My thoughts - After Watching the game on BBC Alba

**~~The Voice Of Reason~~** · 16-01-2010 09:11 PM

I appreciate you see more off the ball stuff at the game, but here are my thoughts having just watched the game on BBC Alba :-

1. Riordan - contrary to the opinions I have read, I thought he DID try. Yes, I have seen him play better.....but I do I think Yogi was right to take Stokes off before him.

2. Didn't think there was anything between the teams. Dun Utd defend well as a team, often leaving only one man up front and are hard to break down. We don't have the pace to penetrate a stubborn defence (see point below).

3. Pace (or lack of) - it is clear that we lack pace throughout the team. In the second half despite us being on top Dun Utd looked capable of breaking at speed.....we don't appear to have enough pace in our team to do that.

4. Their goal - errors all round - Riordan pulled out of a challenge, Cregg lost Swanson (he cheated a bit and got away with it) and Hogg should definately have moved over to close Swanson down a lot quicker.

5. Graeme Smith - looks a good solid keeper......hope he keeps it up.

6. Our Midfield - dont seem to link very well with our front players (I do realise that MZ went off). There was often a big gap between our midfield and front men.

7. Nish - thought Yogi might have started with Nish to combat their height, he must have thought about it, surely.

Room for improvement all round, but if I am honest I didn't think we played as badly as some people have been saying. I think a draw would have been fair.

That's it......cheers.

**monktonharp** · 16-01-2010 09:19 PM

Originally Posted by The Voice Of Reason

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I appreciate you see more off the ball stuff at the game, but here are my thoughts having just watched the game on BBC Alba :-

1. Riordan - contrary to the opinions I have read, I thought he DID try. Yes, I have seen him play better.....but I do I think Yogi was right to take Stokes off before him.

2. Didn't think there was anything between the teams. Dun Utd defend well as a team, often leaving only one man up front and are hard to break down. We don't have the pace to penetrate a stubborn defence (see point below).

3. Pace (or lack of) - it is clear that we lack pace throughout the team. In the second half despite us being on top Dun Utd looked capable of breaking at speed.....we don't appear to have enough pace in our team to do that.

4. Their goal - errors all round - Riordan pulled out of a challenge, Cregg lost Swanson (he cheated a bit and got away with it) and Hogg should definately have moved over to close Swanson down a lot quicker.

5. Graeme Smith - looks a good solid keeper......hope he keeps it up.

6. Our Midfield - dont seem to link very well with our front players (I do realise that MZ went off). There was often a big gap between our midfield and front men.

7. Nish - thought Yogi might have started with Nish to combat their height, he must have thought about it, surely.

Room for improvement all round, but if I am honest I didn't think we played as badly as some people have been saying. I think a draw would have been fair.

That's it......cheers.

I was there,but did not watch Alba,and I agree with almost all you say. missed the goal as Iwent for a wee-wee

so cant comment on it , after the match,heard a lot of Utd fans commenting how well they defended,and that's what won it

***Tricla*** · 16-01-2010 09:45 PM

Originally Posted by The Voice Of Reason

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I appreciate you see more off the ball stuff at the game, but here are my thoughts having just watched the game on BBC Alba :-

1. Riordan - contrary to the opinions I have read, I thought he DID try. Yes, I have seen him play better.....but I do I think Yogi was right to take Stokes off before him.

2. Didn't think there was anything between the teams. Dun Utd defend well as a team, often leaving only one man up front and are hard to break down. We don't have the pace to penetrate a stubborn defence (see point below).

3. Pace (or lack of) - it is clear that we lack pace throughout the team. In the second half despite us being on top Dun Utd looked capable of breaking at speed.....we don't appear to have enough pace in our team to do that.

4. Their goal - errors all round - Riordan pulled out of a challenge, Cregg lost Swanson (he cheated a bit and got away with it) and Hogg should definately have moved over to close Swanson down a lot quicker.

5. Graeme Smith - looks a good solid keeper......hope he keeps it up.

6. Our Midfield - dont seem to link very well with our front players (I do realise that MZ went off). There was often a big gap between our midfield and front men.

7. Nish - thought Yogi might have started with Nish to combat their height, he must have thought about it, surely.

Room for improvement all round, but if I am honest I didn't think we played as badly as some people have been saying. I think a draw would have been fair.

That's it......cheers.

I think you are being very lenient. I just watched it and we were woeful. We had 39% posession according to the BBC.

***hibbie02*** · 16-01-2010 10:13 PM

Just watched it and we were utter sheeiite in the first half. Looked much more composed in the second half, particularly in defence.

Riordan looked ****ged out by 70 mins and only stayed on because Zouma ducked out early.

In the second half we actually had control of midfield and we were on top more. However Spoony needs to look up when passing as he gave the ball away too many times.

DU were defending well for most of the second half and that made the difference.

***blackpoolhibs*** · 16-01-2010 10:17 PM

I watched it too, and while united probably shaved it, it was not as bad as people are making out.

***matty_f*** · 16-01-2010 10:19 PM

Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

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I watched it too, and while united probably shaved it, it was not as bad as people are making out.

Can't argue with that.

**The Harp Awakes** · 16-01-2010 10:27 PM

Yep, not as bad a performance as many on here are saying. If Nish or Spoony's efforts had gone in near the end and we got a 1-1, you wouldn't have got as many critical comments on the board on the performance.

**Hibby 2005** · 16-01-2010 10:43 PM

I watched on Alba too and feared the worst when I saw the line-up. Yogi set up his team for a draw and got what he deserved.

***gorgie_harp*** · 16-01-2010 10:49 PM

Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

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I watched it too, and while united probably shaved it, it was not as bad as people are making out.

Sorry, it was.

But onwards and upwards.

**Sir David Gray** · 16-01-2010 10:49 PM

I haven't seen Alba but my perspective of the game was that the first half was unacceptably bad, we improved in the second half and might have got a goal from a couple of our chances but I still think Dundee Utd deserved to win overall.

We are not attacking well enough just now, the difference between both sides' attacking abilities was quite clear today. Whenever Dundee Utd were in possession, they attacked with pace and were very direct, they played some nice passes and their forward players linked up pretty well. When we had the ball, the person who was in possession was quite often like a statue and the ball usually ended up either going backwards or being launched aimlessly up the park.

It's alright for Hughes to continually say that he has goals in his team, which on paper is obviously true, but we really have to start showing that we are capable of scoring goals. The last time that anyone other than Stokes scored for us was almost two months ago.

That's now the fourth or fifth game in a row where we have been pretty poor and we really need to get back to winning ways next week at home to Hamilton.

Today was a huge opportunity for us to get some daylight between ourselves and Dundee Utd and get ourselves well clear in 3rd place. Whilst there is still a long way to go, we have now lost 3rd place and Hearts are also getting closer by the week.

**Hibby 2005** · 16-01-2010 11:00 PM

Yogi lost the game before it even started with a strange line-up to say the least coupled with a bench that lacked any creativity, Benji being the exception.
His use of Riordan is becoming tiresome and his lack of trust in Galbraith backfiring big time, while the sun seems to shine out of the backsides of Hogg and Rankin.
The great work ethic that Yogi harps on about seems to have gone awol too.

***Kato*** · 17-01-2010 12:39 AM

Originally Posted by The Voice Of Reason

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I appreciate you see more off the ball stuff at the game, but here are my thoughts having just watched the game on BBC Alba :-

1. Riordan - contrary to the opinions I have read, I thought he DID try. Yes, I have seen him play better.....but I do I think Yogi was right to take Stokes off before him.

2. Didn't think there was anything between the teams. Dun Utd defend well as a team, often leaving only one man up front and are hard to break down. We don't have the pace to penetrate a stubborn defence (see point below).

3. Pace (or lack of) - it is clear that we lack pace throughout the team. In the second half despite us being on top Dun Utd looked capable of breaking at speed.....we don't appear to have enough pace in our team to do that.

4. Their goal - errors all round - Riordan pulled out of a challenge, Cregg lost Swanson (he cheated a bit and got away with it) and Hogg should definately have moved over to close Swanson down a lot quicker.

5. Graeme Smith - looks a good solid keeper......hope he keeps it up.

6. Our Midfield - dont seem to link very well with our front players (I do realise that MZ went off). There was often a big gap between our midfield and front men.

7. Nish - thought Yogi might have started with Nish to combat their height, he must have thought about it, surely.

Room for improvement all round, but if I am honest I didn't think we played as badly as some people have been saying. I think a draw would have been fair.

That's it......cheers.

I agree with all of this. Game could have went either way. They got a couple of decisions, the penalty and Goodwillie being adjudged onside at the goal, we didn't - one being an offside against Stokes from a Zoumer pass when his path to goal was open and another being the handball from a Spoony cross which would have been a penalty for Celtic, Rangers and Hearts.

The midfield and attack haven't been all that fluent all season, Hughes describes his best players as "mavericks" and with that we're going to have individuals rather than a unit.

Still early days for this team and hoopefully we can get people in that'll give us a bit bite and have us playing with more purpose going forward.

Would like to see trying to get behind the oppositions defence a bit more.

***Jones28*** · 17-01-2010 12:50 AM

Originally Posted by Hibby 2005

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Yogi lost the game before it even started with a strange line-up to say the least coupled with a bench that lacked any creativity, Benji being the exception.
His use of Riordan is becoming tiresome and his lack of trust in Galbraith backfiring big time, while the sun seems to shine out of the backsides of Hogg and Rankin.
The great work ethic that Yogi harps on about seems to have gone awol too.

Fail to see how Hogg is to blame, he's really come on to a game the past few weeks

**Cameron1875** · 17-01-2010 01:28 AM

I watched on Alba too and feared the worst when I saw the line-up. Yogi set up his team for a draw and got what he deserved.

Utter mince. Dundee utd away is one of toughest games in scotland so to play 4-2-4 with nish and stokes as centre forwards would have been suicidal. The formation yogi picked was to try and combat their midfield(their strong point) by us playing 3 centre mids (effectively just miller) and attack their wing backs (their weak point) through deek and zemmama.

The fact zemmama faked injury and riordan was so poor meant attacking the wing backs was out of question. If liam miller had played like he should then we could have got a grip on midfield as he is the only hibs standard centre mid out there but he didnt have license to go forward as we would be in big trouble if he lost the ball. I will give you the decision to play cregg. Maybe needed more grit in the middle as gomis and bauben had a field day. Mcbride would have made a huge difference

Bad result today but got to bounce back and hopefully sign a decent midfielder in window to help the guys out because the midfielders in reserve e.g. stevenson, cregg, rankin are not good enough for 3rd spot.

Special mention to hanlon: previously not been a fan but outstanding today and wish some of other players shared his and wotherspoons attitude.

GG

**EasterRoad4Ever** · 17-01-2010 06:42 AM

Originally Posted by The Voice Of Reason

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I appreciate you see more off the ball stuff at the game, but here are my thoughts having just watched the game on BBC Alba :-

1. Riordan - contrary to the opinions I have read, I thought he DID try. Yes, I have seen him play better.....but I do I think Yogi was right to take Stokes off before him.

2. Didn't think there was anything between the teams. Dun Utd defend well as a team, often leaving only one man up front and are hard to break down. We don't have the pace to penetrate a stubborn defence (see point below).

3. Pace (or lack of) - it is clear that we lack pace throughout the team. In the second half despite us being on top Dun Utd looked capable of breaking at speed.....we don't appear to have enough pace in our team to do that.

4. Their goal - errors all round - Riordan pulled out of a challenge, Cregg lost Swanson (he cheated a bit and got away with it) and Hogg should definately have moved over to close Swanson down a lot quicker.

5. Graeme Smith - looks a good solid keeper......hope he keeps it up.

6. Our Midfield - dont seem to link very well with our front players (I do realise that MZ went off). There was often a big gap between our midfield and front men.

7. Nish - thought Yogi might have started with Nish to combat their height, he must have thought about it, surely.

Room for improvement all round, but if I am honest I didn't think we played as badly as some people have been saying. I think a draw would have been fair.

That's it......cheers.

The frustrating thing is that the likes of DUFC, Yams, the OF and Dons to an extent all seem capable of WINNING these games when there's little between the teams. This is never more evident than in the SC. Hibs as a club have regularly FAILED to win games like this - and have lost out on points that ultimately separate the winners (Euro places, cups, etc) from the losers.

Big chance against the Huns at home - failed.
Big chance against a crap Yam side at home - failed.
Big chance against a managerless DUFC - failed.

When push come to shove, Hibs pull out of the challenge.

**Penrith Hibee** · 17-01-2010 07:50 AM

Watched the game on Alba and can't understand about the suicide watch going on here. Poor first half not helped by some awful officials and then a reasonable second half when a draw would have been a fair result.

We are clearly a work in progress, my only gripe is the lack of width, give Galbraith a chance and sign a right winger who can go past people ala Sproule and I'll be happy!

**~~The Voice Of Reason~~** · 17-01-2010 08:44 AM

In my opinion (and as a few people have alluded to) we are missing pace in the team.

Here's an idea - lets re-sign AOB from Swindon !

***Tricla*** · 17-01-2010 09:14 AM

Originally Posted by FalkirkHibee

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I haven't seen Alba but my perspective of the game was that the first half was unacceptably bad, we improved in the second half and might have got a goal from a couple of our chances but I still think Dundee Utd deserved to win overall.

We are not attacking well enough just now, the difference between both sides' attacking abilities was quite clear today. Whenever Dundee Utd were in possession, they attacked with pace and were very direct, they played some nice passes and their forward players linked up pretty well. When we had the ball, the person who was in possession was quite often like a statue and the ball usually ended up either going backwards or being launched aimlessly up the park.

It's alright for Hughes to continually say that he has goals in his team, which on paper is obviously true, but we really have to start showing that we are capable of scoring goals. The last time that anyone other than Stokes scored for us was almost two months ago.

That's now the fourth or fifth game in a row where we have been pretty poor and we really need to get back to winning ways next week at home to Hamilton.

Today was a huge opportunity for us to get some daylight between ourselves and Dundee Utd and get ourselves well clear in 3rd place. Whilst there is still a long way to go, we have now lost 3rd place and Hearts are also getting closer by the week.

Originally Posted by Hibby 2005

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Yogi lost the game before it even started with a strange line-up to say the least coupled with a bench that lacked any creativity, Benji being the exception.
His use of Riordan is becoming tiresome and his lack of trust in Galbraith backfiring big time, while the sun seems to shine out of the backsides of Hogg and Rankin.
The great work ethic that Yogi harps on about seems to have gone awol too.

These comments are closer to the mark. I can't understand people who are excusing this performance by saying 'we were better in the second half' or 'Utd shaved it'.

We were better in the second half but that was no real achievement given how terrible we were in the first half.

Utd didn't 'shave' it. They were better than us in every department and if it wasn't for Smith and some good luck we would have been well beaten.

I don't think I or others with this opinion are being unreasonable or are on 'suicide' watch!

This game was the culmination of weeks of sub par performances and I haven't seen any evidence of things being done to change it ie players being dropped or tactics being changed.

I trust Yogi 100% but you do tend to worry slightly when players who continue to turn in poor performances consistently get picked. It's also worrying how one dimensional we are just now.

Hamilton at home is a good chance to sort it though.

***Tricla*** · 17-01-2010 09:16 AM

Originally Posted by Jones28

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Fail to see how Hogg is to blame, he's really come on to a game the past few weeks

Didn't you see his masterclass in marking against the Huns and then the Yams?

**hiberactive** · 17-01-2010 09:29 AM

Only managed to catch the last 20 mins on alba last night-in which i thought it was all Hibs.Nish was unlucky with a header,just the wrong side of the post,Wotherspoon had a great strike which came back of the post-on another day,they go in.Remember when we played them at Easter rd this season we battered them in the 1st half,then they came out and played for 20 mins and in that time pulled a goal back through Webster,after that,we pushed for a winner but it was not to be.There is not much between the 2 teams and i feel we have just not had the rub of the green in this game.Was gutted at the result and then reading about the game on here but after watching part of the game i dont feel as bad because i def feel we were unlucky not to come away from there with at least a point.

***Tricla*** · 17-01-2010 09:40 AM

Originally Posted by hiberactive

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Only managed to catch the last 20 mins on alba last night-in which i thought it was all Hibs.Nish was unlucky with a header,just the wrong side of the post,Wotherspoon had a great strike which came back of the post-on another day,they go in.Remember when we played them at Easter rd this season we battered them in the 1st half,then they came out and played for 20 mins and in that time pulled a goal back through Webster,after that,we pushed for a winner but it was not to be.There is not much between the 2 teams and i feel we have just not had the rub of the green in this game.Was gutted at the result and then reading about the game on here but after watching part of the game i dont feel as bad because i def feel we were unlucky not to come away from there with at least a point.

If you'd seen the 70 mins before that you'd have a different opinion.

I don't feel we were dominant at any point in the game. We were better in the latter stages of the second half and had a couple of chances but it was still one dimensional.

Utd still looked the better side going forward.

**hiberactive** · 17-01-2010 10:33 AM

Originally Posted by Tricla

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If you'd seen the 70 mins before that you'd have a different opinion.

I don't feel we were dominant at any point in the game. We were better in the latter stages of the second half and had a couple of chances but it was still one dimensional.

Utd still looked the better side going forward.

Totally accept that may be the case but was just trying to point out that we might have got a point like Dundee Utd did when they only played for 20 mins at ER,the only difference being,they got a goal.

***blackpoolhibs*** · 17-01-2010 10:35 AM

Originally Posted by hiberactive

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Totally accept that may be the case but was just trying to point out that we might have got a point like Dundee Utd did when they only played for 20 mins at ER,the only difference being,they got a goal.

Surely another team never got lucky, i thought it was only us?

**Dashing Bob S** · 17-01-2010 11:27 AM

I disagree, I thought it was a poor performance. The difference is that we've been used to bad performances but getting results. When you're cruising along in that mode, one of two things can happen. 1) the performances improve and somebody 'gets it' from Hibs, as we've been fantasising about all season. 2) the luck runs out and the 1-0's become 1-1's and the 1-1's become 0-1's, as seems to be happening.

I think the heavy pitches don't suit a relatively lightweight midfield, and we need a hardman in there, or Bamba back. It worries that we seem to be losing the fight and spirit that got us to where we were.

We were away-at-Hamilton/League Cup-against-St Johnstone garbage in the first half against a limited United team, who'd have gone in three up at the break but for Smith's heroics.

Yogi at least recognised the chronic lack of width in the side and changed the formation, and we were better in the second half, though there were too many misplaced passes and although we could have nicked a point, United were just as likely to get a second and overall were good money for the win.

Nothing against Rankin, a decent squad player, but he doesn't protect the defence like McBride, link up with Miller, like McBride, invariably find a green jersey with a pass, like McBride. So why is he in the team in place of McBride? KM's restoration would go a long way to solving our problems.

Also put DR up front and give Galbraith a chance wide. Wotherspoon right midfield please, with Zommer on the bench as impact player for a bit till he stops trying to dribble past six opponents in the centre circle when a simple pass is on.

**Fifer** · 17-01-2010 11:28 AM

Originally Posted by Tricla

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These comments are closer to the mark. I can't understand people who are excusing this performance by saying 'we were better in the second half' or 'Utd shaved it'.

We were better in the second half but that was no real achievement given how terrible we were in the first half.

Utd didn't 'shave' it. They were better than us in every department and if it wasn't for Smith and some good luck we would have been well beaten.

I don't think I or others with this opinion are being unreasonable or are on 'suicide' watch!

This game was the culmination of weeks of sub par performances and I haven't seen any evidence of things being done to change it ie players being dropped or tactics being changed.

I trust Yogi 100% but you do tend to worry slightly when players who continue to turn in poor performances consistently get picked. It's also worrying how one dimensional we are just now.

Hamilton at home is a good chance to sort it though.

Sums it all up perfectly. We have been poor for a long time now. I know it is better than last year , but the team in IHO is not playing very well. When was the last time you can remember, when we gave a team a really good beating. Is it just me or am i missing something.

***JimBHibees*** · 17-01-2010 02:57 PM

Originally Posted by Jones28

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Fail to see how Hogg is to blame, he's really come on to a game the past few weeks

How he was murder against Rangers and Hearts.

***Jones28*** · 17-01-2010 03:54 PM

Originally Posted by JimBHibees

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How he was murder against Rangers and Hearts.

Hogg gets singled out for any mistakes he makes, but Golden Boy Riordan gets hardly a murmur, there were certainly worse players on the pitch both those games

***blackpoolhibs*** · 17-01-2010 04:09 PM

Originally Posted by Jones28

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Hogg gets singled out for any mistakes he makes, but Golden Boy Riordan gets hardly a murmur, there were certainly worse players on the pitch both those games

And again.

**hibsbollah** · 17-01-2010 04:12 PM

Originally Posted by Cameron1875

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The fact zemmama faked injury

Sorry, I must have missed this. Where is your source for this 'fact'

***Aubenas*** · 17-01-2010 05:17 PM

Nothing against Rankin, a decent squad player, but he doesn't protect the defence like McBride, link up with Miller, like McBride, invariably find a green jersey with a pass, like McBride. So why is he in the team in place of McBride? KM's restoration would go a long way to solving our problems.

Also put DR up front and give Galbraith a chance wide. Wotherspoon right midfield please, with Zommer on the bench as impact player for a bit till he stops trying to dribble past six opponents in the centre circle when a simple pass is on.