Why are British politics so negative?

Lived abroad for many years now but from news, social media, conversations with friends it seems that many people define themselves and/or the party they 'support' by who they dislike rather than what they actually believe or relate to. I rarely see anything like "I like Johnson/Corbyn/Sturgeon because of...." type comments, it's always more like "how could you vote for this clown - look at what he/she has done.....".

Lots has been said about how polarised society is becoming, but this feels more than that.

Interested in what others think (agree or disagree0 or the reasons behind this. One theory I guess is that the candidates are so poor it's siding with the one you dislike the least?

I think a lot of it is down to how politicians seem to engage with the public.

theres rarely any of them saying ‘vote for me/us because we’ll do xyz to improve this/that’, it’s much more along the lines of ‘don’t vote for them coz they’re bad’

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Originally Posted by McD

I think a lot of it is down to how politicians seem to engage with the public.

theres rarely any of them saying ‘vote for me/us because we’ll do xyz to improve this/that’, it’s much more along the lines of ‘don’t vote for them coz they’re bad’

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Always on the defensive - hardly ever positive about how to change and improve things.
And when they do try to, they resort to fake news, twisted facts and bull**** to get their point across.

Its not just politicians that cant be trusted to do a proper job these days. So called 'reputable' journalists are worse than useless by spreading fake, unchecked news and not able to conduct a proper interview.

I don't think it is so different to most countries around the world.

Because making people feel unsettled wins votes and minds.

I wouldn’t say it’s a UK thing..

The political scene is much the same in all developed countries. In fact I'd say we have a healthier debate than most.

The trouble is that the British people are by and large pretty stupid, don't like foreigners, drink too much crap booze and watch drivel on TV.

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Originally Posted by heretoday

The political scene is much the same in all developed countries. In fact I'd say we have a healthier debate than most.

The trouble is that the British people are by and large pretty stupid, don't like foreigners, drink too much crap booze and watch drivel on TV.

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Yet in Britian we don't see far right party's standing for election but we do right across the EU.

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Originally Posted by Slavers

Yet in Britian we don't see far right party's standing for election but we do right across the EU.

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A far right party are likely to win this election.

Just watch the leaders debate tonight. Only one of the leaders is putting forward positive positions and arguments. The others are all about stopping that party with NO policy that they want to talk about. Stop indyref2 is the mantra from Libdems and Tories and Labour to a slightly lesser extent

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Originally Posted by Smartie

A far right party are likely to win this election.

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The Tories are not far right.

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Originally Posted by weecounty hibby

Just watch the leaders debate tonight. Only one of the leaders is putting forward positive positions and arguments. The others are all about stopping that party with NO policy that they want to talk about. Stop indyref2 is the mantra from Libdems and Tories and Labour to a slightly lesser extent

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That’s why the liberal agenda is being taken to the cleaners at the moment. It’s all shroud waving and project fear instead of putting a positive programme forward. It was the same with the brexit ref. This leaves loads of space for the view from the extremes to secure prominence in people’s minds.

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Originally Posted by Smartie

A far right party are likely to win this election.

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Whether you agree with the Conservatives or not, whether you agree with Boris Johnson or not, there is no way you could describe them or him as FAR right.

Further to the right than David Cameron or Theresa May's governments? Probably. But that doesn't make them far right.

Refer to 1930s Germany and Italy for far right politics. Even the USA under Donald Trump is more far right.

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Originally Posted by Sir David Gray

Whether you agree with the Conservatives or not, whether you agree with Boris Johnson or not, there is no way you could describe them or him as FAR right.

Further to the right than David Cameron or Theresa May's governments? Probably. But that doesn't make them far right.

Refer to 1930s Germany and Italy for far right politics. Even the USA under Donald Trump is more far right.

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They are in the nationalist, populist, anti-immigrant, anti-EU space inhabited by the likes of Salvini, Le Pen etc. Whether you call that far right or just right is personal taste. They are comfortably further right than the Thatcherites were and miles to the right of Cameron, Osbourne and chums.

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Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

They are in the nationalist, populist, anti-immigrant, anti-EU space inhabited by the likes of Salvini, Le Pen etc. Whether you call that far right or just right is personal taste. They are comfortably further right than the Thatcherites were and miles to the right of Cameron, Osbourne and chums.

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The Conservatives are on record saying immigrants are welcome and valued to the UK however, they are proposing tighter controls on who is allowed into the country - this is not anti-immigrant.

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Originally Posted by Slavers

The Conservatives are on record saying immigrants are welcome and valued to the UK however, they are proposing tighter controls on who is allowed into the country - this is not anti-immigrant.

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The Orange Order are on record saying they don't hate Catholics.

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Originally Posted by Slavers

The Conservatives are on record saying immigrants are welcome and valued to the UK however, they are proposing tighter controls on who is allowed into the country - this is not anti-immigrant.

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For too long EU Nationals have treated Britain like their home...

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Originally Posted by matty_f

For too long EU Nationals have treated Britain like their home...

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Johnson didn't say that Matty (if that's what you're alluding to).

I'm starting to feel like I'm working for Conservative HQ (or Fact Check UK :greengrin) on here. I need a shower before making sure I vote the right way tomorrow!

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Originally Posted by Future17

Johnson didn't say that Matty (if that's what you're alluding to).

I'm starting to feel like I'm working for Conservative HQ (or Fact Check UK :greengrin) on here. I need a shower before making sure I vote the right way tomorrow!

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He said

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“You’ve seen quite a large of people coming in from the EU – 580 million population – able to treat the UK as though it’s basically part of their own country.”

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Not substantially different - it's an appeal to nativism anway.

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Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

The Orange Order are on record saying they don't hate Catholics.

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The Orange Order - and I'm not making this up - gave my children's Catholic primary school a donation of several thousand pounds to pay for a complete refurbishment of the playground about 5 years ago. Substantial astonishment all round.

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Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

He said



Not substantially different - it's an appeal to nativism anway.

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Here I go again but, for me, that is substantially different. For context, an expanded quotation of what he said was:

"over the last couple of decades or more... we’ve seen quite large numbers of people coming in from the whole of the EU...able to treat the UK basically as though it’s part of their own country. And the problem with that is that there’s basically been no control at all. And I don’t think that is democratically accountable.”

For me, the most profound difference compared with the quote - "for too long EU Nationals have treated Britain like their home" - is that Johnson didn't say there was anything wrong with EU nationals treating the UK as their home; in fact, he didn't mention "home" at all.

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Originally Posted by Slavers

The Tories are not far right.

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Not until Friday anyway.

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Originally Posted by lapsedhibee

Not until Friday anyway.

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The two best ways of not having a far right Tory government are either to see them defeated altogether or, paradoxically, to see them with a very large majority within which the ERG Rees-Mogg faction has a much diluted influence.

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Originally Posted by One Day Soon

The Orange Order - and I'm not making this up - gave my children's Catholic primary school a donation of several thousand pounds to pay for a complete refurbishment of the playground about 5 years ago. Substantial astonishment all round.

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:confused:

One for the wtf thread?

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Originally Posted by One Day Soon

The two best ways of not having a far right Tory government are either to see them defeated altogether or, paradoxically, to see them with a very large majority within which the ERG Rees-Mogg faction has a much diluted influence.

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Yep, but neither is looking likely.

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Originally Posted by Future17

Here I go again but, for me, that is substantially different. For context, an expanded quotation of what he said was:

"over the last couple of decades or more... we’ve seen quite large numbers of people coming in from the whole of the EU...able to treat the UK basically as though it’s part of their own country. And the problem with that is that there’s basically been no control at all. And I don’t think that is democratically accountable.”

For me, the most profound difference compared with the quote - "for too long EU Nationals have treated Britain like their home" - is that Johnson didn't say there was anything wrong with EU nationals treating the UK as their home; in fact, he didn't mention "home" at all.

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To me, my "own country" is my home. I would want anybody settling in Scotland to see it as their "own country" too.

You Johnsonian apologists might differ. :wink:

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Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

:confused:

One for the wtf thread?

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I can see why the OO might want to see Catholic schools flourish.

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Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

:confused:

One for the wtf thread?

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It's a real cracker. Funnily enough no commemorative plaque was requested for the facility.

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Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

He said



Not substantially different - it's an appeal to nativism anway.

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Thanks - I paraphrased (because I couldn't recall the actual quote) but the message is, IMHO, the same.

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Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

To me, my "own country" is my home. I would want anybody settling in Scotland to see it as their "own country" too.

You Johnsonian apologists might differ. :wink:

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Ha ha! How did it come to this?!? :greengrin

Fair play, although I think there's a difference between "their own country" and "part of their own country" in interpreting what he said. I guess these things are interpreted by each of us based on our own experiences and/or biases.

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Originally Posted by matty_f

For too long EU Nationals have treated Britain like their home...

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Imagine Sturgeon saying that about the English.

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Originally Posted by Future17

"over the last couple of decades or more... we’ve seen quite large numbers of people coming in from the whole of the EU...able to treat the UK basically as though it’s part of their own country. And the problem with that is that there’s basically been no control at all. And I don’t think that is democratically accountable.”

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That was the whole point of EU open borders. If you're European then anywhere in Europe is your home. With Brexit your home has just been considerably downsized. Ironically, most of the people worst effected by the inward looking consequences of Brexit didn't even have a say in it. It's been a democratic farce from the off.

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Originally Posted by Hibrandenburg

That was the whole point of EU open borders. If you're European then anywhere in Europe is your home. With Brexit your home has just been considerably downsized. Ironically, most of the people worst effected by the inward looking consequences of Brexit didn't even have a say in it. It's been a democratic farce from the off.

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Hard to disagree with that. I'm too young to know, but I wonder if the UK, or at least certain parts of It, were never really sold on the idea in the first place.

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Originally Posted by Future17

Hard to disagree with that. I'm too young to know, but I wonder if the UK, or at least certain parts of It, were never really sold on the idea in the first place.

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It didn't interest anyone until Nigel told us we were being invaded, apart from the outrage of having to consume straight bananas that is.