What should happen to honours won by Rangers in the EBT years?

[JeMeSouviens]

The Old Rangers FC have finally been found guilty of tax dodging by the Supreme Court.

They were previously found guilty of failing to disclose the EBT payments (and side letters that guaranteed them) to the SFA and fined £250000. However, nothing was done regarding the honours the club won while it was making the payments as at the time of the SFA's verdict, a First Tier Tax Tribunal had found the payments weren't liable to tax. Therefore the SFA maintained that no sporting advantage was gained because other clubs could have done the same thing.

Now the Supreme Court verdict is finally in, what should happen?

[CallumLaidlaw]

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The Old Rangers FC have finally been found guilty of tax dodging by the Supreme Court.

They were previously found guilty of failing to disclose the EBT payments (and side letters that guaranteed them) to the SFA and fined £250000. However, nothing was done regarding the honours the club won while it was making the payments as at the time of the SFA's verdict, a First Tier Tax Tribunal had found the payments weren't liable to tax. Therefore the SFA maintained that no sporting advantage was gained because other clubs could have done the same thing.

Now the Supreme Court verdict is finally in, what should happen?

They should be stripped but the titles should remain vacant for those years. If they had not used the EBT scheme there's no proof as to how results would've panned out.


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[hfc rd]

Should be stripped. Cheated to win those trophies and should have them removed from their name

[Carheenlea]

Doesn't bother me really. Lost interest in the Rangers saga a long time ago and the eyes glaze over when the subject raises it's head. Has no bearing on us really.

[MichaelTheCelt]

Stripped and voided. An asterisk should go beside those years in the history books with a statement as to why they were voided.

* For cheating and bringing the game into disrepute, or something like that.

[Sweet Left Peg]

Void them. They cheated to win them but it's impossible to say how other teams would have fared against Rangers teams full of players that they could afford. There was clearly a sporting advantage sought, otherwise why do it in the first place? Why go to such lengths to put players on the pitch that they couldn't otherwise afford? But you can't say that because the team placed first cheated, the team that was second should be awarded it in their place. There are far too many variables in football. Replace the players that benefitted from EBTs with different players and every single match played would turn out differently due to different individuals making different decisions at different points of the game. Some of the scores may have been the same but only through chance. So the only way to alter the history books, as it were, is to say that because Rangers cheated, their records should become null and void.

[Jag7]

I see Barry Ferguson could owe the taxman £1.4m what kind of money were they paying him !!! 😱

[Hibbycol]

Strip them of trophies and titles , incidentally on this subject will eufa want to take the Huns to court to get the money back that was given to the Huns for the European games , leagues they where in ? I do hope so because they are CHEATING BAR STEWARDS ( proven guilty in court by the law) 😁

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[Keith_M]

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I see Barry Ferguson could owe the taxman £1.4m what kind of money were they paying him !!! 😱

I think that's an estimate based on a 50% tax rate, at least it was in the DR.

[makaveli1875]

Strip them of everything they won by cheating

[GreenNWhiteArmy]

I don't think its as black and white as a lot of people have been making out since the ruling. The knock on effect is huge.

Do all points awarded become null and void? What about the impact its had on the other teams not directly impacted by being a runners up. clubs that suffered relegation as a consequence of this?

What about the titles Rangers didn't win how do we compensate clubs who were directly behind them? the year we finished third for example would we have been bumped up to 2nd so potentially missed out on CL revenue?

[lapsedhibee]

The Supreme Court ruling is neither here nor there. The Old Thes should have forfeited every game in which they fielded 'imperfectly registered players' as soon as the side letters became public knowledge. Either league standings should be recalculated for those years assuming The Old Thes lost every match 3-0, and titles awarded accordingly, or - if the rest of the SPFL clubs prefer - asterisks should be put against all the titles and trophies won by the Huns during the period. And if the total of asterisked titles and trophies comes to 13, the Thes should be made to wear 13 asterisks on their tops for five years. (Unless the Thes are a new club, in which case they shouldn't.)

Issue for me is not about tax dodging. They embarked on a risky tax strategy which failed - a bad business decision. Issue is about corrupt governance. Small clubs are made to suffer for accidentally contravening the sport's regulations, and Rangers should suffer (by more than a nominal fine) for wantonly flouting the sport's regulations. Heartily sick of the huns being above and beyond the rules in every way. When I see a hun forearm smash a Hibs player at Ibrox (Boyd/Zemmama), I want to see an immediate red card for the hun. Doing away with some of their historic titles might be a small start in creating a level-playing-field culture.

[Ozyhibby]

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I think that's an estimate based on a 50% tax rate, at least it was in the DR.

Ferguson a bill will be nearer £4.5m when penalties and interest are applied.


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[IncredibleHibee]

Tax evasion is illegal and that is oldco's crime. Now, someone who for example deals drugs for money is committing a crime. under the law the drug money , ill gotten gains, is forfeited/taken away. Oldco's ill gotten gains are the trophies so it only follows that they too are taken away.

[SirDavidsNapper]

Stripped 100% They gained an advantage on the field through dodgy deals. End of. If it doesn't happen it's another disgrace.

[KWJ]

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They should be stripped but the titles should remain vacant for those years. If they had not used the EBT scheme there's no proof as to how results would've panned out.


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This. Voted the 2nd one but this.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004%E2%80%9305_Serie_A

[Ozyhibby]

If the poll results in a vote in favour of stripping the titles, would the admins consider releasing a statement from Hibs.net similar to those released by Aberdeen and Dundee Utd fans?

[MacGruber]

They're not the only team to have been cheating!
Not naming any names, let's just say those that stole the poppies and leave it at that

[lapsedhibee]

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This. Voted the 2nd one but this.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004%E2%80%9305_Serie_A

Astonishingly competitive league table - only 3 points separated UEFA Cup qualifiers Roma from relegated Bologna, and they had exactly the same goal difference!

[Bristolhibby]

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I don't think its as black and white as a lot of people have been making out since the ruling. The knock on effect is huge.

Do all points awarded become null and void? What about the impact its had on the other teams not directly impacted by being a runners up. clubs that suffered relegation as a consequence of this?

What about the titles Rangers didn't win how do we compensate clubs who were directly behind them? the year we finished third for example would we have been bumped up to 2nd so potentially missed out on CL revenue?

Yes, we did get cheated.

Strip titles and Cup wins.

Practically it makes no difference, but it makes a massive statement that cheats shouldn't prosper.

J

[guthrie01]

Should they be stripped of titles ?
Yes

Will they be stripped of the titles ?
Not a chance

There will be a few days of outrage then fans will slowly forget about it and Rangers will once again dodge any real penalty for their cheating

[blackpoolhibs]

Every cup win that was won from cheating should be stripped from their cup tally, and every league game should be given now as a 3-0 defeat.

Resulting in those title wins also being stripped from them.

Every season they cheated and won something, their name should be wiped from that list, and a star put next to the winners that says, no winner and give the reason.

People will then look at the records and see there was no winner and also see why.

[Ozyhibby]

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Every cup win that was won from cheating should be stripped from their cup tally, and every league game should be given now as a 3-0 defeat.

Resulting in those title wins also being stripped from them.

Every season they cheated and won something, their name should be wiped from that list, and a star put next to the winners that says, no winner and give the reason.

People will then look at the records and see why there was no winner and also see why.

Agree 100%.


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[Hibrandenburg]

Change the history books and leave the relevant years blank so that future generations will ask the question as to why there are no winners honours for those particular years. That way the scars they have left will be a reminder for generations to come that Glasgow Rangers were cheats and cheats can't be allowed to prosper.

[Ozyhibby]

If the poll results in a vote in favour of stripping the titles, would the admins consider releasing a statement from Hibs.net similar to those released by Aberdeen and Dundee Utd fans?

[lapsedhibee]

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Every cup win that was won from cheating should be stripped from their cup tally, and every league game should be given now as a 3-0 defeat.

Resulting in those title wins also being stripped from them.

Every season they cheated and won something, their name should be wiped from that list, and a star put next to the winners that says, no winner and give the reason.

People will then look at the records and see why there was no winner and also see why.

You can't have both the 3-0 defeats and the asterisks, imo. If you have the 3-0 defeats you have a different league winner shirley?

[.Sean.]

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If the poll results in a vote in favour of stripping the titles, would the admins consider releasing a statement from Hibs.net similar to those released by Aberdeen and Dundee Utd fans?

They absolutely should.

The should have the titles stripped and the winners left blank.

[blackpoolhibs]

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You can't have both the 3-0 defeats and the asterisks, imo. If you have the 3-0 defeats you have a different league winner shirley?

I disagree, i believe you can give them 3-0 defeats and then have no winner, and give the reason why.

[Super_JMcGinn]

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Stripped and voided. An asterisk should go beside those years in the history books with a statement as to why they were voided.

* For cheating and bringing the game into disrepute, or something like that.

Aye right then

[Ozyhibby]

88% voting for stripping the titles so far. Views of Hibs fans beginning to become clear.


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