Brexit - What Now.

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23-10-2019, 07:28 AM
Moulin Yarns

Quote:

Originally Posted by G B Young

Lib Dems and SNP must be tempted to vote for an election now.

Like it or not, Johnson has achieved something May never came close to - securing the backing of the Commons for a Brexit deal. He will certainly be able to throw a lot of weight behind the 'parliament thwarting the will of the people' mantra going into a general election.

Now I'm confused. The house of commons backs the deal negotiated by Johnson (the will of the people) but he will use 'parliament thwarted the will of the people' in a general election.

How does that work? What does it even mean?
23-10-2019, 07:30 AM
Fife-Hibee

Quote:

Originally Posted by G B Young

Lib Dems and SNP must be tempted to vote for an election now.

Like it or not, Johnson has achieved something May never came close to - securing the backing of the Commons for a Brexit deal. He will certainly be able to throw a lot of weight behind the 'parliament thwarting the will of the people' mantra going into a general election.

Johnson hasn't achieved anything. The supporting of the bill combined with the thwarting of the timetable was purely tactical.
23-10-2019, 07:50 AM
lapsedhibee

Tom Peck's quite good today on the continuing madness resulting from the 'No 10 source' strategy.

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices...-a9167056.html
23-10-2019, 09:07 AM
BroxburnHibee

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bristolhibby

And it will be voted down. Again. Johnston has to squirm. Wait until 1st November then get the election called. Take away from him any idea that he managed to “Get Brexit done”.

J

His Halloween deadline is all but dust now.

Only way it could still happen is if EU reject the extension request but that's highly unlikely.

Think an election needs at least 6 weeks prep so even if it goes ahead we're into December.

Should be motivating the troops now as I think this is nailed on what's gonna happen.
23-10-2019, 09:15 AM
SHODAN

Unless Corbyn and Swinson stop behaving like children and make an election pact then we'll have a Johnson majority just in time for Christmas.
23-10-2019, 09:18 AM
Hibrandenburg

Decent read.

https://www.quora.com/Why-are-Remain...X4Cscy56yx0lmU
23-10-2019, 09:24 AM
Fife-Hibee

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diclonius

Unless Corbyn and Swinson stop behaving like children and make an election pact then we'll have a Johnson majority just in time for Christmas.

Corbyn hasn't ruled out a pact with Swinson. Swinson has however ruled out a pact with Corbyn as it doesn't serve her personal interests.
23-10-2019, 09:37 AM
Cataplana

If people want to make amendments to the bill, they have to pass the bill first. If they don't think two days is long enough for that, then they vote down the timetable.

I actually understood what was happening for once.
23-10-2019, 10:23 AM
BroxburnHibee

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cataplana

If people want to make amendments to the bill, they have to pass the bill first. If they don't think two days is long enough for that, then they vote down the timetable.

I actually understood what was happening for once.

Yep but Johnson the liar didn't want his bill scrutinised.

You don't need much imagination to wonder why.
23-10-2019, 10:38 AM
JeMeSouviens

Johnson/Cummings meeting Corbyn/Milne currently to discuss a possible compromise timetable ...

Edit:

Quote:

Laura Kuenssberg @bbclaurak

Hear nothing was agreed at PM-Corbyn meeting - Labour wanted to discuss a different timetable for Brexit bill, govt wanted to know what Lab would do if the extension is vetoed - sounds like neither side came away with much
23-10-2019, 10:40 AM
G B Young

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fife-Hibee

Johnson hasn't achieved anything. The supporting of the bill combined with the thwarting of the timetable was purely tactical.

Bearing in mind the opposition parties plus the DUP had pledged to vote against the deal, presumably the 'tactic' was to see it fail? It only passed thanks to support from nearly 20 Labour rebels.

Or was this the Labour 'nudge and wink' Nicola Sturgeon was referring to?
23-10-2019, 12:07 PM
Ozyhibby

Quote:

Originally Posted by G B Young

Bearing in mind the opposition parties plus the DUP had pledged to vote against the deal, presumably the 'tactic' was to see it fail? It only passed thanks to support from nearly 20 Labour rebels.

Or was this the Labour 'nudge and wink' Nicola Sturgeon was referring to?

Only 5 of those rebels voted for the timetable so I would say their support was very soft and likely only for the sake of telling their leave constituents that they voted for the deal in the upcoming GE.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
23-10-2019, 12:15 PM
The Harp Awakes

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fife-Hibee

Corbyn hasn't ruled out a pact with Swinson. Swinson has however ruled out a pact with Corbyn as it doesn't serve her personal interests.

It would be suicide for the LDs to form any kind of arrangement with Corbyn primarily because of all the Tory marginal seats they hope to win in the South of England at the next GE.
23-10-2019, 12:19 PM
Jack Hackett

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hibrandenburg

Decent read.

https://www.quora.com/Why-are-Remain...X4Cscy56yx0lmU

Quora is my go to site for intelligent and considered debate on brexit... With one or two contributer exceptions
23-10-2019, 02:22 PM
G B Young

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Harp Awakes

It would be suicide for the LDs to form any kind of arrangement with Corbyn primarily because of all the Tory marginal seats they hope to win in the South of England at the next GE.

Certainly doesn't sound as if Swinson's relationship with Corbyn is likely to improve any time soon judging by this morning's exchange in the Commons:

Lib Dems: 'Corbyn is a Brexiteer'

Speaking after Boris Johnson and Jeremy Corbyn's meeting this morning, Liberal Democrat leader Jo Swinson said: "Would the prime minister like to express his gratitude to the 19 Labour MPs who voted for his deal last night and the leader of the opposition for meeting with him this morning to help push through his bad Brexit deal?
"This is yet more clear proof that Jeremy Corbyn wants to deliver Brexit.
She added: "It seems that Jeremy Corbyn has thrown Mr Johnson another lifeline this morning, as six white men met to discuss pushing through a Brexit deal which will wreck our country.
“Mr Corbyn is a Brexiteer, and Remainers won't forget if a shady backroom deal between Johnson and Corbyn helps to deliver Brexit."
23-10-2019, 02:26 PM
SHODAN

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Harp Awakes

It would be suicide for the LDs to form any kind of arrangement with Corbyn primarily because of all the Tory marginal seats they hope to win in the South of England at the next GE.

A fair point. Just goes to show that at the end of the day she cares more about her own party's performance than actually stopping Brexit.
23-10-2019, 02:37 PM
marinello59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fife-Hibee

Corbyn hasn't ruled out a pact with Swinson. Swinson has however ruled out a pact with Corbyn as it doesn't serve her personal interests.

Corbyn has said he would consider an election pact with another party? When was this?
23-10-2019, 02:38 PM
marinello59

Quote:

Originally Posted by G B Young

Certainly doesn't sound as if Swinson's relationship with Corbyn is likely to improve any time soon judging by this morning's exchange in the Commons:

Lib Dems: 'Corbyn is a Brexiteer'

Speaking after Boris Johnson and Jeremy Corbyn's meeting this morning, Liberal Democrat leader Jo Swinson said: "Would the prime minister like to express his gratitude to the 19 Labour MPs who voted for his deal last night and the leader of the opposition for meeting with him this morning to help push through his bad Brexit deal?
"This is yet more clear proof that Jeremy Corbyn wants to deliver Brexit.
She added: "It seems that Jeremy Corbyn has thrown Mr Johnson another lifeline this morning, as six white men met to discuss pushing through a Brexit deal which will wreck our country.
“Mr Corbyn is a Brexiteer, and Remainers won't forget if a shady backroom deal between Johnson and Corbyn helps to deliver Brexit."

She’s right.
23-10-2019, 02:48 PM
CloudSquall

Quote:

Originally Posted by G B Young

C
She added: "It seems that Jeremy Corbyn has thrown Mr Johnson another lifeline this morning, as six white men met to discuss pushing through a Brexit deal which will wreck our country.

Cringe.
23-10-2019, 02:55 PM
Cataplana

Quote:

Originally Posted by CloudSquall

Cringe.

Is she Kez in disguise?
23-10-2019, 03:36 PM
DaveF

Quote:

Originally Posted by marinello59

She’s right.

Possibly but what's the point of the white men comment?
23-10-2019, 03:38 PM
Slavers

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveF

Possibly but what's the point of the white men comment?

She is clearly racist and implying that being white is a negative attribute in this situation.
23-10-2019, 03:57 PM
Mantis Toboggan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slavers

She is clearly racist and implying that being white is a negative attribute in this situation.

Clearly...
23-10-2019, 03:58 PM
Moulin Yarns

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveF

Possibly but what's the point of the white men comment?

Like Slaver's slavering, it is a poor attempt to point out the narrow group directly influential around the Prime Minister, that there are no 'non-white' or female representatives of the Prime Minister's inner circle. But then it was ever thus! It is representative of the elite Etonian/Bullingdon Club Tory cabinet.
23-10-2019, 04:35 PM
Cataplana

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slavers

She is clearly racist and implying that being white is a negative attribute in this situation.

I think she's suggesting that lack of diversity might be behind a bad decision. I also think she's admitting she has just noticed.
23-10-2019, 05:29 PM
cabbageandribs1875

https://2w6kxc22rrr9mabqt1mglgait6-w...ttoo-small.jpg

diddums :)
23-10-2019, 06:02 PM
cabbageandribs1875

Ian Blackford sent Bercow a letter today... :)

https://scontent.fman2-1.fna.fbcdn.n...45&oe=5E5F2018

he should have sent another one asking that all SNP MP's that speak in the HoC does so without heckling from the vile swine that sit on the opposite benches :agree:
23-10-2019, 06:03 PM
Fife-Hibee

Quote:

Originally Posted by marinello59

Corbyn has said he would consider an election pact with another party? When was this?

He hasn't ruled it out, Swinson has. Come to terms with it.
23-10-2019, 06:45 PM
The Harp Awakes

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroxburnHibee

Yep but Johnson the liar didn't want his bill scrutinised.

You don't need much imagination to wonder why.

I find it interesting that Corbyn and the Labour Party are falling over themselves to agree a new timetable with Boris for pushing the deal through. Add into the equation that Ken Clarke, the most anti Brexit of Tories, is going out of his way to make similar noises.

Sounds to me like the opposition may think they have the numbers to amend the Bill and turn it into a soft Brexit, e.g., customs union and single market for all the UK and get it passed. That would give the opposition the morale high ground (sorted Brexit), and send the ERG and hard Brexiteers into a tailspin leading to civil war in the Tory party again. Would certainly put the opposition parties on much better footing heading into a general election.

Will Boris fall into the bear trap I wonder? The fact he's dithering may indicate he smells a rat.
23-10-2019, 09:41 PM
cabbageandribs1875

jo swinson's ToryLites abstained from a motion by labour earlier bringing all NHS services back entirely into public hands and protect the NHS from post-brexit trade agreements, the motion was backed by SNP,Plaid Cymru,Greens.

https://evolvepolitics.com/jo-swinso...__BIp5EKt6rSU0

'kin shame on them :bitchy:

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