Has a manager in this much trouble ever survived?

[Hibbyradge]

Alex Ferguson is always used as an example of a manager under pressure who went on to do great things, but he had never lost the fans to the extent Fenlon has.

Not to mention the fact that his ability was never in doubt after dominating Scotland and winning the CWC with Aberdeen.

There are bound to be others, but I can't think of anyone else who has survived the circumstances in which PF finds himself now.

Can you?

[KeithTheHibby]

Can't think of a manager off hand however I don't think Fenlon can survive and turn this around UNLESS he strings together some wins.

The damage has been done in the eyes of the fans and the result on Sunday was the last straw for many of us. Why the board haven't acted yet is beyond me. The only thing I can think of is to give him Saturdays game then act if need be.

[Craig_in_Prague]

Not sure...

But, I think the hatred will become Steve Kean like soon?

Which I found disturbing, but that's how I can see it going.

He & Petrie have ripped the soul out of our football club. I'm so sick of Hibs, that I can barely discuss Scottish football with friends anymore, I feel raged and embarrassed with Hibs. The fact nothing will change and it looks like it's going to get worse, makes me doubly depressed by it all.

[The Hibee Harp]

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Alex Ferguson is always used as an example of a manager under pressure who went on to do great things, but he had never lost the fans to the extent Fenlon has.

Not to mention the fact that his ability was never in doubt after dominating Scotland and winning the CWC with Aberdeen.

There are bound to be others, but I can't think of anyone else who has survived the circumstances in which PF finds himself now.

Can you?

Alex Miller - obviously he never went on to great things but did win a trophy at Hibs?

Was a figure of hate before and then survived on the back of the Skol Cup win for years.

He was never sacked at Hibs.

[Islington Hibs]

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Not sure...

But, I think the hatred will become Steve Kean like soon?

Which I found disturbing, but that's how I can see it going.

He & Petrie have ripped the soul out of our football club. I'm so sick of Hibs, that I can barely discuss Scottish football with friends anymore, I feel raged and embarrassed with Hibs. The fact nothing will change and it looks like it's going to get worse, makes me doubly depressed by it all.

Sadly I agree. I believe in supporting the team but I suspect this is going to turn pretty ugly unfortunately as the support has completely lost confidence in Fenlon and the direction of the club. If Petrie thinks he can tough this out I think he is wrong. Unless results improve (ands the style of play) immediately and dramatically Hibs will be playing in front of very small crowds and those that do turn up will be angry.

This is not good and we are becoming a vicious circle of decline.

[Mixu62]

Saw an article recently, I think it was in the Scotsman, saying that Fenlon is lucky Hibs can't afford to sack him. That's a worry. Hate to say it, but I don't think he's going anywhere yet. I've been close to giving up on Hibs and Scottish football in general recently, don't know why I still make the effort from so far away!

[Hibbyradge]

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Alex Miller - obviously he never went on to great things but did win a trophy at Hibs?

Was a figure of hate before and then survived on the back of the Skol Cup win for years.

He was never sacked at Hibs.

I thought about him, but he had his detractors, loads of them, but he never had the team in the mess Fenlon has.

I thought he was sacked in 1996 though.

[Simkin911]

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Alex Miller - obviously he never went on to great things but did win a trophy at Hibs?

Was a figure of hate before and then survived on the back of the Skol Cup win for years.

He was never sacked at Hibs.

I'll beginning to think Pat will see out his contract. What difference would a poor result against Dundee Utd make?

Off thread, never understood the Alex Miller haters. Worked with little cash really, limited success for what we had and did sign some decent players too. The fact he went on to work in the international set up and Liverpooks no 2 suggests he was no muppet.

[The Hibee Harp]

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I thought about him, but he had his detractors, loads of them, but he never had the team in the mess Fenlon has.

I thought he was sacked in 1996 though.

Nah, he resigned after yet another shocker of a derby performance against Hearts (from memory possibly 4-0 at home???)

Douglas Cromb was said to be in tears and tried to talk him out of it.

[Hibbyradge]

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Nah, he resigned after yet another shocker of a derby performance against Hearts (from memory possibly 4-0 at home???)

Douglas Cromb was said to be in tears and tried to talk him out of it.

That rings a bell, right enough.

[truehibernian]

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I'll beginning to think Pat will see out his contract. What difference would a poor result against Dundee Utd make?

Off thread, never understood the Alex Miller haters. Worked with little cash really, limited success for what we had and did sign some decent players too. The fact he went on to work in the international set up and Liverpooks no 2 suggests he was no muppet.

You wouldn't want to know Alex's thoughts on the East of Scotland game at the weekend then mate 😀.

He still follows Hibs with great interest and affection I can assure you.

[superfurryhibby]

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I'll beginning to think Pat will see out his contract. What difference would a poor result against Dundee Utd make?

Off thread, never understood the Alex Miller haters. Worked with little cash really, limited success for what we had and did sign some decent players too. The fact he went on to work in the international set up and Liverpooks no 2 suggests he was no muppet.

Miller-Not sure about little cash. Hibs were signing players for money we can only dream about now (Paul and Keith Wright, Darren Jackson, Michael O'Neil, ). Miller was always going to struggle with his Hunnish background. The fact that he struggled so much against Hearts didn't help either. The other problem fans had with him was his dull, negative tactics, combined with his hang-dog demeanour it gave birth to the "mogadon" moniker. He was no muppet but he had his time at Hibs and had every chance to buiild some success.

[Craig_in_Prague]

Maybe I was lucky I was too young to remember the crap teams under Miller.
But I really enjoyed growing up and watching us from early 90's, we had some terrific players and had seemed to have a good balance in the team most of the time. The Hearts record probably was the major issue during his tenure, but we started to beat them when we had the likes of Jackson & O'Neil in the side.
We got to a few semi's and finals, thought in the 93 final we were a little unfortunate to have lost and that overhead kick from super ally was a right kick in the stones, but we were top of the league at that time and had attacking players we could only dream of now.
His time definitely petered out, but there was just as many good years/teams as there was bad, surely ?

[Steve-O]

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Nah, he resigned after yet another shocker of a derby performance against Hearts (from memory possibly 4-0 at home???)

Douglas Cromb was said to be in tears and tried to talk him out of it.

Was 3-1 at home but we were 3-0 down by half time.

[truehibernian]

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Maybe I was lucky I was too young to remember the crap teams under Miller.
But I really enjoyed growing up and watching us from early 90's, we had some terrific players and had seemed to have a good balance in the team most of the time. The Hearts record probably was the major issue during his tenure, but we started to beat them when we had the likes of Jackson & O'Neil in the side.
We got to a few semi's and finals, thought in the 93 final we were a little unfortunate to have lost and that overhead kick from super ally was a right kick in the stones, but we were top of the league at that time and had attacking players we could only dream of now.
His time definitely petered out, but there was just as many good years/teams as there was bad, surely ?

He had varying degrees of 'success' but I tell you what you won't meet a guy more knowledgable about teams and players.

Still has a huge card index system of players and tactics. The wealth of knowledge, in depth analysis of opponents and enthusiasm for the game at all age levels could be invaluable to Hibs at present - but I'm a wee bit biased as I know the family.

[Aldo]

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He had varying degrees of 'success' but I tell you what you won't meet a guy more knowledgable about teams and players.

Still has a huge card index system of players and tactics. The wealth of knowledge, in depth analysis of opponents and enthusiasm for the game at all age levels could be invaluable to Hibs at present - but I'm a wee bit biased as I know the family.

The only reason Miller wasn't really accepted at Hibs was because if his rangers connection.

I used to get slated for supporting him. Like you say he did bring the likes of Jackson, Keith, Crunchie, Goram to the club.

Could we see him as a DOF??

Maybe with a younger manager??

Couldn't be any worse at the moment.

[Makaveli]

My first thoughts were "Steve Kean" and then "no."

I pray we don't go months with a manager who ends up universally despised.

Fenlon out now.

[Captain Trips]

Thought CC in summer of 2011 was IMO way out of it in terms if performance and his own attitude. Could not believe and still don't believe we never let him leave when there was interest. How Petrie stayed employed after that is unbelievable.

[Saorsa]

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The only reason Miller wasn't really accepted at Hibs was because if his rangers connection.

I used to get slated for supporting him. Like you say he did bring the likes of Jackson, Keith, Crunchie, Goram to the club.

Could we see him as a DOF??

Maybe with a younger manager??

Couldn't be any worse at the moment.

Nah sorry mate, that's a line usually trotted out by the weegie media, he was disliked because the fitba we played under him was painful. They used the same line about Mr. Blooby too and it was pish then as well. I'd rather punch masel in the face than watch again for that number of years the fitba we played when those two were in charge and it has nowt tae do with them being stickies

[spike220]

Graham Henry after the 2007 Rugby World Cup, never seen anything like before, there were whole books written condemning his coaching, philosophies and tactics. He lost friends and the fans, half of fans said they would rather support Australia than the All Blacks led by Graham Henry. ONE OF THE BEST COME BACKS EVER!!! - Sorry could not think of footballing equivalent.

[PeterboroHibee]

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I'll beginning to think Pat will see out his contract. What difference would a poor result against Dundee Utd make?

Ive got that feeling as well. Theres not much lower we can go that getting humiliated in big games and struggling to get into the others, yet the board dont seem to be concerned. I wonder what would make them react, Hearts catching up with us (which is a possibility)?

[spike220]

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Ive got that feeling as well. Theres not much lower we can go that getting humiliated in big games and struggling to get into the others, yet the board dont seem to be concerned. I wonder what would make them react, Hearts catching up with us (which is a possibility)?

Hearts will be lucky to be on zero by December, that was their cup final they played on Sat. As per one of my favourite quotes of all time applies to them: "Your going nowhere - and your thrilled to death about it."

[StevieC]

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He had varying degrees of 'success' but I tell you what you won't meet a guy more knowledgable about teams and players.

He was also well respected by the players and meant to have been an excellent coach.

It was a time in Scottish football where relegation was a HUGE issue and survival was the main objective. There is no doubt that Miller set out his teams defensively, with the objective being to prevent goals and gain the required points needed for safety.

[blackpoolhibs]

That line about we never accepted Miller because of his hun connections has become a FACT, just like how the team has never recovered since Petrie backed the players against Collins when they went to his house.

I'd take Ally McCoist with Bomber Brown, and Bob Malcolm as kit man if we were a winning attractive team to watch.

[Kato]

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The only reason Miller wasn't really accepted at Hibs was because if his rangers connection.

Really? Nothing to do with years of over-cautious, mind-numbing defensive football? Nothing to do with his inability to win a derby? Nothing to do with keeping any creativity batonned down through zonal tactics?

I used to get slated for supporting him. Like you say he did bring the likes of Jackson, Keith, Crunchie, Goram to the club.

It took him about 5-6 years to bring Jackson, Keith, Crunchie et al to the club.

Listen to what Budgie said about him in his book - the worst manager he ever worked under, and he worked under quite a few. Burridge said the way he talked up the opposition before every game stifled Hibs players, that and things like turning any decent winger we ever had under him into a zonal full-back (Tortolano not allowed to cross half-way line game after game) was among other reasons why Hibs fans didn't like him. The Rangers thing was an issue for some sure but most forgot about that the day he had a fight with Fergie's brother on the touch line, he wasn't popular amongst the vast majority because of football reasons, nothing else.

[Treadstone]

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That line about we never accepted Miller because of his hun connections has become a FACT, just like how the team has never recovered since Petrie backed the players against Collins when they went to his house.

I'd take Ally McCoist with Bomber Brown, and Bob Malcolm as kit man if we were a winning attractive team to watch.

Correct. Dougie Cromb tried spinning that one anytime Miller was under pressure. It took Lawrie Reilly himself, a man usually content to protect his privacy, to call it a 'smokescreen'.

[TowerHibs]

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Can't think of a manager off hand however I don't think Fenlon can survive and turn this around UNLESS he strings together some wins.

The damage has been done in the eyes of the fans and the result on Sunday was the last straw for many of us. Why the board haven't acted yet is beyond me. The only thing I can think of is to give him Saturdays game then act if need be.

Petrie has his own long term interests in mind ATM. he will be in London with other SFA blazers living it large

[hibeedonald]

A convincing win v dundee united and this board will look a completely different place.

[PeterboroHibee]

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A convincing win v dundee united and this board will look a completely different place.

I do think that a good result can change the fans minds quite quickly, and football can be a very fickle place. I dont think the unrest amongst the fans in this instance is unjustified however. Our last five results have been -

0-1
0-1
0-7
0-2
0-3

And we have been largely dreadful in all of them. I think its going to take more than a good win against United (who themselves are struggling a bit) to convince the fans, this reaction has been a long time coming (when you consider the likes of 5-1 etc)!

[LeithBoozy]

I only hope they don't leave getting rid of him to long, I remember the sickening scenes of the dons fans spitting on Mark McGee as he walked along the touchline, very sad indeed.