Petrie Out = Butcher Out

[trev the hat]

For me this is a no brainer & IMO will be crucial in winning over the support. I can't see any way Petrie's decisions can be deemed justified yet again & fear post Petrie we could be left with his appointment. In the focus to remove Petrie it should be fully recognised how much of a failure Butcher has presided over.
I have serious concerns that TB becomes overlooked in the bigger picture & it worries me big time.

[WestStandMoaner]

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For me this is a no brainer & IMO will be crucial in winning over the support. I can't see any way Petrie's decisions can be deemed justified yet again & fear post Petrie we could be left with his appointment. In the focus to remove Petrie it should be fully recognised how much of a failure Butcher has presided over.
I have serious concerns that TB becomes overlooked in the bigger picture & it worries me big time.

Agree I feel the same way, no way should Butcher be able to slide under the radar he must go also

[Paisley Hibby]

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For me this is a no brainer & IMO will be crucial in winning over the support. I can't see any way Petrie's decisions can be deemed justified yet again & fear post Petrie we could be left with his appointment. In the focus to remove Petrie it should be fully recognised how much of a failure Butcher has presided over.
I have serious concerns that TB becomes overlooked in the bigger picture & it worries me big time.

Yes, I said the same on another thread. In fact, I think getting shot of Butcher is more important.

[Captain Trips]

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For me this is a no brainer & IMO will be crucial in winning over the support. I can't see any way Petrie's decisions can be deemed justified yet again & fear post Petrie we could be left with his appointment. In the focus to remove Petrie it should be fully recognised how much of a failure Butcher has presided over.
I have serious concerns that TB becomes overlooked in the bigger picture & it worries me big time.

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Agree I feel the same way, no way should Butcher be able to slide under the radar he must go also

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Yes, I said the same on another thread. In fact, I think getting shot of Butcher is more important.

My thoughts as well glad to see a few others concerned the focus is to much on Petrie.

[IberianHibernian]

Still can`t understand why Butcher hasn`t resigned but I suppose it`s financial though his manager income must be low compared with media work . Seeing he hasn`t resigned , you`d expect him to be sacked but I suppose that may happen when LD takes over . Get the feeling that we just can`t afford to sack him - Petrie gambled money on compensation to Fenlon and Nicholl and ICT on getting bigger crowds and success . Massive error even if we`d stayed up since crowds didn`t go up at all despite press hype and then fiasco of last 5 months . That`s my only doubt about anti Petrie stuff and that is that it deflects attention away from need to get new manager in soon to start planning new team - players and coaches at all levels . In a vacuum now since what decent manager would sign for us with current uncertainty ? Relegation is never good but in different circumstances ( automatic resignation from Butcher even if we`d won play off ) we could have had some momentum going with exciting new manager and some new signings .

[greenlex]

I think the opposite. Petrie must go. Butcher has a blank canvas to get a squad/team to compete for promotion. He knows exactly what is required top to bottom in the playing sense. He has started already. He has the ability as he has done this before including his team being unbeaten at home for the whole season at that level. His Inverness side were playing quick passing football so he can replicate that at ER. Last but not least it will cost us money not only to get rid of him and his team but to bring in a replacement with the knowhow or nous to get us back up again. He needs to be given at least a season and take it from there.

[Winston Ingram]

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For me this is a no brainer & IMO will be crucial in winning over the support. I can't see any way Petrie's decisions can be deemed justified yet again & fear post Petrie we could be left with his appointment. In the focus to remove Petrie it should be fully recognised how much of a failure Butcher has presided over.
I have serious concerns that TB becomes overlooked in the bigger picture & it worries me big time.

Absolutely. Keeping means we're already starting next season on the back foot. If the polls on here are anything to go by he's lost the vast majority of the supporters already.

then there's ST sales. I can't imagine a flood of supporters rushing to the ticket office to watch their team kick it into the corners.

[Captain Trips]

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I think the opposite. Petrie must go. Butcher has a blank canvas to get a squad/team to compete for promotion. He knows exactly what is required top to bottom in the playing sense. He has started already. He has the ability as he has done this before including his team being unbeaten at home for the whole season at that level. His Inverness side were playing quick passing football so he can replicate that at ER. Last but not least it will cost us money not only to get rid of him and his team but to bring in a replacement with the knowhow or nous to get us back up again. He needs to be given at least a season and take it from there.

A blank canvas indeed.



No thanks Terry

[southsider]

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Still can`t understand why Butcher hasn`t resigned but I suppose it`s financial though his manager income must be low compared with media work . Seeing he hasn`t resigned , you`d expect him to be sacked but I suppose that may happen when LD takes over . Get the feeling that we just can`t afford to sack him - Petrie gambled money on compensation to Fenlon and Nicholl and ICT on getting bigger crowds and success . Massive error even if we`d stayed up since crowds didn`t go up at all despite press hype and then fiasco of last 5 months . That`s my only doubt about anti Petrie stuff and that is that it deflects attention away from need to get new manager in soon to start planning new team - players and coaches at all levels . In a vacuum now since what decent manager would sign for us with current uncertainty ? Relegation is never good but in different circumstances ( automatic resignation from Butcher even if we`d won play off ) we could have had some momentum going with exciting new manager and some new signings .

If he had any integrity he would have but like every failed football manager he will wait for a pay-off. These days being a failure brings greater financial reward than success. Doubt there is a clause in his contract about relegation but if not, why not. I am up for a treble, Petrie, Butcher and Malpass. Get them the hell away from my club.

[jacomo]

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I think the opposite. Petrie must go. Butcher has a blank canvas to get a squad/team to compete for promotion. He knows exactly what is required top to bottom in the playing sense. He has started already. He has the ability as he has done this before including his team being unbeaten at home for the whole season at that level. His Inverness side were playing quick passing football so he can replicate that at ER. Last but not least it will cost us money not only to get rid of him and his team but to bring in a replacement with the knowhow or nous to get us back up again. He needs to be given at least a season and take it from there.

The question has to be asked... If he knows what he's doing, why has he made such an abject mess of it so far?

I can't understand how he achieved his success at ICT but I'm past caring. I just think he's the wrong man in the wrong job, and Petrie's latest appointment has been his worst.

[trev the hat]

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I think the opposite. Petrie must go. Butcher has a blank canvas to get a squad/team to compete for promotion. He knows exactly what is required top to bottom in the playing sense. He has started already. He has the ability as he has done this before including his team being unbeaten at home for the whole season at that level. His Inverness side were playing quick passing football so he can replicate that at ER. Last but not least it will cost us money not only to get rid of him and his team but to bring in a replacement with the knowhow or nous to get us back up again. He needs to be given at least a season and take it from there.

With the upmost respect
Can you honestly say you would happily pay to watch more of what you've seen over the last 10 home games ?
Butchers total capitulation & out of depth management coincides with a chairman who is totally alienated from the pulse of the Hibs Family.
Put simply neither understand !!!

[IberianHibernian]

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If he had any integrity he would have but like every failed football manager he will wait for a pay-off. These days being a failure brings greater financial reward than success. Doubt there is a clause in his contract about relegation but if not, why not. I am up for a treble, Petrie, Butcher and Malpass. Get them the hell away from my club.

Surely there must have been a clause ? Agree about the treble but would put managers before Petrie simply because we need to start looking for a new management team ( we have a great opportunity to attract a good manager now in summer ) and right appointment would boost season ticket sales and attract new players .

[jeffers]

Butcher out first for me before he does any more damage to the playing side, IMO he's getting far too easy a ride from some fans not to mention the media.

I keep hearing about how well he did at ICT but his honking record at pretty much every other club he's been at is just glossed over. And how everything will be OK when he gets his own players in. But that doesn't excuse:

• His handling of Alex Harris, who was being rested 'til the end of the season only to select him again a few games later and continue to play him when he was woefully off form.
• Tom Taiwo wasn't in his plans only to select him and then praise him as one of our better players. Oh and then drop him completely for the last half dozen or so games of the season.
• His petty spat with KT, who was our best player, but was rarely selected. But claim in the media he was looking forward to having him fit again. And before someone says he was a troublemaker the easy solution to that was tell him he was not wanted and did not need to report for training as he would be away in the summer.
• Liam Craig as a holding midfielder and captain. Only to be told he was free to go at the end of the season. Great judgement there.
• The substitution of Heffernan for OTJ against Hamilton, only to concede a last gasp equaliser then be left hanging on for penalties in extra time.

But we can trust him not make these type of basic errors when he gets his own players in. Players the calibre of Danny Haynes and Daniel Boateng who was so bad he couldn't even get in the squad. Yeah right. Petrie must go one hundred per cent but get that clown Butcher away as well.

[dave62]

Both Petrie's and Butcher's positions at the club are untenable. Both must go.

[Del Boy]

Hopefully if we force Petrie out then Butcher will follow. Might sound daft seeing as its still May but we're running out of time given that we need to recruit a new manager and they then have to virtually sign a new team!!!

[trev the hat]

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Butcher out first for me before he does any more damage to the playing side, IMO he's getting far too easy a ride from some fans not to mention the media.

I keep hearing about how well he did at ICT but his honking record at pretty much every other club he's been at is just glossed over. And how everything will be OK when he gets his own players in. But that doesn't excuse:

• His handling of Alex Harris, who was being rested 'til the end of the season only to select him again a few games later and continue to play him when he was woefully off form.
• Tom Taiwo wasn't in his plans only to select him and then praise him as one of our better players. Oh and then drop him completely for the last half dozen or so games of the season.
• His petty spat with KT, who was our best player, but was rarely selected. But claim in the media he was looking forward to having him fit again. And before someone says he was a troublemaker the easy solution to that was tell him he was not wanted and did not need to report for training as he would be away in the summer.
• Liam Craig as a holding midfielder and captain. Only to be told he was free to go at the end of the season. Great judgement there.
• The substitution of Heffernan for OTJ against Hamilton, only to concede a last gasp equaliser then be left hanging on for penalties in extra time.

But we can trust him not make these type of basic errors when he gets his own players in. Players the calibre of Danny Haynes and Daniel Boateng who was so bad he couldn't even get in the squad. Yeah right. Petrie must go one hundred per cent but get that clown Butcher away as well.

TB Hibs tenure needs no explaining.
I remember his words in the Eastern Cemetery prior to his 1st game.
I really do hope we as a support post Petrie do not tolerate his significant part in our current predicament.

[greenlex]

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With the upmost respect
Can you honestly say you would happily pay to watch more of what you've seen over the last 10 home games ?
Butchers total capitulation & out of depth management coincides with a chairman who is totally alienated from the pulse of the Hibs Family.
Put simply neither understand !!!

No absolutely not. I wouldn't be happy with that. Thankfully it looks like the players are about to be booted and rightly so. Not one of them a winner and not one of them taking any responsibility on the Park. Would I be happy to watch the Inverness team that turned us over regularly. Yes I would. There are probably other managers out there that could do a better job for sure but they are gonna cost us even more money (with no guarantees)that will ultimately come out the playing budget. Add more cash out the playing budget to get rid of them then it makes no sense to do this right now.

[lucky]

I want RP out followed by TB and MM

All 3 have contributed to our downfall so all must go

[Heedersnvolleys]

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Yes, I said the same on another thread. In fact, I think getting shot of Butcher is more important.

This. But please let Leanne pick the next one.

[trev the hat]

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No absolutely not. I wouldn't be happy with that. Thankfully it looks like the players are about to be booted and rightly so. Not one of them a winner and not one of them taking any responsibility on the Park. Would I be happy to watch the Inverness team that turned us over regularly. Yes I would. There are probably other managers out there that could do a better job for sure but they are gonna cost us even more money (with no guarantees)that will ultimately come out the playing budget. Add more cash out the playing budget to get rid of them then it makes no sense to do this right now.

What makes sense is for us to make sure we don't tolerate mediocrity in amy shape or form.
If the £10k a week contract for Butcher & co isn't terminated along with the inept chairman how can you possibly have any confidence in the manager to bring us forward given his choices substitutions.

[Winston Ingram]

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Butcher out first for me before he does any more damage to the playing side, IMO he's getting far too easy a ride from some fans not to mention the media.

I keep hearing about how well he did at ICT but his honking record at pretty much every other club he's been at is just glossed over. And how everything will be OK when he gets his own players in. But that doesn't excuse:

• His handling of Alex Harris, who was being rested 'til the end of the season only to select him again a few games later and continue to play him when he was woefully off form.
• Tom Taiwo wasn't in his plans only to select him and then praise him as one of our better players. Oh and then drop him completely for the last half dozen or so games of the season.
• His petty spat with KT, who was our best player, but was rarely selected. But claim in the media he was looking forward to having him fit again. And before someone says he was a troublemaker the easy solution to that was tell him he was not wanted and did not need to report for training as he would be away in the summer.
• Liam Craig as a holding midfielder and captain. Only to be told he was free to go at the end of the season. Great judgement there.
• The substitution of Heffernan for OTJ against Hamilton, only to concede a last gasp equaliser then be left hanging on for penalties in extra time.

But we can trust him not make these type of basic errors when he gets his own players in. Players the calibre of Danny Haynes and Daniel Boateng who was so bad he couldn't even get in the squad. Yeah right. Petrie must go one hundred per cent but get that clown Butcher away as well.

Add to that...

• His continued selection of the woeful Michael Nelson
• His refusal to use James McPake
• His dreadful transfer dealings in January
• His complete lack of a plan B
• His vocal and public lack of vilification of the squad.
• Prioritising a trip to a south coast student union over watching our next opponents in one of our biggest games in years.
  

...and as for this 'wait til he gets his own players pish'. The job of a manager is to get the best out of the available resources. Not down tools when your not happy with what's available.

[PatHead]

What if RP won't resign. Do you still want Butcher to go and let Petrie pick the new manager?

Who in their right mind would want the job whilst the Chairman's future is in doubt? A new chairman might not want the new guy.

Things have to be done in a logical order starting with the removal of RP.

For the record I am not sure if Butcher should go.

[Hermit Crab]

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For me this is a no brainer & IMO will be crucial in winning over the support. I can't see any way Petrie's decisions can be deemed justified yet again & fear post Petrie we could be left with his appointment. In the focus to remove Petrie it should be fully recognised how much of a failure Butcher has presided over.
I have serious concerns that TB becomes overlooked in the bigger picture & it worries me big time.

Petrie out.

Butcher out

[greenlex]

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What makes sense is for us to make sure we don't tolerate mediocrity in amy shape or form.
If the £10k a week contract for Butcher & co isn't terminated along with the inept chairman how can you possibly have any confidence in the manager to bring us forward given his choices substitutions.

I'm sure Butcher doesn't tolerate mediocrity in any shape or form. What choices of substitutions are these? The ones he was trying for weeks to find the right winning blend or the ones he used? The squad wasn't good enough. The teams wernt good enough. No money in January to strengthen. We got third rate loanees for the money we did have to try and freshen things up. Didn't work. As has been the norm for the last 7 years we spent money on firing managers rather than paying for better players. It has to stop. Butcher is relatively successful at our level given time. He needs to be given time.

[frazeHFC]

Petrie out. Butcher out. Malpas out.

We are guarenteed to have a pretty much new team for next season, and I am hoping we have a brand new set-up off the field too. Time for serious changes.

[trev the hat]

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I'm sure Butcher doesn't tolerate mediocrity in any shape or form. What choices of substitutions are these? The ones he was trying for weeks to find the right winning blend or the ones he used? The squad wasn't good enough. The teams wernt good enough. No money in January to strengthen. We got third rate loanees for the money we did have to try and freshen things up. Didn't work. As has been the norm for the last 7 years we spent money on firing managers rather than paying for better players. It has to stop. Butcher is relatively successful at our level given time. He needs to be given time.

The substitution choices or lack of them / predictability are clear for all to see unless you leave ER prior to 60 min.
devoid of any thought, craft, purpose.
Who brings in the third rate loanees ??
we didn't try & freshen things up, you ain't kidding !
This our level talk is contributory to where we are right now.
Butcher was given plenty time & he made it clear as day to me anyway that he isn't up to task.
Whilst I fully respect your views I'm genuinely surprised you see things as you do.

[Long Time Hibee]

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Butcher out first for me before he does any more damage to the playing side, IMO he's getting far too easy a ride from some fans not to mention the media.

I keep hearing about how well he did at ICT but his honking record at pretty much every other club he's been at is just glossed over. And how everything will be OK when he gets his own players in. But that doesn't excuse:

• His handling of Alex Harris, who was being rested 'til the end of the season only to select him again a few games later and continue to play him when he was woefully off form.
• Tom Taiwo wasn't in his plans only to select him and then praise him as one of our better players. Oh and then drop him completely for the last half dozen or so games of the season.
• His petty spat with KT, who was our best player, but was rarely selected. But claim in the media he was looking forward to having him fit again. And before someone says he was a troublemaker the easy solution to that was tell him he was not wanted and did not need to report for training as he would be away in the summer.
• Liam Craig as a holding midfielder and captain. Only to be told he was free to go at the end of the season. Great judgement there.
• The substitution of Heffernan for OTJ against Hamilton, only to concede a last gasp equaliser then be left hanging on for penalties in extra time.

But we can trust him not make these type of basic errors when he gets his own players in. Players the calibre of Danny Haynes and Daniel Boateng who was so bad he couldn't even get in the squad. Yeah right. Petrie must go one hundred per cent but get that clown Butcher away as well.

Spot on Jeffers. I've said previously his handling of Alex Harris is really bad management, not to mention telling players when he walked in the door that they're crap and then asking/telling them that they need to help us out before they get the boot.
Guess what they did - GIRUY Boss!!!!!!! Amateur management and really worrying! I was happy when he was appointed but have serious reservations now and have never been more embarrassed to be a Hibs fan.

[Crossgates Hibs]

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My thoughts as well glad to see a few others concerned the focus is to much on Petrie.

Agree with this Petrie doesn't pick the team or coach them. Butcher for me has plenty to answer if he comes out and said there was a player power problem or something he might get a bit support but it looks like he trod on the stronger characters to show who was boss and lost the team. I feel the team chucked it ages ago and hasn't tried a leg since the window closed.

[Long Time Hibee]

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Add to that...

• His continued selection of the woeful Michael Nelson
• His refusal to use James McPake
• His dreadful transfer dealings in January
• His complete lack of a plan B
• His vocal and public lack of vilification of the squad.
• Prioritising a trip to a south coast student union over watching our next opponents in one of our biggest games in years.

...and as for this 'wait til he gets his own players pish'. The job of a manager is to get the best out of the available resources. Not down tools when your not happy with what's available.

It just gets worse when you add it all together and in most businesses, if you mess up so often you get the bullet. (and you don't get your contract paid either!!!!) Also has TB ever explained why he brought in Boateng and then having played him once I think, presumably realised he was awful? It really is a joke and we are all supposed to trust him because he'll have 'his' players?

[The Green Goblin]

I think that part of the problem is that there's a strong feeling that things need to change, for there to be a clean slate and for many people, TB will always have that connection to the 'old' regime and relegation. It's a tricky one tbh, because I think he's failed so far in the job- I can't think of any redeeming aspects of keeping him on, except avoiding a financial blow- but he has been here before and done well. Big risk though, given the pressure to get next season right. Ach, what a sad state of affairs all round.