Scotlands Greatest Team....

[RoslinInstHibby]

anyone watch this last night? and if so what did you think of the team?

[sambajustice]

what was the team?

[Danderhall Hibs]

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anyone watch this last night? and if so what did you think of the team?

I taped it and just watched it this morning. Did you vote? I did but I was struggling as I'm too young to have seen some of the shortlisted players. I'm not convinced with the shortlist for managers - most of them were there because of what they done for their club sides.

The team was:

Goram

Jardine McLeish Miller McGrain

Johnstone Souness Bremner Cooper

Dalglish Law

Manager: Stein

[RoslinInstHibby]

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I taped it and just watched it this morning. Did you vote? I did but I was struggling as I'm too young to have seen some of the shortlisted players. I'm not convinced with the shortlist for managers - most of them were there because of what they done for their club sides.

The team was:

Goram

Jardine McLeish Miller McGrain

Johnstone Souness Bremner Cooper

Dalglish Law

Manager: Stein

yeah, i voted apart from jardine, Cooper & McGrain i had selected the rest.

[Phil D. Rolls]

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I taped it and just watched it this morning. Did you vote? I did but I was struggling as I'm too young to have seen some of the shortlisted players. I'm not convinced with the shortlist for managers - most of them were there because of what they done for their club sides.

The team was:

Goram

Jardine McLeish Miller McGrain

Johnstone Souness Bremner Cooper

Dalglish Law

Manager: Stein

The only concerns I have with that line up is how did Davie Cooper get in, and I can think of a better pairing than Dalglish and Law - I'd have preferred Jordan and Dalglish.

[Danderhall Hibs]

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yeah, i voted apart from jardine, Cooper & McGrain i had selected the rest.

I voted on a lot of them as well - never voted Jardine, Bremner, Johnstone or Stein though.

I had Gough, Strachan, someone else! and Ormond in for those ones. Mainly due to not seeing much of the others and only hearing how good they were. Although I did contradict that by picking Law!

[RoslinInstHibby]

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I voted on a lot of them as well - never voted Jardine, Bremner, Johnstone or Stein though.

I had Gough, Strachan, someone else! and Ormond in for those ones. Mainly due to not seeing much of the others and only hearing how good they were. Although I did contradict that by picking Law!

was down in leeds recently and saw his statue, he is pretty much a god down there.

[RoslinInstHibby]

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The only concerns I have with that line up is how did Davie Cooper get in, and I can think of a better pairing than Dalglish and Law - I'd have preferred Jordan and Dalglish.

i think the problem is that people may have voted fav's other than actually positons.....danny Mcgrain was scotlands best ever left back according to the vote

[Danderhall Hibs]

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The only concerns I have with that line up is how did Davie Cooper get in, and I can think of a better pairing than Dalglish and Law - I'd have preferred Jordan and Dalglish.

Lack of choices I think. As far as I remember Cooper wasn't even a regular for Scotland so for him to be shortlisted and selected for the greatest ever team is due to sentimentality.

[RoslinInstHibby]

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Lack of choices I think. As far as I remember Cooper wasn't even a regular for Scotland so for him to be shortlisted and selected for the greatest ever team is due to sentimentality.

defo, Jinky was selected yet played only 22 times for his country scoring 3 goals, but was picked for being celtic's greatest ever player....Cooper should not have been in the team, it should have been baxter

[Danderhall Hibs]

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defo, Jinky was selected yet played only 22 times for his country scoring 3 goals, but was picked for being celtic's greatest ever player....Cooper should not have been in the team, it should have been baxter

And apparently his greatest ever match was in a testimonial game!

[johnrebus]

Johnstone and Cooper are in the team because they are dead, yet Baxter, arguably one of Scotlands' greatest ever players, is not.

The one whose selection really baffles me though is Jardine.

Must be the Hun vote I suppose.

[Joe Baker II]

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i think the problem is that people may have voted fav's other than actually positons.....danny Mcgrain was scotlands best ever left back according to the vote

He arguably was though, McGrain (and Brownlie was close to him too though I missed him at his peak) was one of the all time great players. I did not vote but would have selected 9 of the outfield players chosen plus Leighton, and McGrain at right back and Gemmell left back rather than Jardine (just).

[Dalkeith Hibee]

I'm a bit young to remember most of the shortlisted payers but I was disappointed that Gary McAllister wasnt in the shortlist, considering he had over 50 caps, ex captain and played at a high level right up until his late 30's, winning a European trophy with Liverpool.

Also for all his faults, I thought Craig Brown should have been shortlisted as manager considering he got us to our last World Cup and Euro finals. His record wasnt bad either.

[Holmesdale Hibs]

Although he never did much for Scotland there can't be many players in that team with more medals than Alan Hanson.

Maybe its because the Scottish media (Tam Cowan etc) like to take the p1ss out of him but definitely worth a place on the bench IMO.

[RoslinInstHibby]

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Although he never did much for Scotland there can't be many players in that team with more medals than Alan Hanson.

Maybe its because the Scottish media (Tam Cowan etc) like to take the p1ss out of him but definitely worth a place on the bench IMO.

[stu in nottingham]

Jardine was a fine full back but personally I would have put John Brownlie in his spot. He had more dimensions to his game.

I'd have undoubtedly found space for the sublime skills of Jim Baxter and also Dave McKay who seem a little conspicuous by his absence, a tremendously skilful and tough player who was a good leader.

[truehibernian]

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Jardine was a fine full back but personally I would have put John Brownlie in his spot. He had more dimensions to his game.

I'd have undoubtedly found space for the sublime skills of Jim Baxter and also Dave McKay who seem a little conspicuous by his absence, a tremendously skilful and tough player who was a good leader.

Can't believe that Dave MacKay isn't in there myself . Also maybe would have found room for Alan Gilzean (can you believe maybe at the expense of King Kenny who kept his best form for Liverpool not Scotland IMHO)

[steve75]

Ok I didn't watch it. But, I know many will disagree, was McFadden shortlisted? I'm not by anyway saying he is a great player, he's good but that's it. However based on how utter garbage we've been for years he has been a consistent performer and always comes up with the good at the right times, seems to have won us alot of points over the years.

[ahibby]

I wouldn't have McLeish and Miller over Hanson and McQueen. I'd take a Liverpool and Man Utd centre half over an Aberdeen centre half anyday. I'd have Leighton before Goram and with out thinking very much about who I have liked at Wing back, I'd even have Jackie MacNamara Jnr rather than Jardine.

[dangermouse]

I didn't bother watching this as I reckoned it would just be West of Scotland biased tosh.

Looking at the team I reckon I was correct to better spend my time doing the ironing and watching re runs of Top Gear.

[Danderhall Hibs]

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I didn't bother watching this as I reckoned it would just be West of Scotland biased tosh.

Looking at the team I reckon I was correct to better spend my time doing the ironing and watching re runs of Top Gear.

It was a public vote - didn't matter which side of the country you came from!

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Ok I didn't watch it. But, I know many will disagree, was McFadden shortlisted?

No - only Craig Gordon from the current squad was shortlisted.

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I wouldn't have McLeish and Miller over Hanson and McQueen. I'd take a Liverpool and Man Utd centre half over an Aberdeen centre half anyday. I'd have Leighton before Goram and with out thinking very much about who I have liked at Wing back, I'd even have Jackie MacNamara Jnr rather than Jardine.

Did Hansen not have a reputation for not turning up for Scotland though? Don't think McQueen was shortlisted either. I think the idea was to pick Scotland's Greates Team rather than the players that played for big clubs.

It was a proper right-back they wanted - no mention of wing-backs.

Goram is/was a far better keeper than Leighton IMO.

[hibsbollah]

Its not a bad XI.

Jim Baxter should have been in for Davie Cooper though.

Also, Jardine and McGrain would also win 'dirtiest fullback pairing in world football'

[Mag7]

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Ok I didn't watch it. But, I know many will disagree, was McFadden shortlisted? I'm not by anyway saying he is a great player, he's good but that's it. However based on how utter garbage we've been for years he has been a consistent performer and always comes up with the good at the right times, seems to have won us alot of points over the years.

The programme was called Scotland's Greatest Team so not a chance somebody like McFadden would get anywhere near it given the wealth of choice which exists prior to Scotland becoming permanently c**p (even though we qualified for the 1998 World Cup I'd say the serious decline in standards started as far back as the late 80s/early 90s. McFadden is an above average performer in a less than average team. That's all.

[Hibs On Tour]

My team would be:

Goram

Jardine McLeish Mackay McGrain

Johnstone Souness Bremner Baxter

Dalglish Law

Manager: Stein

Based primarily on then doing it for Scotland. Dalglish is an enigma there - you never felt like he was doing it in the blue shirt but his record stands up to scrutiny. Team would be very different if it were just best Scottish players rather than who played well for Scotland...

[steve75]

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The programme was called Scotland's Greatest Team so not a chance somebody like McFadden would get anywhere near it given the wealth of choice which exists prior to Scotland becoming permanently c**p (even though we qualified for the 1998 World Cup I'd say the serious decline in standards started as far back as the late 80s/early 90s. McFadden is an above average performer in a less than average team. That's all.

It depends what way you look at it. Someone said Jinky had 3 goals in 22 caps for Scotland. Where as Mcfadden had 45 caps and 15 goals, many of which were very important. Therefore he is more consistant for Scotland.

I'm in no way saying he is a better player, however if you look at who was more important for Scotland in each given era, McFadden is in. But if it's based on genuine player ability, I'd agree he's nowhere near that quality.

[--------]

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Jardine was a fine full back but personally I would have put John Brownlie in his spot. He had more dimensions to his game.

I'd have undoubtedly found space for the sublime skills of Jim Baxter and also Dave McKay who seem a little conspicuous by his absence, a tremendously skilful and tough player who was a good leader.

"Best ever" suggests a wee bit more than "eleven players we kinda liked and they're the only ones we can remember because we were drunk most of the time and we're only gonnae vote for Huns or Soapies anyway..." which I suspect is what this is.

Baxter and Mackay should obviously be in. If we're looking for the "best ever" Scottish international strikers, there's really no argument - Reilly and Law. Brownlie was a far better RB than Jardine, too, but I think if we're talking "best ever", again we'd need to go farther back and look at the Shaw brothers, Jock and Davie, or maybe our own Jock Govan who surely invented the idea of an overlapping, attacking full-back.

I'd go with McLeish at CH, but no way was Willie Miller anywhere near our best sweeper. I'd have played Sloop, Buchan or even Forsyth ahead of him.

And then there was John 'Iron Man' Cumming....

Peter Lorimer was a far more effective right winger than Johnstone, and Eddie Gray a much better left winger than Cooper, though IMO Ormond would get my vote. Ormond, for all his faults, was certainly a better and more successful Scottish manager than Stein.

FWIW, I'd vote for:

Goram;

Brownlie, McLeish, Buchan, McGrain;

Bremner, Mackay, Baxter;

Lorimer, Law, Dalglish.

Manager, Willie Ormond.

That's confining myself to voting for people I actually saw playing. Willie Ormond I remember as manager.

[RoslinInstHibby]

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"Best ever" suggests a wee bit more than "eleven players we kinda liked and they're the only ones we can remember because we were drunk most of the time and we're only gonnae vote for Huns or Soapies anyway..." which I suspect is what this is.

Baxter and Mackay should obviously be in. If we're looking for the "best ever" Scottish international strikers, there's really no argument - Reilly and Law. Brownlie was a far better RB than Jardine, too, but I think if we're talking "best ever", again we'd need to go farther back and look at the Shaw brothers, Jock and Davie, or maybe our own Jock Govan who surely invented the idea of an overlapping, attacking full-back.

I'd go with McLeish at CH, but no way was Willie Miller anywhere near our best sweeper. I'd have played Sloop, Buchan or even Forsyth ahead of him.

And then there was John 'Iron Man' Cumming....

Peter Lorimer was a far more effective right winger than Johnstone, and Eddie Gray a much better left winger than Cooper, though IMO Ormond would get my vote. Ormond, for all his faults, was certainly a better and more successful Scottish manager than Stein.

FWIW, I'd vote for:

Goram;

Brownlie, McLeish, Buchan, McGrain;

Bremner, Mackay, Baxter;

Lorimer, Law, Dalglish.

Manager, Willie Ormond.

That's confining myself to voting for people I actually saw playing. Willie Ormond I remember as manager.

it had to be a 4-4-2 formation

[fife hfc]

The team chosen was almost identical to the one I chose and the choice was not just on their form for scotland but also their clubs and even though I never saw brownlie play I would say Jardine deserved his place. The only difference in my team was that I had Baxter instead of Cooper and Ferguson instead of Stein. I can't see anything wrong with the team chosen.

[Pretty Boy]

I would have had Jim Leighton in goals ahead of Andy Goram.

There is little doubt in my mind that Goram was the better keeper. He was world class. However he walked out on Scotland twice.

Jim Leighton on the other hand was a very good goalkeeper who was dropped out the Scotland set up for years and was at one point below such legends as Nicky Walker and Bryan Gunn in the pecking order. Despite this after his career was put back on the rails at Hibs he happily went back when times were tough. He was exemplary in getting us to Euro 96 before being snubbed for Goram at the tournament after he ended his first exile. Leighton stayed loyal and was again vital in helping us to the world cup in 1998 stepping in when Goram was injured and putting in an unbelievably good performance against Sweden at Ibrox in a 1-0 victory. Goram again walked out and Leighton stepped in at France 98. For all he had a bit of a nightmare against Morocco, it was only his perfromances against Brazil and Norway that even gave us a chance of qualification going into that game.

At club level whilst there is little doubt Goram won Rangers titles, for a couple of years Leighton kept us free of relegation, a fact noted by the fact we were relegated the first season after he left.

Goram was the better keeper no doubt, Leighton was by far the better servant to his country.