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31-12-2020, 12:24 PM
easty

Quote:

Originally Posted by J.S

And yet primark is shut. Theres no difference in what they sell apart from food. I know we are trying to keep the economy going but to me it's either lockdown or it's not . I'm sick of this half hearted nonsense

Agree
31-12-2020, 12:29 PM
Santa Cruz

Quote:

Originally Posted by degenerated

Thats good then, you will also no doubt also know that any changes to the limited powers being transferred require to be submitted to Alister Jack for his approval prior to implementation.

Seeing as I only learned the reason they delayed taking responsibility for additional powers about 15 mins ago, nah I wasn't. It wasn't mentioned in the link to the report I posted for the delay.
It say's "The UK's Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) is still administering a swathe of benefits despite the Scottish Parliament being able to legislate on them since last year, in a "split competence" arrangement".

This is veering of covid now, so not really for this thread, so I'll leave it there.

Happy New Year.
31-12-2020, 12:35 PM
ronaldo7

Quote:

Originally Posted by Santa Cruz

Seeing as I only learned the reason they delayed taking responsibility for additional powers about 15 mins ago, nah I wasn't. It wasn't mentioned in the link to the report I posted for the delay.
It say's "The UK's Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) is still administering a swathe of benefits despite the Scottish Parliament being able to legislate on them since last year, in a "split competence" arrangement".

This is veering of covid now, so not really for this thread, so I'll leave it there.

Happy New Year.

Having dealt with the DWP over the years and now dealing with social security Scotland, it's like night and day. Let's get all the powers, I say.

Happy New Year.
31-12-2020, 12:35 PM
Callum_62

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir David Gray

I get that the Scottish Government wants more power, my point is that they already have considerable power as it is to have done a much better job of preventing a lot of the issues laid out in the earlier post which have occurred in Scotland over the last 9 months.

Yes the UK Government is a shambles, yes their decision making will have an impact on what happens up here but I don't agree with the notion that we've got this helpless little Government in Holyrood that is making errors during the pandemic because our nasty big brother has tied one of our hands behind our back.

Happy New Year to you too, here's to many more debates like this in 2021 - although hopefully not about a pandemic!

Almost all the nations that have done well have had strong border controls

I don't think any the devolved nations can control that?

If not, that's a pretty good clove hitch

Sent from my VOG-L29 using Tapatalk
31-12-2020, 12:37 PM
Sir David Gray

232,169 people tested positive in England at least once in the week up to 23rd December, 33% increase on the previous week.

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-...began-12176246
31-12-2020, 12:37 PM
Santa Cruz

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronaldo7

Having dealt with the DWP over the years and now dealing with social security Scotland, it's like night and day. Let's get all the powers, I say.

Happy New Year.

Would agree and glad to hear you had a more positive experience.

Happy New Year.
31-12-2020, 12:40 PM
ronaldo7

Quote:

Originally Posted by Callum_62

Almost all the nations that have done well have had strong border controls

I don't think any the devolved nations can control that?

If not, that's a pretty good clove hitch

Sent from my VOG-L29 using Tapatalk

Travel has been the most important element in transferring the disease. You only have to look at what New Zealand did. Borders closed, whilst the UK government put a premium on Business travelers coming into the UK.
31-12-2020, 12:48 PM
Sir David Gray

Quote:

Originally Posted by Callum_62

Almost all the nations that have done well have had strong border controls

I don't think any the devolved nations can control that?

If not, that's a pretty good clove hitch

Sent from my VOG-L29 using Tapatalk

I agree that not closing the border was a huge error on the part of the UK Government.
31-12-2020, 12:55 PM
Smartie

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir David Gray

I get that the Scottish Government wants more power, my point is that they already have considerable power as it is to have done a much better job of preventing a lot of the issues laid out in the earlier post which have occurred in Scotland over the last 9 months.

Yes the UK Government is a shambles, yes their decision making will have an impact on what happens up here but I don't agree with the notion that we've got this helpless little Government in Holyrood that is making errors during the pandemic because our nasty big brother has tied one of our hands behind our back.

Happy New Year to you too, here's to many more debates like this in 2021 - although hopefully not about a pandemic!

I'm looking forward to the day that this thread is closed down.

The final post should be yours, where you state that the case numbers as of today are zero everywhere.

A wee bit of water to flow under the bridge until we get there yet however...
31-12-2020, 12:58 PM
Sir David Gray

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smartie

I'm looking forward to the day that this thread is closed down.

The final post should be yours, where you state that the case numbers as of today are zero everywhere.

A wee bit of water to flow under the bridge until we get there yet however...

I can't wait for that day.
31-12-2020, 01:03 PM
Sir David Gray

Daily Scottish update;

2622 new cases since yesterday - 10.1% positivity rate
Increase of 41 in the confirmed cases in hospital
Increase of 1 in the confirmed cases in intensive care
68 deaths registered since yesterday
31-12-2020, 01:16 PM
JeMeSouviens

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smartie

I'm looking forward to the day that this thread is closed down.

The final post should be yours, where you state that the case numbers as of today are zero everywhere.

A wee bit of water to flow under the bridge until we get there yet however...

I’m not sure we’ll ever get to zero cases. Almost no deaths should be in sight soon though, thank ****.

Today’s numbers are horrendous. :-(
31-12-2020, 01:16 PM
Mon Dieu4

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir David Gray

Daily Scottish update;

2622 new cases since yesterday - 10.1% positivity rate
Increase of 41 in the confirmed cases in hospital
Increase of 1 in the confirmed cases in intensive care
68 deaths registered since yesterday

Does it say anything about these being for previous dates and catching up? That's over double what the daily standard has been for the last couple of months, if that's just yesterday then it's frightening
31-12-2020, 01:23 PM
Sir David Gray

Breakdown of today's cases by council area;

Glasgow - 307
Edinburgh - 248
North Lanarkshire - 196
South Lanarkshire - 176
Renfrewshire - 126
Aberdeenshire - 124
Dundee - 115
Aberdeen - 115
Dumfries and Galloway - 114
Fife - 101
Inverclyde - 98
North Ayrshire - 90
Scottish Borders - 79
East Ayrshire - 79
Perth and Kinross - 75
West Lothian - 73
Highland - 68
East Renfrewshire - 56
South Ayrshire - 55
East Dunbartonshire - 54
Falkirk - 52
Angus - 46
Midlothian - 40
West Dunbartonshire - 37
Moray - 20
Stirling - 17
East Lothian - 17
Shetland - 16
Argyll and Bute - 15
Clackmannanshire - 9
Na h-Eileanan Siar - 1
31-12-2020, 01:25 PM
Sir David Gray

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mon Dieu4

Does it say anything about these being for previous dates and catching up? That's over double what the daily standard has been for the last couple of months, if that's just yesterday then it's frightening

It could be a catch up but I haven't seen anything so far that says that, sorry.
31-12-2020, 01:25 PM
stu in nottingham

Not extolling it's virtues or otherwise but it's interesting to see some of the conditions of lockdown in Italy over the holiday period by comparison. The below measures are in place until January 6th, the feast of the epiphany when restrictions will be reviewed.

Some days are designated as 'Orange Days' and others as 'Red Days'. The former has fewer restrictions, it's Red today. People cannot leave their own towns, and can only walk only within 500 metres from home. Business closures are in line with top tier restrictions here with a large support package announced and further ones on the way.
.
Leaving the home requires a self-certificate which can be accessed from the internet and filled in with your personal details. You can be stopped by police and asked to produce it..Blieve though tht police can issue you with a certificate on the spot. Violations can attract a 207 euro fine or imprisonment up to three months.
31-12-2020, 01:25 PM
Pretty Boy

The massive jump in both numbers and positivity rate doesn't really make sense unless there is still some kind of Christmas lag.

24th Dec - 1314 cases (5.3% positivity rate)
25th - 1165 (4.3%)
26th - 1149 (8.2%)
27th - 740 (12.3%)
28th - 967 (12.2%)
29th - 1895 (14.4%)
30th - 2045 (11.3%)
31st - 2622 (10.1%)

The 7 day positivity rate has almost doubled in that time as well. Something doesn't add up.
31-12-2020, 01:53 PM
Stairway 2 7

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pretty Boy

The massive jump in both numbers and positivity rate doesn't really make sense unless there is still some kind of Christmas lag.

24th Dec - 1314 cases (5.3% positivity rate)
25th - 1165 (4.3%)
26th - 1149 (8.2%)
27th - 740 (12.3%)
28th - 967 (12.2%)
29th - 1895 (14.4%)
30th - 2045 (11.3%)
31st - 2622 (10.1%)

The 7 day positivity rate has almost doubled in that time as well. Something doesn't add up.

Similar trend in England. The new strain 50% more infectious minimum and infectious diseases love winter. January will be horrific but at least we can get an m and s cardi
31-12-2020, 02:08 PM
marinello59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pretty Boy

The massive jump in both numbers and positivity rate doesn't really make sense unless there is still some kind of Christmas lag.

24th Dec - 1314 cases (5.3% positivity rate)
25th - 1165 (4.3%)
26th - 1149 (8.2%)
27th - 740 (12.3%)
28th - 967 (12.2%)
29th - 1895 (14.4%)
30th - 2045 (11.3%)
31st - 2622 (10.1%)

The 7 day positivity rate has almost doubled in that time as well. Something doesn't add up.

The new strain at work?
31-12-2020, 02:20 PM
Hibrandenburg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir David Gray

I don't dispute that the performance in England has been worse than in Scotland, as you say the figures are all very clear. However I don't think comparing us favourably to England doesn't mean that we should necessarily be happy with things up here.

The handling of the pandemic by the UK Government has been a shambles. We should expect better from our Government and compare their performance against some of the best performing nations.

We can't compare ourselves with anyone else other that Wales and Northern Ireland, simply because all other countries have access to all the levers of power. Anyone who thinks that Scotland have benefitted from the union during the covid crisis wants their heads looking at.
31-12-2020, 02:44 PM
Ozyhibby

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hibrandenburg

We can't compare ourselves with anyone else other that Wales and Northern Ireland, simply because all other countries have access to all the levers of power. Anyone who thinks that Scotland have benefitted from the union during the covid crisis wants their heads looking at.

NI appeared to have started well during the first wave but it’s all gone pear shaped over there now. We compare favourably with Wales.
It’s hard to compare ourselves with anywhere else’s, as you say. Like it or not, we are tied to the Johnson govt.

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31-12-2020, 03:13 PM
G B Young

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir David Gray

Daily Scottish update;

2622 new cases since yesterday - 10.1% positivity rate
Increase of 41 in the confirmed cases in hospital
Increase of 1 in the confirmed cases in intensive care
68 deaths registered since yesterday

The leap in new case numbers day after day is worse than I imagined.
31-12-2020, 03:17 PM
Sir David Gray

55,892 cases and 964 deaths registered in the UK today.
31-12-2020, 03:18 PM
G B Young

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pretty Boy

The massive jump in both numbers and positivity rate doesn't really make sense unless there is still some kind of Christmas lag.

24th Dec - 1314 cases (5.3% positivity rate)
25th - 1165 (4.3%)
26th - 1149 (8.2%)
27th - 740 (12.3%)
28th - 967 (12.2%)
29th - 1895 (14.4%)
30th - 2045 (11.3%)
31st - 2622 (10.1%)

The 7 day positivity rate has almost doubled in that time as well. Something doesn't add up.

I think Sturgeon said yesterday it's due to the new strain of the virus taking a firm hold in Scotland (ie it spreads a great deal more rapidly). Whether there's still a Christmas catch-up going on I don't know.
31-12-2020, 03:21 PM
CloudSquall

Quite saddening to say the least that we are now back at +/- 1000 deaths a day, I thought that was to be a thing of the past.

Cases started to rise rather rapidly here in Argentina also, going from new daily cases of 5 or 6 thousand to nearly 12 thousand yesterday.
31-12-2020, 03:23 PM
Sir David Gray

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir David Gray

55,892 cases and 964 deaths registered in the UK today.

Breakdown of cases;

England - 49,510
Scotland - 2,622
Northern Ireland - 1,929
Wales - 1,831

Breakdown of deaths;

England - 820
Scotland - 68
Wales - 65
Northern Ireland - 11
31-12-2020, 03:24 PM
Moulin Yarns

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronaldo7

Travel has been the most important element in transferring the disease. You only have to look at what New Zealand did. Borders closed, whilst the UK government put a premium on Business travelers coming into the UK.

Not just international travel, but travel within the UK is spreading the virus. I was out for a walk today, quite a few different accents from around the UK as we greeted each other.
31-12-2020, 03:33 PM
G B Young

Quote:

Originally Posted by hibsbollah

:agree: If there is no improvement, or some levelling off, in the numbers, then I would grudgingly accept further delay to a return to school in January but it would be really tragic for my kids. I’m not using that word lightly either. That would be the best part of three academic terms over two calendar years and two sets of exam sittings disrupted for my eldest, who’s had her whole future put at risk, my youngest continuing to retreat into himself as he retreats into his screens, and more time off work for my family and millions like us trying to make sure our kids don’t go totally feral. It has to be the last resort.

Agree with much of what you say there. I especially hear you re the bit in bold. For one of my kids lockdown actually came at a good time due to the difficulties he was having at school, but he has had a much happier time of it since going back in August. It would be so dispiriting to see that undone by another lengthy shutdown. I fear we're looking at date later than January 18th for a return though.

Trying to prevent their kids' retreat into themselves and their screens (as you so rightly put it) is one of the most challenging aspects of being a parent IMHO. Have you watched the Social Dilemma on Netflix? It extends its reach beyond the impact on kids and is a thoroughly depressing watch:

https://www.netflix.com/gb/title/81254224
31-12-2020, 03:42 PM
G B Young

Quote:

Originally Posted by CloudSquall

Quite saddening to say the least that we are now back at +/- 1000 deaths a day, I thought that was to be a thing of the past.

Cases started to rise rather rapidly here in Argentina also, going from new daily cases of 5 or 6 thousand to nearly 12 thousand yesterday.

I noticed that Germany recorded a record daily death toll of more than 1,100 yesterday.

As you say all extremely depressing and a far cry from the PM's prediction of 'back to normal by Christmas' and the FM predicting back in June that 'total elimination' of the virus in Scotland could be only weeks away.

All the talk of heralding a happier 2021 rings rather hollow when faced with these figures. Yes the vaccines will (we have to assume) eventually see us return to some sort of normality but it seems a long way off right now.
31-12-2020, 03:58 PM
Pretty Boy

Quote:

Originally Posted by G B Young

I noticed that Germany recorded a record daily death toll of more than 1,100 yesterday.

As you say all extremely depressing and a far cry from the PM's prediction of 'back to normal by Christmas' and the FM predicting back in June that 'total elimination' of the virus in Scotland could be only weeks away.

All the talk of heralding a happier 2021 rings rather hollow when faced with these figures. Yes the vaccines will (we have to assume) eventually see us return to some sort of normality but it seems a long way off right now.

I understand the sentiment when people are saying things like 'glad to see the back of 2020' and 'we got through it' and whatever else.

The sad reality is that a large chunk of 2021 isn't going to be a whole lot better. The WHO and others have warned for months that vaccination isn't a silver bullet. Things will get better but it's a slow process and I hope people are able to digest that.

I get the New Year is always a time for mawkish or asinine sentimentality so there is obviously an element of that at play but turning the page on the calendar isn't a new beginning. It's more of the same for the foreseeable and in years to come 2021 will probably be viewed almost as unfavourably as 2020.

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