KP - Hibs Voting Intentions

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Originally Posted by lucky

Not surprised by the comments on here but it’s time to take the green specs off. The proposal of points per game costs Hibs £125k in prize money. The loss of two games against them another £250k. There is going to be very little money around next season not only in football but in society. It’s fanciful to think Hibs will average 180000 for home games next year when unemployment levels could hit 20%. There is going to be a drop in ST sales at most clubs if not all, sponsorship will be down as will hospitality. I’d be amazed if any “fan” that could afford a ST did not get one to punish Hibs for voting against ending the season prematurely. This vote is NOT just about Hearts, listen to what it’s means to Partick Thistle and Stranraer and the clubs in the play offs. Football is about competing to the final whistle, the 21/05/16 taught us that. All teams should have the chance to win leagues and cups on the pitch or even get relegated on the pitch not the boardroom.

I can guarantee you now if Hibs were bottom of the league we would be going off our heads about being denying the opportunity to save ourselves on the pitch. These proposals are just wrong

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So do we just wait and wait? When do we call time on this season - or do we not? The longer it goes on, the more likely many of our clubs will hit the buffers waiting on the pay out of desperately needed prize money. That money will be the saving grace for more than a few clubs.

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Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

Dempster says we are good for about 5 months without football in the interview. If it’s that long then most of the clubs in Scotland will be wiped out.
If she has ideas on reconstruction she should say so quickly because the vote is tomorrow.


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Showing your hand in the heat of the moment is a very poor negotiating strategy. If she has ideas on reconstruction I'd expect her to support a no vote tomorrow then mobilise an influencing strategy ahead of the next decision point.

I don't know the ins and outs but I'm definitely looking for a Chief exec to weigh up a complex situation and act in the best interests of the game generally and Hibs specifically before making any decisions. Making decisions based on what's best to "pump the hearts" is exactly what we laugh at keekback for.

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Originally Posted by 18Craig75

Wow a few poor posts on this thread.

Does anyone seriously think the board would vote to save hearts? If we vote against the resolution it’ll be for reasons that affect Hibernian FC. Ie - were set to lose out on 130k right away as St Johnstone will overtake us in the league. What if we need that to keep the lights on?

I’ve voted to relegate hearts because that’s what I’d like to see happen. However if the club vote the other way, I have full confidence they’ve done so with the best interest of Hibs in mind

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What would you suggest the outcome will be if we vote against it? This isn’t for the Prem to end right away with St Johnstone finishing above us. If the league can’t be concluded and it’s voided what position do we finish fifth with hearts 6th while Livi would get prize money for finishing 9th instead of 6th?

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Originally Posted by tamig

So do we just wait and wait? When do we call time on this season - or do we not? The longer it goes on, the more likely many of our clubs will hit the buffers waiting on the pay out of desperately needed prize money. That money will be the saving grace for more than a few clubs.

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It’s not just that. It would be voting against not ending the lower leagues which would collapse a good few clubs down there when the vote isn’t even to end the Prem.

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Originally Posted by DaveF

We are 1 point ahead and played 1 game more. They have taken more points of Hearts and Sevco than we have. Spin stats anyway you like but we are not demonstrably a better team.

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Our first game against them when we were struggling under Hecky was a 2-2 draw. Our last game against them was a 4-1 win. There's no spin there, and that demonstrates that we are the better team.

If Dempster votes for them. She’s lost my support.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

Our first game against them when we were struggling under Hecky was a 2-2 draw. Our last game against them was a 4-1 win. There's no spin there, and that demonstrates that we are the better team.

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Aye ok. It's a bit daft stripping it back to that level as on that basis Hearts are demonstrably better than us.

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Originally Posted by DaveF

Aye ok. It's a bit daft stripping it back to that level as on that basis Hearts are demonstrably better than us.

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I would say giving them 5th place despite having more points than them is just as daft.

We're also ahead of them in the league and their game in hand is against a team that is way above both of us so they would be expected to lose it.

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Originally Posted by SteveHFC

If Dempster votes for them. She’s lost my support.

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Why? It's not even her decision to take, it's the board's.

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Originally Posted by Peevemor

And what if Livi get the prize money for 5th, finish bottom then go down the tubes?

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What do you mean go down the tubes? Surely that could happen to any team right now? Presumably getting the prize money for 5th would mean this is less likely?

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Originally Posted by neil7908

What do you mean go down the tubes? Surely that could happen to any team right now? Presumably getting the prize money for 5th would mean this is less likely?

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Purely to illustrate why the league will be wary of overpaying teams.

Can’t remember who said it but there will have been 42 versions of sporting integrity across the leagues at the start of the shutdown. I suspect that for the vast majority that has faded and finance will drive most thinking now: probably the reason some have called for the cash to be shared ahead of the vote.

For me, call the season, take seventh, and plan for next season whenever it starts.


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Originally Posted by Peevemor

Which is also what's in the SPFL board's proposition.

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With the exception that the spfl then have the power to call it whenever they want without going back to the clubs

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

I would say giving them 5th place despite having more points than them is just as daft.

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They have played a game less. Chances are they would lose but having taken a point of sevco already, who knows. It's our fault for not taking enough points off the likes of Livi, hearts etc for being where we are.

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Originally Posted by Radium

Can’t remember who said it but there will have been 42 versions of sporting integrity across the leagues at the start of the shutdown. I suspect that for the vast majority that has faded and finance will drive most thinking now: probably the reason some have called for the cash to be shared ahead of the vote.

For me, call the season, take seventh, and plan for next season whenever it starts.


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If the cash gets shared before the vote then the vote will never happen and we’ll be talking about this all summer.


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Originally Posted by Lee Marvin

You are being extremely niave and shortsighted if this is what you truely believe.

Please explain to me how voting for reconstruction, in this context, actually benefits Hibs? I am really keen to hear your response.

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That isn't what I said. I said Hibs should be voting in the best interests of Hibs, not to spite Hearts.

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Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES

That isn't what I said. I said Hibs should be voting in the best interests of Hibs, not to spite Hearts.

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The best interests of the Hibernian support is to relegate they ****s though or do the fans not count?

Hearts relegated.

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Originally Posted by DaveF

They have played a game less. Chances are they would lose but having taken a point of sevco already, who knows. It's our fault for not taking enough points off the likes of Livi, hearts etc for being where we are.

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I've edited my post to cover that point. My view is that we deserve to be in 6th place at the moment because that is what we achieved playing football, we're unbeaten against the other team with a claim to sixth and their game in hand was very unlikely to produce the result required for them to pass us.

Why do you think we deserve to be seventh?

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Originally Posted by 90+2

The best interests of the Hibernian support is to relegate they ****s though or do the fans not count?

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Says who? Maybe some would prefer them to stay up and struggle so we can play/beat them 3 times next season?

Some of the comments and input on this thread depress the hell out of me, not just as a Hibs fan or a fitba fan, but as a human being.

Folk are going on about Hibs being 'soft' if they miss this chance to relegate Hearts, saying all this talk about 'this is our city' is hogwash if we don't make ensuring Hearts are relegated our number one priority. Whatever happened to there being 'class, first class and Hibs class' ..... how much nonsense will that be if the club like half the fans on here make ensuring Hearts go down through a situation that's probably as close to the Zombie apocalypse as we will ever see our number one priority, when the future of our whole game is at stake.

Then you have the ... Hearts wouldn't think twice if the shoe was on the other foot folk ... The whole point is we aren't Hearts, the whole point is that what Hearts would do should never be a factor in how we think and how we act as a club ... or a support for that matter. If we genuinely think that Hearts would delight in taking advantage of what is nothing short of the biggest natural disaster to hit humanity since the 1919 flu pandemic which killed millions to put the boot into Hibs then Hibs doing the same thing would to me make us no better than them.

Then you have the I wont renew brigade, including some posters on here I have a great deal of respect for normally. I've seen comments from some folk saying this is like the Sevco situation and fans of other clubs will join the outrage if any decision made saves Hearts. Well I've got news for them, no it isn't ... to fans of other teams Hearts are just another club, probably not a very popular one for sure if comments I've seen from other fans over the years are to be believed, but to them in this situation just another club ... they will be thinking of their own clubs and hopefully how to ensure football continues with as little damage as possible to every club .... If any decision saves Hearts it wont be anywhere near as big a deal to them as it appears to be to a lot of us .... and to think otherwise is having an inflated idea of our own importance that would do credit to our city neighbours.

If you seriously are talking about damaging Hibs by consciously not renewing your season ticket over this issue then your hatred of Hearts truly does outweigh your love of Hibs. Something we delight in accusing Hearts fans of in reverse all the time .. and yet here we are doing exactly the same thing.

I have on many occasions stated that what Hearts did during the Mercer era was possibly the most disgusting act any football club anywhere could have ever undertaken ... To try and end another club, and even worse a direct rival, by killing them off the pitch should have made Hearts very name a swear word in football, a byword for disgusting underhanded behaviour, even to fans who previously had no thought for them either way, if at all.

In my opinion raving at our club to vote a certain way in an overall decision for Scottish football which will affect not just us, not just Hearts, but the whole future of our game based on no other consideration than how much damage it can do to Hearts, be that deserved payback, karma or whatever when the club in question were in a position where relegation through their efforts on the pitch was a long way from certain is in the same ballpark .... not the same, but the same ballpark ... as what Hearts tried to do to us all those years ago.

The ****ing Yams have always been unbearable with their inflated sense of self importance and entitlement ... nobody least of all me would deny that ... they truly think they are God's gift to the beautiful game. The thought of ramping that up to 11 by handing them the chance to play the martyr as well is a far worse outcome to this situation than any idea of a decision Hibs make keeping them in the premiership.

Rant over GGTTH.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

I've edited my post to cover that point. My view is that we deserve to be in 6th place at the moment because that is what we achieved playing football, we're unbeaten against the other team with a claim to sixth and their game in hand was very unlikely to produce the result required for them to pass us.

Why do you think we deserve to be seventh?

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If it goes on average points then we will be 7th. Whether you think it's deserved or not is a matter of opinion.

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Originally Posted by 90+2

The best interests of the Hibernian support is to relegate they ****s though or do the fans not count?

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Fans spiteful emotions don't count when it comes to running a successful football club, no. The best possible Hibs team is what I want, if we have a good team then the support will be happy.

You happy to vote for a horrendous solution to this problem that massively hurts Hibs as long as Hearts go down and we can banter them off a bit on twitter?

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Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

:agree: She cant be seen to want them relegated, as much as i'd like her to say so. :greengrin She's just playing the waiting game until such times as there is no other option, and that will be the only option soon enough. :greengrin

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Totally agree.

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Originally Posted by Peevemor

Purely to illustrate why the league will be wary of overpaying teams.

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It's a very problematic outcome - but we're in the proverbial rock and hard place at the moment.

Let's be honest, everyone here just wants Hearts down. Fine, I get that but it's a rubbish outcome. And has there been any chat about the Scottish Cup? Are we talking about giving up our chances of a semi final?

Quite honestly I couldn't give a toss. This virus business has confirmed to me how fed up I am with football these days. Beam me up, Scotty!

I'm going to trust somebody with the experience and track record of Leeann to make the best choice possible.

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Originally Posted by DaveF

If it goes on average points then we will be 7th. Whether you think it's deserved or not is a matter of opinion.

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Average points based on a different number of games played therefore not comparable. You're right though (for the only time in this wee debate :wink:) it's a matter of opinion and we're unlikely to agree on this so I'll stop here.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52227551


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If I thought that if our positions were reversed that Budge would vote to save Hibs then I might have some sympathy. Given all the underhanded snipes she's aimed at us in statements/interviews over the past few years I think I can safely say there's no chance she would.