Tavares

It does strike me that Rocky and Jair are given a hard time. Almost like folks are waiting to pounce. Sincerely hope that there’s no joining the dots and some prejudices have been at work.

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Originally Posted by RyeSloan

Hardly the worst ever performance but overall it’s hard to say it was anything but mediocre at best.

I’m not sure what type of player he’s meant to be. His touch didn’t look great, doesn’t seem to have an abundance of pace and clearly physically a bit weak.

I certainly wouldn’t be shifting Boyle from that side to accommodate him again after that performance.

But hey you just never know I suppose!

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Boyle started on the left last week.

NM likes inverted wingers seemingly so don’t think Boyle was moved to accommodate him


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Tavares is the type of player who gets a game cause his dad owns the club.

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Originally Posted by 7Hero

Tavares is the type of player who gets a game cause his dad owns the club.

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So it seems the slate is clearly no lt wiped clean from your perspective?

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Originally Posted by Viva_Palmeiras

It does strike me that Rocky and Jair are given a hard time. Almost like folks are waiting to pounce. Sincerely hope that there’s no joining the dots and some prejudices have been at work.

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Campbell and Hanlon get it worse than anyone.

I think it’s as simple as folk just don’t rate them.

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Originally Posted by Viva_Palmeiras

It does strike me that Rocky and Jair are given a hard time. Almost like folks are waiting to pounce. Sincerely hope that there’s no joining the dots and some prejudices have been at work.

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Much the same as Stevenson & Hanlon, would be surprised if race played any part and it’s more down to the way messagebosrds/social media go these days. Folk form an opinion and that’s it then set in stone regardless of how players play.

Given mins & a consistent run of games we will see what’s what, imo I think he’s being written off too soon, he deserves the chance he’s been given now, build his confidence get him bulked up in the gym if he’s too lightweight, there’s work to be done but he’s gotta be given time to achieve that, I feel under LJ he was just abandoned an written off.


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Shame that race is brought into this, sure that is the last thing on anyones mind when they are pointing criticism at Jair or Rocky.

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Originally Posted by 7Hero

Shame that race is brought into this, sure that is the last thing on anyones mind when they are pointing criticism at Jair or Rocky.

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:agree:

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Originally Posted by Viva_Palmeiras

It does strike me that Rocky and Jair are given a hard time. Almost like folks are waiting to pounce. Sincerely hope that there’s no joining the dots and some prejudices have been at work.

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I don’t even know why any regular poster on here would post this? When it’s obviously bollocks.

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Originally Posted by AlbertK86

Boyle started on the left last week.

NM likes inverted wingers seemingly so don’t think Boyle was moved to accommodate him


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Yes, maybe folk didn't spot the change in approach last weekif they weren't at Kilmarnock. Definitely seems to favour 442 with inverted wingers.

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Originally Posted by Viva_Palmeiras

It does strike me that Rocky and Jair are given a hard time. Almost like folks are waiting to pounce. Sincerely hope that there’s no joining the dots and some prejudices have been at work.

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Rocky started horrendously here and Tavares was even worse.

Rocky has shown period of real potential and yesterday was the best I've seen Tavares - patchy, but looking like an actual professional.

I think NM prides himself on the individual development of his players, so I think they'll get chances.

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Originally Posted by Viva_Palmeiras

It does strike me that Rocky and Jair are given a hard time. Almost like folks are waiting to pounce. Sincerely hope that there’s no joining the dots and some prejudices have been at work.

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Sorry but I think this is a massive leap.

McKirdy, Marshall, Hanlon, Stevenson, Jeggo and Campbell have all come in for loads of criticism (some justified, lots not). I think it's just the nature of modern football.

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Originally Posted by neil7908

Sorry but I think this is a massive leap.

McKirdy, Marshall, Hanlon, Stevenson, Jeggo and Campbell have all come in for loads of criticism (some justified, lots not). I think it's just the nature of modern football.

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To call it a leap is generous.

To insinuate that sort of behaviour because some fans don’t rate Rocky or Tavares is out of order.

It’s based on nothing whatsoever.

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Originally Posted by 500miles

Rocky started horrendously here and Tavares was even worse.

Rocky has shown period of real potential and yesterday was the best I've seen Tavares - patchy, but looking like an actual professional.

I think NM prides himself on the individual development of his players, so I think they'll get chances.

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I'm going to watch the match in full again because I thought Jair added little or nothing. I'm not writing him off, I hope he shows the aptitude that convinced us to bring him to Easter Road, but he certainly didn't do that yesterday.

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Originally Posted by Hibbyradge

I'm going to watch the match in full again because I thought Jair added little or nothing. I'm not writing him off, I hope he shows the aptitude that convinced us to bring him to Easter Road, but he certainly didn't do that yesterday.

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From memory he had a cross and the shot that went over the bar, I just can't see him making it here but you never know

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Originally Posted by Hibbyradge

I'm going to watch the match in full again because I thought Jair added little or nothing. I'm not writing him off, I hope he shows the aptitude that convinced us to bring him to Easter Road, but he certainly didn't do that yesterday.

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Looked like a player totally devoid of any confidence tbh, if more time with the squad and more game time helps who knows I suppose, but did look a bit out of his depth.

Was there a massive expectation on him today? He played nearly 60 mins in a first team game in Christ knows how long. His confidence would have used the boost. Don't think he was particularly bad. There were several senior players that walk themselves into trouble for absolutely no reason.

If he gets more game time we may see great improvements in him. Who knows

It's possibly less about race with jair and more that he's seen as a luxury player? Someone with bags of potential, good skills but "just too lightweight and not right for Scottish game" whatever that is. Maybe try telling kyogo that!

FWIW I think there's a player in there, remember it was only his second game back, thought there were good aspects to his play but he wouldn't have got a game if doige and youan were fit, so don't panic!

I also think Monty is genuine that he won't dish out favours, so if he's not seen as good enough he'll not keep his place.

From his perspective imagine going into your work knowing that a large amount of people had questioned your ability and wanted you out for the last year? Must have been tough for him so let's give him time. Fortunately most of the crowd were kind to him.

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Originally Posted by The Modfather

Much the same as Stevenson & Hanlon, would be surprised if race played any part and it’s more down to the way messagebosrds/social media go these days. Folk form an opinion and that’s it then set in stone regardless of how players play.

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Bushiri will only play when Hanlon or Fish can't. No way he will be a regular starter and I won't be surprised to see him moved on in January.

Basing my opinion purely on what I've seen from him on the pitch and not what anyone else is saying on social media or on here.

I also don't care what race he is. (Just adding that for absolute clarity as it appears it might be necessary to mention this when discussing players performances these days :wink:)

The previous head coach put huge pressure on him by needlessly building expectations, then he completely scuppered the player's development. It already seems that Montgomery will be far better for our promising young players. Hibs suporters can help by supporting them.

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Originally Posted by tamig

I think if the coaching stuff can work on the physical side of his game, he could be useful for us. Thats where he lacks most in my opinion. Being able to stay on his feet with someone right up his arse would be a good starting point.

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The physical side comes down to desire so it’s entirely down to him.

You see Whittaker when he came on, he just had a bit of purpose and went to close the ball down and compete like he meant it.

I didn’t think Tavares was dreadful yesterday, there were glimpses, but he’ll need to do more to stay about the team

His confidence is probably non existent in fairness.

Wasn't terrible or nothing special, a few good touches and a half decent effort on goal.

Fans gave him a decent reception as he went off.

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Originally Posted by Tambo

Wasn't terrible or nothing special, a few good touches and a half decent effort on goal.

Fans gave him a decent reception as he went off.

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Yup, won’t be starting again anytime soon if Boyle and Youan both fit.

But gives any idea where he is and what he needs to improve on, no need to write him off completely just yet

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Originally Posted by Unseen work

To call it a leap is generous.

To insinuate that sort of behaviour because some fans don’t rate Rocky or Tavares is out of order.

It’s based on nothing whatsoever.

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Yep, really poor stuff, typed out without any thought given to it whatsoever.

It looked to me like the lad was just over trying. For Montgomery to just throw him in, there must be a player there.

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Originally Posted by Viva_Palmeiras

It does strike me that Rocky and Jair are given a hard time. Almost like folks are waiting to pounce. Sincerely hope that there’s no joining the dots and some prejudices have been at work.

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They get a hard time because they haven't been showing very much on the park, indeed Rocky probably cost us the win at Killie last week. Don't like this implication at all, pretty poor to paint fellow fans in that light.

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Originally Posted by B.H.F.C

The physical side comes down to desire so it’s entirely down to him.

You see Whittaker when he came on, he just had a bit of purpose and went to close the ball down and compete like he meant it.

I didn’t think Tavares was dreadful yesterday, there were glimpses, but he’ll need to do more to stay about the team

His confidence is probably non existent in fairness.

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Different type of player though. Whittaker is a RB so is used to challenging for the ball whereas Tavares is a winger.

Agree though that Tavares needs to build some confidence before he can be judged properly.

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Originally Posted by Keepthefaith

It's possibly less about race with jair and more that he's seen as a luxury player? Someone with bags of potential, good skills but "just too lightweight and not right for Scottish game" whatever that is. Maybe try telling kyogo that!

FWIW I think there's a player in there, remember it was only his second game back, thought there were good aspects to his play but he wouldn't have got a game if doige and youan were fit, so don't panic!

I also think Monty is genuine that he won't dish out favours, so if he's not seen as good enough he'll not keep his place.

From his perspective imagine going into your work knowing that a large amount of people had questioned your ability and wanted you out for the last year? Must have been tough for him so let's give him time. Fortunately most of the crowd were kind to him.

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I'm all for players getting a chance though what we seen yesterday is much the same as we have seen before from him which was disappointing tbh . Kyogo is totally different in that he's a feisty player who regularly gets involved in games.

Tavares had nearly a hour on yesterday and apart from a couple of moments imo he was pretty anonymous . He was far to easily brushed off the ball , didn't close the st johnstone players down quickly enough and can't really remember him putting in any tackles. Felt like we were a man down at times yesterday .

Giving him time is ok though what if we have a player in the youth team thats playing well and could possibly contribute more like young Whittaker did . I did wonder watching Jair yesterday is he any better of a option than Daniel Mackay would have been too .

I didn't see much yesterday to suggest that Jair will come good or there's a player there . I hope of course he comes good and proves me wrong though .

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Originally Posted by Donegal Hibby

I'm all for players getting a chance though what we seen yesterday is much the same as we have seen before from him which was disappointing tbh . Kyogo is totally different in that he's a feisty player who regularly gets involved in games.

Tavares had nearly a hour on yesterday and apart from a couple of moments imo he was pretty anonymous . He was far to easily brushed off the ball , didn't close the st johnstone players down quickly enough and can't really remember him putting in any tackles. Felt like we were a man down at times yesterday .

Giving him time is ok though what if we have a player in the youth team thats playing well and could possibly contribute more like young Whittaker did . I did wonder watching Jair yesterday is he any better of a option than Daniel Mackay would have been too .

I didn't see much yesterday to suggest that Jair will come good or there's a player there . I hope of course he comes good and proves me wrong though .

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its interesting that you didn't comment on the last bit of my post about his confidence and how it might have felt for him to play in front of fans like yourself who have decided he's not good enough. I was watching him pretty closely and what me and my mate noticed was how many good runs he made, how many good positions he got himself into. sure he could have done better at closing down at times and he lost a few tackles (so did Boyle btw) but it feels like he's got more to prove as a result of what's gone on in the last year, especially the way he was brought int o much fanfare and rumours of salary. I think you're being a bit selective to prove a point, but he did ok yesterday, as he also did ok for his cameo against kill the week before.

I trust this manager to get it right with Tavares. however to make a comparison with Whittaker isn't totally fair - they're very different players and I don't see Tavares blocking his development under Monty. McKay would appear to have been at the club long enough, with enough loans at a lower level to form some decent opinion about his career here, though I also trust Monty there too!