafield and being greeted with the salesman saying "a'right big man" made me turn around and walk out!

  7. #1806
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by c31 View Post
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    Walking in to the Arnold Clark car showroom in Seafield and being greeted with the salesman saying "a'right big man" made me turn around and walk out!
    I absolutely hate that as well

    At the training academy we went to, there was an entire morning spent on greeting people properly. They'd get absolutely buried if one of the team there seen that.

    I perfected the greeting that shows that I'm mindfully not badgering them or getting into chatting straight away, but also let them know I was there to help out. It got the initial "ah god, now he's speaking to us" out of the way, but also let them have some time to look around. Later sales managers tried to beat that out of me as the old school way of thinking was "when they come in, go and speak to them, don't take no or go away for an answer and don't let them leave without buying a car" and things went totally downhill for me after that.

    I sold most of my cars to people who didn't like car salespeople as I really dislike being sold to myself and treated people the way I liked to be treated.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  8. #1807
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    On the subject of car showrooms - VIP events, sales events and the like that. Half the time the "discounts" aren't that great, the "free gifts" are accounted for when a deal and discount is being drawn up (i.e. if the free gift has a £200 value, the dealership will just give £200 less discount than they would be able to).

    The companies brought in to call to invite people in never take into account if a person is in a position to change car. When salespeople did that themselves, they wouldn't call someone who didn't want to come along, who had been in and had for example been declined finance or were in negative equity and couldn't change - these companies just drag anyone in and get their hopes up too. Wastes that persons time, wastes the salespersons time, nobody leaves it looking good.

    Even worse, the whole "invite only" thing is bollocks. If someone pulls up, gets out of a car with their card in hand and says "I'd like to buy a car", they're not being told it's an invite only event. Salespeople aren't allowed time off on this period - annual leave is cancelled, days off are cancelled and the like.

    It's completely insulting to the intelligence of customers and staff and is usually when a calamitously uncreative area manager and marketing team sit down and figure out how to sell more cars.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  9. #1808
    @hibs.net private member speedy_gonzales's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    On the subject of car showrooms - VIP events, sales events and the like that. Half the time the "discounts" aren't that great, the "free gifts" are accounted for when a deal and discount is being drawn up (i.e. if the free gift has a £200 value, the dealership will just give £200 less discount than they would be able to).

    The companies brought in to call to invite people in never take into account if a person is in a position to change car. When salespeople did that themselves, they wouldn't call someone who didn't want to come along, who had been in and had for example been declined finance or were in negative equity and couldn't change - these companies just drag anyone in and get their hopes up too. Wastes that persons time, wastes the salespersons time, nobody leaves it looking good.

    Even worse, the whole "invite only" thing is bollocks. If someone pulls up, gets out of a car with their card in hand and says "I'd like to buy a car", they're not being told it's an invite only event. Salespeople aren't allowed time off on this period - annual leave is cancelled, days off are cancelled and the like.

    It's completely insulting to the intelligence of customers and staff and is usually when a calamitously uncreative area manager and marketing team sit down and figure out how to sell more cars.
    You sound like you've worked in a Peter Vardy showroom 🤣
    The "invite only" event is exactly what was happening the day my wife and I decided to look for a new car. The showroom was a hive of activity, chaotic, quite off-putting actually.
    There was no salesman available to deal with us but they didn't want to lose a sale so asked one of their technicians to take us out on a test ride. Now, I'm not sure if that was a deliberate ploy or not, but not being harassed or brown-nosed by an over enthusiastic sales guy is one of the contributing factors to us actually buying the car.
    We had an idea what we wanted, we knew what we could afford, all we needed was the opportunity to drive the car without the spiel.

  10. #1809
    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    On the subject of car showrooms - VIP events, sales events and the like that. Half the time the "discounts" aren't that great, the "free gifts" are accounted for when a deal and discount is being drawn up (i.e. if the free gift has a £200 value, the dealership will just give £200 less discount than they would be able to).

    The companies brought in to call to invite people in never take into account if a person is in a position to change car. When salespeople did that themselves, they wouldn't call someone who didn't want to come along, who had been in and had for example been declined finance or were in negative equity and couldn't change - these companies just drag anyone in and get their hopes up too. Wastes that persons time, wastes the salespersons time, nobody leaves it looking good.

    Even worse, the whole "invite only" thing is bollocks. If someone pulls up, gets out of a car with their card in hand and says "I'd like to buy a car", they're not being told it's an invite only event. Salespeople aren't allowed time off on this period - annual leave is cancelled, days off are cancelled and the like.

    It's completely insulting to the intelligence of customers and staff and is usually when a calamitously uncreative area manager and marketing team sit down and figure out how to sell more cars.
    I’ve been looking for a car recently and was drawn to a deal Nissan were advertising. Go in for a test drive and the guy says do you want me to get you some numbers (yes) he sends me them and they’re all more expensive than the headline deal. I said can I just get the deal one then? That’s only in red and we don’t have any.

    So basically they’re advertising a deal that’s not available.

  11. #1810
    And another one - when the salesman goes “let me just go and speak to my manager” and comes back with a deal that they’re doing just for you and that’s costing them money to do.

    Aye right.

  12. #1811
    @hibs.net private member Mikey_1875's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    the experience was the opposite - dog eat dog, poor training, blame culture (that landed with nobody but the salesperson).
    This was my experience of working in car sales for a couple of years as well. Again, it was driven by a similar type of sales manager(s) that you describe. One thing that did impress me was their creativity in making up new insults/reasons to slag you and the team off every morning meeting! One manager was particularly handy at dishing out fines left, right and centre for any minor indiscretions.

    Pretty toxic atmosphere most of the time with tensions running high as the showroom as a whole was not meeting targets. The difference in wages between hitting and not hitting target is so big that it will always lead to desperation tactics when dealing with customers. As you said have came across plenty of jack the lad type salesman but there are also plenty of good ones I have worked with too.

    Happy to be out of the industry but one thing I will say in the defence is that salesman get a bad reputation for telling lies (and in some cases well deserved) but it is nothing compared to half the nonsense that would come out of the customers mouths on a daily basis. Incredible some of the tales they would come out with to avoid just telling you the real objection. Part of the job though and certainly made me a lot less naive when dealing with people in general.

    From what I have seen and heard recently is that the classic salesman is on the way out and will slowly be replaced with more and more product genius’ who are less interested (and compensated) for the hard sell. Negotiating deals will be a thing of the past and it will just be one rate/price for all take it or leave it.

  13. #1812
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danderhall Hibs View Post
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    I’ve been looking for a car recently and was drawn to a deal Nissan were advertising. Go in for a test drive and the guy says do you want me to get you some numbers (yes) he sends me them and they’re all more expensive than the headline deal. I said can I just get the deal one then? That’s only in red and we don’t have any.

    So basically they’re advertising a deal that’s not available.
    Absolutely HATED that with a passion. It made the salesperson look dishonest when it was the company who knew what they were doing. Literally no reason why the same discount couldn’t be given for any colour.

    Customers never seen past blaming the salesperson though. Hugely thankless job, that.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  14. #1813
    @hibs.net private member McD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danderhall Hibs View Post
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    I’ve been looking for a car recently and was drawn to a deal Nissan were advertising. Go in for a test drive and the guy says do you want me to get you some numbers (yes) he sends me them and they’re all more expensive than the headline deal. I said can I just get the deal one then? That’s only in red and we don’t have any.

    So basically they’re advertising a deal that’s not available.


    once was chatting to a guy who’d worked as a car salesman, and he was speaking about this. Said that it was virtually Impossible to get a car for the price in an advert, due to a myriad of small print, down to things like the price only being for say first responders or serving armed forces, specific colour, advertised price only available at specific days/times of the week, price only applies if you take a service plan, and so on

    and, even if all those conditions were met, there would always be admin fees, cost to put fuel in, etc, to be added as well

  15. #1814
    @hibs.net private member GlesgaeHibby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scouse Hibee View Post
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    Mobility scooters on the road that shouldn’t be.
    Absolutely. Nearly hit this pillock the other week. Came round a bend on the 60mph coast road to be met with this arse trundling along the middle of the road. He does it just to be obtuse as well.

    https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/new...-east-lothian/

  16. #1815
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GlesgaeHibby View Post
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    Absolutely. Nearly hit this pillock the other week. Came round a bend on the 60mph coast road to be met with this arse trundling along the middle of the road. He does it just to be obtuse as well.

    https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/new...-east-lothian/
    Sounds a proper dickhead.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  17. #1816
    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    Sounds a proper dickhead.
    He might have a legal right to be there but that won't stop him getting flattened.

  18. #1817
    @hibs.net private member Moulin Yarns's Avatar
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    On the subject of car salespersons, before Christmas I was wanting a look at the Peugeot e-2008 and went to the local dealer, one guy had a couple going through the paperwork at a desk, one was in an office on the phone and 2 others were chatting by the coffee machine. I wandered round the car, looking in all the windows, getting down to look closer at the grille and wheels, showing a lot of interest in the car. Not so much as an acknowledgement!
    WASH YOUR HANDS, WEAR A MASK, KEEP 2M APART AND GET THE VACCINE

  19. #1818
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikey_1875 View Post
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    Happy to be out of the industry but one thing I will say in the defence is that salesman get a bad reputation for telling lies (and in some cases well deserved) but it is nothing compared to half the nonsense that would come out of the customers mouths on a daily basis. Incredible some of the tales they would come out with to avoid just telling you the real objection. Part of the job though and certainly made me a lot less naive when dealing with people in general.
    Yep, some people thought that talking to salespeople like dirt would get them a good deal. I had one person who casually informed me that "I want the best deal and if anything goes wrong I can find out where you live and we can sort it there". I reported it to my area manager who did nothing about it but an "I know that customer, he's a right character. He won't mean it". The same guy phoned five or six times a day screaming and barking down the phone. I left two months after and caused as much pettiness around that office as much as I could before leaving.

    Also had another customer in that two month limbo period who when asked a fairly routine question about an option he wanted in the car went off on one, calling me all sorts. Thought nothing of it, but got an e-mail asking for a quote which made it clear that he'd gone around every dealership and the cheapest price would win. Simply replied "following our previous correspondences, I politely decline the opportunity to tender for your business. I wish you well in your search for a car". He went off the handle at that one too, phoning up and saying it's a disgrace and it sounds like I didn't want his business. Calmly replied "You're quite correct, I don't".

    You're quite right about the amount of lies you're told though, I missed out on a customer satisfaction bonus one month because someone claimed that I'd promised them their factory order car within five weeks (I defo hadn't, don't promise anything you're not certain will happen) and gave me a terrible review on a customer satisfaction survey, despite having arranged all sorts for the delivery to make life easier for them, even getting their new car delivered to their door. Got absolutely chewed out by my area manager for the promises I hadn't made.

    It's not something that will ever gather any steam because people have no sympathy for salespeople, but it's seen as acceptable even within their employers sometimes for them to take all sorts of abuse. I genuinely ended up quite unwell at the end of my time in the trade - dizzy spells, physically sick every morning, lost a lot of weight, lack of sleep. Absolutely bugger all support in regards to that, apart from a "Are you in a fit state to work?" on one occasion.

    I wouldn't advise for anyone to go into a sales job in the motor trade nowadays; manufacturer demands and targets are so unrealistically high and that just filters down onto the sales floor.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

  20. #1819
    @hibs.net private member Peevemor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    ...

    It's not something that will ever gather any steam because people have no sympathy for salespeople, ...
    I often do to be honest.

    Working in building I've dealt with countless sales reps over the years. The ones who have the easiest job are those that work for the likes of Velux (for example) - they don't have to sell you anything as the product sells itself. They're there simply to make sure you know about any new products/ranges and that your catalogues are up to date. Compare that to the middle aged guy who turns up in a shabby suit trying to sell you artificial stone cladding made from polystyrene and you think - "you poor b*****d, how did you end up doing that?."

    I'm not even rude to people cold calling by phone (apart from the tossers tryng to sell you investment opportunities). I'm sure these people would much rather earn their living in a more rewarding way than working in a call centre trying to sell crap to folk.

    All I expect from any sales person is that he (or she) is straight with me, that he knows his stuff, that he treats me with the same respect that I show him and that he doesn't take me for an idiot.

    And above all, understand that when I say no I mean it.
    Last edited by Peevemor; Yesterday at 01:41 PM.

  21. #1820
    @hibs.net private member hibee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns View Post
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    On the subject of car salespersons, before Christmas I was wanting a look at the Peugeot e-2008 and went to the local dealer, one guy had a couple going through the paperwork at a desk, one was in an office on the phone and 2 others were chatting by the coffee machine. I wandered round the car, looking in all the windows, getting down to look closer at the grille and wheels, showing a lot of interest in the car. Not so much as an acknowledgement!
    That sounds like my ideal experience, I’d much rather go to them if I need something than have them trying to start a conversation!

  22. #1821
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danderhall Hibs View Post
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    And another one - when the salesman goes “let me just go and speak to my manager” and comes back with a deal that they’re doing just for you and that’s costing them money to do.

    Aye right.
    That’s a nonsense, eh? Why bother with the farce, everyone knows it’s bollocks.
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  23. #1822
    @hibs.net private member Peevemor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by matty_f View Post
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    That’s a nonsense, eh? Why bother with the farce, everyone knows it’s bollocks.
    Apart from if the manager is also the sales guy's wife, in which case it's probably true.

  24. #1823
    @hibs.net private member Mikey_1875's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    I wouldn't advise for anyone to go into a sales job in the motor trade nowadays; manufacturer demands and targets are so unrealistically high and that just filters down onto the sales floor.
    The stories you tell are typical of a normal day at the office and it’s very difficult to leave all that stuff at the door when you come in from work. With the benefit of hindsight I can look back on it as ‘character building’ but the industry is definitely in need of a shake up as some of the processes are well in the dark ages. Just don’t get me started on people and their obsession with ****ing car mats

  25. #1824
    @hibs.net private member GlesgaeHibby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northernhibee View Post
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    Sounds a proper dickhead.
    Quote Originally Posted by Killiehibbie View Post
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    He might have a legal right to be there but that won't stop him getting flattened.
    There's no reasoning with him. The police and other residents have tried speaking with him to try and encourage him to use the pavement - for his own safety as well as that of other road users. The pavement in question is a good size largely split into two parts as well, with a lane for cyclists and one for people walking. I think the guy gets a kick out of being an arse.

  26. #1825
    Ultimate Slaver Keith_M's Avatar
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    Wow, the complaints about car salesmen have really got some folk on the defensive





    FWIW, even though I've met some really annoyingly pushy salesmen (like the one I mentioned), I've also encountered quite a few who would just welcome you when you arrive, tell you 'if you need any assistance, just come over to my desk', then leave you to look around without any stress.

    That's definitely how it should be.

  27. #1826
    Pun Lovin' Criminal Northernhibee's Avatar
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    People who park in loading bays. Just had to carry a whole load of heavy shelving a country mile as the two nearest loading bays had cars in with their hazards on.


    Do you think your security can keep you in purity, you will not shake us off above or below. Scottish friction, Scottish fiction

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