Board - Invest or leave (Chicken Licken On Standby)

[Baldy Foghorn]

To the current incumbents of the Board, and I hope to God one of them gets passed this to read........

We have a terrific infrastructure in place, to which you have done well to achieve... A great training complex at East Mains, and a terrific Stadium to boot.....

However, NOW is the time to invest in the playing squad, and add some REAL quality...... There is no point in the Stadium being a third full on matchdays, we have to see some quality additions in the Summer or fans will be lost, maybe even for good.....

The fans want to see a successful team on the park, and pay handsomely to do so.....If quality is not added revenue will almost certainly be down.... At AGM in October then the re-arranged AGM after Hughes departed, Fife Hyland (now MD), said he was looking at ways to increase revenue and turnover, well I put it to you Mr Petrie and Mr Hyland, that the only real way of achieving that goal is by putting a watchable product on the park......

Please show us some level of ambition, give us a team to be excited about, if you are not willing to bring in quality, then you do not deserve to be custodians of our wonderful Club...... Time to step up to the plate Gentlemen.

[matty_f]

Ten pages.

I agree with the sentiments of the o.p., but I would add that if we are calling on the board to invest then we as a support have to give them the means to do it, through season ticket purchases etc.

The board should (and are) be looking for other revenue streams but the fundamental principles of the club are that season ticket money goes directly on the team on the pitch.

If we want genuine quality players we need to dip into our pockets once more and help fund it.

I we do that and the board fail to back cc, then they should be held accountable. They can't, however, spend money that isn't there.

[Baldy Foghorn]

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Is this a takeove bid?

Eh?

[Baldy Foghorn]

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Ten pages.

I agree with the sentiments of the o.p., but I would add that if we are calling on the board to invest then we as a support have to give them the means to do it, through season ticket purchases etc.

The board should (and are) be looking for other revenue streams but the fundamental principles of the club are that season ticket money goes directly on the team on the pitch.

If we want genuine quality players we need to dip into our pockets once more and help fund it.

I we do that and the board fail to back cc, then they should be held accountable. They can't, however, spend money that isn't there.

Chicken and Egg scenario Matty, fans want to see what signings are made before investing... Maybe now is the time for the Board to speculate to accumulate?

[gorgie_harp]

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To the current incumbents of the Board, and I hope to God one of them gets passed this to read........

We have a terrific infrastructure in place, to which you have done well to achieve... A great training complex at East Mains, and a terrific Stadium to boot.....

However, NOW is the time to invest in the playing squad, and add some REAL quality...... There is no point in the Stadium being a third full on matchdays, we have to see some quality additions in the Summer or fans will be lost, maybe even for good.....

The fans want to see a successful team on the park, and pay handsomely to do so.....If quality is not added revenue will almost certainly be down.... At AGM in October then the re-arranged AGM after Hughes departed, Fife Hyland (now MD), said he was looking at ways to increase revenue and turnover, well I put it to you Mr Petrie and Mr Hyland, that the only real way of achieving that goal is by putting a watchable product on the park......

Please show us some level of ambition, give us a team to be excited about, if you are not willing to bring in quality, then you do not deserve to be custodians of our wonderful Club...... Time to step up to the plate Gentlemen.

Spot on mate.

[Phil D. Rolls]

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Eh?

You can't go issuing ultimatums (LH, is this right), without an alternative strategy.

Fans: Invest or leave.
Board: Naw.
Fans: Please?

[CropleyWasGod]

Devil's advocate...

Where is the money to come from?

[Baldy Foghorn]

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You can't go issuing ultimatums (LH, is this right), without an alternative strategy.

Fans: Invest or leave.
Board: Naw.
Fans: Please?

Ultimatum is clear FR, if no quality is added fans will not bother going......

[Baldy Foghorn]

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Devil's advocate...

Where is the money to come from?

Managable level of debt........ Other teams do it

[truehibernian]

You can only invest with the finances you have got in place though. That is the strategy we work to as a club and to be honest, in this day and age, who could argue that it is the best policy at present.

The football side of things is again, to be honest, in quite a good position to work from. Lots of players we have all been shouting about getting rid of are now going. It is up to CC and DA to prove they have an eye for talent, within budget, to replace with better. I am sure they will, and if anything, the last few games have given them the perfect indication of where the team needs strengthened.

I would honestly rather be Hibernian than say Dundee Utd, Aberdeen or Motherwell, to compare competitors. Hearts are of course a wee law unto themselves and who knows what budgets they operate to anymore.

Take United - they are about to lose three star players for diddly squat this summer. Good, influential players that would walk into any other SPL side. Not a penny in though. Houston now has a real test of his management to see if he can get in players as good or better.......has he really been tested in the transfer market ? I would say this summer is the acid test. (no complete stadium or training ground to call their own)

Motherwell - they are going to lose Sutton, possibly Jennings, they sold Reynolds, and they are bound to get offers for young Murphy in the summer. Again, McCall got a tune out the side this last few games, but he has not been tested in the transfer windows. (no complete stadium or training ground)

Aberdeen - new stadium seems to be more pressing than football matters and Craig Brown now on record saying they can only replace like with like in number terms......they cannot add to squad really and certainly are working on a reduced budget. They will also lose Aluko (potentially), Hartley (age), and Diamond (to Hearts).....Brown does have decent contacts however with his time in England......similar to CC I would say. (about to move stadium, still train on community/university pitches)

I agree the football team needs a radical overhaul, however we are going to witness it in summer. Also add in Crawford, Welsh (hopefully) and the likes of possibly young Handling, Smith and Horner........patience and support is vital.

I know we are now long in the tooth to this "in transition" phrase..........but it has never ever more prevalent then now. In SPL and size of club terms, Hibs have always invested properly and in accordance with our position in Scottish football IMHO.......not to some's liking of course, but I accept it and agree with it as a fan and supporter. For me it is the players that have let the club down this season......not the Board.

[lapsedhibee]

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You can't go issuing ultimatums (LH, is this right), without an alternative strategy.

Must be. Plural's never have an apostrophe.

[Andy Bee]

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Ten pages.

I agree with the sentiments of the o.p., but I would add that if we are calling on the board to invest then we as a support have to give them the means to do it, through season ticket purchases etc.

The board should (and are) be looking for other revenue streams but the fundamental principles of the club are that season ticket money goes directly on the team on the pitch.

If we want genuine quality players we need to dip into our pockets once more and help fund it.

I we do that and the board fail to back cc, then they should be held accountable. They can't, however, spend money that isn't there.

TBF that's like Sir Tom asking his customers to just buy these chocolate exhausts until I have enough cash to get the real thing, you just can't expect people to shell out on a shoddy product, Hibs aint a charity.

IMO it's down to the manager, with so many out of contract and the wages saved because of it it's down to CC to make sure he gets the right quality, 3 out 1 in

[CropleyWasGod]

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Must be. Plural's never have an apostrophe.

Ultimata

[Pedantic_Hibee]

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You can only invest with the finances you have got in place though. That is the strategy we work to as a club and to be honest, in this day and age, who could argue that it is the best policy at present.

The football side of things is again, to be honest, in quite a good position to work from. Lots of players we have all been shouting about getting rid of are now going. It is up to CC and DA to prove they have an eye for talent, within budget, to replace with better. I am sure they will, and if anything, the last few games have given them the perfect indication of where the team needs strengthened.

I would honestly rather be Hibernian than say Dundee Utd, Aberdeen or Motherwell, to compare competitors. Hearts are of course a wee law unto themselves and who knows what budgets they operate to anymore.

Take United - they are about to lose three star players for diddly squat this summer. Good, influential players that would walk into any other SPL side. Not a penny in though. Houston now has a real test of his management to see if he can get in players as good or better.......has he really been tested in the transfer market ? I would say this summer is the acid test. (no complete stadium or training ground to call their own)

Motherwell - they are going to lose Sutton, possibly Jennings, they sold Reynolds, and they are bound to get offers for young Murphy in the summer. Again, McCall got a tune out the side this last few games, but he has not been tested in the transfer windows. (no complete stadium or training ground)

Aberdeen - new stadium seems to be more pressing than football matters and Craig Brown now on record saying they can only replace like with like in number terms......they cannot add to squad really and certainly are working on a reduced budget. They will also lose Aluko (potentially), Hartley (age), and Diamond (to Hearts).....Brown does have decent contacts however with his time in England......similar to CC I would say. (about to move stadium, still train on community/university pitches)

I agree the football team needs a radical overhaul, however we are going to witness it in summer. Also add in Crawford, Welsh (hopefully) and the likes of possibly young Handling, Smith and Horner........patience and support is vital.

I know we are now long in the tooth to this "in transition" phrase..........but it has never ever more prevalent then now. In SPL and size of club terms, Hibs have always invested properly and in accordance with our position in Scottish football IMHO.......not to some's liking of course, but I accept it and agree with it as a fan and supporter. For me it is the players that have let the club down this season......not the Board.

As ever, TH, the calculated and composed voice of reason amongst the hyperbole so often displayed on this board.

Some good points from the OP however and to echo the sentiments, it's a chicken and egg scenario. Maybe a bit of give and take, perchance? i.e the board bring in someone like Sproule for example and then say "Back us and buy season tickets in your droves and we'll provide signings of this ilk".

Someone has to start the ball rolling rather than us having an old school disco with us stuck to one wall and the board on the adjacent wall with everyone waiting for someone to make the first move.

[ancient hibee]

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Managable level of debt........ Other teams do it

Do they?Rangers are going to lose the title because they were forced to sell Miller for £300K-a disastrous decision-but I suspect by Lloyds not Rangers.Kilmarnock are for sale-no buyers-Dundee United will be next in trouble as Thompson Junior doesn't want to see the family fortune disappear altogether.I don't think there is much chance of Hibs trotting along to the bank and suggesting we are loaned a few million so we can finish third in the league.

[Pretty Boy]

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Managable level of debt........ Other teams do it

Unless i'm mistaken our last accounts showed that was roughy the financial position we where in - a manageable level of debt.

There seems to be this belief that Hibs are debt free or virtually debt free but this is simply not the case. There are still overdrafts, mortgages and day to day debts. Don't get me wrong Hibs are better placed financially than most in the SPL but we are still opearting with a burden of debt. Getting into more debt with no guarantee of success and/or European football to balance it off is a route we should be careful of treading.

On saying that i don't totally disagree with the sentiment in your original post, we do need investment on the park to keep fans attending and attract new fans along. I have a feeling we may see a bit of money spent in the summer on young guys with potential sell on value down the line. The Hibs board have built up a sound infastructure that will pay dividends in the coming years. In future years when clubs like Aberdeen, Dundee Utd etc are spending money building new stadiums, adequate training facilities and whatever else we will be 2 or 3 steps ahead and be able to channel income into the football side of the business.

[Baldy Foghorn]

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You can only invest with the finances you have got in place though. That is the strategy we work to as a club and to be honest, in this day and age, who could argue that it is the best policy at present.

The football side of things is again, to be honest, in quite a good position to work from. Lots of players we have all been shouting about getting rid of are now going. It is up to CC and DA to prove they have an eye for talent, within budget, to replace with better. I am sure they will, and if anything, the last few games have given them the perfect indication of where the team needs strengthened.

I would honestly rather be Hibernian than say Dundee Utd, Aberdeen or Motherwell, to compare competitors. Hearts are of course a wee law unto themselves and who knows what budgets they operate to anymore.

Take United - they are about to lose three star players for diddly squat this summer. Good, influential players that would walk into any other SPL side. Not a penny in though. Houston now has a real test of his management to see if he can get in players as good or better.......has he really been tested in the transfer market ? I would say this summer is the acid test. (no complete stadium or training ground to call their own)

Motherwell - they are going to lose Sutton, possibly Jennings, they sold Reynolds, and they are bound to get offers for young Murphy in the summer. Again, McCall got a tune out the side this last few games, but he has not been tested in the transfer windows. (no complete stadium or training ground)

Aberdeen - new stadium seems to be more pressing than football matters and Craig Brown now on record saying they can only replace like with like in number terms......they cannot add to squad really and certainly are working on a reduced budget. They will also lose Aluko (potentially), Hartley (age), and Diamond (to Hearts).....Brown does have decent contacts however with his time in England......similar to CC I would say. (about to move stadium, still train on community/university pitches)

I agree the football team needs a radical overhaul, however we are going to witness it in summer. Also add in Crawford, Welsh (hopefully) and the likes of possibly young Handling, Smith and Horner........patience and support is vital.

I know we are now long in the tooth to this "in transition" phrase..........but it has never ever more prevalent then now. In SPL and size of club terms, Hibs have always invested properly and in accordance with our position in Scottish football IMHO.......not to some's liking of course, but I accept it and agree with it as a fan and supporter. For me it is the players that have let the club down this season......not the Board.

Fair points.....We have to bring quality in now though, we can't rely on the youngsters getting us into the top six next season.... We have a huge potential fanbase, a couple of decent quality singings may just entice more bums on seats and add a couple of thousand onto the gates.... How long have Hibs been in transition? We could and should be a major force in the SPL, sadly at the moment we are far from it.......

[Baldy Foghorn]

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Unless i'm mistaken our last accounts showed that was roughy the financial position we where in - a manageable level of debt.

There seems to be this belief that Hibs are debt free or virtually debt free but this is simply not the case. There are still overdrafts, mortgages and day to day debts. Don't get me wrong Hibs are better placed financially than most in the SPL but we are still opearting with a burden of debt. Getting into more debt with no guarantee of success and/or European football to balance it off is a route we should be careful of treading.

On saying that i don't totally disagree with the sentiment in your original post, we do need investment on the park to keep fans attending and attract new fans along. I have a feeling we may see a bit of money spent in the summer on young guys with potential sell on value down the line. The Hibs board have built up a sound infastructure that will pay dividends in the coming years. In future years when clubs like Aberdeen, Dundee Utd etc are spending money building new stadiums, adequate training facilities and whatever else we will be 2 or 3 steps ahead and be able to channel income into the football side of the business.

In the current economic climate Pretty Boy, I reckon there will be a host of quality players looking for new clubs. I just hope we can entice them by paying a reasonable wage, you only get what you pay for.....

[Baldy Foghorn]

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Do they?Rangers are going to lose the title because they were forced to sell Miller for £300K-a disastrous decision-but I suspect by Lloyds not Rangers.Kilmarnock are for sale-no buyers-Dundee United will be next in trouble as Thompson Junior doesn't want to see the family fortune disappear altogether.I don't think there is much chance of Hibs trotting along to the bank and suggesting we are loaned a few million so we can finish third in the league.

Hibs are not in the same level of debt as say Rangers, Celtic, Hearts, at least we have a managable level that is not astronomic, and not paying massive weekly interest like the other teams mentioned.... That is surely a bonus in this day and age, but obviously without going up to our neck in debt, we can surely bring in a better level of player than we currently have

[Cocaine&Caviar]

I have to ask,

when Utd let Goodwillie, Bauben, Gomis and maybe even Kenneth go in the summer, do you think they will reinvest that money to keep them at the level they are currently performing at?

Not a chance, as shown with their releasing players like Myrie-Williams, Casinuovo, Sandaza etc in recent times, there is no money in their accounts for it, same as there isnt for us. This is the climate that all our competitors, Utd, Aberdeen, Well etc have to live with in the current climate, with only Hearts & the OF able to invest significantly in terms of transfer fees and wages.

[Pretty Boy]

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In the current economic climate Pretty Boy, I reckon there will be a host of quality players looking for new clubs. I just hope we can entice them by paying a reasonable wage, you only get what you pay for.....

Of course.

It is clear the playing side of things needs a real overhaul. The board have proved in the past that if the manager identifies a player that he feels will benefit the squad then they will sanction the move. They allowed Hughes to bring in Stokes and Miller, one for a fee and both on a decent wage. Mixu brought back Riordan for a fair wedge and Collins was given a huge weekly wage for one Alan O'Brien.

Hopefully the board and manager see what we all see and moves are made early in the summer to allow us build and gel a team ready to hit the ground running next year.

[grunt]

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Hibs are not in the same level of debt as say Rangers, Celtic, Hearts ...

I think Celtic have a similar level of debt to us, and they have 8 or 9 times our turnover with which to service it.

[Hibs Class]

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To the current incumbents of the Board, and I hope to God one of them gets passed this to read........

We have a terrific infrastructure in place, to which you have done well to achieve... A great training complex at East Mains, and a terrific Stadium to boot.....

However, NOW is the time to invest in the playing squad, and add some REAL quality...... There is no point in the Stadium being a third full on matchdays, we have to see some quality additions in the Summer or fans will be lost, maybe even for good.....

The fans want to see a successful team on the park, and pay handsomely to do so.....If quality is not added revenue will almost certainly be down.... At AGM in October then the re-arranged AGM after Hughes departed, Fife Hyland (now MD), said he was looking at ways to increase revenue and turnover, well I put it to you Mr Petrie and Mr Hyland, that the only real way of achieving that goal is by putting a watchable product on the park......

Please show us some level of ambition, give us a team to be excited about, if you are not willing to bring in quality, then you do not deserve to be custodians of our wonderful Club...... Time to step up to the plate Gentlemen.

with this bit in particular.

[Seveno]

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Chicken and Egg scenario Matty, fans want to see what signings are made before investing... Maybe now is the time for the Board to speculate to accumulate?

Speculate is just that. No guarantee of a return.

Speculation can only be justified where there is spare cash available. It can never be justified if it involves debt and we have seen so many examples of this in the past and the present.

Give me Rod Petrie over David Murray any day.

[NORTHERNHIBBY]

Just now we have the equivalent of a top of the range garage and forecourt for a dealer that sells old bangers. The board are not that naive as to think that the current level of investment in the team, will go anywhere near the amount needed to fill a 21,000 ground. I am more than sure that we will see decent money spent in the close season. Any other strategy does not make sense.

[smurf]

We desparately need the right kind of activity at ER this summer. Otherwise season ticket sales will yet again drop.

The board have got to recognise that only positive moves in recruitment will shift season tickets.

We are not looking, expecting or wanting the club to be daft and spend silly.

What we want to see is a sign of genuine ambition. Not words of intent and ambition but action.

And it needs more than bringing back old faces.

I just really hope the board are aware of just how low feelings are within the support at the moment.

They need to address it and by doing so the support would IMHO respond positively.

[Big Frank]

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To the current incumbents of the Board, and I hope to God one of them gets passed this to read........

We have a terrific infrastructure in place, to which you have done well to achieve... A great training complex at East Mains, and a terrific Stadium to boot.....

However, NOW is the time to invest in the playing squad, and add some REAL quality...... There is no point in the Stadium being a third full on matchdays, we have to see some quality additions in the Summer or fans will be lost, maybe even for good.....

The fans want to see a successful team on the park, and pay handsomely to do so.....If quality is not added revenue will almost certainly be down.... At AGM in October then the re-arranged AGM after Hughes departed, Fife Hyland (now MD), said he was looking at ways to increase revenue and turnover, well I put it to you Mr Petrie and Mr Hyland, that the only real way of achieving that goal is by putting a watchable product on the park......

Please show us some level of ambition, give us a team to be excited about, if you are not willing to bring in quality, then you do not deserve to be custodians of our wonderful Club...... Time to step up to the plate Gentlemen.

Good stuff Baldy

The ball is most definately in the Boards' court.

I feel the fans have stood up and been counted over the last few years.

Quality not quantity required at ER.

[Dalkeith]

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We desparately need the right kind of activity at ER this summer. Otherwise season ticket sales will yet again drop.

The board have got to recognise that only positive moves in recruitment will shift season tickets.

We are not looking, expecting or wanting the club to be daft and spend silly.

What we want to see is a sign of genuine ambition. Not words of intent and ambition but action.

And it needs more than bringing back old faces.

I just really hope the board are aware of just how low feelings are within the support at the moment.

They need to address it and by doing so the support would IMHO respond positively.

If the board show a sign of genuine ambition then i will renew my ST without that sign then i won't spend another penny at ER thats how low i am after 40+ years

[Antifa Hibs]

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We desparately need the right kind of activity at ER this summer. Otherwise season ticket sales will yet again drop.

The board have got to recognise that only positive moves in recruitment will shift season tickets.

We are not looking, expecting or wanting the club to be daft and spend silly.

What we want to see is a sign of genuine ambition. Not words of intent and ambition but action.

And it needs more than bringing back old faces.

I just really hope the board are aware of just how low feelings are within the support at the moment.

They need to address it and by doing so the support would IMHO respond positively.

Not often I'll agree with you but that is spot on.

No one is wanting us to go back to the days of De La Cruz, Zitelli, paying wages we really can't afford. But a signing of £300/£400k, is that really too much for Hibs? Get him paraded in the press, make a big deal of it, get the excitement back.



Incidentally, when was the last signing that got us really excited? Riordan? Stokes maybe?

[Ray_]

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We desparately need the right kind of activity at ER this summer. Otherwise season ticket sales will yet again drop.

The board have got to recognise that only positive moves in recruitment will shift season tickets.

We are not looking, expecting or wanting the club to be daft and spend silly.

What we want to see is a sign of genuine ambition. Not words of intent and ambition but action.

And it needs more than bringing back old faces.

I just really hope the board are aware of just how low feelings are within the support at the moment.

They need to address it and by doing so the support would IMHO respond positively.

Totally agree, since 2006/7 we have gone from the most entertaining side in Scotland, to four years of utter garbage & I've gone from person who paid biweekly, to watch 20 minutes of a Hibs game, in my lunch hour, to somebody who struggles to turn on the T.V. when Hibs are on.

Since my first game in 1965, I've never felt anywhere near as apathetic towards Hibs as I do now & if somebody had told me I'd ever feel like this, I would never have believed them.