Rangers fan statement

[PaulSmith]

Ignore the fact that you may have views on Rangers fans:

On September 27th 2011, The Union Bears and The Blue Order held a protest at Ibrox Stadium in the opening ten minutes of the match against against Kilmarnock. The protest consisted of anti-SNP chanting and the unfurling of 3 banners namely;

"Undefinable Laws Against Supporters"
"SNP Weak On Criminals - Tough on Fans"
"Football Fans Not Criminals"

The protest was not challenged by the police and passed peacefully, with other sections of the Rangers support showing unity with the message of the protest.

For clarity, there are several reasons why we feel we must make a stand upon this issue. We are protesting against the implementation on the 'Offensive Behaviour at Football and Threatening Communications (Scotland) Bill' as proposed by the current SNP government. This bill discriminates against football fans, singling out a demographic of the population for specific laws. The implementation of the bill means that almost any football supporter, whether you be vocal in support of your team or not, could be subject to arrest, without significant police evidence of any actual offence caused.

The criminalisation of football supporters threatens the game which we all love. Supporters attending a football match will now be met with fear of arrest, losing your job and being named in newspapers despite having not had your court case heard.

The Union Bears and The Blue Order would like to make it clear we are against Sectarianism and Racism in all forms. We feel current legislation covers offences of these matters and further legislation is not necessary nor required. We feel this action is being used for political gain, and being supported by police officers in order to preserve their level of responsibility and therefore preserve their level of funding in what is economically challenging times.

We have all seen that our supporters are subject to unnecessary harassment from police officers and we have and will continue to work with the Rangers Supporters working group on resolving these matters.

In a completely separate incident tonight, around 100 supporters in the BF1 section walked out in protest at the heavy handed stewarding and policing which took place within the section at the match. The groups have issued a complaint to the police and the club and this will be dealt with in due course. We would like to thank the rest of the Rangers support for the support shown towards the group regarding this matter.

Astonishingly the whole reason for the stewards getting involved was due to a young supporter in the section having a water bottle in the ground. One which he had cleared with another steward before entering and was told it wouldn't be a problem.

Among the incidents was also the situation where mounted Police outside the stadium charged at young supporters including one who was disabled. He was told by the mounted officers to run.

We will be taking further protest action in forthcoming matches, and would urge you all to stand with us as we fight the injustice against the supporters of Rangers Football Club. We will issue another statement prior to the game on Saturday, which will detail how we wish to have your support.

Supporting Your Team Is not a Crime.

[JimBHibees]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Ignore the fact that you may have views on Rangers fans:

On September 27th 2011, The Union Bears and The Blue Order held a protest at Ibrox Stadium in the opening ten minutes of the match against against Kilmarnock. The protest consisted of anti-SNP chanting and the unfurling of 3 banners namely;

"Undefinable Laws Against Supporters"
"SNP Weak On Criminals - Tough on Fans"
"Football Fans Not Criminals"

The protest was not challenged by the police and passed peacefully, with other sections of the Rangers support showing unity with the message of the protest.

For clarity, there are several reasons why we feel we must make a stand upon this issue. We are protesting against the implementation on the 'Offensive Behaviour at Football and Threatening Communications (Scotland) Bill' as proposed by the current SNP government. This bill discriminates against football fans, singling out a demographic of the population for specific laws. The implementation of the bill means that almost any football supporter, whether you be vocal in support of your team or not, could be subject to arrest, without significant police evidence of any actual offence caused.

The criminalisation of football supporters threatens the game which we all love. Supporters attending a football match will now be met with fear of arrest, losing your job and being named in newspapers despite having not had your court case heard.

The Union Bears and The Blue Order would like to make it clear we are against Sectarianism and Racism in all forms. We feel current legislation covers offences of these matters and further legislation is not necessary nor required. We feel this action is being used for political gain, and being supported by police officers in order to preserve their level of responsibility and therefore preserve their level of funding in what is economically challenging times.

We have all seen that our supporters are subject to unnecessary harassment from police officers and we have and will continue to work with the Rangers Supporters working group on resolving these matters.

In a completely separate incident tonight, around 100 supporters in the BF1 section walked out in protest at the heavy handed stewarding and policing which took place within the section at the match. The groups have issued a complaint to the police and the club and this will be dealt with in due course. We would like to thank the rest of the Rangers support for the support shown towards the group regarding this matter.

Astonishingly the whole reason for the stewards getting involved was due to a young supporter in the section having a water bottle in the ground. One which he had cleared with another steward before entering and was told it wouldn't be a problem.

Among the incidents was also the situation where mounted Police outside the stadium charged at young supporters including one who was disabled. He was told by the mounted officers to run.

We will be taking further protest action in forthcoming matches, and would urge you all to stand with us as we fight the injustice against the supporters of Rangers Football Club. We will issue another statement prior to the game on Saturday, which will detail how we wish to have your support.

Supporting Your Team Is not a Crime.

Jeezo get over yourself, what a crock that is. The line in bold is just completely made up scaremongering.

Here's a new one. Support your team as loud as you want however maybe concentrate a little more limiting your song choices to football songs, not sectarian or songs about Irish politics which 90 odd per cent of Scots could care less about.

[Jack]

Its very difficult to sympathise with them.

[bighairyfaeleith]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Its very difficult to sympathise with them.

I'm not even going to try!!

[Hibernia Na Eir]

If it wanst for RFC/CFC we wouldnt be having ANY of these discussions

[Backto my roots]

I'm sure the Police would have a different opinion on those so called 'innocent' young supporters. Let's get real here, for decades rangers have been allowed to march about saying/singing whatever they like (particularly about Catholics) and are now shocked that their so called 'traditions' are now illegal It's long over due a political party in Scotland has had the balls to stand up to them (and anybody no matter which side) to try and get rid of what is Scotland’s Shame. There maybe some mistakes by the Police trying to tackle it but it would so easy to say it's too hard and hope it goes away but we all know it won't. Rangers have the biggest problem so it should start with them!

[cabbageandribs1875]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Supporting Your Team Is not a Crime.

i noticed you missed out the 'no surrender' on this e-mail have to admit whilst reading the e-mail i was starting to feel sorry for the poor paranoid tramps(well...not that sorry), then noticing the 'no surrender' sign-off i then realised just why i f****n detest the bigoted sectarian b******s




Supporting Your Team Is not a Crime.

No Surrender
The Union Bears and The Blue Order

[LancashireHibby]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

i noticed you missed out the 'no surrender' on this e-mail have to admit whilst reading the e-mail i was starting to feel sorry for the poor paranoid tramps(well...not that sorry), then noticing the 'no surrender' sign-off i then realised just why i f****n detest the bigoted sectarian b******s




Supporting Your Team Is not a Crime.

No Surrender
The Union Bears and The Blue Order

Nice spot. I did cringe at the 'Union Bears' name.

[Cabbage East]

What a load of utter pish.

[easty]

Garbage.

The criminalisation of football supporters threatens the game which we all love. Supporters attending a football match will now be met with fear of arrest, losing your job and being named in newspapers despite having not had your court case heard.

I can safely say I won't be fearing arrest, losing my job or being named in a newspaper. Why? Because I don't go to football to make an arse of myself and sing the crap that they're trying to get rid of with part of these 'undefineble laws'.

Maybe The Union Bears could start a campaign called 'Don't Be A Tw@t At The Football'. At least that'd be productive.

[lucky]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I'm sure the Police would have a different opinion on those so called 'innocent' young supporters. Let's get real here, for decades rangers have been allowed to march about saying/singing whatever they like (particularly about Catholics) and are now shocked that their so called 'traditions' are now illegal It's long over due a political party in Scotland has had the balls to stand up to them (and anybody no matter which side) to try and get rid of what is Scotland’s Shame. There maybe some mistakes by the Police trying to tackle it but it would so easy to say it's too hard and hope it goes away but we all know it won't. Rangers have the biggest problem so it should start with them!

under the law being proposed by the anti football government you post calling them huns and bigots could be questionable. 10 Hibs fans arrested to today for breech and fighting at games have had the added bit of religious/sectarian behaviour added. The proposals are piss poor and designed to catch headlines not criminals.

[Barney McGrew]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

under the law being proposed by the anti football government you post calling them huns and bigots could be questionable. 10 Hibs fans arrested to today for breech and fighting at games have had the added bit of religious/sectarian behaviour added. The proposals are piss poor and designed to catch headlines not criminals.

The term 'hun' has been defined as being sectarian, so using it to describe a Rangers fan is indeed a breach of the new law.

While most will have little sympathy for the Rangers support, in a way I kind of agree with them. There were perfectly acceptable laws already in place, it's just that the police and governing bodies chose not to enforce them.

[Gatecrasher]

Fair Play to them for standing up for something they believe in. Whether other fans agree with it or not.

[ancient hibee]

There are two responses on here which would be indictable offences.

[PaulSmith]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

There are two responses on here which would be indictable offences.

I think that was my point, I read stuff on here that is no doubt monitored...(hello to the PC from the 'Sectarian Team' who will no doubt read it)...and you can bet your bottom dollar that it will only be a matter of time before one of main posters on here is arrested at dawn with the accompanying press core, identified as being a bigot/racist without any right to reply until the court case.

To think that only OF fans will be monitored is wrong, to think that its not political IMO is wrong and I do believe that football fans are an easy target and make great headlines but FFS there are a thousand extra things wrong with neighbourhoods the length and breadth of this City (never mind country) that should have a higher priority.


To the previous poster in regards to the 'No Surrender' comment I thought that it would take away the focus of the main just of the message, nothing else.

[Sylar]

I agree entirely with their stance on the issue in all honesty.

Evidently, from some of the responses on here, the opening "ignore the fact that you may have views on Rangers fans" was evidently ignored, as a large number of them aren't even considering the article which has been issued.

As it is, the article hits the nail firmly on the head for me. This new law is ambiguous and will create even further over-zealous officiating at football matches from stewards and the local authorities.

I've no argument that sectarianism and racism both need stamped out of football, but the Blue Order and RSU are quite correct by pointing out that there are well established laws already out there, which aren't enforced. Perhaps it would be more prudent to investigate why this is the case, rather than attempting to fire through some quick-fire, ambitious bill which is lacking clarity throughout and opens up any potential shout/chant/blog post/email (etc) to legal repercussion.

Most people with half a brain between their ears know what is and isn't acceptable behaviour and I guess, if such knowledge can consistently be translated into behaviour, then there is nothing to fear but can everybody who's ever gone to football consistently hold both hands up and say "I've never shouted/sung/said/typed anything in a footballing context which someone might find derogatory"?

The new bill being planned by the Scottish Government is not a solution to sectarianism and racism at football and is likely to impact on a much wider community of Scottish Football fans, rather than specifically targeting those who regularly engage in such behaviour which is unacceptable.

And to think all of this [summits/Bill proposals] stems from a little case of handbags last year - Christ, can you imagine is such action was taken every time Real Madrid and Barcelona meet, as their sideline skirmishes and antics last season were FAR worse than the cup replay at Celtc park.

[Future17]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

To the previous poster in regards to the 'No Surrender' comment I thought that it would take away the focus of the main just of the message, nothing else.

I understand what you mean, but while the message may be commendable (if a little inaccurate) it's delivered by a person(s) who simply doesn't understand the climate which led to this proposed legislation, and their role in creating it.

Separately, it's not "heavy-handed stewarding" to remove a water bottle from someone inside a football stadium - it's the rules. If they care so much about legislation, maybe they should read that which governs their own ground.

[SkintHibby]

What REALLY worries me about this is that Rangers supporters make up a fair percentage of the Scottish electorate and for football fans of a single team to have so much power over how Scotland votes is very, very worrying.

England done a good job in Scotland with it's divide and rule policy.

[Springbank]

These cretins from Govan make me more and more proud of our SCOTTISH GOVERNMENT!!!

It is about time someone stood up to the Blue and Green bigots.

I for one am all for unfurling a banner at Ibrox that reads simply

THERE IS NO PLACE IN 21st CENTURY SCOTLAND FOR BIGOTS

Their 2 clubs are in terminal decline, slower than we'd all like, but terminal decline nonetheless. This is because good people reject their horrible views which perhaps reflect 19th century Scotland, but hardly 21st century Scotland, and certainly not the country I want to bring my wee boy and wee girl up in.

The sooner these Blue Order people are all arrested the better.

[Springbank]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I agree entirely with their stance on the issue in all honesty.

Evidently, from some of the responses on here, the opening "ignore the fact that you may have views on Rangers fans" was evidently ignored, as a large number of them aren't even considering the article which has been issued.

As it is, the article hits the nail firmly on the head for me. This new law is ambiguous and will create even further over-zealous officiating at football matches from stewards and the local authorities.

I've no argument that sectarianism and racism both need stamped out of football, but the Blue Order and RSU are quite correct by pointing out that there are well established laws already out there, which aren't enforced. Perhaps it would be more prudent to investigate why this is the case, rather than attempting to fire through some quick-fire, ambitious bill which is lacking clarity throughout and opens up any potential shout/chant/blog post/email (etc) to legal repercussion.

Most people with half a brain between their ears know what is and isn't acceptable behaviour and I guess, if such knowledge can consistently be translated into behaviour, then there is nothing to fear but can everybody who's ever gone to football consistently hold both hands up and say "I've never shouted/sung/said/typed anything in a footballing context which someone might find derogatory"?

The new bill being planned by the Scottish Government is not a solution to sectarianism and racism at football and is likely to impact on a much wider community of Scottish Football fans, rather than specifically targeting those who regularly engage in such behaviour which is unacceptable.

And to think all of this [summits/Bill proposals] stems from a little case of handbags last year - Christ, can you imagine is such action was taken every time Real Madrid and Barcelona meet, as their sideline skirmishes and antics last season were FAR worse than the cup replay at Celtc park.

There's the flaw in your argument.

These clubs will die (will die) albeit slowly because they have refused to appeal beyond the lowest common denominator.

They have known at boardroom level for decades that their core demographic is what it is (and I'll leave it at that).

Their fatal flaw was to think that it was easier to go with keeping the LCDs happy, rather than tackle the unpalatable truth of their despicable and destructive views

Thankfully, the number of people who can maintain that sheer bigotry into a 5th and 6th generation since the initial wave of Irish immigration into the Glasgow area is dwindling, and good people like Pat Nevin reject their lacklustre policies that are a sop to say they are wanting to tackle it.

Do these clubs really think the only immigration that ever took place was Irish??? My own family were immigrants to Edinburgh from southern Italy and from the Highlands of Scotland. Settled in the Hibs end of town and we're die-hard Hibees.

It should be about football. In Glasgow it is not. And that is why they are dying out.

Well done the Scottish Govt in this case.

[ScottB]

Ultimately, if Rangers and Celtics bigoted element stopped their vile chanting, this law would never have been proposed. If they stop I doubt this law would ever be used.

But once again, rather than deal with, or in some cases, even admit they have a problem, they respond as if their way of life is being attacked / it's all a big conspiracy blah blah blah.

I find it incredibly easy to turn up at a football match or debate on the game without using sectarian, racist or whatever else language. If people can't manage that then screw 'em frankly.

[Liberal Hibby]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

These cretins from Govan make me more and more proud of our SCOTTISH GOVERNMENT!!!

It is about time someone stood up to the Blue and Green bigots.

The sooner these Blue Order people are all arrested the better.

Bit like these guys eh? http://www.hibs.net/showthread.php?2...=1#post2931730

[pacorosssco]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

The term 'hun' has been defined as being sectarian, so using it to describe a Rangers fan is indeed a breach of the new law.

While most will have little sympathy for the Rangers support, in a way I kind of agree with them. There were perfectly acceptable laws already in place, it's just that the police and governing bodies chose not to enforce them.

Hunbelievable

[AlbertK86]

The guy wasnae arrested for singing anything last night. It was for drinking out a bottle that he shouldn't have had in the stadium. Just so happened when the stewards moved in they were blocked by the rest of the protestors the polis moved in. Real radio phoned them earlier and got this explanation

[weonlywon6-2]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

If it wanst for RFC/CFC we wouldnt be having ANY of these discussions

[yeezus.]

Something makes me think that Gers fans are just unhappy with a nationalist Government AND the fact that they and Celtic can no longer get off with their sectarian chanting.

Old Firm = Scotland's shame

[weonlywon6-2]

[ The implementation of the bill means that almost any football supporter, whether you be vocal in support of your team or not, could be subject to arrest, without significant police evidence of any actual offence caused.

what a load of pash.

theyre spitting the dummy out the pram cause they have got away with it for years

[Elephant Stone]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

. This bill discriminates against football fans, singling out a demographic of the population for specific laws.

Oh dear, this bill discriminates against people who want to sing about famine, 300 year old religious wars and terrorism, please take pity on them.

[ancient hibee]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

These cretins from Govan make me more and more proud of our SCOTTISH GOVERNMENT!!!

It is about time someone stood up to the Blue and Green bigots.

I for one am all for unfurling a banner at Ibrox that reads simply

THERE IS NO PLACE IN 21st CENTURY SCOTLAND FOR BIGOTS

Their 2 clubs are in terminal decline, slower than we'd all like, but terminal decline nonetheless. This is because good people reject their horrible views which perhaps reflect 19th century Scotland, but hardly 21st century Scotland, and certainly not the country I want to bring my wee boy and wee girl up in.

The sooner these Blue Order people are all arrested the better.

And which club has just had the greatest number of fans charged with sectarian offences?

[1two]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Supporters attending a football match will now be met with fear of arrest, losing your job and being named in newspapers despite having not had your court case heard.

No I don't!