Hearts and Europe? (accounts published on 3 May)

[Winston Ingram]

I thought they couldn't qualify for Europe as they needed to file their accts by the 31st of March to be eligible for a licence. These to my knowledge have yet to be filed.

Tonight the commentator on sky said HoMoFc still had a chance of qualifying if they beat us in the final.

Can anybody shed any light on this?

[Jim44]

Judging by a lack of information to the contrary, and constant reference to the Jambos being a stones throw away from a Europa League place, can we assume that all the talk about their ineligibility because of unaudited accounts and financial irregularities etc. is inaccurate?

[jgl07]

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I thought they couldn't qualify for Europe as they needed to file their accts by the 31st of March to be eligible for a licence. These to my knowledge have yet to be filed.

Tonight the commentator on sky said HoMoFc still had a chance of qualifying if they beat us in the final.

Can anybody shed any light on this?

The slueth-like investigative journalists from the Scottish media have missed out on that one. That is probably for the same reason that they described 'Craig Whyte as a billionairre who was buying the club he loves'. A more dim-whitted and idle bunch of wasters I have yet to see.

Rangers may have submitted 'undercover' accounts to the SFA although if this is the case they would probably have submitted them to the authorities as well.

A 'special case' will probably be used to enable the 'not a going concern' to compete in Europe in the unlikely event that they either beat Hibs in the Cup Final or finish ahead of St Johnstone or Dundee United in the SPL.

[jgl07]

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Judging by a lack of information to the contrary, and constant reference to the Jambos being a stones throw away from a Europa League place, can we assume that all the talk about their ineligibility because of unaudited accounts and financial irregularities etc. is inaccurate?

See other thread.

[Winston Ingram]

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The slueth-like investigative journalists from the Scottish media have missed out on that one. That is probably for the same reason that they described 'Craig Whyte as a billionairre who was buying the club he loves'. A more dim-whitted and idle bunch of wasters I have yet to see.

Rangers may have submitted 'undercover' accounts to the SFA although if this is the case they would probably have submitted them to the authorities as well.

A 'special case' will probably be used to enable the 'not a going concern' to compete in Europe in the unlikely event that they either beat Hibs in the Cup Final or finish ahead of St Johnstone or Dundee United in the SPL.

So technically they have missed it but your opinion is the credible upstanding SFA are gonnae do SFA about it and let them in?

[jgl07]

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So technically they have missed it but your opinion is the credible upstanding SFA are gonnae do SFA about it and let them in?

Technically Hearts require special dispensation to even compete domestically next season if their 2010-2011 accounts were not submitted by the end of March.

Given the statements on Hearts' website about financial support being removed by UBIG and the fact that Hearts' accounts have only been signed off by the auditors for some years because of assurances of this support, things look decidedly dodgy.

They have no accounts filed beyond the 2009-2010 season.

Are the Daily Record on their case? I don't think so. It is the same for the rest of the Scottish Media.

Maybe Alex Thomson will investigate once Rangers have been interred?

[greenginger]

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Technically Hearts require special dispensation to even compete domestically next season if their 2010-2011 accounts were not submitted by the end of March.

Given the statements on Hearts' website about financial support being removed by UBIG and the fact that Hearts' accounts have only been signed off by the auditors for some years because of assurances of this support, things look decidedly dodgy.

They have no accounts filed beyond the 2009-2010 season.

Are the Daily Record on their case? I don't think so. It is the same for the rest of the Scottish Media.

Maybe Alex Thomson will investigate once Rangers have been interred?

Trouble with their Accounts is, that last years accounts although not filed at Companies House until 13/5/2011, are dated as being signed by the auditors on 31/3/2011.
Might be the same this year and the SFA already has copies and the Yams enjoy getting £6,000 penalties from Companies House.

[jgl07]

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Trouble with their Accounts is, that last years accounts although not filed at Companies House until 13/5/2011, are dated as being signed by the auditors on 31/3/2011.
Might be the same this year and the SFA already has copies and the Yams enjoy getting £6,000 penalties from Companies House.

Don't all 'big' companies do that?

[Jim44]

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So technically they have missed it but your opinion is the credible upstanding SFA are gonnae do SFA about it and let them in?

I know I'm prejudiced but you would think that, considering the flak and the venom spat at the SFA by Romanov, they would see them coming, go by the book and give a two fingered salute to their 'special case' status.

[Jack]

Did they not change the dates of their financial year?

Would this make a difference?

[CropleyWasGod]

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Did they not change the dates of their financial year?

Would this make a difference?

No.

[Sir David Gray]

We'll beat Hearts in the final and they'll finish 6th in the table.

Problem solved.

[greenginger]

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Did they not change the dates of their financial year?

Would this make a difference?

They changed the date of their year end from last day in July to last day in June presumably to give them an extra month to get their accounts done by the dead-line and they are still late.

Hope their defenders are as slow.

[Winston Ingram]

So the answer to the question is we don't know?

[happiehibbie]

I have spoken to a good few people in the know and the silence is deafening I even asked David Southern !! he would not confirm they had

[jgl07]

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I have spoken to a good few people in the know and the silence is deafening I even asked David Southern !! he would not confirm they had

I assume we can infer that Hearts' accounts have not been submitted. Otherwise it would have been publicized.

Beware the end is nigh!

[Part/Time Supporter]

Apparently there is a story about Hearts finances on BBC radio this morning.

https://twitter.com/#!/BBCGeoffWebst...17353533636608

Edit: Appears their accounts for the 2010/11 season are being posted to shareholders. Announcing profit for last season and reduced debt from £36M to £24M, due to another debt for equity swap. Now trying to trade without support from Vlad.

[Gatecrasher]

What's a debt equity swap? Is this a we owe money to ourselves kind of thing? I find it hard to believe they managed to shed £12m without a significant sale of a player

[Ozyhibby]

Undoubtedly good news for Hearts. £24m is still a very high debt.

[Part/Time Supporter]

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What's a debt equity swap? Is this a we owe money to ourselves kind of thing? I find it hard to believe they managed to shed £12m without a significant sale of a player

Yes. Hearts borrowed that money from Vlad. They aren't going to pay it back, so instead he takes it in (worthless) shares instead.

The significant thing is that his support is now in the process of stopping. Over the last 7 years his funding has allowed them to spend at least twice as much on players than they would normally be able to do. Hearts now have to find a way to break even without his support, but still having to service £24M+ worth of debt.

There was a lot of scepticism when Romanov said in 2005 that he would fund Hearts by £10M a year for 5 years, but that is more or less what he has done. The problem is they haven't really progressed as a club in that period (same stadium, attendance is about the same, on-field results have been inconsistent at best) and now they have to adjust to a more normal state of affairs. Presumably he will stick his oar in now and again though.

[Gatecrasher]

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Yes. Hearts borrowed that money from Vlad. They aren't going to pay it back, so instead he takes it in (worthless) shares instead.

The significant thing is that his support is now in the process of stopping. Over the last 7 years his funding has allowed them to spend at least twice as much on players than they would normally be able to do. Hearts now have to find a way to break even without his support, but still having to service £24M+ worth of debt.

Thanks PTS that rings a bell now, it will be interesting to see what there operating profit/loss is

[grunt]

They announced a "profit" last year, by virtue of the fact that Vlad gave them an £8m donation.
I expect the same process will have been used this year - so not a debt / equity swap, more likely it will be a forgiveness of debt.
But we shall see later today. As pointed out above, Vlad has actually been very generous to them in recent years.

[happiehibbie]

Brian Mclauglin (scoops) tweeted to day hearts have announced they have reduce there debts according to the accounts so i take it they have been done although Late !!!! am sure rangers had to meet a 31st march deadline

[greenginger]

No sign of any ( 2011) accounts on Companies House web site yet.

[Part/Time Supporter]

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No sign of any ( 2011) accounts on Companies House web site yet.

Accounts would need to be approved at an AGM before they can be posted to CH.

[ScottB]

It's not him being generous, he has no choice but to do that sort of 'donation' every season (until they cut back big time). Hearts have a debt limit of about £40 million don't they? All of Vlad's donations and debt swaps have been to pull them back from that limit.

Thus far it would appear proper cuts are coming in the summer, an overdue dose of normality for them...

[greenginger]

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Accounts would need to be approved at an AGM before they can be posted to CH.

Not on planet Yam apparently. Last year their accounts were published about 3 weeks before their AGM. Vlad says jump and the Yams say " How high " .

[son of haggart]

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It's not him being generous, he has no choice but to do that sort of 'donation' every season (until they cut back big time). Hearts have a debt limit of about £40 million don't they? All of Vlad's donations and debt swaps have been to pull them back from that limit.

Thus far it would appear proper cuts are coming in the summer, an overdue dose of normality for them...

Net debt in the latest accounts is down from £36.1m to £24m. Profit of £511K

[Barney McGrew]

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Net debt in the latest accounts is down from £36.1m to £24m. Profit of £511K

http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/articles/2...241384_2757696

I'm struggling to see how there can be a profit from those figures.

£6.9m turnover for the period, with staff costs still over £8m, operating costs at £3.6m and Vlad's cut (sorry, finance charges ) at £1.44m.

The only way there can be a profit surely is counting whatever DFE swap they've done?

[Hibs07p]

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Net debt in the latest accounts is down from £36.1m to £24m. Profit of £511K

Only £24M, that's allright then? I'm glad they've not got any serious debt to worry about in the coming years.